Living the Lifestyle - Thurs 10/27

Calvin2008Brian

Everyone says it, but just how do you do it? How do you take the guidelines of the WW program and turn them into a lifestyle you can live every day...from now on? That is what we are here to explore. Each weekday, a new topic is offered up for discussion. Newbie? Join in! Veteran? Join in! Your thoughts may be just what someone else needs to hear.

Monday –- Podkey (Bob)
Tuesday -- Misterhub (Greg)
Wednesday -- Beachwoman2006 (Cindy)
Thursday -- Calvin2008 (Brian)
Friday -- Al_Howard (Al)

Topic: hunger is the enemy.

Fitness columnist James Fell begins and ends this excellent article with the same four words: hunger is the enemy.

James also sums up what we do here quite neatly: "The entire point here is to control calorie intake by controlling hunger while also promoting health and performance (and maintaining a good relationship with food)."

Simple, right?

But (of course) while simple, this is far from easy, and that's because hunger is a powerful enemy.

Do you control hunger? How?

A second question (from the linked article): "Try going to bed a little hungry. This is a powerful weight loss tool. Before bed is really the only time it’s okay to be hungry, because your appetite will essentially reset over night."

Have you done this? Do you find that your appetite resets over night?

leeless511

Good article, I agree with pretty much everything he says.

Controlling hunger is key, the caloric density point he makes is the focus I usually have on "what to eat."

I do periodically go to bed hungry...I still track points and if I have had what appears to be enough food/calories I won't indulge prior to going to bed. But if I am too hungry I won't sleep so it is a delicate balance.

WW has recently added a new philosophy that is a range of points to use each day, they take the daily + or - 3 and up to 7 weekly over as my range. Amazingly this has worked great for me in keeping me satisfied and I started losing, which is what I was hoping to do.

Al_Howard

If I go to bed hungry, I'll be awake in the middle of the night with the hungry horrors. I find a bit of protein and carbs works well. Lately been doing 120 grams FF Greek yogurt and about 3/4 cup blueberry/strawberry compote. Satisfies the sweet and the hunger.

podkey

I am not often truly hungry whether at night or in the morning. I think for some/many of us folks the problem is "HEDONIC HUNGER"[ hedonism or pleasure driven]as in "I see this. I want this" rather than I am starving. I guess really speaking for myself that way.

My other big time takeaway from James Fell's articles is the value of NEAT ( nonexercise activity thermogenesis) a fancy phrase meaning moving more all day every day rather than just some scanty formal minutes in a gym etc. NEAT in one study accounted for extra calories burned from 100 (that's low) to over 700 extra calories per day. Actually in another study some individuals burned upwards of 1000 extra calories per day without noticeable activity. Use of fitbits and the like seem to help many folks. NEAT is not always detected by even fitbits but I think they are a good approach.

Also taking his articles a step further I believe for many folks moving a bit more can lead to eating a bit less because blood glucose becomes balanced without spiking when we move enough. Better blood glucose control helps with hunger in my view.

OK back to the QOTD of hunger.

I need to avoid situational hedonic hunger. They bring ya that dessert menu with the best ever wood fire baked adult s'more (​housemade graham cracker, ​chocolate spoonbread, caramel sauce, ​marshmallow) . Was I hungry? uh nope. Was my DD hungry?? uh nope. BUT my DD said she would share this amazing "worldclass" s'more with us if we wanted. Alas we didn't order it (really stuffed) but it was a 50:50 toss-up. I only remember one time in my life that I woke up hungry at night when I was maybe about 5 or at most 6 years old. A strange feeling. I store buckets of energy as glycogen and have more the genetic type of the "endurance" athlete. For the same reason I am not hungry in the morning either.

Having said all that BS I do feel a slight difference between "satisfied" and "stuffed". OK I do know stuffed and don't like that for sure. I just need to use portion control for sure.

gadgetgirlIL

I find items with more protein and fat to be better for me at keeping my hunger levels in check. I'm one of the odd ducks who finds that eating fruit actually makes me hungrier.

I can go to bed a little hungry, but it is a fine line. As he writes "If you wake up hungry in the middle of the night, then that’s going to bed too hungry.". When this happens to me, it is usually in combination with some part of my body aching, usually my shoulder, and then I end up getting up and having a small snack along with some ibuprofen to get back to sleep. Trying to ignore the hunger never works.

podkey

Appetite reset?? I do think there exists "timed hunger" . We are hungry because it is a certain time when we are accustomed to eating. If we skip eating at night the hunger may go away to return at another scheduled eating time. I see this with folks especially with the time change and also with travel between time zones. Not sure if that plays a role but could I suppose.

88olds

Controlling hunger doesn't need to mean never be hungry. My plan was to avoid getting too hungry.

First, feeling hungry is not an existential crisis. I quit talking about, and thinking about, how I was starving, famished, could eat a horse.

I ate a lot of apples for a while. I still eat apples, but not 3 per day.

My big problem was right after work. I had to get past the vending machines, get home & make my satisfying point friendly smoothie. I could have planned different but that was my system. I told myself that the discomfort I felt driving home was what weight loss felt like. I could tolerate a bit of hunger temporarily in support of my goal. No biggie.

podkey

Years ago I use to drink a beer and eat a snickers bar right after work just before driving home but I don't think it was "real hunger". That was a strange time.

Calvin2008Brian

About that bedtime thing: I can go to bed a little bit hungry, but when I do I always wake up in the morning a little bit hungry. I do not feel that appetite-reset phenomenon James mentions. I wish I did! On the plus side, though, I almost never wake up in the middle of the night with an urge to eat.

I feel that when I'm doing well in weight loss mode I'm often ok with a little bit of hunger. I know I'm not going to starve, or blackout, or have any real ill effects at all from a bit of hunger.

Like several of you said above, the toughest time for me to stay on track is in the early evening. I need to plan better and have a piece of fruit on hand more often for those time.

lilybbbbb

Never go to bed hangry

I like and have experienced/witnessed plenty of anecdotal evidence regarding NEAT.
I also notice, along the lines of @podkey 's post, that I'm rarely hungry in the morning and also that even if I'm legitimately somewhat hungry, say, when I get home from work, if I go for a walk or bike ride or something, I eat less afterwards than I would have if I had just eaten immediately.

podkey

That's my girl Lily! We are all different but you roll more the way I do. I did poorly last night at a dinner for DW upcoming B-day as DD had surgery today as follow-up. I ordered the short ribs, Spätzle special. Never had it before and it was great even topped with a bit of horseradish (but not too much) and served braised in an espresso dried prune reduction (not too sweet and tasty) . It was more portion than I needed for sure but I ate it any way. oh well.


I don't worry about it too much and jumble up NEAT with narcotic level high end cardio (say being chased by a dog) it's all good. over 90% true max yesterday.

Rachel0778

I disagree with going to bed hungry. When I do, I wake up at 2am ravenous and have a hard time going back to bed. I'd rather eat a 100-200 calorie snack before bed and have great sleep than to "save" those calories but have my sleep compromised.

I also agree with @lilybbbbb 's idea for a walk, any exercise helps to diminish hunger for me as well!

Jimb376mfp

"Try going to bed a little hungry. This is a powerful weight loss tool. .......your appetite will essentially reset over night."

Have you done this? Do you find that your appetite resets over night?
***********************
This reminded me of an old GoaD thread when someone mentioned that when he heard people say "I'm starving" he would laugh and think when was the last time any GoaD was ever REALLY HUNGRY?
You know like third world starving people hungry?

I realized that I never let myself even get close to being hungry. I would eat in advance just so I would NEVER be hungry later. I never went to bed hungry in my life!

I have eliminated mindless snacking while watching TV. I don't require a night time "legal" WW Approved snack every night. I never heard this theory about going to bed hungry so I may just try it.

Calvin2008Brian

If we could have signature blocks here like we did on WW, mine would have James Fell's quote:

"The entire point here is to control calorie intake by controlling hunger while also promoting health and performance (and maintaining a good relationship with food)."

I don't think even King Steve ever put it so succinctly.

podkey

I read much of his articles and find that he is more on target that almost anyone I have read.
Not exactly sure how he sorta missed the hedonic pleasure seeking appetites in our brain as I think in some folks that is more on target that actual physical hunger but really he debunks a lot of stuff and is very level headed. As he points out we can lose weight eating high protein, hi carb, vegan, neo-pagan diet stuff. Long term we need some good tasty foods (not best ever for every day necessarily) and a system to eat them in the right portions. For me that means measuring the portions as physical hunger is a poor guide for me.

minimyzeme

Often, I think I do control hunger (I know, it's not real hunger). I work largely from home so that provides me with some latitude with respect to my schedule, but especially my meals. I'm across the boards when it comes to feeding. When time allows, the first thing I try to be aware of is whether I am hungry and if so, how hungry. This is also in context with what I know is on the docket for the day and how it might influence my food choices relative to my point allowance. Some days, I'll choose to have a light breakfast--maybe just yogurt and half a whole grain tortilla with a teaspoon each of peanut butter and jam. Other days, I'll go for a heartier breakfast: apple, egg with ham, half a glass of milk, etc. I guess my point is that I try not to get stuck in a rut and if possible respond appropriately to my hunger that time of day in the context of what else I have going.

The other snacks and meals are often done similarly. Even if I'm eating out, I can make it relatively small--either in the meal choice itself or just by splitting it and taking some home. I find for me, my perception of hunger drives my choices and options snack/meal-wise. If I'm hungry I try to tend to it before it gets to be an insurmountable feeling. If I don't and I let it go too far, that's when I KNOW I will make bad choices.

I definitely do better to control hunger when I'm active. I found the NEAT article on-target for me. In my previous life I did a lot of field work; now not as much but still some. I'm not likely go get a gym membership but I often hike, snowshoe or just do physical activity around the property. I have noticed when I'm active, I'm usually engaged / thinking about other things (more specifically not thinking about food). So I think it helps on a couple fronts.

I have not intentionally tried going to bed hungry though I don't do anywhere near the amount of late-night eating before bed that I used to. I usually have something light in the early-mid evening. Occasionally I'll have a few spoonfuls of yogurt shortly before bed a couple hours later. Short answer: I don't know about the appetite reset. I'll have to give this a try.

countcurt

I didn't really know what hunger was until I got serious about weight management. Because I was always hungry. It was only after having to live on a food 'budget' that I realized I'm actually often not hungry. And yet, I eat anyway. If I ate only when I was hungry, I'd never have to worry about my weight again.

So, while many of the specific tactics Fell presents are quite logical, they all boil down to figuring out ways to balance caloric intake.

Like others, though, the going to bed hungry idea was a stinker for me. I woke up at 3AM starving. I could not fall back asleep and because it happened when I was religiously following WW, I wasn't going to give up precious points. So I make sure I am NOT hungry at bedtime.

podkey

I agree with Curt. Fell does present a lot of good no-nonsense ideas but it often isn't about physical hunger. Cinnabon craving is NOT hunger but a hankering . I too need portion control and a food budget. Want more steamed broccoli or brussels sprouts? Yes. A cinnabon? nope.