Lately: More Tired, Less Energy?
Violet_Flux
Posts: 481 Member
The last little while, I've noticed I'm feeling more and more tired, and have less energy.
Just a month or two ago I had no trouble getting up in the morning, and was enthusiastic about daily excercise. Nowadays it feels like an act of will to get on the bike, when all I really want to do is be back in bed. At work I'm just barely above the level of 'showing up', very ineffective and not getting much done.
There have been two changes over the past 2 months, that maybe are involved?
Diet-wise I joined MFP and got stricter about carbs. I estimate I was on about 50g / day before, now I am under 20g net / day. I wasn't actually counting or tracking food/calories/carbs prior to Jan 30th, but I can estimate based on what I was eating at the time. My calories are maybe on the low side, but I'm satisfied. Not feeling hungry or deprived.
Excercise-wise, I had to switch from daily walks to daily biking (on the trainer for now), because I developed plantar fasciitis and the pain got to be intolerable. I'm spending less time on the bike than I was walking, and according to the excercise app in my watch, I'm burning fewer calories on the bike than I was burning when walking.
The forced switch to cycling has bothered me somewhat, I really really want to be walking. For the past 10 years I was too out-of-shape to walk more than 100 meters without getting winded, and I was really pumped about being able to walk anywhere. I was doing 4km / day minimum and loved it. Having that 'taken away' was a real blow.
For what it's worth, I have been in ketosis more or less since the end of August 2016. I check with ketostix 2 or 3 times a week and with a few isolated exceptions, there's always been a positive reading. The actual amount varies depending on what time of day I test, but I've been told the actual amount isn't that relevant anyways?
So I'm sort of stuck wondering if I'm doing something wrong, or if the tiredness is just emotional or 'because weather' or something like that.
Any advice would be most appreciated!
p.s. my food diary is public if anyone wants to check what sorts of stuff I'm eating.
Just a month or two ago I had no trouble getting up in the morning, and was enthusiastic about daily excercise. Nowadays it feels like an act of will to get on the bike, when all I really want to do is be back in bed. At work I'm just barely above the level of 'showing up', very ineffective and not getting much done.
There have been two changes over the past 2 months, that maybe are involved?
Diet-wise I joined MFP and got stricter about carbs. I estimate I was on about 50g / day before, now I am under 20g net / day. I wasn't actually counting or tracking food/calories/carbs prior to Jan 30th, but I can estimate based on what I was eating at the time. My calories are maybe on the low side, but I'm satisfied. Not feeling hungry or deprived.
Excercise-wise, I had to switch from daily walks to daily biking (on the trainer for now), because I developed plantar fasciitis and the pain got to be intolerable. I'm spending less time on the bike than I was walking, and according to the excercise app in my watch, I'm burning fewer calories on the bike than I was burning when walking.
The forced switch to cycling has bothered me somewhat, I really really want to be walking. For the past 10 years I was too out-of-shape to walk more than 100 meters without getting winded, and I was really pumped about being able to walk anywhere. I was doing 4km / day minimum and loved it. Having that 'taken away' was a real blow.
For what it's worth, I have been in ketosis more or less since the end of August 2016. I check with ketostix 2 or 3 times a week and with a few isolated exceptions, there's always been a positive reading. The actual amount varies depending on what time of day I test, but I've been told the actual amount isn't that relevant anyways?
So I'm sort of stuck wondering if I'm doing something wrong, or if the tiredness is just emotional or 'because weather' or something like that.
Any advice would be most appreciated!
p.s. my food diary is public if anyone wants to check what sorts of stuff I'm eating.
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How's your salt intake?1
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Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »
Wow! That is interesting. Thx!1 -
Thank you both for getting back to me.
@Cadori, I think it's ok? I usually get 4000 to 5000mg per day? I've never knowingly gone through keto-flu symptoms, unless maybe it's been at a low level that didn't really stick out to me? I do drink a lot of water though. I only drink to thirst but I have days where I'm up to 14 cups in the day.
@Sunny_Bunny_ Dang I've never heard of that before. Pork is sort of the staple meat of my diet. I like it, and it's cheap. Poultry and Beef are both significantly more expensive around here, and I'm not that keen on either of them. I do steak on the BBQ when the weather permits.
Actually one thing I neglected to mention, I've basically been 'Tired' as my default, most of my adult life. That had improved along with energy levels while doing this dieting & excercising, until recently.0 -
Steph_Maks wrote: »Thank you both for getting back to me.
@Cadori, I think it's ok? I usually get 4000 to 5000mg per day? I've never knowingly gone through keto-flu symptoms, unless maybe it's been at a low level that didn't really stick out to me? I do drink a lot of water though. I only drink to thirst but I have days where I'm up to 14 cups in the day.
@Sunny_Bunny_ Dang I've never heard of that before. Pork is sort of the staple meat of my diet. I like it, and it's cheap. Poultry and Beef are both significantly more expensive around here, and I'm not that keen on either of them. I do steak on the BBQ when the weather permits.
Actually one thing I neglected to mention, I've basically been 'Tired' as my default, most of my adult life. That had improved along with energy levels while doing this dieting & excercising, until recently.
I don't doubt there's a mental component to it too. Just reading the changes you had to make really make that apparent to me. When I have to do things I don't want to or differently than I want to, it can sure suck the wind out of your sails.1 -
Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »
Interesting... Every now and then I have high glucose readings after supper, and then other days I will be within spitting distance of double digits. This has been one of those great puzzles for me, and I was always trying to find a pattern in the carb consumption. I have gone back with a couple of recent ones, and there was no pork involved.
It does mean I need to look at protein sources as I try to dial things in.
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According to this article, you just need to start marinading the fresh pork first in an apple cider vinegar solution (I couldn't see what else was in it). It's a tiiiiny study, but no harm in trying it out to see if you see a difference.2
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I'll not change my eating habits based on a "study" of 3 people. Possible merit though. I'm not discounting it. I'd do more research 1st.
It is frequently encouraged on this site to not eat the fat but rather the the protein. That is not the design of medical ketogenic diets (the purpose of which is to save or at least improve lives). Even in the new versions of medically ketogenic (that I have seen), protein is limited versus fat. Certainly your diet may not be deemed "medical" but obesity is a medical condition. Perhaps you can try upping your fat?
Since you pointed out your diary is open and encouraged a "look see", I personally think that an average of about 1100-1200 calories per day over several months (whether you feel satisfied/hungry or not) is not sufficient calories to properly fuel a person of your weight, especially since you are getting some exercise. Try eating at close to whatever higher level you were eating before to lose 100 pounds (Kudos on that). Perhaps if you ate more you would have more energy?
If you were effectively losing eating slightly higher carbs, were feeling better and losing perhaps you should try that again? You don't have to eat super low carb to lose weight and you don't have to be in ketosis to lose weight. Using those strips is just another unnecessary stressor (unless there is a medical reason to be in ketosis but then you would probably be using a more reliable test).
Hopefully you are doing prescribed exercises (or some found on the net) for plantar fasciitis. They work for some people. They did me. I had it and was instructed to rub my foot over a tennis ball, do raises on steps to stretch the foot and oddly enough to lighten the covers on my bed and make every effort to sleep on my side (versus back) so my toes were not "pointing" every night for 8 hours as I slept. Mine was the type that made it extremely painful to walk in the AM but worked itself out during the day with foot movement.
I prefer walking to my stationary bike but the bike has some great positives especially if I "crank it up" for a little/shorter "hiit" workout. I got mine when I acquired knee pain from pounding the pavement too hard, too soon, too over weight, too much pressure on the knees which are now fine.
Don't mourn the temporary respite from your walks. That's stress. Find the benefit in your bike even if it only that it will help heal your feet so you can start walking again for exercise. Our response/reaction to events in life are important and something we have more control over than the actual event itself. The event being the foot problem resulting the use of the bike versus walking.
Hopefully Spring is just around the corner for you and weather will be improving.
Just my general observations.
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Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »
Interesting... Every now and then I have high glucose readings after supper, and then other days I will be within spitting distance of double digits. This has been one of those great puzzles for me, and I was always trying to find a pattern in the carb consumption. I have gone back with a couple of recent ones, and there was no pork involved.
It does mean I need to look at protein sources as I try to dial things in.
I think it's just good to be aware that this could happen.
Then testing like you've done will help guide you from there.
I've not tested but I know I don't feel as satisfied or generally good eating pork. Or even chicken for that matter. But pork just leaves me feeling hungry too soon. Could be the reaction they are saying. Idk. I haven't actually tested.1 -
Thanks @kpk54 for the detailed post.
Most of the carbs I cut out recently were basically sugar -- store-bought stirfry sauce, store-bought bbq sauce, that sort of thing. I make my own low-carb sauces now, but I could switch back to the sugary ones pretty easily. There's more calories in them as well of course.
I'll see about upping the fat a bit too. I haven't really increased it much at all since switching to low carb. I did try eating pork belly meat instead of pork chops, for the higher fat content. They were good but a little too much like bacon (which I don't actually like that much lol).
And yeah, I was losing weight at the higher carb level. It was when I stalled through the whole month of January that I joined MFP, started counting, and decided to cut back to < 20g net carbs. It seemed to work too, I got past the plateau and lost a bunch of weight in February.
Re. the plantar fasciitis, I have got a sheet of excercises to help with that, and I'm trying to incorporate them into my daily routine this week.
Admittedly, I was really stupid about it. I did not know what was wrong with my foot, only that it hurt in the morning when I first got up. I was walking over 4km every day before breakfast, and continued to do so despite the pain.
I wasn't worried as I knew that the pain would go away after the first km. Then after a month, it took 2km to get rid of the pain. Then a few more weeks and the pain was constant, all day long. Then I finally saw a doctor.
Stupid, but I sort of have that mindset of powering through pain, just walk it off, mind over matter.
Now I'll mull all this over and see where it gets me.
Thanks again everyone for the advice and input!1 -
Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »
I think it's just good to be aware that this could happen.
Then testing like you've done will help guide you from there.
I've not tested but I know I don't feel as satisfied or generally good eating pork. Or even chicken for that matter. But pork just leaves me feeling hungry too soon. Could be the reaction they are saying. Idk. I haven't actually tested.
It means there is a new variable to be aware of. Things can be complicated and mysterious sometimes. I'll keep working on it.
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Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »
Hmmm.....I eat a lot of pork. In fact, this weekend's crockpot special which is what I made for lunches all week is pork. I do wonder if preparation in other ways affects this such as the fact that the pork shoulder I used was cooked with a half pound of bacon, plenty of salt, butter and olive oil for about 8 hours.
That is a VERY small sample size to call a study. It does raise an eyebrow, though.
I smell an n=1 experiment.3 -
cstehansen wrote: »Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »
Hmmm.....I eat a lot of pork. In fact, this weekend's crockpot special which is what I made for lunches all week is pork. I do wonder if preparation in other ways affects this such as the fact that the pork shoulder I used was cooked with a half pound of bacon, plenty of salt, butter and olive oil for about 8 hours.
That is a VERY small sample size to call a study. It does raise an eyebrow, though.
I smell an n=1 experiment.
That would definitely be a delicious n=1 though...
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baconslave wrote: »cstehansen wrote: »Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »
Hmmm.....I eat a lot of pork. In fact, this weekend's crockpot special which is what I made for lunches all week is pork. I do wonder if preparation in other ways affects this such as the fact that the pork shoulder I used was cooked with a half pound of bacon, plenty of salt, butter and olive oil for about 8 hours.
That is a VERY small sample size to call a study. It does raise an eyebrow, though.
I smell an n=1 experiment.
That would definitely be a delicious n=1 though...
Also pretty easy given what I have prepared for this week which is heavy on pork. I can simply do the same with beef next week and then with pork marinated in ACV the next. Given I already track BG religiously, that is no extra work.3 -
Steph_Maks wrote: »
Stupid, but I sort of have that mindset of powering through pain, just walk it off, mind over matter.
Girl. I do this too. And now I have 3 old injuries I have to nurse as I run and I feel like an idiot.
Good decision getting it checked out and a diagnosis with a treatment plan!
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cstehansen wrote: »
Also pretty easy given what I have prepared for this week which is heavy on pork. I can simply do the same with beef next week and then with pork marinated in ACV the next. Given I already track BG religiously, that is no extra work.
I am looking forward to your experience with it.
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Well, I love all meats marinated, so pork loins will get a vinegar one now. I used dry rubs to marinate them before. Not sure if a 3 person sample is good science, but I think it would make the pork taste great. We do eat a lot of pork loin chops and bacon, & some salami that should be good given how that is processed.
Nice link thanks.1 -
Steph_Maks wrote: »
Re. the plantar fasciitis, I have got a sheet of excercises to help with that, and I'm trying to incorporate them into my daily routine this week.
@Steph_Maks There are also some insoles that help with plantar fascitis. My daughter used them and they worked pretty well for her. I think we actually got them at Walmart, but you could probably get at a Walgreens, or Rite Aid or such....1 -
@Steph_Maks There are also some insoles that help with plantar fascitis. My daughter used them and they worked pretty well for her. I think we actually got them at Walmart, but you could probably get at a Walgreens, or Rite Aid or such....
Thanks, I did find some at the local drug store, that seem to help a bit.
I've heard that custom ones are better but can be expensive. Going to look into that soon too, to see if it's feasable / affordable.0 -
Just following up on how things have played out. Tuesday I went to bed early because dead tired, and of course then I had insomnia. Stared at the ceiling for 5 hours, then when I did get to sleep I kept waking up.
So I was really surprised when I got up Wednesday and found I had more energy and wasn't all that tired anymore!
Felt better yesterday and today as well. So I guess it was just mental / emotional / whatever after all? (Or maybe complaining about it made it go away lol!)
I have rethought my caloric and macro goals though as it was pointed out that they were too low. I've upped it to 1600 cal and 30/100/130 for carb/protein/fat. Not sure I'll hit those numbers consistently, but I'll see how it goes.
Thanks again everyone for the feedback and info!6 -
@Violet_Flux
I'm bumping this for you as Stephanie talked a bit here about insomnia, sleep disruption, and being "emotional".
Out of all the people I've interacted on with through MFP you stick with me as we joined around the same time, and I've found your comments, and posting on here really self reflective, and honest. I'm impressed by your ability to do that.
I hope you continue to post, and ask for help when needed. I do you feel better.
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Thank you @mmultanen for bringing this to my attention. I have no recollection of her writing this.
And thank you also for your kind comments. I will suggest to Violet that she should try and be a more active participant here again. I confess our activity here today has been due to the crisis we found ourselves in. I normally do not take control but it was necessary today, to avert any longterm damage or regrettable decisions.
Unrelated to the current situation, but this comment caught my attention:
Unknown to us at the time, but structural dissociation itself takes a substantial amount of mental energy; the mind has to work hard to keep so many separate selves hidden from each other.Steph_Maks wrote:Actually one thing I neglected to mention, I've basically been 'Tired' as my default, most of my adult life.0
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