Trying a balanced approach
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vm007
Posts: 243 Member
Hello,
So I've tried keto and I've tried high carb this time I'm trying an approach which would be balanced but with more inclination towards 1g protein per LBM then fat then carbs which puts me around
150-160 grams of protein
130g fat and
100g carbs (total not net)
I've taken this approach so I can live life without phone in my hand lol -I even took up eating meat (which I had given up for year and half) in the name of balanced approach. However, it's my first time doing keto whilst consuming meat/seafood/eggs. Before I tried keto plant and dairy based and yes it was very hard lol
Few questions for everyday life
Chicken breasts/thighs- the skin on it- that's fine to consume right? (btw how many calories are in this uncooked chicken breast n thigh attached piece with skin?)
Most days my breakfast may be 4 eggs and bacon strips 2 - that's fine?
Pork - the fat that comes with it, is it ok?
Lamb- that fat ok ?
In summary animal fat ok?
How about kfc chicken skin ok? it's fried and what not lol
What kind of fat is off limits? in main thread it says trans fat is bad - it's the one that is used to re-fry n fry over n over again right?
TIA
So I've tried keto and I've tried high carb this time I'm trying an approach which would be balanced but with more inclination towards 1g protein per LBM then fat then carbs which puts me around
150-160 grams of protein
130g fat and
100g carbs (total not net)
I've taken this approach so I can live life without phone in my hand lol -I even took up eating meat (which I had given up for year and half) in the name of balanced approach. However, it's my first time doing keto whilst consuming meat/seafood/eggs. Before I tried keto plant and dairy based and yes it was very hard lol
Few questions for everyday life
Chicken breasts/thighs- the skin on it- that's fine to consume right? (btw how many calories are in this uncooked chicken breast n thigh attached piece with skin?)
Most days my breakfast may be 4 eggs and bacon strips 2 - that's fine?
Pork - the fat that comes with it, is it ok?
Lamb- that fat ok ?
In summary animal fat ok?
How about kfc chicken skin ok? it's fried and what not lol
What kind of fat is off limits? in main thread it says trans fat is bad - it's the one that is used to re-fry n fry over n over again right?
TIA
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Replies
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KFC and other fast food places have coating that contain who knows what, I'd opt for a healthier fat and take off the coastings at fast food joints.
USDA should have calorie counts for anything you have a question about, I go to their website or use USDA in front of any entries in MFP.
Yes, animal fats are fine, as in bacon, pig fat.
I love lamb just don't like the taste of the fat, it is the only meat I trim fat off of, it is just my taste perference and I am getting plenty of other fats when I eat it.
No trans fats, heating olive oil above 375F, turns it into a transfat oil, btw.
You can save fats from your cooking just strain it so stray particles doesn't pollute it. Heck bacon grease can be kept on the counter as can true ghee.3 -
retirehappy wrote: »KFC and other fast food places have coating that contain who knows what, I'd opt for a healthier fat and take off the coastings at fast food joints.
USDA should have calorie counts for anything you have a question about, I go to their website or use USDA in front of any entries in MFP.
Yes, animal fats are fine, as in bacon, pig fat.
I love lamb just don't like the taste of the fat, it is the only meat I trim fat off of, it is just my taste perference and I am getting plenty of other fats when I eat it.
No trans fats, heating olive oil above 375F, turns it into a transfat oil, btw.
You can save fats from your cooking just strain it so stray particles doesn't pollute it. Heck bacon grease can be kept on the counter as can true ghee.
Nutritional values are same for true ghee and bacon grease? lol this will blow some minds if answer is yes.1 -
"heating olive oil above 375F, turns it into a transfat oil, btw"
Does this mean we can safely roast chicken or fish etc at 350 degreees if we use olive oil?0 -
retirehappy wrote: »KFC and other fast food places have coating that contain who knows what, I'd opt for a healthier fat and take off the coastings at fast food joints.
USDA should have calorie counts for anything you have a question about, I go to their website or use USDA in front of any entries in MFP.
Yes, animal fats are fine, as in bacon, pig fat.
I love lamb just don't like the taste of the fat, it is the only meat I trim fat off of, it is just my taste perference and I am getting plenty of other fats when I eat it.
No trans fats, heating olive oil above 375F, turns it into a transfat oil, btw.
You can save fats from your cooking just strain it so stray particles doesn't pollute it. Heck bacon grease can be kept on the counter as can true ghee.
Nutritional values are same for true ghee and bacon grease? lol this will blow some minds if answer is yes.
Macronutrients? Yes. They differ slightly in their fatty acid breakdowns and their micronutrient profiles are going to be a bit different too, due to the fact that a) cows and pigs have different diets and b) one's bodyfat and the other is milkfat, so they serve slightly different purposes to the animal the produces them.
Overall, though, they're not vastly different.
In fact, when it comes to the fatty acids, bacon fat has a similar profile to palm oil with a little olive oil, blended together. In both cases (and in the case of other animal fats), it's the palmetic and lauric acids that makes it solid (or solid-ish) at room temperature. How solid a fat is at room temperature depends largely on how much palmetic, stearic, or lauric acid (the three most common saturated fatty acids, though there are several others) it contains.
(Here's a really random fact for you -- black bear fat is made almost entirely of the same fatty acid that olive oil is primarily made of -- oleic acid.)
Regarding the "heating olive oil turns it into a transfat" thing, that's not quite accurate. What happens is that the fats oxidize, or break down. When they oxidize by heat, they form compounds that the body tries to use, but can't use properly and cause issues over the long term if done chronically.
The more saturated a fat is, the more stable and less likely to oxidize it is, because more of its hydrogen atoms are matched to a carbon atom. Saturated fats have all of their hydrogen and carbon atoms matched up in a 1:1 ratio (that's why if you look at the scientific info about fatty acids, they are marked as something like "18:0" -- 18 "links" per molecule chain, 0 unmatched carbon links). Monounsaturated fats (like olive oil) have one hydrogen atom per chain that is bonded to two hydrogen atoms (oleic acid is written as "18:1"), known as a "double bond." Polunsaturated fats, like most vegetable, nut, and seed oils and most of the Omega-3 and Omega-6 fats, have multiple double bonds ("18:2," "18:3," etc).
These unmatched spots create "kinks" or bends in the molecule and make the molecule less stable, because the hydrogen atoms can "break off" (in a sense). So, the more of these doubled-up hydrogen atoms, the points at which the molecule can break down.9 -
@vm007 welcome to MFP forums. 150 grams and less of carbs is considered by most to be low carb. I plan to stay just under 50 grams of carbs daily for the rest of my life but that does not involve any weighing or counting other than weighing my body each more to get my net results of CICO. Now I just eat until I get full. For two years now my weight has been in the 195-210 range on autopilot. My average calories runs around 2000+ daily and I do walk one quarter of a mile every day out of habit for about three years now. Best of success. The right way to eat is the way that works for YOU.
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I usually cook my chicken skin on, bone in.
Use the USDA entries: 05057, Chicken, broilers or fryers, breast, meat and skin, raw (100 g has 172 calories) and 05091, Chicken, broilers or fryers, thigh, meat and skin, raw (100 g has 221 calories).
You don't include the bones, though, so if weighing and logging I normally use the cooked entries (like 05060, Chicken, broilers or fryers, breast, meat and skin, cooked, roasted, 100 g has 197 cal) and pull the meat off the bone before weighing it or else weighing the leftovers afterwards.1 -
On olive oil and higher heats: http://www.seriouseats.com/2015/03/cooking-with-olive-oil-faq-safety-flavor.html
(This helped me stop worrying about it. I wouldn't fry with it or use it in a wok, but I don't really ever fry or use a wok, so no matter!)0 -
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Dragonwolf wrote: »edited:
Regarding the "heating olive oil turns it into a transfat" thing, that's not quite accurate. What happens is that the fats oxidize, or break down. When they oxidize by heat, they form compounds that the body tries to use, but can't use properly and cause issues over the long term if done chronically.
The more saturated a fat is, the more stable and less likely to oxidize it is, because more of its hydrogen atoms are matched to a carbon atom. Saturated fats have all of their hydrogen and carbon atoms matched up in a 1:1 ratio (that's why if you look at the scientific info about fatty acids, they are marked as something like "18:0" -- 18 "links" per molecule chain, 0 unmatched carbon links). Monounsaturated fats (like olive oil) have one hydrogen atom per chain that is bonded to two hydrogen atoms (oleic acid is written as "18:1"), known as a "double bond." Polunsaturated fats, like most vegetable, nut, and seed oils and most of the Omega-3 and Omega-6 fats, have multiple double bonds ("18:2," "18:3," etc).
These unmatched spots create "kinks" or bends in the molecule and make the molecule less stable, because the hydrogen atoms can "break off" (in a sense). So, the more of these doubled-up hydrogen atoms, the points at which the molecule can break down.
Wow, thanks for correcting me. I love the science of all this stuff. I have read a number of places it gets transferred into trans fat, so thought that must be the case. All I knew for sure was it changes flavor after it is heated up too high.0 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »@vm007 welcome to MFP forums. 150 grams and less of carbs is considered by most to be low carb. I plan to stay just under 50 grams of carbs daily for the rest of my life but that does not involve any weighing or counting other than weighing my body each more to get my net results of CICO. Now I just eat until I get full. For two years now my weight has been in the 195-210 range on autopilot. My average calories runs around 2000+ daily and I do walk one quarter of a mile every day out of habit for about three years now. Best of success. The right way to eat is the way that works for YOU.
Thanks for the welcome.
I'm not doing this for weight loss but for maintenance now. I lost my weight doing CICO and I did 8 weeks of keto this year and 4 weeks last year. It worked but it was with CICO and I was a vegetarian back then (no meat, eggs or seafood) it was exceptionally taxing figuring out meals but I managed net carbs to be lower than 50g a day. Yes, a lot of meals were exactly the same lol.
This year since I'm not a vegetarian anymore I thought I'll try keto the first thing and I'm trying to go by approximation and using the weight scale as little as possible. Hopefully I'd be able to fine tune my estimation skills.
I workout 4 days a week (5/3/1) strength training.1 -
With respect to olive oil:
I'm going to add somewhat of a non-scientific response... but based more on my pondering about this topic...
Most olive oils, or at least commercial olive oils available for purchase in North America are not pure olive oils.... they are mixed with up to 30% of other oils.. I believe 30% is the threshold where companies can legally call it pure olive oil... This is true of extra virgin and lighter varieties... (There were some news articles to this effect recently....the articles names a dozen commercial varieties that called themselves 100% olive oil, but were in fact mixed with other oils).
My background is Greek...Olive oil in Greece is a staple.....Vegetable and Canola oils etc are not that easy to come by....most people grow (or have contacts who grow) olives and have them crushed into olive oil. But.... they are true and pure olive oils... not mixed with any other oils... You can see and taste the difference...
The health and longevity of those living in the Mediterranean are one of the healthiest in the world....
So.. when i see studies knocking olive oil, it always makes my wonder how and why they came to these conclusions...
That said... Greek food tends not to be deep fried.... but certainly a lot of pan frying, braising, stewing, roasting.... and the food tends to be quite oily....
and most would be using olive oil to cook with. It's just readily available to them.
My mother has only ever used olive oil to cook with... and she's 85 years young5 -
With respect to olive oil:
I'm going to add somewhat of a non-scientific response... but based more on my pondering about this topic...
Most olive oils, or at least commercial olive oils available for purchase in North America are not pure olive oils.... they are mixed with up to 30% of other oils.. I believe 30% is the threshold where companies can legally call it pure olive oil... This is true of extra virgin and lighter varieties... (There were some news articles to this effect recently....the articles names a dozen commercial varieties that called themselves 100% olive oil, but were in fact mixed with other oils).
My background is Greek...Olive oil in Greece is a staple.....Vegetable and Canola oils etc are not that easy to come by....most people grow (or have contacts who grow) olives and have them crushed into olive oil. But.... they are true and pure olive oils... not mixed with any other oils... You can see and taste the difference...
The health and longevity of those living in the Mediterranean are one of the healthiest in the world....
So.. when i see studies knocking olive oil, it always makes my wonder how and why they came to these conclusions...
That said... Greek food tends not to be deep fried.... but certainly a lot of pan frying, braising, stewing, roasting.... and the food tends to be quite oily....
and most would be using olive oil to cook with. It's just readily available to them.
My mother has only ever used olive oil to cook with... and she's 85 years young
Efharisto para poli, @Tsoufla! I am Italian by birth (Well, ok, I was born in England, but I apparently was 'Made in Italy'!) and I am at total one with your comments regarding oil. I always study the labels of 'olive oil' in the UK. Very often - all too often, in fact - there is small print announcing (admitting) that the oil is 'blended using carefully selected oils from the EU'... but as you say, the percentages are not revealed.
So I tend to buy authentic, classified Italian, Greek or even Spanish olive oils, and never touch 'own brand' stuff.1 -
@vm007 Just dropping in to say I too, try to keep things "balanced". I've lost my excess (via 40%c/30/30) and have been maintaining for 3 years. I tried a few things along the way in regards to varying macros (clear down to MTKD where both protein and carbs are very limited).
At this time keep my carbs ~50 grams daily with no emphasis on being in ketosis. It's no big deal if I happen to go over on carbs for a few tomato or cucumber slices or a small bowl of chili with kidney beans. ~50 grams seems good to me...I'm older, female and somewhat inactive. I let the protein and fat fall where they fall within my calorie amount. I'm confident I get adequate protein and the fat keeps me satiated. My daily eating seems to have me split fairly evenly between saturated and unsaturated fat.
I read the forum, supplement with my own research for things that interest me and make decisions accordingly. I seem to have no food allergies, sensitivities or metabolic issues that I'm aware of. My goal is to continue to maintain my weight and health while eating a wide variety of fish, meat, vegetables, dairy, eggs, oils and occasional fruit and not being stymied by food choices in everyday life. Read. Research. Decide. Be flexible but not foolish.2 -
I hear the most balanced 'meal' is a glass of wine in each hand....
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AlexandraCarlyle wrote: »I hear the most balanced 'meal' is a glass of wine in each hand....
I thought it was a bacon cheeseburger in each hand (bunless of course)4 -
Glasses, I think you'll find, are both less messy and more easily replenished....
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I'm in for the Bacon Cheeseburger shooters...4
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@vm007 Just dropping in to say I too, try to keep things "balanced". I've lost my excess (via 40%c/30/30) and have been maintaining for 3 years. I tried a few things along the way in regards to varying macros (clear down to MTKD where both protein and carbs are very limited).
At this time keep my carbs ~50 grams daily with no emphasis on being in ketosis. It's no big deal if I happen to go over on carbs for a few tomato or cucumber slices or a small bowl of chili with kidney beans. ~50 grams seems good to me...I'm older, female and somewhat inactive. I let the protein and fat fall where they fall within my calorie amount. I'm confident I get adequate protein and the fat keeps me satiated. My daily eating seems to have me split fairly evenly between saturated and unsaturated fat.
I read the forum, supplement with my own research for things that interest me and make decisions accordingly. I seem to have no food allergies, sensitivities or metabolic issues that I'm aware of. My goal is to continue to maintain my weight and health while eating a wide variety of fish, meat, vegetables, dairy, eggs, oils and occasional fruit and not being stymied by food choices in everyday life. Read. Research. Decide. Be flexible but not foolish.
This time around I'm little bit more relaxed with measuring calories and I've noticed if I eat what I've been eating abs stay visible. I'm at low carbs level like less than 150g a day now but I end up at less than 100g.
I went for balanced approach this time around to see how that feels. I've done keto and I've done the norm of 50-55% Carbs a day that mfp sets. So I'm in middle now lol. Let's see how it goes. I have to say, stomach feels flat and abs stay visible but 50-55% range it was day dependent for some reason. Lol2 -
I've banned canola oil from my life. I used it for years until I read about how it's made. Apparently its manufacture entails many different processes, including one to "deodorize" the stuff, otherwise it would stink so badly no one would touch it. It's a Frankenfood with poor personal hygiene.
Since I've never been a fan of olive oil I use avocado oil for both cooking and for salads. It's neutral tasting, has a high smoke point and (yeah!) Costco sells it at a very competitive price.2
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