Two months into this new WOE keto - some questions
Options
bluets2011
Posts: 241 Member
Female, 45. - 5'9, SW: 189.3 CW: 167.7 GW: 147. Calories a day 1200. Losing average 2lbs a week.
First of all I feel really well on this WOE, don't think I had the carb flu or anything. Weight is coming off (21.6lbs - 85 days), for the amount I'm eating/exercising maybe I should be losing more, but I have hashimotos and female hormone issues so I'm fine with this rate.
My questions are:
- hunger gone at all. Some days I have a hard time reaching the 1200 (I have gone over maybe 3 days since starting)
- I'm not eating back exercise calories, can't manage.
- I don't understand net carbs nor net calories. I've set my carbs 30g a day is that net?
- I want to feel hungry/ looking forward to my meal again.
- I'm drinking a copious amount of water. I stop logging at 4l but I drink much more and still always thirsty.
- I've decided on keto to help with my sugar addiction and low energy after meals I used to have.
I think I'm doing something wrong. My diary is open any help/insights would be great.
Thank you
First of all I feel really well on this WOE, don't think I had the carb flu or anything. Weight is coming off (21.6lbs - 85 days), for the amount I'm eating/exercising maybe I should be losing more, but I have hashimotos and female hormone issues so I'm fine with this rate.
My questions are:
- hunger gone at all. Some days I have a hard time reaching the 1200 (I have gone over maybe 3 days since starting)
- I'm not eating back exercise calories, can't manage.
- I don't understand net carbs nor net calories. I've set my carbs 30g a day is that net?
- I want to feel hungry/ looking forward to my meal again.
- I'm drinking a copious amount of water. I stop logging at 4l but I drink much more and still always thirsty.
- I've decided on keto to help with my sugar addiction and low energy after meals I used to have.
I think I'm doing something wrong. My diary is open any help/insights would be great.
Thank you
5
Replies
-
It sounds to me as if it is working.
I don't especially do any intentional exercise. I will record a walk to the post office if I remember. I do not eat the calories back.
To get net carbs, you subtract the fiber from the total.
The lack of hunger is a side effect for me and maybe most in this WOE. I have to be a little intentional about staying in a decent range. I have been busy the last couple of days, and the calories have been low. Mid-afternoon yesterday I took a look at the count and had a coffee with heavy cream and an ounce of peanuts. I still only came in at about 1300 for the day which is a lot less than my 2000 goal. When I am low like this, I miss my protein goal.
On some level you have to have a "food is medicine" approach to things - or I do anyway. Our instincts are bad sometimes, and left to our own devices we might be inclined to eat a bag of M&M's. The macros give me some targets to stay on track.4 -
Hi! Sounds like you are doing great! You may need to tweak something to be more comfortable but overall you sound successful at this way of eating. I didn't take a look at your diary yet, just wanted to get my first thoughts down.
I don't have a lot of hunger either. I'm 5'8", 47 yo, CW 187. I figure my body is getting what it needs from my body fat. I've asked a question about eating too few calories a million times in various forums & my main takeaway from all the advice is if you aren't hungry don't eat. If you have lots of energy & you just don't have an appetite then don't sweat it. If you feel lousy (cold, fatigued, irritable, losing hair) then you'll know your metabolism is slowing & things are going wrong & you need to eat more. My hunger & satiety cues were so screwy for years that it's hard for me to trust them now. Whenever I'm good & truly hungry I go aha! That's it!
I've never heard of net calories but net carbs refers to the way the US records carbs with fiber included. Since fiber doesn't appreciably raise blood sugars, it can be subtracted (some say) to achieve net carbs. I try to stay around 20 net carbs per day, some folks can only achieve ketosis at 20 grams carbs TOTAL. We are all different.
As for the always thirsty, this may sound counter intuitive but are you getting enough salt/ other electrolytes? This diet drains the fluids out of us & takes all our salt with it.
Also, as I'm sure you are aware, excessive thirst is a marker of type 2 diabetes so if it doesn't resolve, that's a thought.
Hang in there!4 -
Congrats on your success so far @bluets2011!
A very quick look at your diary tells me you really need to up your sodium. That might be the cause of your thirst, as @LizinLowell has suggested. 2300mg is barely enough sodium for folks eating carbs. On a low carb or keto diet, you need to be at least 3000mg, maybe even 5000mg.
Low sodium is one of those things where we've been misled for years. Too much sodium might make you pee more, but too little sodium can kill.
Net calories is just the calories you eat minus the calories you've burned in a workout. Eg. you eat 1200 cal but you've burned 100 doing some workouts, then your 'net calories' for the day would be 1100.
Good luck!3 -
LizinLowell wrote: »...losing hair
For some of us with a genetic predisposition, it may be too late to use hair loss as an indicator. Just saying...11 -
It sounds to me as if it is working.
I don't especially do any intentional exercise. I will record a walk to the post office if I remember. I do not eat the calories back.
To get net carbs, you subtract the fiber from the total.
The lack of hunger is a side effect for me and maybe most in this WOE. I have to be a little intentional about staying in a decent range. I have been busy the last couple of days, and the calories have been low. Mid-afternoon yesterday I took a look at the count and had a coffee with heavy cream and an ounce of peanuts. I still only came in at about 1300 for the day which is a lot less than my 2000 goal. When I am low like this, I miss my protein goal.
On some level you have to have a "food is medicine" approach to things - or I do anyway. Our instincts are bad sometimes, and left to our own devices we might be inclined to eat a bag of M&M's. The macros give me some targets to stay on track.
Thank you for your reply. Fine then I do 30g without subtracting so I should be on ketosis even though the sticks do not show it. I do a fair amount of exercise. 15.000 steps a day plus 6 gym classes, plus 3 yoga sessions. My target is 1200 but for instance in the two last days I have eaten 715 and 840 calories. I don't feel weak nor light headed nothing but I do think I should be eating more.
1 -
Thank you Liz! Weight loss I'm really pleased just don't want to damage myself eating so little. So yes makes sense that my body is using its own fat even though the ketosis sticks do not show I'm in ketosis. I'll add some more salt to my diet then. I've been tested for diabetes and it's clear. Must be the electrolytes then. And maybe I'd need 20g total to get into ketosis. At the moment under 30 not sure it's happening.LizinLowell wrote: »Hi! Sounds like you are doing great! You may need to tweak something to be more comfortable but overall you sound successful at this way of eating. I didn't take a look at your diary yet, just wanted to get my first thoughts down.
I don't have a lot of hunger either. I'm 5'8", 47 yo, CW 187. I figure my body is getting what it needs from my body fat. I've asked a question about eating too few calories a million times in various forums & my main takeaway from all the advice is if you aren't hungry don't eat. If you have lots of energy & you just don't have an appetite then don't sweat it. If you feel lousy (cold, fatigued, irritable, losing hair) then you'll know your metabolism is slowing & things are going wrong & you need to eat more. My hunger & satiety cues were so screwy for years that it's hard for me to trust them now. Whenever I'm good & truly hungry I go aha! That's it!
I've never heard of net calories but net carbs refers to the way the US records carbs with fiber included. Since fiber doesn't appreciably raise blood sugars, it can be subtracted (some say) to achieve net carbs. I try to stay around 20 net carbs per day, some folks can only achieve ketosis at 20 grams carbs TOTAL. We are all different.
As for the always thirsty, this may sound counter intuitive but are you getting enough salt/ other electrolytes? This diet drains the fluids out of us & takes all our salt with it.
Also, as I'm sure you are aware, excessive thirst is a marker of type 2 diabetes so if it doesn't resolve, that's a thought.
Hang in there!
1 -
Steph_Maks wrote: »Congrats on your success so far @bluets2011!
A very quick look at your diary tells me you really need to up your sodium. That might be the cause of your thirst, as @LizinLowell has suggested. 2300mg is barely enough sodium for folks eating carbs. On a low carb or keto diet, you need to be at least 3000mg, maybe even 5000mg.
Low sodium is one of those things where we've been misled for years. Too much sodium might make you pee more, but too little sodium can kill.
Net calories is just the calories you eat minus the calories you've burned in a workout. Eg. you eat 1200 cal but you've burned 100 doing some workouts, then your 'net calories' for the day would be 1100.
Good luck!
Thanks @Steph_Maks weight loss wise I have no complaints at all. I'll try upping my sodium but my food is really salty already. So yes my net calories are quite low. Yesterday I ate 840 and exercise expenditure 1227. Someone here mentioned heavy cream and peanut butter that's easy to eat more of :-).
1 -
Since there have been many good replies so far, I won't repeat but will add that the primary concern I would have with eating so little is not getting adequate micronutrients so a multivitamin would probably be a good idea.
My personal experience is my appetite returned more when I got closer to goal weight. I still have times where I'm not hungry so I don't eat. My "fasting" is rarely planned. For instance a didn't eat dinner this last Friday and didn't eat breakfast Saturday. I think I went about 25-26 hours between meals.
I have been maintaining weight most of the last 10 months or so, although I have been trying to add some muscle the last month or so and am up about 5 lbs. Since my belt is not getting any tighter and my lifts at the gym are getting heavier, I am ok with the scale going up a little.3 -
bluets2011 wrote: »
Thank you Liz! Weight loss I'm really pleased just don't want to damage myself eating so little. So yes makes sense that my body is using its own fat even though the ketosis sticks do not show I'm in ketosis. I'll add some more salt to my diet then. I've been tested for diabetes and it's clear. Must be the electrolytes then. And maybe I'd need 20g total to get into ketosis. At the moment under 30 not sure it's happening.LizinLowell wrote: »Hi! Sounds like you are doing great! You may need to tweak something to be more comfortable but overall you sound successful at this way of eating. I didn't take a look at your diary yet, just wanted to get my first thoughts down.
I don't have a lot of hunger either. I'm 5'8", 47 yo, CW 187. I figure my body is getting what it needs from my body fat. I've asked a question about eating too few calories a million times in various forums & my main takeaway from all the advice is if you aren't hungry don't eat. If you have lots of energy & you just don't have an appetite then don't sweat it. If you feel lousy (cold, fatigued, irritable, losing hair) then you'll know your metabolism is slowing & things are going wrong & you need to eat more. My hunger & satiety cues were so screwy for years that it's hard for me to trust them now. Whenever I'm good & truly hungry I go aha! That's it!
I've never heard of net calories but net carbs refers to the way the US records carbs with fiber included. Since fiber doesn't appreciably raise blood sugars, it can be subtracted (some say) to achieve net carbs. I try to stay around 20 net carbs per day, some folks can only achieve ketosis at 20 grams carbs TOTAL. We are all different.
As for the always thirsty, this may sound counter intuitive but are you getting enough salt/ other electrolytes? This diet drains the fluids out of us & takes all our salt with it.
Also, as I'm sure you are aware, excessive thirst is a marker of type 2 diabetes so if it doesn't resolve, that's a thought.
Hang in there!
@bluets2001 - Just to ask, did you have your fasting INSULIN levels checked? By fasting glucose and A1C levels, I'm nowhere near pre-diabetic, but with the added context of insulin levels, I am in that category. It is quite possible (and often even common) for your insulin to go haywire long before you get to it affecting your blood glucose levels. Just as point of reference. I'm not saying this is the case, but just a consideration to know that Fasting Glucose and A1C levels are not the only indicators of this...
The reference to "sugar addiction" and such always point me in the direction of evaluating insulin resistance, after discovering this out about myself...
Good luck.4 -
Egads. I'm guessing you have set MFP for weight loss and perhaps at sedentary? If this is the case, the 1200 calorie target includes the deficit to lose "x" per week. If you eat only 700 calories a day you have a double deficit. The deficit built in when eating 1200 and another 500 of the allocation MFP provides. (1200-500=700).
Furthermore MFP is designed to eat back exercise calories in order to fuel your body and provide your body with the nutrients it needs for everything from hair health to heart health. You are eating back nothing.
Yes. You are eating far too little. Eat some high calorie, nutrient dense foods such as avocado. Your body doesn't ask for much except to provide it with the nutrition it needs. Eat. You were correct in posing your question. Follow your gut instincts. That red number you are seeing at the end of the equation on your newsfeed is telling you what you need to know. Eat.6 -
I agree with kpk! Eat some nuts or heavy whip cream in something! It is important. I have days like this but they often are followed up with heavy eating days so it balances out. If you arent getting hungry days and stay like that too long its not good for you.1
-
Great insights, comrades!
My 2 cents... Like @cstehansen, as I've burned through my Strategic Energy Reserve©, I've tended to be a little hungrier (but it hasn't come back in the diabolical form
it assumed back in those misguided LF days 
...)
If I had to pick just one commandment
to revere as gospel in weight-loss mode, it would be to make certain to get adequate sodium and protein for your circumstances. (You don't really need carbs, and you've got 100K+ of fat calories on board.)
©@2t9nty
5 -
Great insights, comrades!
My 2 cents... Like @cstehansen, as I've burned through my Strategic Energy Reserve©, I've tended to be a little hungrier (but it hasn't come back in the diabolical form it assumed back in those misguided LF days ...)
If I had to pick just one commandment
to revere as gospel in weight-loss mode, it would be to make certain to get adequate sodium and protein for your circumstances. (You don't really need carbs, and you've got 100K+ of fat calories on board.)
©@2t9nty
This is probably TMI, but my Strategic Energy Reserve has been substantially reduced in two specific areas. I have lost 90 pounds so far, and I know the majority of it has been in my waist and butt. My wife has mentioned this more than once, and she has license to notice such things. FWIW, my secretary asked just how much I had lost, and when I told her, she said it is most obvious in my face and hands. In vestments this has to be true since that is all that is visible.4 -
LOL, also probably your secretary shouldn't be commenting on your waist & butt
(she/he showed a bit of discretion there) @2t9nty 8 -
canadjineh wrote: »LOL, also probably your secretary shouldn't be commenting on your waist & butt (she/he showed a bit of discretion there) @2t9nty
True that...5 -
cstehansen wrote: »Since there have been many good replies so far, I won't repeat but will add that the primary concern I would have with eating so little is not getting adequate micronutrients so a multivitamin would probably be a good idea.
My personal experience is my appetite returned more when I got closer to goal weight. I still have times where I'm not hungry so I don't eat. My "fasting" is rarely planned. For instance a didn't eat dinner this last Friday and didn't eat breakfast Saturday. I think I went about 25-26 hours between meals.
I have been maintaining weight most of the last 10 months or so, although I have been trying to add some muscle the last month or so and am up about 5 lbs. Since my belt is not getting any tighter and my lifts at the gym are getting heavier, I am ok with the scale going up a little.
Thank you @cstehansen I was taking a multivitamin it finished so I'll buy another. I'm 19kbs away from goal, so hopefully my hunger will come back. That's good to know that after all this time you still get days that you can't eat. I'll trust the process :-).
0 -
KnitOrMiss wrote: »bluets2011 wrote: »
Thank you Liz! Weight loss I'm really pleased just don't want to damage myself eating so little. So yes makes sense that my body is using its own fat even though the ketosis sticks do not show I'm in ketosis. I'll add some more salt to my diet then. I've been tested for diabetes and it's clear. Must be the electrolytes then. And maybe I'd need 20g total to get into ketosis. At the moment under 30 not sure it's happening.LizinLowell wrote: »Hi! Sounds like you are doing great! You may need to tweak something to be more comfortable but overall you sound successful at this way of eating. I didn't take a look at your diary yet, just wanted to get my first thoughts down.
I don't have a lot of hunger either. I'm 5'8", 47 yo, CW 187. I figure my body is getting what it needs from my body fat. I've asked a question about eating too few calories a million times in various forums & my main takeaway from all the advice is if you aren't hungry don't eat. If you have lots of energy & you just don't have an appetite then don't sweat it. If you feel lousy (cold, fatigued, irritable, losing hair) then you'll know your metabolism is slowing & things are going wrong & you need to eat more. My hunger & satiety cues were so screwy for years that it's hard for me to trust them now. Whenever I'm good & truly hungry I go aha! That's it!
I've never heard of net calories but net carbs refers to the way the US records carbs with fiber included. Since fiber doesn't appreciably raise blood sugars, it can be subtracted (some say) to achieve net carbs. I try to stay around 20 net carbs per day, some folks can only achieve ketosis at 20 grams carbs TOTAL. We are all different.
As for the always thirsty, this may sound counter intuitive but are you getting enough salt/ other electrolytes? This diet drains the fluids out of us & takes all our salt with it.
Also, as I'm sure you are aware, excessive thirst is a marker of type 2 diabetes so if it doesn't resolve, that's a thought.
Hang in there!
@bluets2001 - Just to ask, did you have your fasting INSULIN levels checked? By fasting glucose and A1C levels, I'm nowhere near pre-diabetic, but with the added context of insulin levels, I am in that category. It is quite possible (and often even common) for your insulin to go haywire long before you get to it affecting your blood glucose levels. Just as point of reference. I'm not saying this is the case, but just a consideration to know that Fasting Glucose and A1C levels are not the only indicators of this...
The reference to "sugar addiction" and such always point me in the direction of evaluating insulin resistance, after discovering this out about myself...
Good luck.
I'll check with my GP what he tested me for. I'm not sure, I know it was blood sugar. But yesterday I had some bouillon and my thirsty is better today! In the past more salt would make me thirstier it seems it was what I was lacking!
2 -
Great insights, comrades!
My 2 cents... Like @cstehansen, as I've burned through my Strategic Energy Reserve©, I've tended to be a little hungrier (but it hasn't come back in the diabolical form it assumed back in those misguided LF days ...)
If I had to pick just one commandment
to revere as gospel in weight-loss mode, it would be to make certain to get adequate sodium and protein for your circumstances. (You don't really need carbs, and you've got 100K+ of fat calories on board.)
©@2t9nty
@RalfLott protein I'm aiming at 1g per kilo of body weight. But yes it seems my sodium was off as someone pointed out. Bouillon yesterday less thirsty today! Ahah I do want to be hungry again but I'll go with the flow and just accept at this point I'm not, really forcing myself to eat makes me nauseous. And I used to stuff my face in the past!
0 -
@Catawampous yes these last days my hunger hasn't come back yet. But I'm adding sodium and see how it goes. Thank you for replying0
-
Egads. I'm guessing you have set MFP for weight loss and perhaps at sedentary? If this is the case, the 1200 calorie target includes the deficit to lose "x" per week. If you eat only 700 calories a day you have a double deficit. The deficit built in when eating 1200 and another 500 of the allocation MFP provides. (1200-500=700).
Furthermore MFP is designed to eat back exercise calories in order to fuel your body and provide your body with the nutrients it needs for everything from hair health to heart health. You are eating back nothing.
Yes. You are eating far too little. Eat some high calorie, nutrient dense foods such as avocado. Your body doesn't ask for much except to provide it with the nutrition it needs. Eat. You were correct in posing your question. Follow your gut instincts. That red number you are seeing at the end of the equation on your newsfeed is telling you what you need to know. Eat.
@kpk54 yes I do know I'm not eating enough, and I asked the question here because I know this can be a result from keto eating. I'm not eating this little on purpose. I love my food!! I've been vegan and vegetarian for most of my life mainly eating bread and carbs, so I think my body is adapting to this amount of protein. I eat eggs and fish and dairy now, everyday, this is quite new to me. I think my body will adapt and meanwhile I'll try adding these nutrient dense foods you mentioned. But if we think of my weight loss, I'm not eating that little, I never lose more than 2lbs a week so far.
2
