Reset 5/3/1 or keep on schedule

tomcornhole

As a variation on 5/3/1 I am doing my scheduled numbers each week and then for a challenge, I try next months numbers. For example, today was 5 day and I did my scheduled 195x6. Then I put on 225 and did 5 of those. That puts me 3 months ahead on squats. I am 2 months ahead on bench and OHP and 1.5 mo ahead on DL. I like this approach as some days I cannot do the next months set and then I stay on schedule. I still do BBB after the "joker" set. That is killer.

Any thoughts on this variation of 5/3/1?

Tom

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danimalkeys

you only did 195x6 but got 225x5? You should be repping out that last set to almost failure.

tomcornhole

I could have gotten 8 at 195, I guess. I'd rather go up in weight and do another 5 than max out 195.

danimalkeys

I thought a good idea I read about with the joker sets was to do them only on the 5/3/1 day. Doing them each workout might end up burning you out early. You should stick to the plan, max out your work weights, and then take the jokers and bbb as assistance.

jacksonpt

No, I wouldn't reset. You're supposed to be working at sub-max weights, so you should be able to jump ahead a month or to (or 3 or 4 potentially). Furthermore, if you did 195x6, then followed that up with 225x5, something's off. You should be doing more at 195, or mentally you're quitting.

Unless you think the 1RM you based your numbers on might be wrong, I'd stay where you are.

tomcornhole

You should be doing more at 195, or mentally you're quitting.

Nailed it. I was saving some because I knew I wanted to go heavier. I could have knocked out 12 at 195 if I went all in. I'll adopt that approach going forward on 5 and 3 days. On 5/3/1 day, I'm going to target 3 reps on the last set and then do single jokers up to 1RM. That makes me happy and I like doing it.

Tom

danimalkeys

You should be doing more at 195, or mentally you're quitting.

Nailed it. I was saving some because I knew I wanted to go heavier. I could have knocked out 12 at 195 if I went all in. I'll adopt that approach going forward on 5 and 3 days. On 5/3/1 day, I'm going to target 3 reps on the last set and then do single jokers up to 1RM. That makes me happy and I like doing it.

Tom

That sounds like a good plan. Even if your 1RM weights are off, if you are getting a lot of reps on your 5 and 3 days, it will still get you stronger.

I just dumped 5/3/1. I'm losing weight and my numbers keep going down. It was too frustrating to hit 2 reps of a weight I hit 5 of when I was 15lbs heavier. Rather than have to recalculate every couple months and start over, I started an intermediate 5x5 routine yesterday, but I'm also intrigued by a 3x5 plan I saw, that I'm probably going to jump into in lieu of the 5x5, where you do:

Monday
Bench 3x5
Row 3x5
Squat 3x5
SLDL 3x5

Thursday
OHP 3x5
Chins 3x5
SLDL 3x5
Squat 3x5

You superset the 1st 2 lifts and then the 2nd 2 lifts so you are doing push and then pull back to back. When you can get 3x5 of your weight, then you move to 3x6. Then to 3x7. Once you hit 7 reps, you add 5lbs to upper and 10lbs to lower, and start back over at 5 reps. This routine would fit in a lot better with what I know my recovery times are yet give enough work volume to make gains, and give room for growth at each lift at it's own pace vs following a written out plan.

tomcornhole

I like that program. Mostly because I don't need my 5/3/1 spreadsheet to execute it.

Is SLDL Stiff Legged Dead Lift?

Also, we're close to the same age. I want to lift more. I needed a week between major lifts while in a cut or at maintenance. Found that out the hard way. That's why 5/3/1 works for me. It is better in a bulk (where I am now). But not by a lot. I just don't see how I could squat and DL more than once a week. Bench and OHP would be fine right now as I am light because of a shoulder injury that is finally going away. I do a 4 day split with one major lift on each of the 4 days + BBB. With the pull-ups, chin-ups, rows, curls, dips, tricep extensions and hanging leg curls, there isn't a lot left in the tank to do any more. Maybe I need to start creatine.

How much recovery time do the 50ish crowd give themselves?

Tom

chrisdavey

SLDL's are a LOT less taxing than full deadlifts.

You will adapt to the frequency. First few weeks can be tough though.

I remember a trainer I know saying "if you wanted to increase your squat the most you could in a month, would you squat once a week?"

After you have run a smolov program everything else is low frequency though :laugh:

danimalkeys

I like that program. Mostly because I don't need my 5/3/1 spreadsheet to execute it.

Is SLDL Stiff Legged Dead Lift?

Also, we're close to the same age. I want to lift more. I needed a week between major lifts while in a cut or at maintenance. Found that out the hard way. That's why 5/3/1 works for me. It is better in a bulk (where I am now). But not by a lot. I just don't see how I could squat and DL more than once a week. Bench and OHP would be fine right now as I am light because of a shoulder injury that is finally going away. I do a 4 day split with one major lift on each of the 4 days + BBB. With the pull-ups, chin-ups, rows, curls, dips, tricep extensions and hanging leg curls, there isn't a lot left in the tank to do any more. Maybe I need to start creatine.

How much recovery time do the 50ish crowd give themselves?

Tom

I pretty much need a Monday and Thursday schedule if I'm lifting heavy with the same lifts, which is why that routine I outlined above is something that would probably work for me. I was doing ok with the 5/3/1 schedule, and I'd combine the deadlift and press day together on Thursdays. I did minimal assistance on the squat and dead/press days. 5x10 of box squats on squat day and a couple extra sets of deads and chin-ups on deadlift/press day. Bench day I was doing the bench workout, then close grip bench with chains on the bar, rows and curls, supersetting all the assistance.

Back in my powerlifting days I'd do 4 days but 2 of them were light/ assistance. Heavy bench, heavy squat, light bench/assistance, light squat/assistance. That's back when "light bench" was declines with 315 and light squat was good mornings with 405 lol.

Sarauk2sf

How long have you been bulking and how long have you been running 5/3/1?

danimalkeys

How long have you been bulking and how long have you been running 5/3/1?

Me? or o/p? I've been cutting (for almost 2 years now- 280 to my current weight) and have been running 5/3/1 since May.

Sarauk2sf

How long have you been bulking and how long have you been running 5/3/1?

Me? or o/p? I've been cutting (for almost 2 years now- 280 to my current weight) and have been running 5/3/1 since May.

OP.

5/3/1 gets tough on a long cut (they all do tbh).

I was asking as I found my strength improvements ran away from me re the normal progression for 5/3/1 when bulking. I ran the Frequency Project as it was flexible re adding weight, but really did not include enough volume imo (frequent but not a lot of volume).

jacksonpt

How long have you been bulking and how long have you been running 5/3/1?

Me? or o/p? I've been cutting (for almost 2 years now- 280 to my current weight) and have been running 5/3/1 since May.

OP.

5/3/1 gets tough on a long cut (they all do tbh).

I was asking as I found my strength improvements ran away from me re the normal progression for 5/3/1 when bulking. I ran the Frequency Project as it was flexible re adding weight, but really did not include enough volume imo (frequent but not a lot of volume).

As in... you were progressing faster than the program was advancing?

tomcornhole

How long have you been bulking and how long have you been running 5/3/1?

5 weeks bulking. 5/3/1 since May 2013. I was progressing nicely on 5/3/1 meeting the weights. Things are mucked up right now with injuries that caused my bench and OHP to go way down (injury is healed now) and form changes that caused my squat and DL to go way up. What I know for sure is that recovery is much mo better in a bulk than it was in a cut. I gotta stop the bulk though because my pants don't fit.

Tom

Sarauk2sf

How long have you been bulking and how long have you been running 5/3/1?

Me? or o/p? I've been cutting (for almost 2 years now- 280 to my current weight) and have been running 5/3/1 since May.

OP.

5/3/1 gets tough on a long cut (they all do tbh).

I was asking as I found my strength improvements ran away from me re the normal progression for 5/3/1 when bulking. I ran the Frequency Project as it was flexible re adding weight, but really did not include enough volume imo (frequent but not a lot of volume).

As in... you were progressing faster than the program was advancing?

Yep. However, I had been cutting for a year before that plus I started taking creatine which could have had something to do with it (being a vegetarian, I was probably impacted more than usual). That, plus I was doing a lot of frequency and so I think that helped with form/technique.

I do not think that it would be that much of a difference if it not for the things mentioned above all combining to significantly increase my lifts.