Yikes!
mrsnaethe
Posts: 10
Is the idea of eating clean really that unknown/unwanted? I mentioned how eating clean is optimal for health, not just weight loss, and I got my butt handed to me and my ideals questioned. I honestly thought i was giving good, common-sense advice and was told I was condescending and couldn't back my "claims" up. Whew... tough crowd.
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Yep it is a really tough crowd.
What I really hate is the constant "Give me the science" or "I can eat pizza and McDonalds and still lose weight as long as I keep under budget" and the "it's calories in, calories out - that's all that matters".
The thing is if they actually looked at the science they would be really surprised at what they would find.
The thing is I'm sure there are some people out there that want to get actually healthy not just slimmer - but you get drowned out by the vocal minority and it just makes me want to scream.
I was probably a bit naive thinking that well we're all here with almost the same goal in mind - ie to get fit and I thought that eating healthily would be a part of that but it would seem not. I've been on MFP for three whole weeks and am very disillusioned by the general community boards and attitude out there.0 -
It's always a tough crowd when you vary from what's some consider the norm. Eating unprocessed food is the norm. American's have gotten so lazy and want everything fast. I just shake my head when I walk into the grocery store and what's waiting for us at the door. Simple carbs galore. I sometimes feel like we're treated like cattle heading to the slaughter. Just corn feed us until we're nice and fat.0
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LOL - it's getting that way here in Australia too - the food companies fatten you up and then they turn around and sell you their newest diet products and the drug companies sell you the latest pill to fix what ails you - when those people go back to their "normal diet" surprise the surprise the weight comes back on so you get to have another miracle cure diet or pill and it just keeps going around in circles.
If people would just eat what they were supposed to eat they probably wouldn't have got sick/fat in the first place.
And the governments don't help because absolutely everything is driven by the economy these days. It's the food companies and drug companies that lobby government and fund the research - so where is the independence?
Yep I'll get off my soap box now - but I have been doing a lot of research on diets and government recommendations as to what we should eat and it is shocking the distortions and manipulations that have been made that are clearly not in the public interest.0 -
Denial is not just a river in Egypt...
A lot of people think they are making good food choices and put way too much faith that foods are not being modified - chemically, genetically or otherwise. I've tried talking to some of my friends and relatives about simply reading labels to understand what they are putting into their bodies. The typical response is either a deer-in-the-headlight stare or stubborn resistance. Most of them glom onto one data point to justify the 'healthiness' of a food item and disregard everything else that's potentially bad about it; for example, my mother-in-law once picked up a bag of Doritos and told me, "SEE?! Zero trans fat...they're GOOD for you!" People believe what they want to believe - it's maddening sometimes!0 -
I couldn't agree more and was shocked! People just don't want to give up their junk food and I can't even tell you the reactions I get from people when I turn down cookies in the office!0
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Yea, I was totally blown away with the replies I got. I guess people don't like to hear the truth!
I just can't fathom that it's not common knowledge that it isn't just the number of calories you eat, but the quality! People were like "that is so radical" and "that's too hard". Nothing good ever comes easy! Any type of diet/lifestyle change is difficult, and I honestly don't think this lifestyle is difficult at all. I get to eat lots of food and stay well below my caloric goals each day and I know what I'm putting in my body is good for it and isn't going to give me cancer in 10 years.
Sure it's a little more expensive but like I pointed out... what costs more, preventative or ambulatory care? Should I prevent illness now (or get rid of it in my case) or should I pay some quack to feed me useless and expensive medication?0 -
It is odd though don't you think that it is more expensive to buy good wholesome food than it is to buy mass produced junk?
It is really screwed up that a box of biscuits (cookies) is cheaper than a kilo of carrots.0 -
It is odd though don't you think that it is more expensive to buy good wholesome food than it is to buy mass produced junk?
It is really screwed up that a box of biscuits (cookies) is cheaper than a kilo of carrots.
Absolutely, I think it's ludicrous. That's definitely one of the issues in the US with our obesity problem.0 -
Yeah, I don't even try to discuss the benefits of a plant based whole food diet. I have tried, and just get gifs of dancing pop tarts.
Pretty sad, but the groups are great support!0 -
Pop Tarts - I think you can buy them here - but thankfully I don't think are that common.
Ingredients of a pop tart?
ENRICHED FLOUR (WHEAT FLOUR, NIACIN, REDUCED IRON, VITAMIN B1 [THIAMIN MONONITRATE], VITAMIN B2 [RIBOFLAVIN], FOLIC ACID), CORN SYRUP, HIGH FRUCTOSE CORN SYRUP, DEXTROSE, SOYBEAN AND PALM OIL (WITH TBHQ FOR FRESHNESS), SUGAR, CRACKER MEAL, CONTAINS TWO PERCENT OR LESS OF WHEAT STARCH, SALT, DRIED BLUEBERRIES, DRIED GRAPES, DRIED APPLES, LEAVENING (BAKING SODA, SODIUM ACID PYROPHOSPHATE, MONOCALCIUM PHOSPHATE), CITRIC ACID, MILLED CORN, GELATIN, SOYBEAN OIL, MODIFIED CORN STARCH, MODIFIED WHEAT STARCH, SOY LECITHIN, XANTHAN GUM, CARAMEL COLOR, RED 40, VITAMIN A PALMITATE, NIACINAMIDE, REDUCED IRON, NATURAL AND ARTIFICIAL FLAVOR, BLUE 2, BLUE 1, VITAMIN B6 (PYRIDOXINE HYDROCHLORIDE), COLOR ADDED, TURMERIC EXTRACT, VITAMIN B2 (RIBOFLAVIN), VITAMIN B1 (THIAMIN HYDROCHLORIDE). - from Kelloggs website.
Nutritional content of a pop tart?
Serving Size 1 Pastry
Calories 200
Total Fat 5g
Sodium 170mg
Sugars 16g
Dietary Fiber less than 1g
(Also from kelloggs)
Price of pop tarts? Funnily I had a look at where you could buy them here and found them at Lollyworld - at least Australia does seem to recognise the fact that these things are, well lollies. We don't manufacture pop tarts here so they have to be imported from America.
Box of 8 (416 grams) $10.00 (AUD)
But hey the box says they are made with real fruit so they must be health food - yes? Oh and the colour added is apparently titanium oxide - I actually use titanium oxide a lot - I have a big tube of titanium white paint here - but I hadn't thought about eating it before.
BLUEBERRIES
Ingredients
Blueberries
Nutritional Info per 100g serving
57 Calories
Total Fat 0.3 g 0%
Saturated fat 0 g 0%
Polyunsaturated fat 0.1 g
Monounsaturated fat 0 g
Cholesterol 0 mg 0%
Sodium 1 mg 0%
Potassium 77 mg 2%
Total Carbohydrate 14 g 4%
Dietary fiber 2.4 g 9%
Sugar 10 g
Protein 0.7 g 1%
Vitamin A 1% Vitamin C 16%
Calcium 0% Iron 1%
Vitamin D 0% Vitamin B-6 5%
Vitamin B-12 0% Magnesium 1%
(Straight from Google)
Price of Blueberries?
In Australia - $39.84 per kilo. (from Woolworths online).
I don't need to say anything else do I?0 -
And keep in mind a little foil-like container comes with 2 pop tarts. No one eats ONE.
It's 400 calories of nothingness. It's not horrible. It's not plastic.
I just don't get it. A box has 3 2-packs. So...3 days of snack? Or one, I suppose.
ps: you picked a FRUIT pop tart. Many are not that.0 -
Yep I picked a frosted blueberry one - at least it had something in the name of it that resembled a food.
But apparently you can't give people healthy food advice on the board unless you fit into what they consider to be the perfect example of whatever their idea of clean eating is. As the OP found out the vultures will circle and pick your food diary apart. I wasn't aware that clean eating required absolute 100% perfection all of the time - my own aim is to do the best I can most of the time.
I have one day a fortnight when I don't have a choice - when I travel to the nearest big town to shop (it's a 140 kilometre round trip) and I eat at McDonalds on that one day and when I get back home I will get myself and the children Subway for dinner mainly because I am too tired to cook. It's like a treat for them - and me to have a night off from cooking but I doubt very much that I would be able to go on the main board and give any sort of clean or healthy eating advice because I put McDonalds and Subway in my diary which is public. If I made it private it would probably be something like why is your diary private what have you got to hide? It's definitely a double standard because you wouldn't get the same reaction if you went through their diary and picked out that they actually did eat fruit or vegetables.0 -
Part of it is the prevailing dogma on the boards is "diets don't work". So anything that sounds like a diet is BAD. Somehow these same folks don't believe that weighing, measuring and counting junk food to meet X calories and some arbitrary macro percentages is DIETING.0
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And funnily dieting is exactly what they are doing.
I suppose it has something to do with the mindset that dieting means that you have to eat just lettuce leaves and drink only water and do a lot of rigorous exercise. Of course that sort of diet would never work in the long term because it would be impossible to stick to. So I suppose "diets don't work" does make sense in that context.0 -
I'm sure that's why. It's the extremes that will keep getting folks into trouble.And funnily dieting is exactly what they are doing.
I suppose it has something to do with the mindset that dieting means that you have to eat just lettuce leaves and drink only water and do a lot of rigorous exercise. Of course that sort of diet would never work in the long term because it would be impossible to stick to. So I suppose "diets don't work" does make sense in that context.
I do wonder about the "I eat crap everyday" folks who swear they will count forever, and the others who swear they'll just exercise self control.0 -
I saw a thread yesterday - this woman said she didn't want to change her lifestyle, wanted to eat whatever she wanted, didn't want to be a gym junkie etc etc and I did notice that one poor low carber got shot down. It was apparently obvious from the initial post that she was having a huge dig at anything that she considered a "fad" diet.
I was admittedly curious and posted on her thread - just to see what happened. I thought I was polite - just simply gave some advice about swapping higher calorie foods for lower calorie foods (didn't even mention vegetables once). I would consider the replies I got both aggressive and defensive. At one stage she even tried to make out that I was some sort of creep for asking what the thread was really about.
The reactions I got have me somewhat intrigued.0 -
I recall several years ago myself and a few others wanted to turn off the whole "net calories" thing. You would have thought I said something horrific the reaction we got!
Folks are so very sure they are doing it right. There's no room for anything different in their heads, nor any sense that there my be different kinds of "right".0 -
It can be a bit discouraging out on the main-boards at times. I like to think the majority are the quiet members that skip responding to those threadss....because really why should anyone have to justify eating healthier when looking to lose, gain, or maintain.Yep it is a really tough crowd.
What I really hate is the constant "Give me the science" or "I can eat pizza and McDonald's and still lose weight as long as I keep under budget" and the "it's calories in, calories out - that's all that matters".
The thing is if they actually looked at the science they would be really surprised at what they would find.
The thing is I'm sure there are some people out there that want to get actually healthy not just slimmer - but you get drowned out by the vocal minority and it just makes me want to scream.
I was probably a bit naive thinking that well we're all here with almost the same goal in mind - ie to get fit and I thought that eating healthily would be a part of that but it would seem not. I've been on MFP for three whole weeks and am very disillusioned by the general community boards and attitude out there.
Congrats on being here for your health, glad you joined up 3 weeks ago...try not to be discouraged by the negative talk but sometimes it is easier to stay away from the main-boards for a bit. I take breaks from it or I'd be needing a hat as I'd have pulled all my hair out by now!
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The pop tart brigade has actually been a bit quieter lately. Where's jonnythan been? He's one of the primary folks who proudly declares that his diet is fueled by processed crap.
These fellows have gone so far as to say there are vital nutrients in the crap they eat and that we don't need to worry because the processed foods they love are "fortified" and "enriched". They really put their faith in the food industry.
But then, they are of the mind that macros and calorie counts are all that matter.0 -
pop tart brigade.. yes it does seem there is one! I noticed too that it's been quieter on the pop tart front...The pop tart brigade has actually been a bit quieter lately. Where's jonnythan been? He's one of the primary folks who proudly declares that his diet is fueled by processed crap.
These fellows have gone so far as to say there are vital nutrients in the crap they eat and that we don't need to worry because the processed foods they love are "fortified" and "enriched". They really put their faith in the food industry.
But then, they are of the mind that macros and calorie counts are all that matter.
Finally posting in the group...should have jumped in much sooner... enjoying the conversation and nice to be among ppl that don't worship pop tarts!:drinker: 0 -
I agree--I thought the community aspect would be more positive. I left WW for MFP for that reason. WW pushes their own foods in packages and I don't usually eat from packages. (or would prefer not to eat that way). Thanks for your positive comments!
btw, this is in response to mungowungo's post from a few days ago--my system was slow in serving up all the subsequent posts0 -
It's open season on clean eating on the boards today. Yesterday they announced the new mods and one of them promptly mocked clean eating in one of his posts. I commented on it on the now locked thread about the new mods and it was removed... but it doesn't bode well (and is odd given his user name is about minimalist shoes).
Oh well. I should spend less time here anyway.:drinker:0 -
that's not a good sign, plus the other that magically dropped off the list due to photosIt's open season on clean eating on the boards today. Yesterday they announced the new mods and one of them promptly mocked clean eating in one of his posts. I commented on it on the now locked thread about the new mods and it was removed... but it doesn't bode well (and is odd given his user name is about minimalist shoes).
Oh well. I should spend less time here anyway.:drinker:0 -
And I now know what you meant about Jonnythan........ he is apparently back.0
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Hes back alright. Boy he loves to argue just for the sake of arguing.And I now know what you meant about Jonnythan........ he is apparently back.0 -
Late to the party ( this thread, that is!)! I recently posted about the number of carcinogens still allowed in our food....I wasn't trashed nearly as badly as I thought I could/would be. But I also stay on point when discussing on forums too. There are many many many yahoos who want to taunt you into arguing. And I love when the tinfoil hat gifs come flying out too!
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1147808-donuts?page=5 .....btw that jonnythan was part of the "conversation"....ermergosh....I would like very much to quiet that one with a well placed twinkie! ; )
Suffice it to say: People on the forums literally want to have their poptarts and eat them too. They don't want to believe that we have things readily sold to consumers that can be harmful. The Marketers from these companies have done an outstanding job in terms of "snow job" on the masses.0 -
What baffles me is that some of them (I can think of 3) will simultaneously say that a "paleo diet" isn't healthy (one of them called it dangerous, and another said we don't know enough about it to not think it's dangerous), while then going on about how heavily processed crap is fine. They sure are trusting souls...Trusting in the food scientists and food marketers anyway.
"Wheat Belly" doctor is dangerous while having ketchup with 3 kinds of sugar, including two invented in the last 50 or so years is good common sense.0 -
I support clean eating 100%, till those people eat clean they will not know how their health is being affected. I have read everything on clean eating and how beneficial it is. Some think that they can eat anything and stay fit, but truth is they may look good on the outside but the inside doesn't look great. I have had many people question me about my clean eating usually I don't even answer with a response because it is my health I am working on and they may never get that until they realize that I was right. Keep doing what you are doing.0
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lol. Yes.....the dangers of clean eating and paleo diet, vegan....organic. Yet artificial everything is fine because "the FDA says it's safe"....trusting souls indeed! The logic is completely flawed. Spock would be astounded (haha)!
I do think that the tide is turning in some of the markets for alternatives to the middle isle junk. For example, did you know that Kroger is increasing it's line "Simple Truth" because consumer demand for natural, organic foods has increased--and the company is listening! Kraft took out some of the artificial colors from their products....many, many success stories for 2013!
I just read this great article about how young farmers are turning toward non-gmo farming....the market is growing, thus the demand. If anyone is interested:
http://www.non-gmoreport.com/articles/january2014/young-farmers-see-opportunities-growing-non-gmo.php0 -
And then don't forget that the testing of artificial sweeteners was done on specially bred rats that are prone to cancer anyway so the results of the studies aren't correct - so they have to be safe, right? ....... (Yes, I am being sarcastic)0
This discussion has been closed.