An aspect of keto I don't quite understand..

StrongCurves

I just posted this question to food and nutrition but was informed I'd be better off posting it here! (Obviously)

I've read a lot about keto and seen some fantastic weight loss results in people on this diet. However there's just one thing I'm having a bit of trouble understanding and that's consuming between 25-50grams of carbohydrates a day. There are 11 grams of carbohydrates in a banana, even my vegtable smoothie which consists of variety of green vegtables has 5 grams! I assume there's possibly something I'm not quite understanding about this type of diet. I understand how it works but I don't quite understand how it's possible to consume so few carbs.

My goal is to lose fat and gain some lean muscle. However I'm consuming perhaps 100 grams of protein a day and find it difficult to integrate a lot of fat into my diet without consuming over the recommened amount of carbs a day for keto. I'm new to this and get quite confused and find it difficult to wade through all the diet fads and find out which information is correct as so much of it is conflicting.

Would love to hear about peoples experiences/success stories who have done keto!

thatdupeally

This isn't a fruit eaters diet. I eat 15-20 carbs a day. I have for two years. Smoothies are pretty much out of the picture. It's not hard if you can do without sugar. I eat veggies but only low-carb veggies. Take a look at this food guide! https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ah8MbmZepQxWdGo4bnB2QmxxMUlmTzZUTXYzMURRLWc#gid=0

albertabeefy

As has been mentioned, fruit is high in sugar/carbohydrate compared to most vegetables. All the nutrients and vitamins you find in fruit you can find in similarly coloured vegetables for MUCH less calories, carbs and sugar.

The only fruit I eat regularly are berries - mostly strawberries and raspberries. And only 1/4 to 1/3 a cup at a time.

I'm fortunate in that as a large, active guy with a fast metabolism I can eat more calories and carbohydrates and still stay keto adapted. Today, for example, I had about 65g (net) of carbohydrate. But that's at about 3,000 calories - so it's fairly similar to a 1,500 calorie diet with ~30g of carbohydrate.

Most of your carbohydrate should come from non-starchy vegetable sources. Leafy greens are especially nutrient dense. I had about 9 full cups of greens tonight in my salad (yeah, I'm a huge eater) which was only 9g net of carbohydrate. For most people a serving is about 3 cups - so 3g of carb.

If you get the bulk of your carbohydrate from non-starchy vegetables, and only take in limited high-fiber fruit (small servings of berries, etc.) you'll actually find it difficult going over 30g in a day unless you eat copious amounts like I do.

Oh and smoothies don't have to be out of the picture ... but FRUIT smoothies are. I tend to make keto protein shakes (2/3 of a scoop of whey isolate, 1/4c berries, 1/2c (or more) of heavy cream and 1/3 cup of baby spinach) and they're extremely low-carb (about 6% of calories from carbohydrate) and at a great macronutrient ratio for ketogenic dieting. (Obviously, though, someone eating less calories would have less of it overall - probably 1/2 what I do in a sitting, as mine are often 600+ calories each)

thatdupeally

As has been mentioned, fruit is high in sugar/carbohydrate compared to most vegetables. All the nutrients and vitamins you find in fruit you can find in similarly coloured vegetables for MUCH less calories, carbs and sugar.

The only fruit I eat regularly are berries - mostly strawberries and raspberries. And only 1/4 to 1/3 a cup at a time.

I'm fortunate in that as a large, active guy with a fast metabolism I can eat more calories and carbohydrates and still stay keto adapted. Today, for example, I had about 65g (net) of carbohydrate. But that's at about 3,000 calories - so it's fairly similar to a 1,500 calorie diet with ~30g of carbohydrate.

Most of your carbohydrate should come from non-starchy vegetable sources. Leafy greens are especially nutrient dense. I had about 9 full cups of greens tonight in my salad (yeah, I'm a huge eater) which was only 9g net of carbohydrate. For most people a serving is about 3 cups - so 3g of carb.

If you get the bulk of your carbohydrate from non-starchy vegetables, and only take in limited high-fiber fruit (small servings of berries, etc.) you'll actually find it difficult going over 30g in a day unless you eat copious amounts like I do.

Oh and smoothies don't have to be out of the picture ... but FRUIT smoothies are. I tend to make keto protein shakes (2/3 of a scoop of whey isolate, 1/4c berries, 1/2c (or more) of heavy cream and 1/3 cup of baby spinach) and they're extremely low-carb (about 6% of calories from carbohydrate) and at a great macronutrient ratio for ketogenic dieting. (Obviously, though, someone eating less calories would have less of it overall - probably 1/2 what I do in a sitting, as mine are often 600+ calories each)

I did smoothies when I first started with carbsmart yogurt, strawberries, and HWC but now It just doesn't fit my macros. I'd rather have cheesecake lol

StrongCurves

Thanks for the list! Really helpful

Skoster1

If you get the bulk of your carbohydrate from non-starchy vegetables, and only take in limited high-fiber fruit (small servings of berries, etc.) you'll actually find it difficult going over 30g in a day unless you eat copious amounts like I do.

QFT!

My net carb limit daily is 23 grams and I am virtually always under, sometimes by as much as 11 grams. Even the other day when I was just freakishly hungry and ate almost 600 calories over my goal I was still under on carbs by 3g.

I eat somewhere in the neighborhood of 1/4 to 1/3 kg of green leafy veggies per day (I include things like celery and bok choy even though parts aren't leafy since they're similar carb-wise). Even with my avocado obsession (I seriously love those things now, they're like my keto-candy!!) I don't have any real issue with carbs.

Just remember, net carbs are what's important, not total carbs. Subtract that fiber!

rubywanderlust

I've been trialling a keto diet for a couple of weeks now. For the first week it took me some time to wrap my head around just how much fat you need to take in to make up for the carbs, and where I was getting a lot of hidden carbs in my diet. Fruit is pretty much out, but it have found that a small amount of frozen berries mixed with some creme fraiche gives me a hit of sweet that is offset by high fat. Milk and yoghurt were contributing a lot of carbs to my diet, which I didn't expect. I cut those out, and added high fat foods instead, and it helped with getting the carbs down.

I'm on roughly 1500 calories per day, and feel very good, not hungry for the most part. I've also lost 5 lbs, but suspect a lot is water.
Because I don't think keto is a diet I want to pursue for the long term (not that I think there is anything wrong with it, it just isn't what I want as a lifestyle). I'm using it more as a way to educate myself on where carbs are, what effect they have on my body and appetite and then will attempt to reintegrate some low GL carbs back into my diet (beans, for example) on a moderate scale.

I did find I had to drink a LOT more water or herbal tea or else I'd start to feel a little shaky. That has passed and it really is quite easy to maintain. Finding hgh fat foods after avoiding them my whole adult life is the real challenge. Cavemanketo.com has some good recipes, and preparing meals in advance has been very helpful. As well as dramatically increasing my veggie intake.

Miamiuu

I always suggest people try low carbing out and see if its for them. I dont get high energy when I low carb so I only do it for a short period of time. I dont take the time to count fiber, or fat and just watch carbs. I lose weight on this diet when I do it. Thats why I do it. I like the feeling of being full most of the time.

rubywanderlust

I always suggest people try low carbing out and see if its for them. I dont get high energy when I low carb so I only do it for a short period of time. I dont take the time to count fiber, or fat and just watch carbs. I lose weight on this diet when I do it. Thats why I do it. I like the feeling of being full most of the time.

I'm curious, what happens one some resumes a "normal" healthy diet which incorporates carbs, after a very low carb diet? Do the pounds stay off unless you overeat?

I'm fortunate that I don't really have a weight or health issue that requires a major dietary change. However that also means I'm not strongly motivated to continue this for long, especially as I like to cook and don't want to be restricted by counting carbs. It does mean that I can try all those high fat French recipes I've always avoided, though.:laugh:

albertabeefy

I'm curious, what happens one some resumes a "normal" healthy diet which incorporates carbs, after a very low carb diet? Do the pounds stay off unless you overeat?

One will regain some water-weight as glycogen reserves are again replenished, but no - you won't gain bodyfat unless you over-eat.

If, however, you adopted the diet for reasons of glycemic control, and re-incorporate carbohydrate, your glycemic control may not be as tight ... In this situation it's best to monitor blood glucose levels while re-introducing dietary carbohydrate slowly to see what you tolerate and still maintain healthy control.

Skoster1

I always suggest people try low carbing out and see if its for them. I dont get high energy when I low carb so I only do it for a short period of time. I dont take the time to count fiber, or fat and just watch carbs. I lose weight on this diet when I do it. Thats why I do it. I like the feeling of being full most of the time.

I'm curious, what happens one some resumes a "normal" healthy diet which incorporates carbs, after a very low carb diet? Do the pounds stay off unless you overeat?

I'm fortunate that I don't really have a weight or health issue that requires a major dietary change. However that also means I'm not strongly motivated to continue this for long, especially as I like to cook and don't want to be restricted by counting carbs. It does mean that I can try all those high fat French recipes I've always avoided, though.:laugh:

From what I've read, in order to maintain the weight loss one needs to:

1. Use weight training to change the body composition into one which has enough muscle to have a sustainable maintenance calorie level (e.g. don't end up skinny-fat)
2. Stabilize the weight loss by staying low carb at maintenance calories for a while
3. Slowly reintroduce carbs while keeping a close watch on maintaining maintenance calories
4. Understand that the water weight will come back, so adjust calorie intake to take that into account while reintroducing carbs

It's easy to forget how easy it is to go way over maintenance calories on a SAD (Standard American Diet). I figure it's less about the carbs putting the weight back on and more about the ease with one can eat way over maintenance.

Especially those of us with less effective off switches for eating.

I can sit down and eat a pizza. Not some pizza, *a* pizza. Not a small pizza, *A LARGE* pizza. A large, deep dish, Chicago style, stuffed with everything pizza. My off switch for eating is crappy, which is why it's doubly important for me to track every last gram. Sometimes I feel silly tracking things like spices, and I overestimate them massively so that they show a carb (or I combine several meals worth of spices into one entry), but I know myself, and I cannot be trusted around food without that oversight.

Leonidas_meets_Spartacus

I always suggest people try low carbing out and see if its for them. I dont get high energy when I low carb so I only do it for a short period of time. I dont take the time to count fiber, or fat and just watch carbs. I lose weight on this diet when I do it. Thats why I do it. I like the feeling of being full most of the time.

I'm curious, what happens one some resumes a "normal" healthy diet which incorporates carbs, after a very low carb diet? Do the pounds stay off unless you overeat?

I'm fortunate that I don't really have a weight or health issue that requires a major dietary change. However that also means I'm not strongly motivated to continue this for long, especially as I like to cook and don't want to be restricted by counting carbs. It does mean that I can try all those high fat French recipes I've always avoided, though.:laugh:

If some one has metabolic syndrome of Insulin resistance like 64 Million Americans, the lucky ones who lost weight on low carb will gain back most of the weight once they go to Standard American Diet. Weight loss/ gain is much more than calories and calories out . Hormones play a big role on hunger management lipogenisis etc.

albertabeefy

Weight loss/ gain is much more than calories and calories out . Hormones play a big role on hunger management lipogenisis etc.

It's a little confusing to many as it sort of IS still calories-in/calories-out ... BUT it's the calories OUT part of the equation that seems to change.

When I was morbidly obese I was eating roughly 2,800 calories a day - basically around 50/20/30 ratio of carb/protein/fat. I slowly gained a few pounds every year which took me up to a high of ~350lbs. (The highest I ever measured was 355, but it fluctuated.) According to most BMR and TDEE calculators, I should've been LOSING weight, but wasn't. And yes, I measured my intake very carefully so I know what I was consuming prior to starting the ketogenic diet.

When I started the VLCKD (for the first year I stayed under 30g/day net) something changed with my metabolism. I changed to 5 meals a day, all measured/weighed to be exactly 550 calories each. That's 2,750 calories a day. I lost 70lbs in 3 months. On a whopping 350 calorie per WEEK caloric reduction.

Sure, I started exercising later on... but the first two weeks was NO exercise, and the first few weeks after that was between 2 and 10 minutes a day. So it wasn't enough to hugely impact the calories-in/calories-out formula.

So when Leonidas says it's not just about "calories-in / calories-out" he's correct, because there's literally 10's of thousands of us for whom the "calories-out" side of the equation changes dramatically with just the dietary change. I personally don't want it to change BACK.

Deborah105

@thatdupeally - that is a fantastic spread sheet! Thank you!

thatdupeally

@thatdupeally - that is a fantastic spread sheet! Thank you!

No prob!

vixy83

Hi i can't seem to view the spreadsheet and would love a gander, could you repost please @thatdupeally :-)

Skoster1

Hi i can't seem to view the spreadsheet and would love a gander, could you repost please @thatdupeally :-)

http://tinyurl.com/73xeleb

I made a tinyurl of it so it doesn't go across a line break.