Advice on openers and progression
tomcornhole
Posts: 1,084 Member
Been posting this on my home page, but wanted quick input from everyone here, too.
Meet is 3 May. Finishing up my 3 week (of 5/3/1) this week. I feel strong. In Maintenance right now. Close to meet weight (200 vs 198.4)
Plan to hit my openers next week and then rest for a week. All 1RM's were tested 1 month ago and are actual weights (I just weighed all my plates and bar). The weights are a little weird because the federation I am lifting in uses kilos. All weights listed are in lbs. Here's what I'm thinking for lifts:
Squat
264.6 Open
286.6 Second
303.1 Final
296.0 PR
Bench
215.0 Open (I have tripled this paused)
231.5 Second (never tried this paused. I did do 2x223 paused this week. That was tough)
242.5 Final (done this touch and go for 1RM)
242.0 PR (not paused. no clue what paused is but I just started paused bench and it is a LOT harder)
DL
385.8 Open
429.9 Second
440.9 Final
437.0 PR
Total if I hit all final lifts is 986.61, which is short of my 1,000 lbs goal, but I do hit 3 PR's.
I can hit the openers for triples now if I went downstairs and did some minimal warmup work. The second I have done many times in the gym but not all on the same day. I've hit those numbers for doubles (except for bench). The third round is, well, I have no clue. Never moved those numbers and certainly never on the same day, in a meet, that is my first meet, wearing goofy clothes, while some guy is yelling commands at me with many people watching and judging me.
Appreciate your thoughts. I am stoked.
Tom
Meet is 3 May. Finishing up my 3 week (of 5/3/1) this week. I feel strong. In Maintenance right now. Close to meet weight (200 vs 198.4)
Plan to hit my openers next week and then rest for a week. All 1RM's were tested 1 month ago and are actual weights (I just weighed all my plates and bar). The weights are a little weird because the federation I am lifting in uses kilos. All weights listed are in lbs. Here's what I'm thinking for lifts:
Squat
264.6 Open
286.6 Second
303.1 Final
296.0 PR
Bench
215.0 Open (I have tripled this paused)
231.5 Second (never tried this paused. I did do 2x223 paused this week. That was tough)
242.5 Final (done this touch and go for 1RM)
242.0 PR (not paused. no clue what paused is but I just started paused bench and it is a LOT harder)
DL
385.8 Open
429.9 Second
440.9 Final
437.0 PR
Total if I hit all final lifts is 986.61, which is short of my 1,000 lbs goal, but I do hit 3 PR's.
I can hit the openers for triples now if I went downstairs and did some minimal warmup work. The second I have done many times in the gym but not all on the same day. I've hit those numbers for doubles (except for bench). The third round is, well, I have no clue. Never moved those numbers and certainly never on the same day, in a meet, that is my first meet, wearing goofy clothes, while some guy is yelling commands at me with many people watching and judging me.
Appreciate your thoughts. I am stoked.
Tom
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Replies
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Congrats on doing your first meet.
I was ironically planning to do one on the same day as yours but the injury back in February is still not 100% so it ain't happening.
Regarding your question, I'll leave that to Sara and anyone else with PL meet experience who wishes to chime in.0 -
First, any lift you make is now a "real" PR, because it is done under meet conditions.
Openers get you in the game and keep you there, so I think what you have selected is fine. It's going to be a long day, and by the time you deadlift, your body will be screaming from squats and bench and might be tightening up, so be flexible. Stay hydrated and bring some snacks along that are nutrient dense but not too heavy to affect your stomach.
For your 2nds, you need to gauge how your openers feel. If any of them feel heavy then adjust accordingly. I've done meets before where my opener felt like a ton and I knew it wasn't going to be a good day. I've had meets where PR weight felt like a feather. That video I posted to your home page was a 3rd attempt and a PR. I took a 4th attempt for a state record that was 20lbs heavier and it flew up- I was good for another 50lbs over the weight in that vid, but I had never touched the 4th attempt weight even in the gym, so how would I know how it would feel? Just how it goes sometimes... those are the days you want on the platform!
If you miss a 2nd, take it again as a 3rd. If you nail it, then go all out on your 3rds, that's where you push yourself beyond what you've ever done before.0 -
I'll agree with everything danimalkeys said. I had my first meet at the end of March - it was a blast. Sara had recommended that I use a weight that I could get an easy triple for my openers. That's what I did, and went a little conservative on squat, dropping another 20 lbs - wanted to make sure that, for my first lift, all I had to do was wait for the squat and rack commands.
After that, it was just a matter of taking things how they felt. My 2nd deadlift was a PR by 10 lbs. My original thought for 3rd DL was about 30 lbs less than I what I did, but it felt so easy (chalk and adrenaline are wonderful), I was feeling it. So I went up quite a bit, and like danimalkeys mentioned, the weight I pulled for my 3rd felt good.
All that said, your plan seems solid, to me. Here's a link that I think IronPlayground shared a few weeks ago, regarding selections. http://www.marylandpowerlifting.com/page.asp?contentID=135
And Jim Wendler, in the 5/3/1 for Powerlifting book, suggests taking your meet goal (3rd lift), and using 85% of that for your first and 92.5% for your 2nd.
No matter what you end up deciding, have fun and enjoy the experience.0 -
The advice I received, was to make your opener something you can nail in your sleep. Make your third a "balls out PR", and split the difference between the two for your second. Also very important to factor in how you're feeling that day. If you're feeling off and your warmups are feeling heavy (which happens sometimes and it sucks), then adjust your attempts accordingly.0
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Been posting this on my home page, but wanted quick input from everyone here, too.
Meet is 3 May. Finishing up my 3 week (of 5/3/1) this week. I feel strong. In Maintenance right now. Close to meet weight (200 vs 198.4)
Plan to hit my openers next week and then rest for a week. All 1RM's were tested 1 month ago and are actual weights (I just weighed all my plates and bar). The weights are a little weird because the federation I am lifting in uses kilos. All weights listed are in lbs. Here's what I'm thinking for lifts:
Squat
264.6 Open
286.6 Second
303.1 Final
296.0 PR
Bench
215.0 Open (I have tripled this paused)
231.5 Second (never tried this paused. I did do 2x223 paused this week. That was tough)
242.5 Final (done this touch and go for 1RM)
242.0 PR (not paused. no clue what paused is but I just started paused bench and it is a LOT harder)
DL
385.8 Open
429.9 Second
440.9 Final
437.0 PR
Total if I hit all final lifts is 986.61, which is short of my 1,000 lbs goal, but I do hit 3 PR's.
I can hit the openers for triples now if I went downstairs and did some minimal warmup work. The second I have done many times in the gym but not all on the same day. I've hit those numbers for doubles (except for bench). The third round is, well, I have no clue. Never moved those numbers and certainly never on the same day, in a meet, that is my first meet, wearing goofy clothes, while some guy is yelling commands at me with many people watching and judging me.
Appreciate your thoughts. I am stoked.
Tom
you know where i stand on this. i think you are selling yourself a bit short on the openers and basically waisting the lift. i did the same at my first meet and i paid for it on squat and bench both by having to make too big of a jump from lift to lift. in my opinion i would take the openers up by 10lbs at least. especially deadlift. thats a 45lb jump from 1 to 2.... plus you should just be able to tell them the pounds and not worry about the kilos.0 -
Your plan sounds good. It's your first meet and so a little conservative is good - get good lifts on the board.
I usually have a range in my head. My opener has been an easy 3 (actually, an easy 5 in some cases where I am unsure due to cutting weight) - well, in my vast experience of 3 meets, lol. Use your warm ups to also gauge if your opener still feels right. I would only change (you can change as long as your flight is still 5 mins (I think it is) from starting lifting) is you feel really good or really bad - don't nickel and dime it or second guess yourself.
Have a range in your head for your second and third before you start the meet - you will need to tell them what your next lift is within 1 minute of finishing your lift. I find a range is good as you can go on the upper end if the lift felt good, or the lower if it felt heavy. Obviously, you can go outside this range, but for your first meet, there will be so much going on that is new, it is just one less thing to have to worry about too much. They should have a chart readily available with kg to lb conversion that makes it easier to give them your lifts. At the USAPL meet in LA they had it on a big flipchart on an easel.
Also, I would recommend having your warm ups laid out. But be prepared to be a bit flexible with your weights as you will probably have to work in with others.0 -
Good point on the warmups. You can't be using 5's and 10's and working out 5/3/1 warmup percentages. 45's and 25's are what everyone will be using. I always warmed up at home the same way I did on meet day so it was all routine and comfortable.
Typically, I'd do:
Squat- 135x8 185x5 225x3 275x3 315x1 365x1 405x1 maybe 455x1 then open around 500
bench- bar x10 95x10 135x5x185x3 225x1 275x1 315x1 365x1 then open 405-425 or so.
Deadliftt 135x5 225x3 315x1 405x1 455x1 then open with 525.0 -
Good point on the warmups. You can't be using 5's and 10's and working out 5/3/1 warmup percentages. 45's and 25's are what everyone will be using. I always warmed up at home the same way I did on meet day so it was all routine and comfortable.
Typically, I'd do:
Squat- 135x8 185x5 225x3 275x3 315x1 365x1 405x1 maybe 455x1 then open around 500
bench- bar x10 95x10 135x5x185x3 225x1 275x1 315x1 365x1 then open 405-425 or so.
Deadliftt 135x5 225x3 315x1 405x1 455x1 then open with 525.
holy crap dude0 -
Thanks everyone. This has been a ****e week for lifting. Everything feels heavy and easy numbers are hard. Today was supposed to be 3x385 on DL and I could barely get 3x365. Might be a bit overtrained, might just be bad week. 4 days off and then I plan to hit my openers for squat and bench on Saturday and DL on Sunday. Then rest until the meet. As it sits right now, if the meet were this Saturday I would open with 245, 205 and 365.0
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you know where i stand on this. i think you are selling yourself a bit short on the openers and basically waisting the lift. i did the same at my first meet and i paid for it on squat and bench both by having to make too big of a jump from lift to lift. in my opinion i would take the openers up by 10lbs at least. especially deadlift. thats a 45lb jump from 1 to 2.... plus you should just be able to tell them the pounds and not worry about the kilos.
What are your thoughts on going light on the opener and if it feels easy, making a big jump on the 2nd and stopping by the warmup room for an quick 1x hit on a mid weight? For example, right now for squat I am looking at 245, 265, 285. If I open at 245 and everything is feeling light, then give them 285 for a second and hit 265 for 1 in the warmup room before the second lift. In a 15 person flight, there seems to be plenty of time to knock out a quick single and not hurt recovery. At least at the meet I watched last weekend there was.0 -
I've only done 2 meets. My first meet I was nervous about squats, so I put in a really low # for my opener. I got it, but then attempted a 50lb jump on attempt 2 which was way too much of a jump for me. So for squat at least when I am strategizing my opener, it is something I have hit for a double or triple in the gym, multiple times, and to depth! But not particularly something I can do "in my sleep" because that won't prime me for a heavy 2nd attempt.
My typical strategy is this:
1: something I've gotten multiple times for a triple or double
2. something around my gym PR +/- 5-10lbs (depending on how attempt 1 went)
3. 5-10lb PR, maybe a bit more on DL if I'm on fire
My coach give me a big fat NO when I suggested an intermediate warm up weight between attempts 1 and 2 like you mentioned in your last post. I didn't ask for further explanation, but I figure he's my coach and he's done a lot more of these than I have ;-) There's really less time than you'd think, and the following flight will be in there getting warmed up too.0 -
Good point on the warmups. You can't be using 5's and 10's and working out 5/3/1 warmup percentages. 45's and 25's are what everyone will be using. I always warmed up at home the same way I did on meet day so it was all routine and comfortable.
Typically, I'd do:
Squat- 135x8 185x5 225x3 275x3 315x1 365x1 405x1 maybe 455x1 then open around 500
bench- bar x10 95x10 135x5x185x3 225x1 275x1 315x1 365x1 then open 405-425 or so.
Deadliftt 135x5 225x3 315x1 405x1 455x1 then open with 525.
holy crap dude
That was 7-8 years ago, with full powerlifting gear, and at least 50-60lbs heavier than I am now. Those weights would crush me today. I'm lifting about half that now, though it's for 5-7 reps. I have no idea what my maxes are, I wouldn't even attempt one because I'm not training for that anymore.0 -
Thanks everyone. This has been a ****e week for lifting. Everything feels heavy and easy numbers are hard. Today was supposed to be 3x385 on DL and I could barely get 3x365. Might be a bit overtrained, might just be bad week. 4 days off and then I plan to hit my openers for squat and bench on Saturday and DL on Sunday. Then rest until the meet. As it sits right now, if the meet were this Saturday I would open with 245, 205 and 365.
Do your deadlift on Friday and squat/bench Sunday or Monday. Deadlifts take the most out of you and take the longest to recover from.0 -
What are your thoughts on going light on the opener and if it feels easy, making a big jump on the 2nd and stopping by the warmup room for an quick 1x hit on a mid weight? For example, right now for squat I am looking at 245, 265, 285. If I open at 245 and everything is feeling light, then give them 285 for a second and hit 265 for 1 in the warmup room before the second lift. In a 15 person flight, there seems to be plenty of time to knock out a quick single and not hurt recovery. At least at the meet I watched last weekend there was.
No. Don't undercut your opener. Something you can triple is a good conservative lift. Definitely no additional warmups. You'll have plenty of adrenaline and if you decide on a bigger jump, you can do it. In my post above where I mentioned my warmups and then openers, My 2nd attempts on squat and deadlift would typically be 50-60lbs more than my opener. Bench I'd go 20-30lbs depending on how the opener and warmups went.
A 15 person flight will go pretty quick. The key is, how many flights will they have? Better to rest up and mentally prepare for your next attempts. Visualize the lift, every step of the way.0
