Paleo Pup?
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You not only misunderstood me, so does the author of the blurb you posted - who is a proponent of raw diets and is propagandizing.While dogs are more omnivorous than cats (you should see my basset hound up on his hind legs eating the low-hanging figs from my tree), our dogs are also on a grain-free diet.
http://rawfed.com/myths/omnivores.html
Also, just because an animal does eat something, it doesn't mean it's in any way good for them or that they get any nutrition out of it.
I said "more omnivorous than cats" - dogs are also carnivores, but cats are obligate carnivores - meaning in the wild, felids only eat animals. The facts about dogs in the wild indicate that dogs eat raw meat but, unlike cats, can get a good portion of their necessary nutrition from fruit and plants. A hungry wild dog may eat a fruit or a plant (like my basset and the fig tree), but a hungry wild cat will not.
A raw diet may be better for dogs and cats - assuming that the appropriate nutrients are included. Humans and dogs can produce taurine - so it is not needed; cats cannot (one of the distinctives of an obligate carnivore) and so it must be added.
You are right, though I'd be careful with using the term "omnivorous" to describe dogs at all. As stupid as it is (to me, at least), it's a controversial thing over whether dogs are carnivores or omnivores.
Dogs are facultative carnivores, and don't suffer as much from less meat or lacking certain nutrients for a while, whereas, like you mentioned, cats are obligate carnivores, and suffer greatly from even a single meal that lacks certain nutrients. Dogs can eat more non-meat foods, but, they don't get much in the way of nutrients from it -- they simply don't have the gut composition or flora to really get much out of it.
And the "blurb" was my own, not a quote from the link. Being able to do something, and it being good or ideal are two different things. Sounds familiar, doesn't it?
On a side note, the site I linked is no more propagandizing than the myriad of Paleo books and websites thrown around this group (and arguably, it's not even as bad as some, since it doesn't have books or products to sell). It also has quite a few more sources cited than most other sites claiming canine dietary needs (hell, even Wikipedia, which is usually a good place to find citations for certain claims, has a "citation needed" note for the line saying "dogs are omnivorous"). The myths following the one I linked are quite fascinating, actually.
But anywho, I'm really not trying to fight, so I'll just stop at this point, since I suspect even the above will be taken as argumentative (it's really not meant to be, I just don't know how else to phrase it).0 -
We're cool
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My "fancy" old farm dog has been grain-free for about 3 years since he had a ton of skin issues and smelled like a corn chip on regular dog food.
He has a healthy helping of green beans every night to keep his weight down.
He also loves carrots, sweet potatoes, kale, spinach, cauliflower, strawberries and tomatoes just to name a few.
He eats pretty good!
He had knee repair surgery last year so he has to stay light to help his joints so the green beans help him feel fuller.
Since he's been grain free, he's maintained a healthy weight and has no stomach issues..unless he decides to steal a box of Godiva...like at Christmas.0 -
Please do keep us up to date with this, it is an interesting situation and I love hearing about successes that trump current medical opinion. Out vet had us remove our cat's canned tuna when she was going though kidney failure and she wouldn't eat the medical diet food, there is no happy ending to this story.
The pups have been on 100% raw for a week now and we have had no throwing up or any other issues (that we can see). So glad we made the move and are in it for life!
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Please do keep us up to date with this, it is an interesting situation and I love hearing about successes that trump current medical opinion. Out vet had us remove our cat's canned tuna when she was going though kidney failure and she wouldn't eat the medical diet food, there is no happy ending to this story.
You might want to consider some extra researching on the "low protein" thing. Cats, especially, are built to thrive on a high-protein diet. It doesn't make sense, then, that depriving them of protein would do them any favors, even in a situation of kidney failure. Cats are not humans, and shouldn't be treated as such, and I think that's largely what's happening here.
Unfortunately, conventional veterinary medicine is in as poor a shape (if not poorer) than conventional human medicine.
http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/08/06/kidney-disease-in-cats.aspx0 -
Hey guys,
This isn't totally related to the original post but Happy Hips dog treats are going to be recalled. They're at Petco and Pet Smart primarily. A lot of doggies have gotten sick or died from them. The source is meat from China. I would buy them all the time for my dogs because they appeared more natural and primal. My pups are fine but I felt the need to warn you other dog parents 0 -
Good heads-up for everyone,Golightly, thanks. I read that it was a lot of different brands that were toxic - all meat jerkies from China, for both dogs and cats.
I'm finding this whole thread interesting. We feed our cats Fancy Feast (the Classic canned has no grains) and Blue Wilderness grain-free kibble (they love chicken and salmon, hate the duck). I'd love to make their food, but haven't invested in the meat grinder yet - good ones that will do bones are pricey.
One of our cats grew up with a house rabbit, and eats a lot of greens - chard, escarole, spinach. He'll beg for them like begging for a treat. Or else he'll help himself to my salad when I'm not looking. No digestive issues - he just was close to our rabbit, and cats do learn behaviors from the animals around them.0 -
I didn't know it includes a lot of brands! Yikes! The jerky treats surprised me because they weren't cheap and seemed healthy in comparison to the grain and corn crap that's out.
We use the Blue Wilderness too, it's the wild game one. The dogs seem to do well on it. That's too cute about your cat! Mine likes greens too, he's a houseplant terrorist hehe 0 -
I'd love to make their food, but haven't invested in the meat grinder yet - good ones that will do bones are pricey.
You don't need to grind their meat up, not even for cats. The most you might have to do is cut it up or otherwise expose the tasty innards (especially with cats, as they tend to be picky). You might have to mix it in with their usual food for a while, but there's no reason (other than cats' pickiness) why you can't just give them whole animals like sardines or whatever, or chunks of bone-in meat.This isn't totally related to the original post but Happy Hips dog treats are going to be recalled.
I assume you're giving them to your dogs for the glucosamine content? If so, talk to your butcher about getting the chicken (and other poultry) feet. They're packed with glucosamine and condroitin, and it's a lot more bioavailable to your animals than the fortified stuff.0 -
I assume you're giving them to your dogs for the glucosamine content? If so, talk to your butcher about getting the chicken (and other poultry) feet. They're packed with glucosamine and condroitin, and it's a lot more bioavailable to your animals than the fortified stuff.
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^Dragonwolf
Thank you so much for posting this! I will be checking into it.0
