Battle of the Sexes: Indecent Exposure

KimmyEB

Why is it okay for men to walk around shirtless, but not women?

Why are the ratings (G, PG, PG-13, R, etc.) different for male and female nudity? Do you feel the ratings systems should be changed or are they fine as is?

Discuss.

BrettPGH

Oh.


I thought this was the thread where we'd all nude up and see who wins. My bad.



*zip*

TheRoadDog

I don't have a problem with women walking around topless.

Elizabeth_C34

Because men cannot focus when boobies are out.

KimmyEB

Oh.


I thought this was the thread where we'd all nude up and see who wins. My bad.



*zip*

:laugh: Sorry to disappoint. I had to have an attention-getting title though!

RoadDog--I'm sure most guys don't.

I'm just curious as to people's general thoughts on the subject, why you may feel there is a double standard (or maybe you don't, who knows?), etc.

KimmyEB

Because men cannot focus when boobies are out.

My friends and I watched Bad Teacher last weekend, and the one time boobs were shown, my friend's brother-in-law was literally staring at the TV with wide eyes. Everyone was saying his name, shouting at him (jokingly) to cover his eyes, trying to get his attention from the boobs on screen, and he literally didn't look away from the screen until the boobs were gone. It was hilarious. No one else was entranced (male or female) except for him, haha.

Elizabeth_C34

I'm just curious as to people's general thoughts on the subject, why you may feel there is a double standard (or maybe you don't, who knows?), etc.

Serious answer this time.

I think a woman's breasts have been traditionally seen as a sexual thing and something that has been controlled by "modesty" for many years in many cultures. I know that in Europe, people are really more open about nudity. Most of the beaches are nude or top optional. I liked that things were so much more open there than in the states.

Elizabeth_C34

Because men cannot focus when boobies are out.

My friends and I watched Bad Teacher last weekend, and the one time boobs were shown, my friend's brother-in-law was literally staring at the TV with wide eyes. Everyone was saying his name, shouting at him (jokingly) to cover his eyes, trying to get his attention from the boobs on screen, and he literally didn't look away from the screen until the boobs were gone. It was hilarious. No one else was entranced (male or female) except for him, haha.

My husband is like that. He is a breast man. I think his IQ drops by a good 100 points when they come out.

MikeSEA

This is kind of a joking response and a serious response: as a gay man, I wouldn't mind seeing more mainstream male full frontal. I find the inequity both annoying and slightly disturbing.

KimmyEB

I'm just curious as to people's general thoughts on the subject, why you may feel there is a double standard (or maybe you don't, who knows?), etc.

Serious answer this time.

I think a woman's breasts have been traditionally seen as a sexual thing and something that has been controlled by "modesty" for many years in many cultures. I know that in Europe, people are really more open about nudity. Most of the beaches are nude or top optional. I liked that things were so much more open there than in the states.

Yeah, no doubt that throughout history, women's breasts seem to have been covered in a lot of cultures. It's interesting looking at art, though, where the rules seem almost completely different--Greek statues of fully nude women, or just hair hair covering certain parts, and if I remember right, Greek statues of fully nude men, as well. Paintings of nude women in the Renaissance, as well. I don't remember if I saw any nude male painting from that time.

I remember in my sociology class, we had to vote on whether or not we'd all be okay watching certain movies and documentaries where nudity may be shown. For example, one video was of an African tribe where the women go topless. I was really shocked at how many people raised their hands in favor AGAINST it. And this was a COLLEGE class, mind you! They finally "compromised" with "we can show this, but only if we skip the parts where women are topless." Which is basically the whole thing. So we learned nothing of the women in that tribe, just about the men. It was fine for them to be in nothing but a loincloth or shorts, though.

KimmyEB

This is kind of a joking response and a serious response: as a gay man, I wouldn't mind seeing more mainstream male full frontal. I find the inequity both annoying and slightly disturbing.

ME TOO! Well, I find the inequity both annoying and slightly disturbing, I mean. I'm a woman, so I can't be a gay man.

I like what Elizabeth said in regards to nudity being more "open" in other places than the United States. I know a friend of mine is Spanish, and topless beaches aren't anything weird for her. I also used to live with a bunch of Germans who found it highly amusing that nudity is so "ewww" and taboo here. I have friends who don't try to hide nudity from their children. Don't get me wrong, they're not showing their kids XXX porn movies or anything, but they don't ingrain in their children that nudity is something bad or to be ashamed of.

kennethmgreen

It's not really fair and it is a double standard. But the dong just isn't pretty, especially in a flaccid state. Part of the problem is that it changes. When it is needed functionally it arguably looks better, but now you're stuck with a movie actor walking around with a hard-on and that just looks silly unless there is some action going on. Not to mention it creates spacing and lighting issues for the production crew. And SAG insurance doesn't cover dong injuries.

_SusieQ_

Because men cannot focus when boobies are out.

My friends and I watched Bad Teacher last weekend, and the one time boobs were shown, my friend's brother-in-law was literally staring at the TV with wide eyes. Everyone was saying his name, shouting at him (jokingly) to cover his eyes, trying to get his attention from the boobs on screen, and he literally didn't look away from the screen until the boobs were gone. It was hilarious. No one else was entranced (male or female) except for him, haha.

My husband is like that. He is a breast man. I think his IQ drops by a good 100 points when they come out.

I know mine just did, and I was just thinking about the bewbies.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

TheRoadDog

Because men cannot focus when boobies are out.

Not true. Take your top off and watch me focus.

KimmyEB

But the dong just isn't pretty, especially in a flaccid state.

That's not a good reason. Plus that's personal preference. If I say "well boobs are ugly"...doesn't mean everyone agrees and that boobs are now outlawed in movies.

kennethmgreen

But the dong just isn't pretty, especially in a flaccid state.

That's not a good reason. Plus that's personal preference. If I say "well boobs are ugly"...doesn't mean everyone agrees and that boobs are now outlawed in movies.

OK. I don't have time to cite the hundreds of peer-reviewed journals that prove dong unattractiveness when flaccid. But you have to at least admit that if we are looking at these body parts sexually (and that's why they are censored, right?), only the man's equipment changes in the context of sex. It's not like boobs inflate when it's go time (nipple respone to arousal notwithstanding).

Thanks for providing means for me to type that last sentence.

KimmyEB

But the dong just isn't pretty, especially in a flaccid state.

That's not a good reason. Plus that's personal preference. If I say "well boobs are ugly"...doesn't mean everyone agrees and that boobs are now outlawed in movies.

OK. I don't have time to cite the hundreds of peer-reviewed journals that prove dong unattractiveness when flaccid. But you have to at least admit that if we are looking at these body parts sexually (and that's why they are censored, right?), only the man's equipment changes in the context of sex. It's not like boobs inflate when it's go time (nipple respone to arousal notwithstanding).

Thanks for providing means for me to type that last sentence.

I don't think flaccid dongs are unattractive. I don't think they're attractive, either. I think they are just...there.

Also, why do we have to only see nudity in the contexts of sex? Nudity can be portrayed in films without it being in a sexual manner. Are you having sex every single time you're naked? :laugh:

jenbit

But the dong just isn't pretty, especially in a flaccid state.

That's not a good reason. Plus that's personal preference. If I say "well boobs are ugly"...doesn't mean everyone agrees and that boobs are now outlawed in movies.

OK. I don't have time to cite the hundreds of peer-reviewed journals that prove dong unattractiveness when flaccid. But you have to at least admit that if we are looking at these body parts sexually (and that's why they are censored, right?), only the man's equipment changes in the context of sex. It's not like boobs inflate when it's go time (nipple respone to arousal notwithstanding).

Thanks for providing means for me to type that last sentence.

I don't think flaccid dongs are unattractive. I don't think they're attractive, either. I think they are just...there.

Also, why do we have to only see nudity in the contexts of sex? Nudity can be portrayed in films without it being in a sexual manner. Are you having sex every single time you're naked? :laugh:

^^^^^ Dont I wish LOL

kit_katty

Because men cannot focus when boobies are out.

Not true. Take your top off and watch me focus.

Snicker!

mikajoanow

This is kind of a joking response and a serious response: as a gay man, I wouldn't mind seeing more mainstream male full frontal. I find the inequity both annoying and slightly disturbing.

ME TOO! Well, I find the inequity both annoying and slightly disturbing, I mean. I'm a woman, so I can't be a gay man.

I like what Elizabeth said in regards to nudity being more "open" in other places than the United States. I know a friend of mine is Spanish, and topless beaches aren't anything weird for her. I also used to live with a bunch of Germans who found it highly amusing that nudity is so "ewww" and taboo here. I have friends who don't try to hide nudity from their children. Don't get me wrong, they're not showing their kids XXX porn movies or anything, but they don't ingrain in their children that nudity is something bad or to be ashamed of.

I never did with mine either. But *part* of that comes naturally. One day I was going to hop in the shower with my then 2 1/2 year old (closer to 3) like we usually did. And for the first time ever, he looked at me, and covered his eyes with his hands. He became aware at that very moment that I was different and was clearly embarrassed. I have three boys and all of them at some point figured out that I was different than they were. Now I always try not to freak out when they walk in on me when I am getting dressed, but I don't make it a habit of being naked in front of them at all. Especially now my teenagers, who would pretty much die if they saw me naked lol

I don't want to walk around topless for myself anyway. I have fake boobs and they are heavy. I don't think its comfortable at all to walk around with them out and about. Even when I go to bed I wear a bra.

MikeSEA

It's not really fair and it is a double standard. But the dong just isn't pretty, especially in a flaccid state. Part of the problem is that it changes. When it is needed functionally it arguably looks better, but now you're stuck with a movie actor walking around with a hard-on and that just looks silly unless there is some action going on. Not to mention it creates spacing and lighting issues for the production crew. And SAG insurance doesn't cover dong injuries.

I would suggest that you just haven't seen enough of them then perhaps.

futiledevices

It's legal for women to walk around topless here. I would not feel comfortable doing that, though, because men will gawk, which is creepy.

KimmyEB

It's legal for women to walk around topless here. I would not feel comfortable doing that, though, because men will gawk, which is creepy.

Where do you live, if you don't mind me asking?

futiledevices

It's legal for women to walk around topless here. I would not feel comfortable doing that, though, because men will gawk, which is creepy.

Where do you live, if you don't mind me asking?

Toronto

Azdak

There's no question there is a double standard. I think this one is pretty easy (in the movies that is). The movie industry especially has always been controlled by men--and they like seeing women naked and are completely freaked out at the idea of male nudity. It's probably still an attitude that women are too emotional and fragile to be able to look at such a thing.

I can't say this for certain, but I suspect that an erect penis, either with penetration or without, has traditionally marked the difference between "nudity" and "pornography" and that still seems to be a fixed border. Even on shows like HBOs "Cathouse" that are graphically sexual in nature, they will show the women with legs spread apart and engaging in oral sex, but they still avoid or "pixelate" any view of the erect penis.

(A bit of urban folklore that may be true, says that Ralph Fiennes is so well-endowed that his penis had to be digitally shortened post-production for "the English Patient" because in early test screenings the audiences were kind of shocked).

Male producers/directors have always used their positions of power to coerce women, especially young aspiring female actors, into doing nude scenes or having sex. For some directors -- John Landis comes to mind -- it is laughably obvious. Look at "Animal House", "Stripes", "Trading Places" -- the nude scenes in those movies were completely and obviously gratuitous.

American attitudes towards sex and nudity have always been neurotic to the point of pathological. The hysterical reaction to the "wardrobe malfunction" at the Super Bowl a few years ago was an international embarrassment.

adrian_indy

There's no question there is a double standard. I think this one is pretty easy (in the movies that is). The movie industry especially has always been controlled by men--and they like seeing women naked and are completely freaked out at the idea of male nudity. It's probably still an attitude that women are too emotional and fragile to be able to look at such a thing.

I can't say this for certain, but I suspect that an erect penis, either with penetration or without, has traditionally marked the difference between "nudity" and "pornography" and that still seems to be a fixed border. Even on shows like HBOs "Cathouse" that are graphically sexual in nature, they will show the women with legs spread apart and engaging in oral sex, but they still avoid or "pixelate" any view of the erect penis.

(A bit of urban folklore that may be true, says that Ralph Fiennes is so well-endowed that his penis had to be digitally shortened post-production for "the English Patient" because in early test screenings the audiences were kind of shocked).

Male producers/directors have always used their positions of power to coerce women, especially young aspiring female actors, into doing nude scenes or having sex. For some directors -- John Landis comes to mind -- it is laughably obvious. Look at "Animal House", "Stripes", "Trading Places" -- the nude scenes in those movies were completely and obviously gratuitous.

American attitudes towards sex and nudity have always been neurotic to the point of pathological. The hysterical reaction to the "wardrobe malfunction" at the Super Bowl a few years ago was an international embarrassment.

I lived in Germany off and on for 4 years and their attitude toward sex is so much more laid back. Funny story. When I was home on leave once, I couldn't sleep so I stayed up watching TV. I flipped through the channels and came on E news and was watching Wild on Cancun, a show about college kids at spring break. They get to a wet T-shirt contest, and as they started pouring the water on the shirts, they blurred it out. I decided I had lost interest and switched channels to USA network and Casino was on. It was the scene where Joe Pesci and his brother are taken to a corn field and beaten to death with baseball bats. Guess what? No editing. Uncut, blow for blow, death by baseball bat. WTF? It's 1 AM, both channels are basic cable, but I can't see boobs, but I can see a vicious murder?

It's to easy to complain about the obvious stupidity of the main stream american value system....but has anyone ever stopped to think why so many men in this nation our chronic premature ejaculators?

BrettPGH

(A bit of urban folklore that may be true, says that Ralph Fiennes is so well-endowed that his penis had to be digitally shortened post-production for "the English Patient" because in early test screenings the audiences were kind of shocked).

If he has half a brain this rumor began and was spread by Ralph Fiennes.

Hmm he was nude in shadow in Red Dragon, never really went full frontal but there were scenes of him running around naked (I just watched it a few weeks back). Well at least he didn't trip over it.

KimmyEB

I can't say this for certain, but I suspect that an erect penis, either with penetration or without, has traditionally marked the difference between "nudity" and "pornography" and that still seems to be a fixed border. Even on shows like HBOs "Cathouse" that are graphically sexual in nature, they will show the women with legs spread apart and engaging in oral sex, but they still avoid or "pixelate" any view of the erect penis.

I googled this, because as I was thinking more on it, I do remember certain movies where a penis is shown, but it wasn't erect, and it wasn't in a sexual situation--it was for comedic purposes. I see a lot of people saying the same as this, that it being erect is what turns it to "pornography."

(A bit of urban folklore that may be true, says that Ralph Fiennes is so well-endowed that his penis had to be digitally shortened post-production for "the English Patient" because in early test screenings the audiences were kind of shocked).

LOL I'll never think of Lord Voldemort the same ever again. :laugh:

Male producers/directors have always used their positions of power to coerce women, especially young aspiring female actors, into doing nude scenes or having sex. For some directors -- John Landis comes to mind -- it is laughably obvious. Look at "Animal House", "Stripes", "Trading Places" -- the nude scenes in those movies were completely and obviously gratuitous.

I've never watched any of those movies. I can't give an opinion on that. :ohwell: Opening something up from this line of thinking, though--is there ever a backlash to these types of movies? Or these directors, for putting so much nudity out there? Do you think a female director putting more male nudity, or nudity in general, would receive criticism?

American attitudes towards sex and nudity have always been neurotic to the point of pathological. The hysterical reaction to the "wardrobe malfunction" at the Super Bowl a few years ago was an international embarrassment.

YES!! That is what I'm saying. And I agree--the "wardrobe malfunction" was just so ****ing stupid. International embarrassment, indeed. :sick:

Adrian--I must say, I've never stopped to think why so many men in this nation are chronic premature ejaculators!

Futiledevices--I had no idea that was legal in Toronto!

adrian_indy

I can't say this for certain, but I suspect that an erect penis, either with penetration or without, has traditionally marked the difference between "nudity" and "pornography" and that still seems to be a fixed border. Even on shows like HBOs "Cathouse" that are graphically sexual in nature, they will show the women with legs spread apart and engaging in oral sex, but they still avoid or "pixelate" any view of the erect penis.

I googled this, because as I was thinking more on it, I do remember certain movies where a penis is shown, but it wasn't erect, and it wasn't in a sexual situation--it was for comedic purposes. I see a lot of people saying the same as this, that it being erect is what turns it to "pornography."

(A bit of urban folklore that may be true, says that Ralph Fiennes is so well-endowed that his penis had to be digitally shortened post-production for "the English Patient" because in early test screenings the audiences were kind of shocked).

LOL I'll never think of Lord Voldemort the same ever again. :laugh:

Male producers/directors have always used their positions of power to coerce women, especially young aspiring female actors, into doing nude scenes or having sex. For some directors -- John Landis comes to mind -- it is laughably obvious. Look at "Animal House", "Stripes", "Trading Places" -- the nude scenes in those movies were completely and obviously gratuitous.

I've never watched any of those movies. I can't give an opinion on that. :ohwell: Opening something up from this line of thinking, though--is there ever a backlash to these types of movies? Or these directors, for putting so much nudity out there? Do you think a female director putting more male nudity, or nudity in general, would receive criticism?

American attitudes towards sex and nudity have always been neurotic to the point of pathological. The hysterical reaction to the "wardrobe malfunction" at the Super Bowl a few years ago was an international embarrassment.

YES!! That is what I'm saying. And I agree--the "wardrobe malfunction" was just so ****ing stupid. International embarrassment, indeed. :sick:

Adrian--I must say, I've never stopped to think why so many men in this nation are chronic premature ejaculators!

Futiledevices--I had no idea that was legal in Toronto!

It's because, as Azdak pointed out, competely neurotic and repressed when it comes to sexuality. It's funny the change that happens to women when they have a son. Generally speaking, every woman would like a man who is capable in the bedroom. I realize women prioritze this in varying degrees, but even those who don't have high sex drives wouldn't mind if her partner was good in bed. And every woman hopes that her first time, which is usually in their teen years with a teen boy is going to be special. But if the guy has never seen a pair of boobies before, that party is over before it started. And what is hilarious is who are the most protective of their sons sexuality? MOMS! You all are sabotauging yourselves! Lol.

BrettPGH

It's because, as Azdak pointed out, competely neurotic and repressed when it comes to sexuality. It's funny the change that happens to women when they have a son. Generally speaking, every woman would like a man who is capable in the bedroom. I realize women prioritze this in varying degrees, but even those who don't have high sex drives wouldn't mind if her partner was good in bed. And every woman hopes that her first time, which is usually in their teen years with a teen boy is going to be special. But if the guy has never seen a pair of boobies before, that party is over before it started. And what is hilarious is who are the most protective of their sons sexuality? MOMS! You all are sabotauging yourselves! Lol.

True but the same can be said of dads and their little girls. I love women, big fan! Especially the sex part.

But if that little "Eric" thinks he can keep talking to my little girl and hearts are going to keep getting used I will break that 11 year old. Watch me.