am i a hard gainer?

Zero2hero2013

how many calories do people need to consume as a hard gainer?
i am starting to think i am a hard gainer.

here is my reasoning. my standard maintenance net calories are 2450. i have set my original net calories for the first 4 weeks at 2900 which was 450 calories surplus, at the end of the month i didnt actually gain any weight. where i should have gained almost 2kg.
the last 2 weeks i upped my calories, i set it at 3200 calories so 750 calorie surplus. and yet currently still no weight gain.

i plan on continueing this for another 2 weeks where i will adjust.

i have currently been tackling this problem by doing the following.

1, eat more lol
2, sleep more :-) winnner :-)
3, train less. i switched my routine from a 4 day week to 3 days a week.

does anyone have anymore suggestions to help? im trying to plan for the worst so if nothing changes i can adapt instantly when i want too.

currently i am eating, gym days, 3800 calories, i actually over allow calories that i burn in the gym, for example my 1 hour gym training burns 350 calories. instead of the recomended. and i add in any extra walking as well. usually allow 500 calories on gym days.

on non gym days i eat 3200 calories, and if i do anything extra above what i consider the normal i add thoose calories bacl aswell.

am i being paranoid? my weight was 87.7kg when i started, 86.6kg after week 1, then fluctuated up and down by 1kg, and currently 87.1kg.
any hard gainers out there? can you advise me how you got around these problems?

UponThisRock

Maintenence is a moving target.I've been bulking for 7 months, every time I daiin 5 lbs my weight stalls and I need to add calories. Just eat more, it's pretty simple.

ouija86

You have to lift hard, and eat huge amounts of food.

Without seeing what you're eating or how you're training can't really give you any advice.

Zero2hero2013

my food diary is open to public so please hit it up and flick through, thats everything i have eaten in the last 6 weeks. i think anyway lol.
and my trainign is in my journal which is in this group, anything you can think of to help im all ears.
currently i have just upped my calories by a further 200 daily, and i have swapped 5% of the protein intake onto carbs. i think i have too much protein and not enough carbs. maybe that will make a difference? oh, carbs now at 50% protein 25% and fat 25%.
still be getting 200+g of protein daily.

Zero2hero2013

i also added tomorrows intake, its a little different to my norm but i think its got to be the way forward.

ilovedeadlifts

There really isn't such thing as a hard gainer.
There are people who aren't training correctly, aren't resting enough, and aren't eating enough.

Get a solid program and eat more. Honestly, for gaining weight, I was never able to properly do it while counting my calories. Drink milk like it's water. And constantly stuff your face.

You'll put the weight on.

LovesGG

From my experience, I started gaining on 2300 but then it stalled. I had to increase to 2500 calories then it stalled again. I increased to 2700 hundred calories and it didn't stall but it was too slow of a gain. I was on 3000 calories for about a week and I couldn't handle it so I am back down to 2700 calories and having a hard time holding on to all the weight I've gained. *sigh*

I also avoided cardio like the plague but I've been slowly reintroducing it into my routine now that I feel secure about not losing all my work.

But when I go to the gym, I still bust my bust to get to 3000 calories by the end of the day.
I tried to maintain on 2000 calories but I lost weight. So now my maintenance has increased too and I'm trying to figure it out.
All I can suggest is that you increase by 200 until you find the golden number but you're already doing that.

Some of my hard gainer, male friends have increased to 4000+ calories to bulk. I've seen some hit 5000+ with no luck so just keep on going and take measurements (if you're not already doing so) as well to document your progress.

Zero2hero2013

yeah gonna do this new diet for 2 weeks and i am hoping the reduction in protein and the increase in carbs should have a positive effect. thanks for all the input. im feeling very positive over the next month il gain around 1-2kg of weight which il be happy with.

i was thinking back to when i actually got fat. i put all the food into the calorie log and totted it all up. wow. i didnt get fat eating 3000 calories lets put it that way. i reckon on an average dayi was eating 4500-5500 calories. and i was gaining around 3kg a month of pure fat lol. i guess i never really thought about it properly before this exercise.

nick1109

I recon your eating enough calories but taking too many shakes. try and eat food instead and replace semi skimmed milk with full fat.

If you're not gaining then it might be down to training- Keep it simple. Compounds with the big lifts and get plenty of rest

ouija86

1. Wherever you are drinking a shake now, eat whole food instead.

2. You need a bigger lunch (your metabolism is highest at mid day).

3. Do not use gainer shakes as a meal replacement. You're far better off taking in a half shake or something with some whole food rather than relying on a shake. It will work in a pinch, but as good practice avoid doing it.

4. Good ole fashion milk beats skimmed stuff anyday. I think I go through 2 gallons+ a week of 2%...I would suggest whole milk but I prefer to eat icecream now that its summer time haha.

5. Lift harder. Almost everyone I've ever talked to that's a "hard gainer" that has a good diet/macros doesn't get the results they want simply because they are not pushing themselves as hard as they could. All free weights, compound movements, and go heavy. I prefer dumbells as I work out alone, and if I can't finish a rep I can always drop the weights if I have to.

mideon_696

yeah i agree with dropping the shakes in favour of larger portioned meals.
400gm of meat for example. easy calories.

eat the biggest meals whenever you feel like. for me its much easier to smash a giant meal post workout before i bed.
like my 2000 calorie effort last night

also be sure to be lifting hard, but i have doubts you are already doing this.
while gaining, your lifts should always be heading north, especially at your stage of training.

FoxyMcDeadlift

There is no such thing as a hard gainer.

2500 calories is the recommended amount for the average sedantry male.

you are: taller than average, weigh more than average, more active than average

"For weight gaining purposes, eating clean isnt a useful concept, big macs are" - Rippetoe

Zero2hero2013

thanks for all the help, il train harder and eat more. cheers. also i will imrpve my training routine. you know add in compounds and stuff. coz obviously i am not currently. and obviously i am not really into this and giving it my all each session. hqavent beaten any personal bests in the last 6 weeks at all.

Zero2hero2013

just gone through my training records.
my best on the 16/04/2012 in deadlifts was 1repmax of 150kg, currently i have got 190kg, 2 months.
squats which i am doing more to work on now. was 90kg for 5 now is 105kg for 5 in 2 months
single rep max of bench was 90kg, with bad form, lowered it and started again 6 weeks ago. couldnt do 75kg for 1 rep when i changed the form, yesterday managed to get 90kg for 2.5 reps, little assistance on the 3rd rep.

as far as strength increases go i think i am making good progress. its just that my weight is not increasing. although im 90% sure my fat is decreasing.
also my bicep as grown from 14.1 to 14.5 in the last 6 weeks. my legs have gained around 1'' i havent checked my chest but will do tonight. although i know my chest has grown, didnt really have much of a chest/pecs 2 months ago, now its filling out very fast.

my aim is just to get a slight increase in weight weekly. even 2 lbs a month would be perfect. if no changes after the latest increase in food by next friday il add even more food in. but the shakes are easy for me to handle in the morning, and evening.
im eating like this currently.

7am, shake, 740 calories
10am, meal 1 actual food, 550-700 calories,
1.30pm, post workout, protien shake high protein, with banana or orange juice for insulin spike. 500 cals
3pm, meal 2, as meal 1,
6pm, meal 3, 550-700 cals usually different to the previous.
9pm, mass gainer shake. 740 calories

so i am getting half my dailt calorie from shake and half from food. weekends i relax and eat crap. easily pollish of a large pizza, 2200 calories in one sitting. i was getting 350g of protein daily, but i have lowere dit and gettign 250-300 now and adding the extra into carbs and fat. i cant handle eating another meal daily. so i guess il have to find another snack that i can eat daily. i got told to avoid sandwhiches, maybe il eat a daily chicken and bacon baguette.

VMarkV

There is no such thing as a hard gainer.

2500 calories is the recommended amount for the average sedantry male.

you are: taller than average, weigh more than average, more active than average

"For weight gaining purposes, eating clean isnt a useful concept, big macs are" - Rippetoe

This...everyone who has plenty of weight training experience is a hard gainer (well, unless chemically enhanced of course). Putting on 2lbs of LBM in one year is a pretty good accomplishment, putting on weight however is just about caloric surplus.

If you are trying to up calories, just stay at around 1g/lb bodyweight for protein (possibly more may be required for tall people, so I stay slightly higher than this), fat intake at 0.5-0.75g/lb BW, then enough carbohydrates to create a 500 or so kcal surplus. This is a much slower method supposidly best for gaining as much LBW with minimal BF...lots of patience required.

Alternative: if you are simply going for weight gain (lots) or a typical bodybuilder bulk (lots of muscle, but lots of fat too) I would suggest simply upping your calories with fats if you simply can't stomach enough carbohydrates. Preferably, using EVOO since it's liquid and high in MUFAs...you actually offput the cardiovascular detriments of gaining weight with getting significantly better cholesterol ratios (my BP increased, but my cholesterol was phenomenal). I used this in the past to put on a good 15lbs in about 5 months...gained quite a bit of fat though, I'm just now starting to see what I gained (currently approaching low BF).

Like others have said, you need to re-calculate your BMR and adjust macros everytime you gain a few lbs

Zero2hero2013

here is some pics, one in early may the other around 4 weeks later.
first one was may 19th


the next 2 are of last week so 3 weeks later weighing the same.



couldnt find another bicep one at that time.

Zero2hero2013

i think i need to stop worrying about the scales full stop. as long as my strength is going up i am happy. in september il dirty bulk if needed. problem sorted. cheers for the input

Zero2hero2013

right, gonna get to the bottom of this. got a bodyfat test booked for today at 3.45. i had one 4 weeks ago and this was the result.

88.4kg 13.42% bodyfat, so if i am lower bodyfat i have gained muscle. i should weigh roughly the same.

FoxyMcDeadlift

You worry about all numbers too much IMO. What matters aside from your weight, and how much you can pick up? i have no idea what my bf% is, or how big my biceps are. I dont care.

Zero2hero2013

i think the mirror, measurements are the way to track progress. so all i can hope is that i have a lower bodyfat% at the same weight, if that is the case i wont up my calories. building muscle. losing fat at the same time however short lived il definately take lol.

Zero2hero2013

ok, i am 12.6% bodyfat! im not a hard gainer i have just been burning fat off and building muscle together. thats soo much more reasurring lol! so my bofy fat is now 11.25kg, and lean mass is 78.04kg compared to 4 weeks ago when i had 11.86 bodyfat and 76.53kg. so up 1.5kg of lean mass and down 0.6 kg of fat. woohoo! no extra calories needed for now then.