Deviating From The Stronglifts Formula - Thoughts?

DaveRCF

Up until now I've been sticking with the strict 5X5, two workout regimen from Stronglifts but I've found that doing this Mon, Wed, Fri is proving challenging from a recovery standpoint. I tend to get a couple of bike rides in on the weekend which tends to add to the recovery "issue".

I've been thinking of sticking with SL on Monday and Friday but possibly mixing it up on Wednesdays with a non-SL workout. Dips, chin-ups, pull-ups, lat pulldowns, etc. As you can see these are all upper body exercises; it is my legs that are getting hammered by SL, primarily from squatting (and to an extent, cycling). Age of course (49) plays a role as well.

Anyhow, just throwing this out for comments. Does anybody mix it up here or are you all SL devotees? Any other exercises you would recommend? Or if recommending sticking to SL 3X/wk, any sage advice on helping recovery?

EvanKeel

I'm afraid that I don't know enough about the muscle groups involved or how they relate to each other in the program. Something does come to mind, though.

I assume that the lifts were put together in alternating work outs for a reason. Given that, I might consider having two alternate Wednesday workouts to compliment Friday and Monday, which will alternate either A and A or B and B from week to week. I don't know what those workouts would be, unfortunately.

kazzari

It is perfectly acceptable to take an extra day to recover. There is not a strict requirement to stick with MWF. I don't hesitate to take an extra day if my legs aren't recovering quickly enough. If this means fewer overall workouts weekly, oh well. You are really making up that missing workout with cycling, so you may not be getting in 3 SL workouts, but you still doing a lot. I would look at cycling as a recovery exercise, actually, at least it would be for me since it is endurance and doesn't tax your fast twitch muscle fibers...unless you are doing serious hill climbing. On your off day do a few assistance exercises?

jfan175

A lot of people progress on 2x a week resistance training. I'm 51 and am starting SL, but I'm doing the workouts every third day instead of MWF. We're in this for the long haul, and we don't need issues with unrecovered joints and tendons slowing our progress.

I just finished p90x and didn't miss a workout, and I now have tendonitis in both elbows. Luckily the SL exercises do not aggravate the elbows (they only hurt when lifting pronated, i.e. chins, curls, etc.). I should have taken a couple of rest days when I first felt the discomfort, but I foolishly pressed on. To answer your question, I think 3x a week sqatting would be too much on the knees, hips and quads if you're also biking on the weekends (designated rest days). As far as helping with recovery, stretching and yoga if you can get into that. I'm adding cardio and yoga to my program.

UponThisRock

Have you considered cutting volume back a little, maybe to 3x5?

mmapags

Have you considered cutting volume back a little, maybe to 3x5?

This! I've done this in the last couple of weeks for the same recovery reason. It's working out well so far.

DaveRCF

Have you considered cutting volume back a little, maybe to 3x5?

I've considered this but kind of thought I was wimping out because I'm not stalling yet. Would move to 3X5 once I plateau on 5X5.
I just downloaded a copy of Rippetoe and Kilgore's Practical Programming for Strength Training to try and educate myself a bit. Great value at $10 for the e-book.

mmapags

Have you considered cutting volume back a little, maybe to 3x5?

I've considered this but kind of thought I was wimping out because I'm not stalling yet. Would move to 3X5 once I plateau on 5X5.
I just downloaded a copy of Rippetoe and Kilgore's Practical Programming for Strength Training to try and educate myself a bit. Great value at $10 for the e-book.

Rippletoe recommeds 3x5 in Starting Strength. I know what you mean about the wimping out thing. I went through that same thought process. But, as the weights got up there, I was getting whipped! I was useless for 2 days. Also, you get slightly more volume over a week with 3 at 3x5, than 2 at 5x5. I don't think you need to get to stalling to cut back volume. It hasn't effected progression so that's been good.

DaveRCF

Have you considered cutting volume back a little, maybe to 3x5?

I've considered this but kind of thought I was wimping out because I'm not stalling yet. Would move to 3X5 once I plateau on 5X5.
I just downloaded a copy of Rippetoe and Kilgore's Practical Programming for Strength Training to try and educate myself a bit. Great value at $10 for the e-book.

Rippletoe recommeds 3x5 in Starting Strength. I know what you mean about the wimping out thing. I went through that same thought process. But, as the weights got up there, I was getting whipped! I was useless for 2 days. Also, you get slightly more volume over a week with 3 at 3x5, than 2 at 5x5. I don't think you need to get to stalling to cut back volume. It hasn't effected progression so that's been good.

Great insights from another "elderly" lifter. Thanks very much. I will take your advice to heart.

DaveRCF

It is perfectly acceptable to take an extra day to recover. There is not a strict requirement to stick with MWF. I don't hesitate to take an extra day if my legs aren't recovering quickly enough. If this means fewer overall workouts weekly, oh well. You are really making up that missing workout with cycling, so you may not be getting in 3 SL workouts, but you still doing a lot. I would look at cycling as a recovery exercise, actually, at least it would be for me since it is endurance and doesn't tax your fast twitch muscle fibers...unless you are doing serious hill climbing. On your off day do a few assistance exercises?

I started to read Practical Programming for Strength Training last night and Rippetoe is pretty clear in the first chapter that if you haven't properly recovered prior to your next workout you aren't doing yourself any favors. So taking that to heart, I am switching to 3X5 on my working squat sets, 5X5 for everything else, to see if my legs can recover more quickly.

So I guess I am saying that your advice seems spot on!

UponThisRock

It is perfectly acceptable to take an extra day to recover. There is not a strict requirement to stick with MWF. I don't hesitate to take an extra day if my legs aren't recovering quickly enough. If this means fewer overall workouts weekly, oh well. You are really making up that missing workout with cycling, so you may not be getting in 3 SL workouts, but you still doing a lot. I would look at cycling as a recovery exercise, actually, at least it would be for me since it is endurance and doesn't tax your fast twitch muscle fibers...unless you are doing serious hill climbing. On your off day do a few assistance exercises?

I started to read Practical Programming for Strength Training last night and Rippetoe is pretty clear in the first chapter that if you haven't properly recovered prior to your next workout you aren't doing yourself any favors. So taking that to heart, I am switching to 3X5 on my working squat sets, 5X5 for everything else, to see if my legs can recover more quickly.

So I guess I am saying that your advice seems spot on!

cool, let us know how it goes

IronPlayground

This is good info! I've been having the same squat fatigue issues lately. May be switching to 3x5 soon.

DaveRCF

Well I've gotten in two workouts where I am 3X5 on squats and 5X5 on the other lifts (except DL at 1X5) and this seems to be working for me. I can get my bike rides in and not feel any squat fatigue. Seems to leave a bit more in the tank for the other lifts as well.

I guess at the end of the day 5X5 squats 3X per week just wasn't right for me.

jdhosier

Well I've gotten in two workouts where I am 3X5 on squats and 5X5 on the other lifts (except DL at 1X5) and this seems to be working for me. I can get my bike rides in and not feel any squat fatigue. Seems to leave a bit more in the tank for the other lifts as well.

That is interesting. I am 55 and I have been wondering if my recovery time is long enough. I stalled on OHP on a Monday and took the rest of the week off with just some cardio. When I started back up, I was able to the next OHP weight (5 lbs more) for the full 5x5. I had a similar thing happen earlier with squats.

I addition, I spent an hour with a trainer yesterday and he checked my form on squats. When I was done he was impressed and asked me where I learned the form. He was surprised when I said YouTube. Anyway, he had me do some other things like Lat Pulldowns and flys and inclined flys with some dumbells. I believe now, that there are some areas where SL is not covering some important muscle groups. I may go to a different schedule on SL and add some other exercises that I need.

UponThisRock

Well I've gotten in two workouts where I am 3X5 on squats and 5X5 on the other lifts (except DL at 1X5) and this seems to be working for me. I can get my bike rides in and not feel any squat fatigue. Seems to leave a bit more in the tank for the other lifts as well.

I guess at the end of the day 5X5 squats 3X per week just wasn't right for me.

I've always thought that 5x5 was pushing the envelope a little bit in terms of volume. not easy to stick with when the weights get heavier

kazzari

Well I've gotten in two workouts where I am 3X5 on squats and 5X5 on the other lifts (except DL at 1X5) and this seems to be working for me. I can get my bike rides in and not feel any squat fatigue. Seems to leave a bit more in the tank for the other lifts as well.

That is interesting. I am 55 and I have been wondering if my recovery time is long enough. I stalled on OHP on a Monday and took the rest of the week off with just some cardio. When I started back up, I was able to the next OHP weight (5 lbs more) for the full 5x5. I had a similar thing happen earlier with squats.

I addition, I spent an hour with a trainer yesterday and he checked my form on squats. When I was done he was impressed and asked me where I learned the form. He was surprised when I said YouTube. Anyway, he had me do some other things like Lat Pulldowns and flys and inclined flys with some dumbells. I believe now, that there are some areas where SL is not covering some important muscle groups. I may go to a different schedule on SL and add some other exercises that I need.

What muscle groups do you imagine are being left out? You are hitting everything. Rippetoe, at this level the only useful assistance exercise are pull ups, which work all the muscles lat pulldowns work and more...they are far superior. When they get too easy, add weight. Also...fractional for OHP. Go up 2 lbs I you stall St 5. It is working for me.

mmapags

Well I've gotten in two workouts where I am 3X5 on squats and 5X5 on the other lifts (except DL at 1X5) and this seems to be working for me. I can get my bike rides in and not feel any squat fatigue. Seems to leave a bit more in the tank for the other lifts as well.

That is interesting. I am 55 and I have been wondering if my recovery time is long enough. I stalled on OHP on a Monday and took the rest of the week off with just some cardio. When I started back up, I was able to the next OHP weight (5 lbs more) for the full 5x5. I had a similar thing happen earlier with squats.

I addition, I spent an hour with a trainer yesterday and he checked my form on squats. When I was done he was impressed and asked me where I learned the form. He was surprised when I said YouTube. Anyway, he had me do some other things like Lat Pulldowns and flys and inclined flys with some dumbells. I believe now, that there are some areas where SL is not covering some important muscle groups. I may go to a different schedule on SL and add some other exercises that I need.

What muscle groups do you imagine are being left out? You are hitting everything. Rippetoe, at this level the only useful assistance exercise are pull ups, which work all the muscles lat pulldowns work and more...they are far superior. When they get too easy, add weight. Also...fractional for OHP. Go up 2 lbs I you stall St 5. It is working for me.

Totally this! You are a woman with some great lifting knowledge!!

kazzari

Well I've gotten in two workouts where I am 3X5 on squats and 5X5 on the other lifts (except DL at 1X5) and this seems to be working for me. I can get my bike rides in and not feel any squat fatigue. Seems to leave a bit more in the tank for the other lifts as well.

That is interesting. I am 55 and I have been wondering if my recovery time is long enough. I stalledu on OHP on a Monday and took the rest of the week off with just some cardio. When I started back up, I was able to the next OHP weight (5 lbs more) for the full 5x5. I had a similar thing happen earlier with squats.

I addition, I spent an hour with a trainer yesterday and he checked my form on squats. When I was done he was impressed and asked me where I learned the form. He was surprised when I said YouTube. Anyway, he had me do some other things like Lat Pulldowns and flys and inclined flys with some dumbells. I believe now, that there are some areas where SL is not covering some important muscle groups. I may go to a different schedule on SL and add some other exercises that I need.

What muscle groups do you imagine are being left out? You are hitting everything. Rippetoe, at this level the only useful assistance exercise are pull ups, which work all the muscles lat pulldowns work and more...they are far superior. When they get too easy, add weight. Also...fractional for OHP. Go up 2 lbs I you stall St 5. It is working for me.

Totally this! You are a woman with some great lifting knowledge!!

Thanks! LOL.

sjohnny

Are you still adding 5lbs each time since you've gone to 3x5 on squats? I think that running three times a week and lifting three times a week is giving me some of the same issues. I'm not up to what I would think of as a heavy weight on squats but I'm already getting a lot of fatigue.

mmapags

Nope. I'm increasing once a week now. Fatigue and recovery became an issue as weight got higher.

sjohnny

I think I'll go 3x5 this week and still add the weight each workout. If that still seems too much I'll cut adding the weight back to twice a week and if that's still too much once a week.

DaveRCF

Tweaked my right quad again trying a new squat PR. Other lifts going great, but even with reduced volume I am have quad. Issues. Being a skinny biker I thought this would be the the least of my problems.