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The Case For Settling
DMZ_1
Posts: 2,889 Member
This article from The Atlantic (http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2008/03/marry-him/306651/) makes the case why settling is a better option that remaining single for women. The article is a bit long, but well worth the read as is most content from The Atlantic. There is a degree of truth in this article for men, but men have better dating prospects for longer.
Here are some good quotables from the article.....
"Marriage ultimately isn’t about cosmic connection—it’s about how having a teammate, even if he’s not the love of your life, is better than not having one at all. "
"Why Smart Men Marry Smart Women (a book) makes the most blatant case for settling: if women were more willing to “think outside the box,” as one of the book’s married sources advises, many of them would be married."
"Chris believes that women are far too picky: everyone knows, he says, that a single middle-aged man still has appealing prospects; a single middle-aged woman likely doesn’t. And he’s right."
"The paradox, of course, is that the more it behooves a woman to settle, the less willing she is to settle; a woman in her mid- to late 30s is more discriminating than one in her 20s. She has friends who have known her since childhood, friends who will know her more intimately and understand her more viscerally than any man she meets in midlife."
"But then my married friends say things like, “Oh, you’re so lucky, you don’t have to negotiate with your husband about the cost of piano lessons” or “You’re so lucky, you don’t have anyone putting the kid in front of the TV and you can raise your son the way you want.” I’ll even hear things like, “You’re so lucky, you don’t have to have sex with someone you don’t want to.”
The lists go on, and each time, I say, “OK, if you’re so unhappy, and if I’m so lucky, leave your husband! In fact, send him over here!”
Not one person has taken me up on this offer. "
Thoughts?
Here are some good quotables from the article.....
"Marriage ultimately isn’t about cosmic connection—it’s about how having a teammate, even if he’s not the love of your life, is better than not having one at all. "
"Why Smart Men Marry Smart Women (a book) makes the most blatant case for settling: if women were more willing to “think outside the box,” as one of the book’s married sources advises, many of them would be married."
"Chris believes that women are far too picky: everyone knows, he says, that a single middle-aged man still has appealing prospects; a single middle-aged woman likely doesn’t. And he’s right."
"The paradox, of course, is that the more it behooves a woman to settle, the less willing she is to settle; a woman in her mid- to late 30s is more discriminating than one in her 20s. She has friends who have known her since childhood, friends who will know her more intimately and understand her more viscerally than any man she meets in midlife."
"But then my married friends say things like, “Oh, you’re so lucky, you don’t have to negotiate with your husband about the cost of piano lessons” or “You’re so lucky, you don’t have anyone putting the kid in front of the TV and you can raise your son the way you want.” I’ll even hear things like, “You’re so lucky, you don’t have to have sex with someone you don’t want to.”
The lists go on, and each time, I say, “OK, if you’re so unhappy, and if I’m so lucky, leave your husband! In fact, send him over here!”
Not one person has taken me up on this offer. "
Thoughts?
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Replies
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"But then my married friends say things like, “Oh, you’re so lucky, you don’t have to negotiate with your husband about the cost of piano lessons” or “You’re so lucky, you don’t have anyone putting the kid in front of the TV and you can raise your son the way you want.” I’ll even hear things like, “You’re so lucky, you don’t have to have sex with someone you don’t want to.”
Actually, these are all reasons I'm happy to be single! Especially that last one. Lol!
I would love to enter into a relationship, but I am definitely more discriminating now. I'll go out with a wide range of guys but it will be a long time before I give someone ownership into my life. I've "been there done that" and the fantasy of the perfect wistful marriage/LTR has already been shattered for me.
As the article points out, middle aged women have less options, and there is fierce competition amongst women for what slim pickins there are (to the extent that they'll put up with poor treatment and no teamwork just to "have a man") which it makes it less likely to find a man who really wants to be a partner. That’s why I’ve absolved myself of the pressure to find someone new. It would be nice, but so is being able to rear my son the way I want and spend my money (and time) the way I want.
That said, I disagree with the notion that it’s better to settle just so you can have someone rather than to be alone. I’ve seen too many women who settled just to have someone and now they’re miserable. I’d rather be single than married and still alone.0 -
I wouldn't say that I settled when I got married in my 20s, but I can agree with the above about being much happier single than miserable in a marriage that isn't with the right guy. And by settling/right guy, it's not about how much money he has, his looks or his job - it's about how much he contributes to the relationship. I'll never make the mistake of getting married too quickly again without really knowing how someone is going to be as a partner for the long haul. I'm not going to settle for someone unwilling to give to the relationship what it needs to stay alive and what I need to be happy.That said, I disagree with the notion that it’s better to settle just so you can have someone rather than to be alone. I’ve seen too many women who settled just to have someone and now they’re miserable. I’d rather be single than married and still alone.0 -
I think your priorities change as you age so what would seem like settling in your 20s now doesn't seem as much so by the time you pass 35. I get what the article is saying... most women pass by a lot of "good" options early on and would probably change their mind later in life if they knew that.
Truthfully, women's options do get less as they age. I'm 36 and still not sure whether I want a family. It drives me CRAZY when family members placate me with comments like, "You're just a baby and still have plenty of time." That's NOT true as a female, but if they said it to a single 36 year old guy, I'd agree. He can much more easily choose a woman 10 years his junior and still have that family. I can not.
I've never had any serious long term relationships so I can't say whether it's better to be "happily single" or unhappily involved. But at this point for me, I'm not ready to settle. I still want a man that I look at and want to rip off his clothes just as much as I want to share life's experiences with him. Is that too much to ask, haha? The real change is what I NOW think settling looks like is a lot different than 10 years ago...0 -
Considering how I don't even believe in paper marriage, I would rather be single with 27 cats for the rest of my life than settle for the sake of a "partner".0
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I do admit there are times when I think that there are an awful lot of people my age that are in relationships or married, having kids, whatever and I think for a second "why not me?"
Then I look at the type of relationship they have and the things they put up with for the sake of "settling" and realize that ****ing sucks and wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole. I've been in a relationship that was amazing so I know it exists and I'm willing to wait for it, even if it never comes along again.0 -
"Marriage ultimately isn’t about cosmic connection—it’s about how having a teammate, even if he’s not the love of your life, is better than not having one at all. "
So wrong in so many ways.0 -
You know what I don't want Hollywood love.
But I want something..some compatibility. Right now all I get are offers for sex.
How can I settle when the only men that I encounter want nothing more from me than what is between my legs.
I can't settle for that because they don't want any kind of settling and would run a mile in the opposite direction if I wanted more than to have sex with them.
Mr Nice guy who I can talk to doesn't want to touch me at all. But would commit. Its f ucked up.
I would be happy with a friend who was atleast affectionate...doesn't have to be mind blowing doesn't have to be rich, or handsome even just not fugly...just a companion who might want to raise a family with me. But he is no where to be found.0 -
I'm sorry DM, but I find it really disrespectful that you posted this (granted the Atlantic is a reputable publication - and I did not have time to read the article). Whether the information is factual or not, anyone who has spent time on the boards knows that you of all people are least likely to compromise your desire for a "top tier attractive young twenty something". So why do you think it's ok to preach to the women of Single Peeps that we should be settling? We are all well aware of reality...0
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I'm sorry DM, but I find it really disrespectful that you posted this (granted the Atlantic is a reputable publication - and I did not have time to read the article). Whether the information is factual or not, anyone who has spent time on the boards knows that you of all people are least likely to compromise your desire for a "top tier attractive young twenty something". So why do you think it's ok to preach to the women of Single Peeps that we should be settling? We are all well aware of reality...
If given the choice between staying permanently single and being in a long term relationship, I would settle. I desire to meet someone amazing, but I can foresee a scenario in which I settle to a point. And the point of the article is to not be overly idealistic, but to find someone good enough. Don't throw away good enough for someone possibly better. The grass is not always greener on the other side. So I don't perceive the idea that I am preaching. Settling, for men, is better than staying single. Being single "sucks", as one line in the article says.
The point of the article, written by a woman for women, is to not be overly choosy. Typically speaking, men do not have as much of a rep for being overly choosy. Granted, there are some overly choosy men. But not being overly choosy is a great precept for both men and women to follow.0 -
I think what PJ is feeling, Dave, doesn't surprise me though I don't think you meant this post in any negative way. It's a very thought provoking interesting idea, especially given how frustrated many of us are with the lack of what we right now consider reasonable prospects.
I think what' strikes that weird feeling though is that it's you of all people posting this. You have clear ideas of what you want so I can't even imagine you settling, though clearly I don't know you that well, since I was surprised at your comment of eventually settling. I think it just strikes an odd note that you're the person posting this, no disrespect meant by that but it seems ironic I suppose.
Still, I think it's a great topic and while I may or may not agree, it's interesting food for thought...0 -
I'm sorry DM, but I find it really disrespectful that you posted this (granted the Atlantic is a reputable publication - and I did not have time to read the article). Whether the information is factual or not, anyone who has spent time on the boards knows that you of all people are least likely to compromise your desire for a "top tier attractive young twenty something".You have clear ideas of what you want so I can't even imagine you settling, though clearly I don't know you that well, since I was surprised at your comment of eventually settling. I think it just strikes an odd note that you're the person posting this, no disrespect meant by that but it seems ironic I suppose.
you know, when guys tell me women should just settle... it's because they're tired of being rejected and wish someone would just "settle" for them.
Probably not DM's case but just something for you ladies to think about. 0 -
I'm sorry DM, but I find it really disrespectful that you posted this (granted the Atlantic is a reputable publication - and I did not have time to read the article). Whether the information is factual or not, anyone who has spent time on the boards knows that you of all people are least likely to compromise your desire for a "top tier attractive young twenty something".You have clear ideas of what you want so I can't even imagine you settling, though clearly I don't know you that well, since I was surprised at your comment of eventually settling. I think it just strikes an odd note that you're the person posting this, no disrespect meant by that but it seems ironic I suppose.
you know, when guys tell me women should just settle... it's because they're tired of being rejected and wish someone would just "settle" for them. Probably not DM's case but just something for you ladies to think about.
I also took posting of this as Dave showing his hopes that one of these amazing, top-tier women he pursues would "settle" for him.
I disagree with the whole notion of settling for good enough. I think as you get older, you redefine amazing. I certainly did between my early and late 20s (and even further into my 40s). I would have never settled for someone I didn't think was amazing in a lot of ways. It didn't work out for many reasons, but this article isn't about finding someone to marry for a lifetime now, is it? All those women in the story complaining about their husbands might very well be rid of them when the kids get older with divorce rates as they are.0 -
Granted, I didn't even read the article, but I can tell where this is heading just by all the responses.
I view it less as "settling" and more as "finally being realistic". I think a lot of women, mostly younger, have such a flooring sense of self entitlement that they think they deserve to be swept off her feet by Prince Charming. Then, when they are in their 30's and it still hasn't happened yet, they view all their potential dates as "settling". When in reality, they are finally finding a decent match for themselves.0 -
I view it less as "settling" and more as "finally being realistic". I think a lot of women, mostly younger, have such a flooring sense of self entitlement that they think they deserve to be swept off her feet by Prince Charming. Then, when they are in their 30's and it still hasn't happened yet, they view all their potential dates as "settling".
Really?! Jaw hits floor... You don't give women much credit, do you? Most of us know that Prince Charming is a fairytale from fairly early on. What intelligent, competent adult women generally aim to find though, is an equal - someone we can care for, desire, and critically, respect, who will feel the same way about us. 'Settling' for someone who doesn't meet those criteria, especially the first and last, seems like a pretty good recipe for a relationship that's doomed to failure from the word 'go'.0 -
"Well, I know it's a fairy tale... but it would be nice isn't it? We never know after all! No... but let's be realistic. Well. Still."
Really?! Jaw hits floor... You don't give women much credit, do you? Most of us know that Prince Charming is a fairytale from fairly early on. What intelligent, competent adult women generally aim to find though, is an equal - someone we can care for, desire, and critically, respect, who will feel the same way about us. 'Settling' for someone who doesn't meet those criteria, especially the first and last, seems like a pretty good recipe for a relationship that's doomed to failure from the word 'go'.I view it less as "settling" and more as "finally being realistic". I think a lot of women, mostly younger, have such a flooring sense of self entitlement that they think they deserve to be swept off her feet by Prince Charming. Then, when they are in their 30's and it still hasn't happened yet, they view all their potential dates as "settling".
Most women haven't totally given up hope. So they still BELIEVE it is possible. There is still this little corner of their mind who keeps the thought alive.
* Connects to POF and look at women's headlines *
* Nods *
Yep. Not saying you are the target described by this kind of article, though, but there is a world out there and a lot of people you (and I) don't get to talk to. And I know that a lot of women in their early 20s (25 less) think like that. And (how surprising!) of course they are the ones who have the most options. So they can afford to be the more demanding ones. So the article is right in that.
And as Mike said, I'd rather focus on those women who are more grounded.
As for the article, I think it's weird. It's like it's a one sided problem.
Women can't find any decent men. The solution: obviously adjust your expectations and settle for lesser men. :laugh:
No. As much as I want "my perfect woman" (i.e. who is fun to be with, beautiful in my eyes and interesting to have a talk to), I know I need to offer the same thing in return. Only valid for 25 years old and less IMHO.
Obviously the girl in the video is talking about not grabbing a 8/10 opportunity because girls want to wait for a 10/10 (ignoring men who make spelling mistakes for example). Of course in this case, you better adjust your expectations (10/10 do not exist and if they do, you're probably no match for them). Although technically you don't have to, yet.
As for myself, I've integrated and accepted the fact that I will die alone (like everyone of us) so whatever happens in the meantime is just a bonus...0 -
Granted, I didn't even read the article, but I can tell where this is heading just by all the responses.
I view it less as "settling" and more as "finally being realistic". I think a lot of women, mostly younger, have such a flooring sense of self entitlement that they think they deserve to be swept off her feet by Prince Charming. Then, when they are in their 30's and it still hasn't happened yet, they view all their potential dates as "settling". When in reality, they are finally finding a decent match for themselves.
Prince Charming doesn't exist. But I'd like to meet "Prince Doesn't Cheat, Gamble, Drink Heavily, Blow Money He Doesn't Have, Non-Suicidal, Acts His Age, and Is Trustworthy". Until then, I think I'll stay single, thanks!0 -
I think in our 20's we may settle due to the biological need to mate up and procreate. Most of my friends that married in their 20's are divorced now. And not in a 'we grew apart' type of way, but in a 'how the hell did I put up with the crap for so long' kind of way.
The ones that did made it (or have thus far) were a match. Talked to each other, shared the same values, enjoyed the same music, were equal health wise. This ran the gammet from couch potatoes to working a yard business 10 hrs a day.
Now at 51 and single for the first time since 21 or so, I am not interested in dating. I met a nice guy-59 yr old fireman still on the job, healthy, intelligent, liked to talk ( a lot :laugh:) On the 3rd date I could see him looking past my eyes to the boobs of the 30 yr old passing by. Not once, but numerous times. See he was going to 'settle' for a somewhat nice looking woman 8 yrs younger, healthy, homemaker. Is this because his buddies said "You ain't getting any younger dude, you'll need someone to take care of you in your old age" ?? Don't know.
I decided that I will not get into a relationship until I know the we will both wake up in the morning and say "Damn, how'd I get so lucky!?"
I would never EVER recommend settling. It leads to resentment, hate and eventually divorce. :flowerforyou:0 -
Granted, I didn't even read the article, but I can tell where this is heading just by all the responses.
I view it less as "settling" and more as "finally being realistic". I think a lot of women, mostly younger, have such a flooring sense of self entitlement that they think they deserve to be swept off her feet by Prince Charming. Then, when they are in their 30's and it still hasn't happened yet, they view all their potential dates as "settling". When in reality, they are finally finding a decent match for themselves.
Prince Charming doesn't exist. But I'd like to meet "Prince Doesn't Cheat, Gamble, Drink Heavily, Blow Money He Doesn't Have, Non-Suicidal, Acts His Age, and Is Trustworthy". Until then, I think I'll stay single, thanks!
:drinker: Amen0 -
I'm sorry DM, but I find it really disrespectful that you posted this (granted the Atlantic is a reputable publication - and I did not have time to read the article). Whether the information is factual or not, anyone who has spent time on the boards knows that you of all people are least likely to compromise your desire for a "top tier attractive young twenty something". So why do you think it's ok to preach to the women of Single Peeps that we should be settling? We are all well aware of reality...
How is he going to land that "top tier" young supermodel if he doesn't convince her to settle? ;-)
Remember, the theme of the article is that apparently women should settle, not men...
--P0 -
By the way, I'm expecting this thread to get even more interesting... I'm off to go pop some popcorn.
--P0 -
I decided that I will not get into a relationship until I know the we will both wake up in the morning and say "Damn, how'd I get so lucky!?"
I would never EVER recommend settling. It leads to resentment, hate and eventually divorce. :flowerforyou:
I scrolled through this forum in search of something that might help me feel better about a personal situation that I am going through.
You have no idea how much this quote means and how I'm taking it into consideration
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Granted, I didn't even read the article, but I can tell where this is heading just by all the responses.
I view it less as "settling" and more as "finally being realistic". I think a lot of women, mostly younger, have such a flooring sense of self entitlement that they think they deserve to be swept off her feet by Prince Charming. Then, when they are in their 30's and it still hasn't happened yet, they view all their potential dates as "settling". When in reality, they are finally finding a decent match for themselves.
Prince Charming doesn't exist. But I'd like to meet "Prince Doesn't Cheat, Gamble, Drink Heavily, Blow Money He Doesn't Have, Non-Suicidal, Acts His Age, and Is Trustworthy". Until then, I think I'll stay single, thanks!
Damn, so close, I was right there until that whole Acts his age thing! That is just asking too much! I am now assuming this is why I am still single! (And going into complete denial that it's because I'm a shy twit who is never around)
...(And this whole post may just be an excuse for me to use the word twit... it's already been a long day at work.)0 -
Its my opinion that if the thought of "eh, I'll settle for that. It's the best I can do" ever crosses your mind at any point in the relationship, then you're setting yourself up to be miserable. After a first date, I always ask myself if I feel like I would be settling if he and I turned in to a long term thing, or even a second date. If the answer is yes, I'm moving on. I would rather be miserable by myself than have someone helping me get there.0
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Granted, I didn't even read the article, but I can tell where this is heading just by all the responses.
I view it less as "settling" and more as "finally being realistic". I think a lot of women, mostly younger, have such a flooring sense of self entitlement that they think they deserve to be swept off her feet by Prince Charming. Then, when they are in their 30's and it still hasn't happened yet, they view all their potential dates as "settling". When in reality, they are finally finding a decent match for themselves.
Prince Charming doesn't exist. But I'd like to meet "Prince Doesn't Cheat, Gamble, Drink Heavily, Blow Money He Doesn't Have, Non-Suicidal, Acts His Age, and Is Trustworthy". Until then, I think I'll stay single, thanks!
Amen!0 -
Nah, that's okay. Even though I'm now middle aged, I can still get laid easier than most men can.
Why would I want to settle down with someone I'm not totally in love with?
Unless he's rich and doesn't care that I'm marrying him for his money, cause I'll tell him straight out that's what I'm doing. Or short, fat, bald college professor dudes, call me, I want that family discount so I can go back to school and get my PhD.
Actually, college professors are good in my book, they always have interesting conversation. But if youre stupid and you want my attention, you better be hot, and even then, I'm not going to marry you.
Heh, don't mind me, I woke up in a dire mood this morning!0 -
I think that this article speaks to women that haven't been married before. lol. If you have been married or are in a LTR that wasn't all that stellar .. you would know instantly that this is just dumb. For someone that has been in a bad marriage would never in a billion years do it again .. just to have a partner. I got this *kitten* .. I don't need someone's help. So .. if I am bringing someone into my life it is because of how he makes me feel, it is someone that will be my other half and I his. Otherwise .. I have batteries .. which is the only thing I NEED a man for.
People look for this all encompassing relationship to make their lives complete. It doesn't exist .. you have to make your life complete .. then another person can enhance it, but you need to be complete with yourself.
Settling is just dumb.0 -
Prince Charming doesn't exist. But I'd like to meet "Prince Doesn't Cheat, Gamble, Drink Heavily, Blow Money He Doesn't Have, Non-Suicidal, Acts His Age, and Is Trustworthy". Until then, I think I'll stay single, thanks!
I got 6 out of 7. If you'd settle for someone like me you'd at least get to spend a few fun weekends in Las Vegas every year.0 -
#1 thing - you never, EVER settle just to avoid being alone. That is very bad advice for either gender.
"A single middle-aged woman likely does not have appealing prospects......." why not? Almost seems the opposite to me..... she has had time to fully mature, establish herself, and gain some life experience. If she has kids, they are grown or are at least aren't toddlers anymore; and depending on what exact age she is (what does the author consider "middle-aged?"), she is likely in her sexual prime. I'm just not seeing the logic behind the author's statement here.
I feel like the author has prioritized other things over being in love when it comes to getting married at a certain age, and I just can't agree with that. I will not marry unless I am in love, period.0 -
Prince Charming doesn't exist. But I'd like to meet "Prince Doesn't Cheat, Gamble, Drink Heavily, Blow Money He Doesn't Have, Non-Suicidal, Acts His Age, and Is Trustworthy". Until then, I think I'll stay single, thanks!
I got 6 out of 7. If you'd settle for someone like me you'd at least get to spend a few fun weekends in Las Vegas every year.
I had that fun with an ex. But his habit wasn't something I could handle long term. Financially not cool for someone who is pretty logical about money.0 -
This kind of drivel really bothers me!!! Ageist/Sexist crap!! DM I am pretty damn sure that my prospects are better now than they were 20 years ago!! For every single middle age woman, there is a guy. Not all older guys want young girls, and certainly, not many young girls want old guys!!! And you'd be surprised how many younger guys want older women!! So, the articles logic is clearly flawed!
If Madonna can pull a 19 year old, so can I!!!! :laugh:
As the lady herself said "what do you do at 50 then, just curl up and die?"
It's evident to me that you settle LESS as you get older!! Perhaps when you've finished settling now, get divorced by the time you're 40, you'll be able to understand why
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This discussion has been closed.