Sodium guidelines
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wfte
Posts: 195 Member
I was interested to find out people's opinions on the sodium guidelines, both on low carb and normal diets. I'm asking here as daren't ask on general forums with the blinkered fat bad, grains good, calories in, calories out, eat less, move more attitudes that populates them for the main.
I've read a lot of pieces that are now suggesting salt has been wrongly accused as an enemy (pretty much like fats). The salt theories hold a lot of similarities with the fat hyposithis that certain data has been looked at to support the theory while other data ignored. Also evidence that at the very least it's sodium in conjunction with other factors that cause issues and not sodium alone. There's even evidence to suggest that a low salt diet is MORE deadly than a diet too high in salt.
Without even tracking I know by diet has always been high in sodium, probably worse in the past as eat less processed foods now. I'm always breaking the salt allowance and that's ignoring the fact I usually log veg as boiled in unsalted water and never log any salt I may add at the table. Never has the doctor had any issues or concerns with my blood pressure, despite bring morbidly obese for most of my life.
I believe that at the very least the sodium RDA is obscenely low and anything upto 3 times(or so) that amount would be fine for any normal healthy person (barring those with any over sensitivity)
I am a little concerned that maybe since being low carb I may have taken on a slightly bias view though, formed a " you lied about fats, you lied about whole grains, why should I believe you about salt" state of mind.
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=its-time-to-end-the-war-on-salt
I've read a lot of pieces that are now suggesting salt has been wrongly accused as an enemy (pretty much like fats). The salt theories hold a lot of similarities with the fat hyposithis that certain data has been looked at to support the theory while other data ignored. Also evidence that at the very least it's sodium in conjunction with other factors that cause issues and not sodium alone. There's even evidence to suggest that a low salt diet is MORE deadly than a diet too high in salt.
Without even tracking I know by diet has always been high in sodium, probably worse in the past as eat less processed foods now. I'm always breaking the salt allowance and that's ignoring the fact I usually log veg as boiled in unsalted water and never log any salt I may add at the table. Never has the doctor had any issues or concerns with my blood pressure, despite bring morbidly obese for most of my life.
I believe that at the very least the sodium RDA is obscenely low and anything upto 3 times(or so) that amount would be fine for any normal healthy person (barring those with any over sensitivity)
I am a little concerned that maybe since being low carb I may have taken on a slightly bias view though, formed a " you lied about fats, you lied about whole grains, why should I believe you about salt" state of mind.
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=its-time-to-end-the-war-on-salt
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Replies
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Agreed! I try to eat as much as possible.... because if I don't, I get a headache. From what I have learned - if salt isn't hurting you right now, i.e. you don't have issues with salt, then you don't have to worry about eating too much of it. But then again, my Dad and I have a funny way of needed more than the usual person because we really sweat it out.0
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The one thing that sticks out like a sore thumb, and the doctors I work for will tell you the same thing: there is a STRONG government-lead misconception on the whole salt intake issue.
No matter what you cannot avoid salt in foods - its in naturally occuring foods. Even meats have a sodium count but minimal.
Its when a person willingly chooses to eat processed, junk, candy, all the foods they are not supposed to be focusing on, THOSE are the foods where its an area of concern.
On the medical side of things, there are prescriptions that do warn the patient, no salt/salt substitutes - please consult with your physician. Im actually on a blood pressure medication that has that label... however, my electrolytes are well balanced and I use kosher salt, sea salt or himalayan pink sea salt in my cooking, or to season my individual plate. And I have the Endocrinologist's blessing; why? Because I consume only 100% natural foods.
The more natural your food intake is, the more natural salt you are safe to use - again, provided your treating physicians/specialists are ok with it.
There are salt-sensitive patients who have to have quite the restriction... but there is never enough emphasis with that patient to get rid of the bad food choices... its pitiful....
In another group, there is a (self-proclaimed) Registered Dietician who is throwing her weight around saying that added salt is bad for you, blah blah blah, everything in the bread/grains group is healthy for you, blah blah blah.... This is where my blood boiled because she was making a blanket statement - one that does NOT apply to all groups/conditions/situations. I gave her one hell of a run for her money and strongly advised her to stop giving food-related advice because she is at risk of a major liability, and that MFP can get into some serious trouble.
She argued... actually argued that her advice is professional and sound. I argued back reminding her "YOURE NOT A PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIAN - GET A GRIP! You should be reminding people to hold this discussion with their Primary Care providers!!!! An Endo or any specialty that can intervene. Your RD does not mean you have a MEDICAL DEGREE!"... I was so angry.... Ive been in healthcare for over 17 years and there are physicians that I work for who dont like RD's very much because they fail to address the actual medical advice given to the patient. If the physician tells them to have a better balance of food, keep it natural as possible, avoid low-fat-this-that-the other thing because of the preservatives, etc... and then the RD comes around and starts recommending the very things the PCP told the patient NOT to have.... they get angry.. and rightfully so! ....UGH!!!
I have a kosher salt shaker on my desk right next to me... 8-)0 -
On a low carb note, 'extra' salt is often recommended to combat headaches and fatigue.
I feel best on at least double the default guideline.
As ever it's best to use your body as a measure, not some arbitrary level.0 -
I bought a trader joes himilayn rock salt... and I will suck on a rock from time to time. It cures a head right quick and it sorta makes me feel better. IDK why but it does. I will especially eat it t after sitting in the hot sun all day long at my kids soccer games and sweating up a whole mess.0
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The low carb diet given to me by my physician recommends drinking bouillon every day to increase salt intake unless you use plenty of salt on your food. It states that if you feel light headed or dizzy, drink the bouillon or something salty. I recently spoke to a dietician connected with my insurance's wellness plan who suggested that I lower my salt intake because my blood pressure was slightly elevated at a previous dr's appointment (135/90). I had lost weight since that appointment so I checked my bp at the pharmacy and it was 115/80. The answer to my elevated bp is weight loss and controlling my blood glucose levels with low carb...not lower salt.0
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I tried the DASH (Dietary Approaches to Stop Hypertension) diet years ago. My Sodium target was 2500 mg.
1) it didn't make an noticable difference in my BP (even the clinical results I'd consider very moderate)
2) It is damn near impossible to do it unless you make 100% of your food from scratch. There is ALMOST NOTHING that you can buy in a box, a can or a jar that will not throw you over your Sodium limit for the day
My Doc said that unless you are one of those persons who is hyper sensitive to Sodium then forget about it. And if you are hyper sensitive then you'd need to cut your sodium way under 2500 mg.0 -
I had lost weight since that appointment so I checked my bp at the pharmacy and it was 115/80. The answer to my elevated bp is weight loss and controlling my blood glucose levels with low carb...not lower salt.
Ummmm .. your BP is within normal range... Are they smoking crack?
In normally active patients:
Systolic normal range is 80-120
Diastolic normal range is 60-80
In hardcore athletes, its not uncommon for their BP to be much lower than those numbers...
....yeah.. someone was smoking crack...0 -
Cramer - you are cracking me up! I hear you about a one size doesn't fit all approach. I think that's why it's so hard to tell people how to eat, etc. We gotta realize not everyone is the same. I may be able to woof down 3000 mg of salt a day... but someone else may bloat up on that. Although, the bloat is related to the carbs... but I will digress.
Also, the smoking crack comment made me LOL! I'm usually around 100/70... much better than the 120ish/90 I was at when i smoked in my 20's!0 -
I had lost weight since that appointment so I checked my bp at the pharmacy and it was 115/80. The answer to my elevated bp is weight loss and controlling my blood glucose levels with low carb...not lower salt.
Ummmm .. your BP is within normal range... Are they smoking crack?
In normally active patients:
Systolic normal range is 80-120
Diastolic normal range is 60-80
In hardcore athletes, its not uncommon for their BP to be much lower than those numbers...
....yeah.. someone was smoking crack...
LOL!! The pressure that she didn't like was the 135/90. Yes, that is elevated for me but it's not that bad. Personally, I think it was a result of me lifting 300+ pounds onto the exam table in the doc's office. Dropping 52 pounds makes a huge difference. When I was in my 20's (and still significantly overweight) my bp averaged 90/65. I won't tell her that. LOL!! I'd like to get back to that someday. Regardless, it isn't due to my salt intake.0
