Secession
Bahet
Posts: 1,254 Member
Go. Just go. Hook your home up to your pick up or Camaro, take Alabama or Mississippi or some other completely useless state, fill it with the mouth breathing birthers who want to form a 3rd world country because they are so angry that their guy lost and go. Make sure you pay your share of the national debt first. We also need to get the triple digit IQ people who want to stay in the US out first. Then we can make Puerto Rico a state and we won't even have to change the flag. Welcome to Dumbf*ckistan.
0
Replies
-
Looks like people in 36 useless states filed petitions. Poor Mississippi doesn't even rank in the top 5 in signatures and you pick on them!
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/11/secession-petitions-gain-clicks-fast/0 -
I'm beyond sick of the "your guy lost attitude" coming along with criticism of this movement. Obviously you don't get it or you are content with living in tyranny. To me, and everyone I know that has signed it, it has nothing to do with the election. It has to do with the current state of this country called 'America'.
I signed. Do I think it will happen, NO. Do I want it to, NO. I signed it as a statement. To let our leaders see how sick the people are of their decisions, how we are sick of being treated like peasants.That the country we are living in is NOT America. I am one of the most Patriotic people I know. I love everything American was founded on, the sacrifice that went into making this country and everything America stood for.. I have half a mind to stop paying the government *kitten*. I'm 25 years old, the outrageously, out of control debt is not my responsibility. I haven't lived/work long enough to pay my 'fair share" that people old and wiser (what a joke) have arranged for me to inherit. Thank you. The government doesn't pay it's bills, which costs me more, why the hell should I?
The Constitution has NO VALUE. Our government leaders disregard it in every manner. Our government in the past 10 years has made it so that people can be spied on by the government with NO cause or warrant. From the local police to the CIA, we are being watched with satellites, drones, cell phones and our computers. Any single citizen can be taken away and never seen again, no trial, no rights. The federal government has disregarded and walked over the Constitution regarding states rights, the 2nd amendment and enforce laws that they do not have the power to!
The most un-patriotic action I have seen are those who are letting this country turn into what it has and are doing nothing about it but bending over and taking it. Our service men swear to defend the Constitution, yet they take orders that blatantly are disregarding the Constitution. Our Servicemen swear to defend us against enemies foreign and domestic, yet are ruled by the biggest enemy to the people, our Federal government. It makes me sick.
A little piece of truth I have grown to love over the weekend. If anyone really cared about this country, enough to call themselves patriotic, they wouldn't go along with this corrupt government and allow it to continue the way it is. Everyone who supports this government, this President, Congress and Senate, is blind, and doesn't deserve freedom.
And a little financial advice to our leaders before I end my rant:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubWnK7hEG6Q&list=FLLvMGoYqDpbk0UsG9B6_YdQ&index=1&feature=plpp_video 0 -
Everyone who supports this government, this President, Congress and Senate, is blind, and doesn't deserve freedom.
LOL We'd be much better off if people who believe that left the country.0 -
Obviously [...] you are content with living in tyranny.
I'm not sure even 'hyperbole' is enough to describe any claims that Americans live under "tyranny". Your civil rights (by which those who claim this generally seem to mean their 'right' to do whatever they damn well please, irrespective of the effect of their actions on others) may be slightly curtailed in the name of security and safety for all, but this does not equate to "tyrrany" - I refer you to the Oxford Dictionary definition:
Definition of tyranny
noun (plural tyrannies)
[mass noun]
cruel and oppressive government or rule: refugees fleeing tyranny and oppression
[count noun] a state under cruel and oppressive government.
cruel, unreasonable, or arbitrary use of power or control: the tyranny of her stepmother
figurative the tyranny of the nine-to-five day
(especially in ancient Greece) rule by one who has absolute power without legal right.
Re. legal right: your rulers - Executive, Senate and House - are all granted this by the mandate of popular election. The system is so designed as to avoid absolute power residing in the hands of one person or branch, unless you are suggesting that your entire government now functions outside the law? As for cruel, oppressive and arbitrary...may I suggest studying or visiting an ex-Soviet state, much of the Middle East, Africa and Asia, or certain parts of South America for a lesson in just how generous your freedoms as an American are. 'The Lives of Others' is an excellent film to see, if you want a depiction of a truly tyrannous state - unspeakably cruel, hideously oppressive and utterly arbitrary.0 -
Everyone who supports this government, this President, Congress and Senate, is blind, and doesn't deserve freedom.
LOL We'd be much better off if people who believe that left the country.
Let me rephrase: Everyone who supports a corrupt government and supports a government that kills it's own citizens with drones, and illegally spies on it's citizens, does not deserve freedom.0 -
Obviously [...] you are content with living in tyranny.
I'm not sure even 'hyperbole' is enough to describe any claims that Americans live under "tyranny". Your civil rights (by which those who claim this generally seem to mean their 'right' to do whatever they damn well please, irrespective of the effect of their actions on others) may be slightly curtailed in the name of security and safety for all, but this does not equate to "tyrrany" - I refer you to the Oxford Dictionary definition:
Definition of tyranny
noun (plural tyrannies)
[mass noun]
cruel and oppressive government or rule: refugees fleeing tyranny and oppression
[count noun] a state under cruel and oppressive government.
cruel, unreasonable, or arbitrary use of power or control: the tyranny of her stepmother
figurative the tyranny of the nine-to-five day
(especially in ancient Greece) rule by one who has absolute power without legal right.
Re. legal right: your rulers - Executive, Senate and House - are all granted this by the mandate of popular election. The system is so designed as to avoid absolute power residing in the hands of one person or branch, unless you are suggesting that your entire government now functions outside the law? As for cruel, oppressive and arbitrary...may I suggest studying or visiting an ex-Soviet state, much of the Middle East, Africa and Asia, or certain parts of South America for a lesson in just how generous your freedoms as an American are. 'The Lives of Others' is an excellent film to see, if you want a depiction of a truly tyrannous state - unspeakably cruel, hideously oppressive and utterly arbitrary.
Please, our rights are not being 'curtailed in the name of safety and security', they are being done in the name of government control and corruption. Statistically, I am more likely to be killed by furniture than a terrorist. I am intelligent enough to know better than to think the government is doing what is best for me. In fact, they are doing what is best for them.
Please explain how allowing the feds to take a person from their home, detain, imprison or kill them is right. I know for a fact I am on a government watch list. They could take me today and kill me off with no reasoning and no trial. I'm not a dangerous person, I am a very non-confrontational person and I have no history of mental instability or violence. All they have to say is I That was a threat (whether I was or not) and it's already been done to people like myself this year! How is that NOT tyranny!?
"When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. When the government fears the people, there is liberty."
Thomas Jefferson
"If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy."
James Madison0 -
These petitions are obviously sour grapes since we just had an election where the popular vote also matched the electoral college vote. So these petitions are obviously being started and signed by those whose chosen candidate lost the election.0
-
These petitions are obviously sour grapes since we just had an election where the popular vote also matched the electoral college vote. So these petitions are obviously being started and signed by those whose chosen candidate lost the election.
Obviously, you are mistaken. That may be the reason for some but not all. Everyone who signed is sick of our government, period. Many people who have signed did not vote R or D, including myself.0 -
Please, our rights are not being 'curtailed in the name of safety and security', they are being done in the name of government control and corruption. Statistically, I am more likely to be killed by furniture than a terrorist. I am intelligent enough to know better than to think the government is doing what is best for me. In fact, they are doing what is best for them.
Please explain how allowing the feds to take a person from their home, detain, imprison or kill them is right. I know for a fact I am on a government watch list. They could take me today and kill me off with no reasoning and no trial. I'm not a dangerous person, I am a very non-confrontational person and I have no history of mental instability or violence. All they have to say is I That was a threat (whether I was or not) and it's already been done to people like myself this year! How is that NOT tyranny!?
And your 'facts' come from where, exactly? If you were on a government 'watch list' without knowing any reason for being so, it would seem profoundly incompetent of the government to let you know that... Just because you don't know why someone was detained does not mean there was no reason, unless you are privy to all the many layers of work that go on in the security services of the world. I find it in-credible to suggest that in a country with so intrusive and powerful a media as the US, you could be "taken and killed off with no reasoning and no trial" - sounds like the worst sort of scaremongering to me. Given that the US hasn't been able (or really tried) to hide the detention of those who pose a credible security risk (Bradley Manning, for example), I rather doubt your debt-ridden government would be wasting the sort of manpower and money required to keep the 'disappearance' of 'innocent citizens' quiet.
The statistics may indeed currently make furniture a more likely killer than a terrorist - I don't know, nor do I care. However, have you ever stopped to think that the work the government does in protecting its' citizens is, in all likelihood, stopping a rather large chunk of terrorist activity from ever posing a threat? Things we never know about, because they were stopped in time. If this was not the case, those statistics might be a little different...
The government may not be doing what you deem best for you personally. However, in a country like America, I think it's safe to assume that the majority of government is acting in the best interests of the majority of its' citizens.0 -
These petitions are obviously sour grapes since we just had an election where the popular vote also matched the electoral college vote. So these petitions are obviously being started and signed by those whose chosen candidate lost the election.
Obviously, you are mistaken. That may be the reason for some but not all. Everyone who signed is sick of our government, period. Many people who have signed did not vote R or D, including myself.
So....your chosen candidate did not win?0 -
I wish I could believe that this was an Independent movement free of political party just concerned with corruption, the wars, and civil liberties, but I can't. I have a hunch that if Mitt Romney would have won, this secession movement would have never happened. Besides, if things are so bad in this nation and people want to make a statement...getting a few thousand people to "sacrifce" 30 seconds out of their day to sign a petition isn't going to cut it. I, for one, deeply believe that their are major problems in this nation...I think a by far more sane way to go about starting a revolution is by finding an independent candidate and starting a true grass-roots movenment. Funny, many Dems and repubs agree on a lot of stuff, they just don't know it because they are busy screaming at each other about gay marriage or obabmacare. But the timing of this secession movement stinks of conservative bitterness and if I remember right, when Obama won in 2008, Texas governor Rick Perry and his merry band of idiots wanted to secede as well.0
-
Please, our rights are not being 'curtailed in the name of safety and security', they are being done in the name of government control and corruption. Statistically, I am more likely to be killed by furniture than a terrorist. I am intelligent enough to know better than to think the government is doing what is best for me. In fact, they are doing what is best for them.
Please explain how allowing the feds to take a person from their home, detain, imprison or kill them is right. I know for a fact I am on a government watch list. They could take me today and kill me off with no reasoning and no trial. I'm not a dangerous person, I am a very non-confrontational person and I have no history of mental instability or violence. All they have to say is I That was a threat (whether I was or not) and it's already been done to people like myself this year! How is that NOT tyranny!?
And your 'facts' come from where, exactly? If you were on a government 'watch list' without knowing any reason for being so, it would seem profoundly incompetent of the government to let you know that... Just because you don't know why someone was detained does not mean there was no reason, unless you are privy to all the many layers of work that go on in the security services of the world. I find it in-credible to suggest that in a country with so intrusive and powerful a media as the US, you could be "taken and killed off with no reasoning and no trial" - sounds like the worst sort of scaremongering to me. Given that the US hasn't been able (or really tried) to hide the detention of those who pose a credible security risk (Bradley Manning, for example), I rather doubt your debt-ridden government would be wasting the sort of manpower and money required to keep the 'disappearance' of 'innocent citizens' quiet.
The statistics may indeed currently make furniture a more likely killer than a terrorist - I don't know, nor do I care. However, have you ever stopped to think that the work the government does in protecting its' citizens is, in all likelihood, stopping a rather large chunk of terrorist activity from ever posing a threat? Things we never know about, because they were stopped in time. If this was not the case, those statistics might be a little different...
The government may not be doing what you deem best for you personally. However, in a country like America, I think it's safe to assume that the majority of government is acting in the best interests of the majority of its' citizens.
I am speechless. I don't know if I want to laugh or cry at your last statement.
I know I am on a government watch list as I meet the criteria. I don't need to post a link to some money-controlled news corporation to prove anything. The media is a joke, spewing honest, twisted news. The issues I touched on happen, before our own eyes. Maybe you don't see them because you are not a citizen or resident here, but you should, as they effect your country also. None of it is deniable if you just look at what is happening rather than argue in denial.
I give it 5 years before all of you who disagree are screaming out about how horrible things have become. The country is now more divided than ever, which is perfect for the gov't as the people are easier to control when arguing among themselves. The gov't is entering a treaty to limit our guns, better to control the people when you disarm them. The people cannot chose a leader to answer our problems when the leader is hand picked by the richest and most powerful in our country. It will take a revolution to wake up everyone in the country. It's already in process, that was given with the number of Libertarian votes in this last election. There are huge movements for liberty and the numbers grow massively by the year. The revolution movement may not take over by the next election, but I wouldn't doubt it.
An author I adore sums this up well, "Cheer and jeer on, America. But know this: unless we miraculously stand up to the ringmasters, and confront the circus that has become our political process, we are cheering our own demise."0 -
I wish I could believe that this was an Independent movement free of political party just concerned with corruption, the wars, and civil liberties, but I can't.
We all know that isn't the case, but the Romney supporters are not the only ones behind this. Like I mentioned, I would have been even more disappointed had Romney one, but I signed the petition, just because a voice is louder in numbers and the people need to be heard, not because I want to secede. I think to many people its about being fed up and speaking up.0 -
I know I am on a government watch list as I meet the criteria.
What's the "criteria" for being on a government watch list? I'm curious.0 -
These petitions are obviously sour grapes since we just had an election where the popular vote also matched the electoral college vote. So these petitions are obviously being started and signed by those whose chosen candidate lost the election.
Obviously, you are mistaken. That may be the reason for some but not all. Everyone who signed is sick of our government, period. Many people who have signed did not vote R or D, including myself.
So....your chosen candidate did not win?
No, I didn't vote for a candidate who COULD win, but rather against the others who I did not want to win.0 -
These petitions are obviously sour grapes since we just had an election where the popular vote also matched the electoral college vote. So these petitions are obviously being started and signed by those whose chosen candidate lost the election.
Obviously, you are mistaken. That may be the reason for some but not all. Everyone who signed is sick of our government, period. Many people who have signed did not vote R or D, including myself.
So....your chosen candidate did not win?
No, I didn't vote for a candidate who COULD win, but rather against the others who I did not want to win.
So you signed the petition because you did not agree with the popular vote....sour grapes.0 -
Revolution hmmmmm and you wonder why your on a goverment watch list ? I dont even know what to say at this point :huh:0
-
I know I am on a government watch list as I meet the criteria.
What's the "criteria" for being on a government watch list? I'm curious.
You can get that information directly from DHS, or a simple google search. Then again, every single person here has been flagged, simply by the words they have posted in this forum. It would be odd for a person you know to NOT be on one, as that is how the government justifies monitoring it's citizens.
I know for sure because I have posted online every single word in the DHA internet monitoring keyword list and because I always have the pleasure of being delayed by security when I fly, which is a given.0 -
Revolution hmmmmm and you wonder why your on a goverment watch list ? I dont even know what to say at this point :huh:
Ironic that you all supposedly love a country that was founded by a revolution. Every major change that has taken place (civil rights anyone) was a result of a revolution. Yet that word is so appalling to you.0 -
Revolution hmmmmm and you wonder why your on a goverment watch list ? I dont even know what to say at this point :huh:
Ironic that you all supposedly love a country that was founded by a revolution. Every major change that has taken place (civil rights anyone) was a result of a revolution. Yet that word is so appalling to you.
I love that you question the patriotism of anyone who does not agree with you. That strategy has been used by many to get their way.0 -
An author I adore sums this up well, "Cheer and jeer on, America. But know this: unless we miraculously stand up to the ringmasters, and confront the circus that has become our political process, we are cheering our own demise."
Now this, I agree with. Though I suspect for different reasons, and with a different interpretation, than yours. About to sign off for the day - have fun, all!0 -
Your tea party in a nutshell:Rep. Chris Kapenga (R-Delafield) is one of the nine from Wisconsin who told the Campaign for Liberty he would back legislation to declare Obamacare illegal and allow police to arrest federal officials who take steps to implement it in Wisconsin. He said he believes the health care law is unconstitutional, despite the U.S. Supreme Court’s ruling that it passes constitutional muster.
“Just because Obama was re-elected does not mean he’s above the constitution,” Kapenga said.
Words fail me.
But I see the same level of civic ignorance and self-absorption in many others as well.
There are over 310 million people in this country.
Nobody has a monopoly on the definition of "America".
Nobody has a monopoly on the definition of "patriotism".
Nobody has a monopoly on the definition of "freedom".
In many ways, the definitions of those terms are defined by the will of the people as expressed through the electoral process, with the judiciary system as the arbiter of last resort on what is considered "Constitutional".
To claim that the over 50% of population who supported a different interpretation of those ideas somehow "don't understand America" is an argument that fails on the basis of its own shallowness and myopia.0 -
I give it 5 years before all of you who disagree are screaming out about how horrible things have become.
its funny how all these crack pot 5 year predictions never come to pass. there is always some big event that is a few years away and then there is some excuse when that time comes to pass. like that Reverend that keeps predicting the end of the world and then it comes to pass and he has some excuse as to why.
The USA is not going to fall, we are not going to lose our liberty, there is no grand plan to let the UN takeover, 12/21/12 is not the end of the world, we wont be raptured whenever that reverend's next prediction says we will be, Obama is not a mancurian candidate...etc...
people who believe all that really should seek some kind of therapy.0 -
Since I am pretty worn out on this subject, thanks to facebook.... all I'm gonna say is:
It ain't happenin'... and Perry has backpeddled so fast with his support of secession (not that I think we should anyway)...0 -
:huh: :noway: <---- me reading this thread. Wow. Just. Wow.0
-
I wish I could believe that this was an Independent movement free of political party just concerned with corruption, the wars, and civil liberties, but I can't. I have a hunch that if Mitt Romney would have won, this secession movement would have never happened. Besides, if things are so bad in this nation and people want to make a statement...getting a few thousand people to "sacrifce" 30 seconds out of their day to sign a petition isn't going to cut it. I, for one, deeply believe that their are major problems in this nation...I think a by far more sane way to go about starting a revolution is by finding an independent candidate and starting a true grass-roots movenment. Funny, many Dems and repubs agree on a lot of stuff, they just don't know it because they are busy screaming at each other about gay marriage or obabmacare. But the timing of this secession movement stinks of conservative bitterness and if I remember right, when Obama won in 2008, Texas governor Rick Perry and his merry band of idiots wanted to secede as well.
I have to agree with you on this one. While there are many things I don't agree with our Government and elected officials on (many of which I didn't vote for)... it's no reason to secede.... if the reasons that are stated in the petitions to secede are actually the real reasons, then they would have been calling to secede before Obama was ever nominated as the Democrat runner in 2008. Because a lot of the things that people are screaming at in at least the Texas Petition, Bush signed into law... things like the Patriot act and NDAA.
Sorry, I can never really get my final say on anything. Especially when I read something I either totally agree with or totally disagree with.0 -
I wish I could believe that this was an Independent movement free of political party just concerned with corruption, the wars, and civil liberties, but I can't.
We all know that isn't the case, but the Romney supporters are not the only ones behind this. Like I mentioned, I would have been even more disappointed had Romney one, but I signed the petition, just because a voice is louder in numbers and the people need to be heard, not because I want to secede. I think to many people its about being fed up and speaking up.
All I am saying is that people with your beliefs have every right to be upset, no doubting that. But much like how the Tea Party was exploited by the conservatives, and the anti-war movement was exploited by the dems, this is just another case of exploitation. I'm not happy with much that goes on nowadays, but instead of letting the right or left hijack my displeasure and use it to further their own two-party straglehold, I am looking to start working how I can start moving foward and getting a guy like Jesse Ventura ballot access in Indiana for 2016.0 -
I wish I could believe that this was an Independent movement free of political party just concerned with corruption, the wars, and civil liberties, but I can't.
We all know that isn't the case, but the Romney supporters are not the only ones behind this. Like I mentioned, I would have been even more disappointed had Romney one, but I signed the petition, just because a voice is louder in numbers and the people need to be heard, not because I want to secede. I think to many people its about being fed up and speaking up.
All I am saying is that people with your beliefs have every right to be upset, no doubting that. But much like how the Tea Party was exploited by the conservatives, and the anti-war movement was exploited by the dems, this is just another case of exploitation. I'm not happy with much that goes on nowadays, but instead of letting the right or left hijack my displeasure and use it to further their own two-party straglehold, I am looking to start working how I can start moving foward and getting a guy like Jesse Ventura ballot access in Indiana for 2016.
Perhaps third party folks should look at nominating someone not as polarizing as Jesse Ventura. He has some pretty outlandish stances that will scare off moderate voters. Like it or not, this country is moderate to just right of moderate. Nominating someone who is way outside of that will only support the view that third parties are full of nuts.0 -
I wish I could believe that this was an Independent movement free of political party just concerned with corruption, the wars, and civil liberties, but I can't.
We all know that isn't the case, but the Romney supporters are not the only ones behind this. Like I mentioned, I would have been even more disappointed had Romney one, but I signed the petition, just because a voice is louder in numbers and the people need to be heard, not because I want to secede. I think to many people its about being fed up and speaking up.
All I am saying is that people with your beliefs have every right to be upset, no doubting that. But much like how the Tea Party was exploited by the conservatives, and the anti-war movement was exploited by the dems, this is just another case of exploitation. I'm not happy with much that goes on nowadays, but instead of letting the right or left hijack my displeasure and use it to further their own two-party straglehold, I am looking to start working how I can start moving foward and getting a guy like Jesse Ventura ballot access in Indiana for 2016.
Perhaps third party folks should look at nominating someone not as polarizing as Jesse Ventura. He has some pretty outlandish stances that will scare off moderate voters. Like it or not, this country is moderate to just right of moderate. Nominating someone who is way outside of that will only support the view that third parties are full of nuts.
I could care less if he is polarizing. He only needs 34 % of the vote to win in a three party race...and this notion that he has outlandish views usually go away once people read his books or hear him interviewed or debate. Besides. the real reason he would win is he would out debate both parties and I have a feeling voter turnout would increase since most americans would probably love seeing a guy like him to run...and isn't a corporate turd.0 -
Aw man. I was enjoying the conspiracy theorising (real word?) going on in here. I was waiting for someone to talk about how Obamacare is going to start handing out the Mark of the Beast on 03/23/13. Oh well, back to reality.0
