A lesson from the guys?
fullofwhimsy
Posts: 218
Read an interesting article while I was supposed to be working. For women - rejection and the numbers game. Thoughts?
Get Rejected More (You’re Not Doing It Enough) - Terri Trespicio
If you're weeping into a glass of sherry and wondering why the world is so cruel and your life is so loveless, well, you have no one to blame but yourself.
Yes, I said that. Because if you're like a lot of women, you wait. And wait. You think you're enlightened and independent, yet there you are clinging to this Disneyfied idea of romance, believing down deep that if you click your heels, the Right One will appear, if you just sit quietly and wait. It's not the world getting in your way; it's you.
You need to make **** happen. Here's how: You need to take more risks. And you need to get rejected. In fact, my challenge to you is to get rejected no fewer than three times. Tonight, if possible. Because it means you're getting somewhere. Also, because it's unlikely you'll even get that far before someone takes you up on it. (Trust me on this.)
Men already know this. They play the numbers. They're used to rejection — they accept it as part of the game. If they ask out ten ladies, it means one or two or three will say yes. They go after what they want, and expect rejection. Regularly.
I knew a guy like this in college. He was nothing to look at, truly, but a fun, personable guy. He was never the hottest guy in the room. But he asked out EVERYONE. And the man always had a date. It's not magic. It's numbers.
You need to think this way. You don't need to "act" like a man, but you need to adopt the mentality, create the calluses, and push through it. If you prefer a more gender-neutral example, think business: A salesperson doesn't go into the field thinking everyone will say yes. But she goes out knowing that to get a return on those efforts, she needs to aim for far more than she'll actually land.
When's the last time you got rejected? And what did you do about it? If the answer is go home, lick your wounds, and stop shaving your legs, that's the wrong answer.
I've gotten rejected lots of times–tons. It sucks every single time. It will always hurt. But it doesn't always have to stop you cold. When I look at the past year alone, I've been told many times "no," or "later," and "maybe not."
STRIKE ONE: I was seeing a man in the midst of a divorce; he had pursued me. Then he said he needed time; he'd be back. That was a year ago. When I asked whatever happened to him, he said he was dating other people, but decided he "didn't want to continue our thing." Our thing? Meaning, that thing he started? Yeah, that hurt. Moving on.
STRIKE TWO: I sold a guy a set of drawers on craigslist. I was charmed. I emailed him to let him know I thought so. We went for coffee. Then, a walk. He emailed me the next day and said I just wasn't what he was looking for in a girlfriend. I was shocked, then hurt. Then, over it. Next?
STRIKE THREE: I put the full-court press on a guy I met at a singles event (or rather, I happened to him — find out how to do this). I had him in the bag — I thought. He texted me the next day to go out. Then he changed the date. Then, he changed his mind.
I have more…you want me to go on? You get my point. I get hurt, sad. I don't quit. And I'm never without a date if I want one. I just go get one.
I also find men wherever they are — not just out at some bar. Anyone you meet is game, and he doesn't have to be in striking distance of a gin and tonic to be game. I recently visited the Apple Genius bar for help with my Mac. The guy who helped me was completely adorable. I started to leave after our session and then turned my *kitten* right around and went back inside and, when I couldn't find him, gave my card to another employee to give to him.
He wrote me back a very polite, service-oriented note. I wrote back telling him I was interested in him. And I didn't hear back. For a month.
I forgot about it.
And then, weeks later, he started following me on Twitter. I called him out ("hey I know you") and he replied, "We should hang out."
So we did. And we are.
Be warned: The more time you spend in a gaggle of ladies, the less time you spend taking the risk of putting yourself out there in a real way — making yourself vulnerable, trying, and, failing. Failing isn't a mistake or something you shouldn't have done. It's something you should be doing more.
Do it. Go out — alone. Look hot. Feel hot. Sit at the bar and get a drink. Start a conversation with someone who's even just mildly attractive. I don't give a **** if he's married, gay, or about to enter the priesthood. Buy him a drink. You will probably not marry this man. But you may date him. Who knows? And at the very least, you have a fun, flirty conversation. There will be more.
Do it again. And again. Introduce yourself to guys you meet randomly, in passing, anywhere. Rack up numbers. And you will get results — and likely, a guy who appreciates a woman with a little initiative.
Get Rejected More (You’re Not Doing It Enough) - Terri Trespicio
If you're weeping into a glass of sherry and wondering why the world is so cruel and your life is so loveless, well, you have no one to blame but yourself.
Yes, I said that. Because if you're like a lot of women, you wait. And wait. You think you're enlightened and independent, yet there you are clinging to this Disneyfied idea of romance, believing down deep that if you click your heels, the Right One will appear, if you just sit quietly and wait. It's not the world getting in your way; it's you.
You need to make **** happen. Here's how: You need to take more risks. And you need to get rejected. In fact, my challenge to you is to get rejected no fewer than three times. Tonight, if possible. Because it means you're getting somewhere. Also, because it's unlikely you'll even get that far before someone takes you up on it. (Trust me on this.)
Men already know this. They play the numbers. They're used to rejection — they accept it as part of the game. If they ask out ten ladies, it means one or two or three will say yes. They go after what they want, and expect rejection. Regularly.
I knew a guy like this in college. He was nothing to look at, truly, but a fun, personable guy. He was never the hottest guy in the room. But he asked out EVERYONE. And the man always had a date. It's not magic. It's numbers.
You need to think this way. You don't need to "act" like a man, but you need to adopt the mentality, create the calluses, and push through it. If you prefer a more gender-neutral example, think business: A salesperson doesn't go into the field thinking everyone will say yes. But she goes out knowing that to get a return on those efforts, she needs to aim for far more than she'll actually land.
When's the last time you got rejected? And what did you do about it? If the answer is go home, lick your wounds, and stop shaving your legs, that's the wrong answer.
I've gotten rejected lots of times–tons. It sucks every single time. It will always hurt. But it doesn't always have to stop you cold. When I look at the past year alone, I've been told many times "no," or "later," and "maybe not."
STRIKE ONE: I was seeing a man in the midst of a divorce; he had pursued me. Then he said he needed time; he'd be back. That was a year ago. When I asked whatever happened to him, he said he was dating other people, but decided he "didn't want to continue our thing." Our thing? Meaning, that thing he started? Yeah, that hurt. Moving on.
STRIKE TWO: I sold a guy a set of drawers on craigslist. I was charmed. I emailed him to let him know I thought so. We went for coffee. Then, a walk. He emailed me the next day and said I just wasn't what he was looking for in a girlfriend. I was shocked, then hurt. Then, over it. Next?
STRIKE THREE: I put the full-court press on a guy I met at a singles event (or rather, I happened to him — find out how to do this). I had him in the bag — I thought. He texted me the next day to go out. Then he changed the date. Then, he changed his mind.
I have more…you want me to go on? You get my point. I get hurt, sad. I don't quit. And I'm never without a date if I want one. I just go get one.
I also find men wherever they are — not just out at some bar. Anyone you meet is game, and he doesn't have to be in striking distance of a gin and tonic to be game. I recently visited the Apple Genius bar for help with my Mac. The guy who helped me was completely adorable. I started to leave after our session and then turned my *kitten* right around and went back inside and, when I couldn't find him, gave my card to another employee to give to him.
He wrote me back a very polite, service-oriented note. I wrote back telling him I was interested in him. And I didn't hear back. For a month.
I forgot about it.
And then, weeks later, he started following me on Twitter. I called him out ("hey I know you") and he replied, "We should hang out."
So we did. And we are.
Be warned: The more time you spend in a gaggle of ladies, the less time you spend taking the risk of putting yourself out there in a real way — making yourself vulnerable, trying, and, failing. Failing isn't a mistake or something you shouldn't have done. It's something you should be doing more.
Do it. Go out — alone. Look hot. Feel hot. Sit at the bar and get a drink. Start a conversation with someone who's even just mildly attractive. I don't give a **** if he's married, gay, or about to enter the priesthood. Buy him a drink. You will probably not marry this man. But you may date him. Who knows? And at the very least, you have a fun, flirty conversation. There will be more.
Do it again. And again. Introduce yourself to guys you meet randomly, in passing, anywhere. Rack up numbers. And you will get results — and likely, a guy who appreciates a woman with a little initiative.
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Replies
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I totally appluad this message however undoublty the *kitten* storm is about to follow....... THis lady reminds me of me lol0
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HALLELUJAH!0
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While I like the get *kitten* done line, I completely disagree with almost all of it. One thing this world doesn't need is ladies acting like men. And what the author seems to forget (unless I missed it), is that most guys that play #'s do so to get laid, not find a meaningful relationship. I can tell you as a guy, one thing I try to avoid is the girl that has been around the world and back as far as dating is concerned. Instead I'd say, figure out what you want, and pursue quality over quantity.0
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Funny, but I recognise in myself that I don't try anymore. It's not fear of rejection. Jeez, I get rejected every time I text my ex!!! lol
I guess I just can't be arsed!! :bigsmile:
However, I think it's a good bit of advice. You have to reach out for what you want in life.
I design and sell kitchens, so I know all about the numbers game! It definitely works! :flowerforyou:0 -
Poncho - with all due respect - TOTALLY disagree. Women need to hear more of this. Like WAY more.
Notice she's not saying go rack up numbers to get laid, she's saying quit waiting around for Prince Charming to come and find you on your couch watching the Bachelor with your cats. Get out there.. talk to people, flirt, have fun, be open, confident and make something happen.0 -
While I like the get *kitten* done line, I completely disagree with almost all of it. One thing this world doesn't need is ladies acting like men. And what the author seems to forget (unless I missed it), is that most guys that play #'s do so to get laid, not find a meaningful relationship. I can tell you as a guy, one thing I try to avoid is the girl that has been around the world and back as far as dating is concerned. Instead I'd say, figure out what you want, and pursue quality over quantity.
I think it was more about NOT sitting back and looking pretty and waiting for guys to knock on your door. Rather, to be going out and making yourself available and approaching guys, without fear of rejection.
Even if you approach one guy that's double your chances than if you approached zero!!
It doesnt mean that you should compromise on quality. When selling kitchens, I dont quote every kitchen I walk into. About 70% of them are a waste of time. I only quote if someone is serious about buying a kitchen. If you see what I mean?? But if I didnt get off my *kitten* and quote those 30% then I'd achieve zero income.0 -
I think women actually getting their feet in the water and approaching guys is good, the #'s game however is a terrible way to go about finding someone of quality... sure you might stumble onto someone eventually. But most of the people you will find while playing the #'s game is people also playing the #'s game.
I can tell you right now you will find more guys trying to get laid and less trying to find a relationship if you play #'s.
Unless I have a completely different idea of what the #'s game is?? Every guy I know that does this, approaches as many gals as possible hopping one hits.... and like I said above they're looking to get laid not find a relationship.
I ultimately think my brother had it right when he said the **** just happens... one day your single and the next bam, you have a wife and two kids.... don't over think these self proclaimed experts, people have been getting in relationships long before them and will long after their gone.0 -
To add, I think JJ had a pretty good strategy of not being so picky with little things like the initial message she received... maybe by playing the #'s of giving more people a chance is the best bet.0
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I completely understand the idea to go out and be active in the community instead of sitting around at home. I admit I'm guilty of that sometimes. And I get that to be rejected you must actually put yourself in positions to be rejected. But I disagree with the notion that as a woman you must approach these men...I know a lot of you will disagree.
My main point: put yourself in a place to be approached. You will not meet men sitting at home in your sweats. You may end up being rejected but you will also put yourself in a good place to meet people.0 -
I think women actually getting their feet in the water and approaching guys is good, the #'s game however is a terrible way to go about finding someone of quality... sure you might stumble onto someone eventually. But most of the people you will find while playing the #'s game is people also playing the #'s game.
I can tell you right now you will find more guys trying to get laid and less trying to find a relationship if you play #'s.
Unless I have a completely different idea of what the #'s game is?? Every guy I know that does this, approaches as many gals as possible hopping one hits.... and like I said above they're looking to get laid not find a relationship.
I ultimately think my brother had it right when he said the **** just happens... one day your single and the next bam, you have a wife and two kids.... don't over think these self proclaimed experts, people have been getting in relationships long before them and will long after their gone.
If you translate this to online dating, how can it not be a numbers game? As we have talked about in other threads, it seems that every profile is 'generic' and alot of us say the same things. It's really hard to tell if you are going to get quality when you show up for that first date or even the fifth. I have no idea if buddy is trying to get laid or find a relationship unless I meet him and get to know him. And from my experience, I have been meeting alot of men, and haven't been doing too well. Maybe there also, then, has to be a better approach at online dating lol.....
But I also agree with your brother, most people I ask who are married or getting married, say they don't know how it happens -- they were friends, then wam married. So then I wonder how people must just then be taking the wrong approach to online dating (I refer to online dating becuase this is what I use to put myself out there). There seems to be so much pressure to have this instant love connection, that you forget about getting to know the person and you get all caught up and sometimes, force things. If you were to meet in real time (ie bar, party, etc.) you don't look at the person and go 'she is single so we must click immediately'.
ETA: if you have suggestions on how to find quality over quantity, I am sure more than me will be all ears
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To add, I think JJ had a pretty good strategy of not being so picky with little things like the initial message she received... maybe by playing the #'s of giving more people a chance is the best bet.
I think this is the point of the OP. It's not the "get out there and sleep with dozens of guys" #s game. It's the "give men a chance and learn to get over being rejected" #s game. It's the "don't hide yourself from the world after a bad experience" #s game. The OP never said that a gal should put it all on the line and give it up to every man she meets. There's a balance between being open and aggressive in MEETING people, and being aggressive in taking men to bed. You CAN (and rightly SHOULD) do the first without the second.
... my two pennies.0 -
To add, I think JJ had a pretty good strategy of not being so picky with little things like the initial message she received... maybe by playing the #'s of giving more people a chance is the best bet.
I think this is the point of the OP. It's not the "get out there and sleep with dozens of guys" #s game. It's the "give men a chance and learn to get over being rejected" #s game. It's the "don't hide yourself from the world after a bad experience" #s game. The OP never said that a gal should put it all on the line and give it up to every man she meets. There's a balance between being open and aggressive in MEETING people, and being aggressive in taking men to bed. You CAN (and rightly SHOULD) do the first without the second.
... my two pennies.
Exactly... kinda where my post came from.... You have to meet lots of men to find the quality ones, we certainly shouldn't/aren't sleeping with them all!0 -
To the Virgins, to make much of Time
GATHER ye rosebuds while ye may,
Old Time is still a-flying:
And this same flower that smiles to-day
To-morrow will be dying.
The glorious lamp of heaven, the sun,
The higher he's a-getting,
The sooner will his race be run,
And nearer he's to setting.
That age is best which is the first,
When youth and blood are warmer;
But being spent, the worse, and worst
Times still succeed the former.
Then be not coy, but use your time,
And while ye may, go marry:
For having lost but once your prime,
You may for ever tarry.
----Robert Herrick. 1591–16740 -
Nah, it isn't always about just getting laid. The concept works equally well if you are looking for a relationship. Whether you're looking for sex or a relationship step 1 is always meeting someone to see if there is any connection or chemistry. This is where the numbers game helps, because you never know if you are going to hit it off with someone or have absolutely nothing in common with them until you talk to them.I think women actually getting their feet in the water and approaching guys is good, the #'s game however is a terrible way to go about finding someone of quality... sure you might stumble onto someone eventually. But most of the people you will find while playing the #'s game is people also playing the #'s game.
I can tell you right now you will find more guys trying to get laid and less trying to find a relationship if you play #'s.
Unless I have a completely different idea of what the #'s game is?? Every guy I know that does this, approaches as many gals as possible hopping one hits.... and like I said above they're looking to get laid not find a relationship.
I ultimately think my brother had it right when he said the **** just happens... one day your single and the next bam, you have a wife and two kids.... don't over think these self proclaimed experts, people have been getting in relationships long before them and will long after their gone.
So you can either waste your time trying to figure out what they're all about from afar, come up with a bunch of BS reasons not to talk to them, or finally build up enough courage to go talk to them...or you can just dive right in and get it done quickly...like a band aid.
I think this practice would be great for a lot of women for many reasons. Seems like a lot of women are afraid of rejection. After you get rejected a couple hundred times like most men you start to realize that's it's not personal and it's really not that big of a deal. Also, learning to take initiative in life, learning to step out of your comfort zone, and being proactive are useful and attractive traits to have.0 -
I completely agree with this.Poncho - with all due respect - TOTALLY disagree. Women need to hear more of this. Like WAY more.
Notice she's not saying go rack up numbers to get laid, she's saying quit waiting around for Prince Charming to come and find you on your couch watching the Bachelor with your cats. Get out there.. talk to people, flirt, have fun, be open, confident and make something happen.0 -
This is a great article, and I agree that you do need to get rejected in order to get somewhere. And, I think the # game just meants if you initiate conversation with 3 men, and get rejected all 3x.......you might feel bad, but if you initiate with 20 guys the chance of rejecting 20x is much less.....makes sense.
A guy friend and I had a conversation about me being shy........he said "to practice" I should just talk to any guy I meet........in the grocery store, at work, etc. and I think there was a thread about this also..........anyway I did that day talk to some guy at the store that normally would not have said anything to--I wasn't attracted to him, but was practicing not being so shy.....and it was fine. Have since retreated a little back in to shy shell......but should come out once warm weather comes back.....0 -
Even if it's just for 10 seconds, most people will just try to make an interaction with another person happen decently. I know I would.A guy friend and I had a conversation about me being shy........he said "to practice" I should just talk to any guy I meet........in the grocery store, at work, etc. and I think there was a thread about this also..........anyway I did that day talk to some guy at the store that normally would not have said anything to--I wasn't attracted to him, but was practicing not being so shy.....and it was fine. Have since retreated a little back in to shy shell......but should come out once warm weather comes back.....0 -
IDK, sometimes I read things different. I just see a big gap between initiating conversation with a crush and going up to every guy you think is cute. Do you really need to practice getting rejected?? Seems to me it's a pretty large part of life, if you just enter the game you will get plenty of it playing the #s or not. I'll concede to I'm the odd ball here as everyone else seems to agree with the article.0
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IDK, sometimes I read things different. I just see a big gap between initiating conversation with a crush and going up to every guy you think is cute. Do you really need to practice getting rejected?? Seems to me it's a pretty large part of life, if you just enter the game you will get plenty of it playing the #s or not. I'll concede to I'm the odd ball here as everyone else seems to agree with the article.
Poncho you know normally I agree with you but women and men handle rejection differently ...alot differently ...If women handled rejection more like men they would probably save alot of emotional hardship (and their hips would thank them for laying of the ice cream)
I talk to everyone male female at the bar lol...If I slept with all the guys I said hi to or flirted with I wouldn't have time to do anything else (ewwww)0 -
IDK, sometimes I read things different. I just see a big gap between initiating conversation with a crush and going up to every guy you think is cute. Do you really need to practice getting rejected?? Seems to me it's a pretty large part of life, if you just enter the game you will get plenty of it playing the #s or not. I'll concede to I'm the odd ball here as everyone else seems to agree with the article.
Poncho you know normally I agree with you but women and men handle rejection differently ...alot differently ...If women handled rejection more like men they would probably save alot of emotional hardship (and their hips would thank them for laying of the ice cream)
I talk to everyone male female at the bar lol...If I slept with all the guys I said hi to or flirted with I wouldn't have time to do anything else (ewwww)
I was never saying I thought the article had anything to do with sleeping with anyone. I said the guys I know that play or played the #'s game did so trying to get laid... I don't think using the #'s game will work to developed a relationship... hell online is basically a #s game and most people here know what a nightmare it is. I nearly lost all faith in humanity online dating!!
So with what you're saying about handling rejection, I think we can agree that loads more of it will come with the #s game... Do most women have the emotional capacity to handle it??0 -
I think the whole point is to teach them to handle it better emotionally ...... I would like to think that other women have the emotionl cabality to handle it0
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Poncho...that is the whole point of the article. For women to practice being rejected so as to develop the "emotional capacity" to handle it better...and two..they might meet someone fun or interesting at the very least.
Prahsaurus...that you quoted Herrick makes me love you a great deal.0 -
Well in my 30 years on Earth (Mars was much friendlier) I found that rejection is part of life... I don't think you really have to go looking for it or practice unless you have been hiding in a cave... Think I'll write a convincing article on how the sky is blue.
I encourage you all to go out and get rejected as much as possible... This group will get a lot more interesting that's for sure!0 -
Well in my 30 years on Earth (Mars was much friendlier) I found that rejection is part of life... I don't think you really have to go looking for it or practice unless you have been hiding in a cave... Think I'll write a convincing article on how the sky is blue.
I encourage you all to go out and get rejected as much as possible... This group will get a lot more interesting that's for sure!
I feel like you're taking it very literally and missing the spirit of the message.0 -
The point is rejection is a part of life, but some people will do everything in their power to avoid it.Well in my 30 years on Earth (Mars was much friendlier) I found that rejection is part of life... I don't think you really have to go looking for it or practice unless you have been hiding in a cave... Think I'll write a convincing article on how the sky is blue.
I encourage you all to go out and get rejected as much as possible... This group will get a lot more interesting that's for sure!0 -
I agree 100% that women should try a little bit more of this.
This post reflects the kind of person I sometimes wish I was. Sometimes. To be perfectly honest, though, "playing the field" has never really been all that appealing to me. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it and I have massive respect for those with the ability to spark up conversations with 10 girls in an hour, it's just not my thing. I mean, what if they all said yes? HOW WOULD I FIND TIME TO WORKOUT AND POST ON MFP!?
I'm probably missing the opportunity to meet some amazing people, though, so I think I should ramp this up slightly.0 -
I agree 100% that women should try a little bit more of this.
This post reflects the kind of person I sometimes wish I was. Sometimes. To be perfectly honest, though, "playing the field" has never really been all that appealing to me. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it and I have massive respect for those with the ability to spark up conversations with 10 girls in an hour, it's just not my thing. I mean, what if they all said yes? HOW WOULD I FIND TIME TO WORKOUT AND POST ON MFP!?
I'm probably missing the opportunity to meet some amazing people, though, so I think I should ramp this up slightly.
Just a side note.. I love that your playing hopscotch in your pic lol0 -
The point is rejection is a part of life, but some people will do everything in their power to avoid it.Well in my 30 years on Earth (Mars was much friendlier) I found that rejection is part of life... I don't think you really have to go looking for it or practice unless you have been hiding in a cave... Think I'll write a convincing article on how the sky is blue.
I encourage you all to go out and get rejected as much as possible... This group will get a lot more interesting that's for sure!
My point is, how do you avoid it?? If the author of the article makes money on this stuff I'm in the wrong field.
Anyway, this one isn't for me.0 -
Just a side note.. I love that your playing hopscotch in your pic lol
It's not hopscotch, I was just winding up to kick that kid in the face.
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I am super friendly and will talk to anyone, pretty much anytime or anywhere. I meet tons of men on a friend/casual basis, but I don't ask anyone out. For me the tough part is when they express interest and pursue, we get to know each other a bit and THEN I get rejected. In that case I am pretty much horrible at not taking it personally..because at that point, it IS actually personal.
My response is basically to find fault in myself and try and figure out what is wrong with me, while also simultaneously thinking "DON'T YOU REALIZE HOW AWESOME I AM?" and F YOU then! It almost doesn't even matter if I actually wanted them (and often I don't!), but the rejection piece pretty much takes over.
Any thoughts? Or should I just go straight to booking a therapy appointment... 0
