The things that have come up lately
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I think we have to remember the target audience for this book. It isn't written for confident women who don't allow men to treat them like doormats. It's written for women who let men treat them like doormats, accept the crumbs of a last minute booty call in the hopes it will make the guy like them, chase after men who are not interested in them, act needy and desperate in the early stages of a relationship, and are wondering why they are being pumped and dumped. In theory it's all fine and good to tell people to do what comes naturally and to just be themselves, but for some women that means sleeping with a guy on the first date not because they are ready or want to, but because they are afraid they will lose the guy otherwise.
As far as The Rules, it's been a solid ten years since I read it, so I can't specifically remember everything. I do agree that some of their advice is a little nutty. If you pick and choose certain examples out, then yeah, it can sound a little too "game playing." But the overarching theory behind it is great for women who have difficulty establishing boundaries. They need a specific guideline (i.e. "don't accept last minute dates") to follow as they develop into the more confident self who won't let the man treat them like a doormat. If I recall, the book even says that these aren't written in stone and you have to be flexible, depending on the circumstances.It absolutely does tell you to play games. It says that if a guy calls you on Thursday to ask you out for Saturday, you should turn him down because you want to send him the message that you are in such high demand that he can't wait till two days before the weekend to ask you out. Even if your "plans" include nothing more than staying home and doing your nails, you're supposed to say you are busy so that it doesn't seem like you have nothing going on. I just think that is ridiculous. If you like the guy and you're not busy, why on Earth would you turn him down?
I think this is one of the best rules in the book for the early stages of dating. What is the reasoning behind it? A couple things:
1. You should have a busy, fun life going on, in which you have already made plans for that evening. (In other words, you shouldn't be sitting around hoping a guy calls you up and asks you on a date. You should be able to entertain yourself by now. You should have plans.)
2. You may be second or third choice if you are getting asked out at the last minute, which means he's not that into you.
To me, having plans to stay home dye my hair, do my nails and catch up on my DVR are no less "plans" than going out to meet a friend for drinks. That was my plan for the evening; I go out typically around 4-5 nights a week, so I look forward to my nights at home. So I would easily turn down a date if those were my plans and I wouldn't consider it playing games at all.
But again, you have to consider this rule in context. Is this a first date or a guy you've been out with three times? Are you dying to go out for the evening? Does he typically make plans in advance? How last minute is it? (I don't have a problem with accepting a date for Saturday on Thursday, provided I don't already have plans and want to go out that night.)
The point is more for the doormat girls who are getting calls from guys at 8 p.m. on Saturday night asking "so wanna go out tonight?" to learn to say "NO."It also tells you to not return every phone call because if a guy really likes you, he will keep trying to reach you. That's exceedingly rude, in my opinion, and I would not continue to pursue someone who doesn't return my calls. That doesn't say "I'm a great catch, and you need to try harder to win me over." It screams "I'm not interested in you. Please go away."
Well, you aren't a man! LOL. It's 100% been my experience, without exception, that men who are interested will pursue, and will call you more than once even if you don't return their call. Now, I agree with you that it is rude not to return a call, but there have been times when I haven't had a chance to return the call yet and he's called again. So. I don't recall the book saying to never return calls, though. I think the point is just that you should be busy enough that you aren't just sitting by the phone waiting to get a call from him. You should be out doing your own thing.
In my opinion, everyone plays games in the beginning of a relationship to varying degrees because they are trying to put their best foot forward. For example, you don't call or text a new love interest every single time you really want to in the beginning because you don't want to risk looking like a crazy stalker. That's playing games -- after all, you are holding back what comes naturally. I really wouldn't put trying to maintain a little mystery at the top rung of horrible things to do to a new suitor.0 -
Dating is always fun in the beginning, if there's any connection at all. And sometimes you read a connection when there really isn't one just because you WANT this person to be great. People like the feeling of excitement that comes with new possibilities. But I think you also quickly get to a point when you know whether there is or isn't any long-term potential. And men tend to be less willing than women to drag it out if they've got that feeling that it's going to flame out after a month.
A lot of guys do have their "games," like the 3-day rule for calling a woman after a first date, but I have found that with most men, the key is not in the timing; it's in whether or not he keeps his word like a grown man.0 -
I think this is one of the best rules in the book for the early stages of dating. What is the reasoning behind it? A couple things:
1. You should have a busy, fun life going on, in which you have already made plans for that evening. (In other words, you shouldn't be sitting around hoping a guy calls you up and asks you on a date. You should be able to entertain yourself by now. You should have plans.)
2. You may be second or third choice if you are getting asked out at the last minute, which means he's not that into you.
That's precisely my point. The book says to reject the guy even if you DON'T have plans. That's dumb. I understand not going out with a guy who calls you at the last minute, as in literally the same day he wants to go out with you. That IS disrespectful of your time. I do not understand refusing to go out with a guy you like just because he called you 48 hours in advance, rather than 72, and that is what the book suggests you do.
And I agree with Roadie that if you'd truly rather stay home and do your nails or watch your DVR than go on a date, then you're not really looking for romance. Sure, it sounds cool and disaffected to say you consider staying home to be equal to going out in the "having plans" hierarchy, and if you're sick or just really exhausted from a long week at work, maybe it's a legit excuse. If you're not going to be fun and energetic on the date, maybe it's better to postpone it. But let's be honest ... if you're going to turn down an evening with a great guy so you can give yourself a pedicure, that's just a sheer lack of interest. Ranks right up there with the "I'm washing my hair" excuse.0 -
When people try to play games with me, I play my own game. It's called "Let's see who can give less of a f**k." I win every time.
LMAO0 -
:laugh: I can usually do this too...but if I really like someone its harder. :grumble:When people try to play games with me, I play my own game. It's called "Let's see who can give less of a f**k." I win every time.
LMAO0 -
I do what I want! Hate rules!!
Rules are for people who have no idea who they are or what they want. If you have to play be some arbitrary set of rules you better be sure you can keep playing the game.
It makes me sad to think that there are women who define themselves by a relationship, so willing to lose their identity. Oh, poor me...I'm so worthless without a man. God forbid someone thinks of me as a spinster. :noway:0 -
And I agree with Roadie that if you'd truly rather stay home and do your nails or watch your DVR than go on a date, then you're not really looking for romance. Sure, it sounds cool and disaffected to say you consider staying home to be equal to going out in the "having plans" hierarchy, and if you're sick or just really exhausted from a long week at work, maybe it's a legit excuse. If you're not going to be fun and energetic on the date, maybe it's better to postpone it. But let's be honest ... if you're going to turn down an evening with a great guy so you can give yourself a pedicure, that's just a sheer lack of interest. Ranks right up there with the "I'm washing my hair" excuse.
Yeah, totally disagree with this. I'm not trying to sound "cool and disaffected" either (LOL, WTF?) Why do you have to be going out somewhere or interacting with other people to legitimately have plans? Why does it make my plans any less important? That makes no sense to me. Why should I cancel my plans for me time because some guy decided at the last minute he wants to go out? Sorry, but I'm not a doormat. My weeks are very busy, and there is only so much time in a week to go out on dates, particularly if a guy is asking last minute (and yeah, a day in advance, and sometimes even two days, is last minute to me). My evenings are usually planned out in advance and I like to have a night or two at home each week to do my own thing. I've turned down plenty of great guys for last minute dates in order to take care of myself, and it definitely wasn't due to lack of interest. They learn pretty quickly with me that my schedule fills up and if they snooze, they lose. And I don't lose any sleep over the guys that don't get it.
But hey, to each their own.0 -
It makes me sad to think that there are women who define themselves by a relationship, so willing to lose their identity. Oh, poor me...
It is completely and very said, and these girls are probably the ones who end up doormats. Hence the 'rules' to help women be more independent and not a doormat.
Not saying all the rules are cool, but some are a good idea.
ETA: A good book for someone who is a doormat is 'why men love *****es' while they employ some of the same ideals as the original link, they also go alot deeper into other stuff.0 -
:laugh: I can usually do this too...but if I really like someone its harder. :grumble:When people try to play games with me, I play my own game. It's called "Let's see who can give less of a f**k." I win every time.
LMAO
I don't care for the chase or games.0 -
:laugh: I can usually do this too...but if I really like someone its harder. :grumble:When people try to play games with me, I play my own game. It's called "Let's see who can give less of a f**k." I win every time.
LMAO
I don't care for the chase or games.
trust me I hate games. but if someone is trying to play the game then you have to have some pride and show no interest.
most guys have caught on early on that I don't play games. Well then I move on to the next one because the right guy for me won't play games.0
