Strength and Cardio Questions

tracieangeletti

Not sure where to start so I'll give you my schedule first:

Monday: 3 miles on the elliptical, 10 minutes on rowing machine, 30-45 strength training (lifting heavy, well, heavy for me), 30-40 push-ups, 100 crunches, 100 oblique crunches, planks, 25 tricep dips

Tues: 2 miles on elliptical, 10 minutes on rowing machine, 55 minute spin class, push-ups, crunches, planks, tricep dips (same as above)

Wed: 2 miles on elliptical, 10 minutes on rowing machine, 55 minute spin class, push-ups, crunches, planks, tricep dips, 30-45 minute strength training

Thurs: 2-3 miles on elliptical, 60 minute Body Pump class (low weight, many reps), push-ups, crunches, planks, tricep dips

Fri: 2 miles on elliptical, 10 minutes on rowing machine, 55 minute spin class, push-ups, crunches, planks, tricep dips

Sat: 30-45 strength training

Sun: REST!!! :-)

My first question is about cardio. I've been told you can do too much and it can interfere with strength training. What is considered too much?? How does it interfere? I still have about 7-10 lbs to lose. I know I can't build muscle in a deficit but I'm trying to keep the muscle I have for now. Next question is that I was thinking of taking my strength training from Wed. and adding it on to Thurs., so I won't be lifting two days in a row but doing two lifting programs on the same day. Would that be ok? I'm still so confused and don't want to undue benefits from one type of exercise by doing too much or the wrong kind of another. Suggestions???

ElizabethKalmbach

I think you need to stop and come up with a goal. WHY are you working out? Are you training for a marathon (endurance) or to get stronger (strength.)? Right now it looks like you're trying to do EVERYTHING and over-training.

I am doing strength training. I have picked ONE program (NROL) and I am sticking to it 3 days a week, per the recommendations of the book. I have reduced my cardio because the book recommended that I do so. I have not gained weight doing less cardio. I have more free time. I am still making strength gains at a predictable rate, even though I am struggling with other health issues.

Make a specific fitness goal, and then aim for it like a laser.

tracieangeletti

I think you need to stop and come up with a goal. WHY are you working out? Are you training for a marathon (endurance) or to get stronger (strength.)? Right now it looks like you're trying to do EVERYTHING and over-training.

I am doing strength training. I have picked ONE program (NROL) and I am sticking to it 3 days a week, per the recommendations of the book. I have reduced my cardio because the book recommended that I do so. I have not gained weight doing less cardio. I have more free time. I am still making strength gains at a predictable rate, even though I am struggling with other health issues.

Make a specific fitness goal, and then aim for it like a laser.

I have people at the gym ask me if I'm training for something and I just tell them I'm training for my summer shorts!! lol I'm really just trying to lose those last 7-10 lbs and really trying to change the fat over to muscle. I really have no idea what I'm doing, as you can tell. I started going to the gym with my friend who is a runner and I just started doing whatever she does. The running didn't work out so well for me, as I have a trick knee, so I moved over to the elliptical. I truly just want to be in good shape, healthy, and not constantly be worried about rolls of extra fat. I'm noticing improvements, although slowly. I still haven't made it to my calorie goal of TDEE-10% because I'm petrified of gaining weight, so I'm trying to do it in baby steps but still find myself obsessing over every calorie. I'm open to any exercise ideas. Oh, I have MS also. Not sure what health issues you have, but they do tend to make this whole thing even harder!!

colleen3115

If you aren't training for an event and want to look good in your summer shorts I would suggest changing your focus to strength. If you only have 7-10 pounds to lose, when you reach that scale # do you think your body will look like what you want it to look like? There are lots of skinny-fat people out there. They hit that magic number and are disappointed. Warm up for 10 or so minutes. Just a warm up. Lift Heavy! (New Rules of Lifting and New Rules of Lifting for Women are both GREAT books to get you on the right track and not over training.) All that cardio could be causing your body to hang onto those last 7-10 pounds.

tracieangeletti

If you aren't training for an event and want to look good in your summer shorts I would suggest changing your focus to strength. If you only have 7-10 pounds to lose, when you reach that scale # do you think your body will look like what you want it to look like? There are lots of skinny-fat people out there. They hit that magic number and are disappointed. Warm up for 10 or so minutes. Just a warm up. Lift Heavy! (New Rules of Lifting and New Rules of Lifting for Women are both GREAT books to get you on the right track and not over training.) All that cardio could be causing your body to hang onto those last 7-10 pounds.

I AM the dreaded skinny fat. Years of low cal dieting and no strength training. It was the only way I knew how to diet. Now I'm learning that this was COMPLETELY wrong.:sad: I am totally intimidated by strength training but I'm trying. I have to go get that book I guess and read up. If I adjust my cardio does that mean I have to re-figure my TDEE? How would you adjust the cardio? Get rid of something? Elliptical? Spin?

ElizabethKalmbach

Initially, NROL will recommend that you get rid of ALL OF IT. I had trouble letting go and did so slowly. I was pleased to find that I did not pack on pounds and had more free time. I love not having to get up early for a workout and still being able to eat. The way you burn calories between heavy lifting and cardio are different. Grab the book, read-up, and give yourself a little time to process the information. Then trust the trainers.

twinmomtwice4

I completely agree with Elizabeth!! I think you're doing way too much. And I definitely think there's too much cardio going on.

Pick your goal and then find a program that works for you.

Sometimes, with the realization that shorts and tank top weather is right around the corner, we try to stuff everything into one workout each day and lose sight of what our goals are. We make it too complicated, when really we just need to simplify it.

Try doing a strength training routine 3-4 days a week and then do cardio on your off-days from lifting. And make sure you take that rest day!!

Take it from someone who knows...I was doing 6 days of cardio on top of my strength training and I got stuck in a plateau. All the cardio was causing me to have too large of a deficit in my eating. As soon as I increased my calories and cut back on my cardio, the weight started coming off again!

tracieangeletti

Initially, NROL will recommend that you get rid of ALL OF IT. I had trouble letting go and did so slowly. I was pleased to find that I did not pack on pounds and had more free time. I love not having to get up early for a workout and still being able to eat. The way you burn calories between heavy lifting and cardio are different. Grab the book, read-up, and give yourself a little time to process the information. Then trust the trainers.

NO cardio?? NONE?? Won't that drastically reduce my fat loss? I know I can't gain muscle in a deficit and right now I'm 129 lbs with about 28% bf so that leaves my lbm at about 93 lbs. So I'm pretty sure I'm not a fat burning machine yet. I have MS and when I was very sick I lost a lot of muscle. UGH. Totally confused and depressed as to what to do next. I will run out and grab that book and see what it says to do. I'm assuming this will change my TDEE to a lower number. Right?

ElizabethKalmbach

NO cardio?? NONE?? Won't that drastically reduce my fat loss? I know I can't gain muscle in a deficit and right now I'm 129 lbs with about 28% bf so that leaves my lbm at about 93 lbs. So I'm pretty sure I'm not a fat burning machine yet. I have MS and when I was very sick I lost a lot of muscle. UGH. Totally confused and depressed as to what to do next. I will run out and grab that book and see what it says to do. I'm assuming this will change my TDEE to a lower number. Right?

But if you're on a plateau right now, you're not having ANY fat loss, are you? You're killing yourself at the gym for no results. So it's time to try something different.

Think about it this way, you BREAK your muscles down when you work out. You BUILD THEM when you REST. If you do not give your muscles a chance to REBUILD between workouts, you are just breaking them down day after day, starving them for supplies to rebuild, and wondering why you aren't gaining any muscle mass. You need to really REST and REBUILD your muscles. And you need to give them building materials to work with. Pick a workout plan. Follow it. Trust it. See if you don't get better results than you are currently.

tracieangeletti

NO cardio?? NONE?? Won't that drastically reduce my fat loss? I know I can't gain muscle in a deficit and right now I'm 129 lbs with about 28% bf so that leaves my lbm at about 93 lbs. So I'm pretty sure I'm not a fat burning machine yet. I have MS and when I was very sick I lost a lot of muscle. UGH. Totally confused and depressed as to what to do next. I will run out and grab that book and see what it says to do. I'm assuming this will change my TDEE to a lower number. Right?

But if you're on a plateau right now, you're not having ANY fat loss, are you? You're killing yourself at the gym for no results. So it's time to try something different.

Think about it this way, you BREAK your muscles down when you work out. You BUILD THEM when you REST. If you do not give your muscles a chance to REBUILD between workouts, you are just breaking them down day after day, starving them for supplies to rebuild, and wondering why you aren't gaining any muscle mass. You need to really REST and REBUILD your muscles. And you need to give them building materials to work with. Pick a workout plan. Follow it. Trust it. See if you don't get better results than you are currently.

Ahhhh... TRUST. Got to learn to give up control and start to trust. I will go buy the book and read. A more in depth strength training program was my next move anyways so why not start now?!?! For now I will cut down on cardio on strength days to just the 10 minutes on rowing machine or 1 mile on the elliptical and just do push-ups and tricep dips on those days. The other days I guess I'll do the 55 minute spin class and maybe, well, I don't really know. lol I'll do crunches everyday. Do you have any idea what activity level this would put me in?? I use scooby and I was using 5-6 hours of strenuous exercise for activity level but I guess I should move down to 3-5 hours of moderate exercise. Does that sound about right??

Gapwedge01

Initially, NROL will recommend that you get rid of ALL OF IT. I had trouble letting go and did so slowly. I was pleased to find that I did not pack on pounds and had more free time. I love not having to get up early for a workout and still being able to eat. The way you burn calories between heavy lifting and cardio are different. Grab the book, read-up, and give yourself a little time to process the information. Then trust the trainers.

NO cardio?? NONE?? Won't that drastically reduce my fat loss? I know I can't gain muscle in a deficit and right now I'm 129 lbs with about 28% bf so that leaves my lbm at about 93 lbs. So I'm pretty sure I'm not a fat burning machine yet. I have MS and when I was very sick I lost a lot of muscle. UGH. Totally confused and depressed as to what to do next. I will run out and grab that book and see what it says to do. I'm assuming this will change my TDEE to a lower number. Right?

I think you need to study cardio vs strength training. No one is saying you have to eliminate your cardio. Just reduce it. Strength training helps you maintain your LBM which includes muscle while cardio in and by itself will promote LBM loss. Both will reduce fat loss, but strength training if done properly will tone and shape your body showing definition in the muscles you have. You will experience a newbie muscle growth in the beginning also. With strength training you need to focus on BF% and measurements as opposed to scale weighing. Not to mention the benefits of stronger bone density and better fitting clothes. Don't do cardio just before a lifting session. You can do some light cardio after your lifting session however. Give your muscles some repair time by only lifting 3-4 times a week.
I am able to balance cycling with my weight training buy adjusting my cardio (cycling) around my lifting sessions. I have dropped 2 pant sizes since I began lifting but only dropped a couple of pounds. Now, how can that be? I have lost BF and maintained or gained some LBM. It is a slower process, but I refuse to be a skinny fat person.

tracieangeletti

Ok. I'm going to get the Rules for Lifting book today and start reading. In the mean time I will do this:

Mon: 30-45 minute strength training, push-ups, tricep dips, planks, crunches, and then either 10 minutes on rowing machine or 1 mile on elliptical (which takes me about 10 minutes to do)

Tues: Either 1 mile on elliptical or 10 minutes rowing, 55 minute spin class, planks, crunches

Weds: Same as Tues

Thurs: 30-45 minute strength training, 60 minute Body Pump class, push-ups, tricep dips crunches, might not do any cardio on this day

Fri: Same as Tues and Weds

Sat: 30-45 minute strength training, and maybe either the rowing or elliptical or no cardio at all

Sounding better?? Where do you think this will put me for activity level to compute for TDEE? Moderate? I promise this is the LAST question... well... until next time!! lol THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR ALL YOUR REPLIES!! You have been very helpful and it is truly appreciated!:happy:

Gapwedge01

Ok. I'm going to get the Rules for Lifting book today and start reading. In the mean time I will do this:

Mon: 30-45 minute strength training, push-ups, tricep dips, planks, crunches, and then either 10 minutes on rowing machine or 1 mile on elliptical (which takes me about 10 minutes to do)

Tues: Either 1 mile on elliptical or 10 minutes rowing, 55 minute spin class, planks, crunches

Weds: Same as Tues

Thurs: 30-45 minute strength training, 60 minute Body Pump class, push-ups, tricep dips crunches, might not do any cardio on this day

Fri: Same as Tues and Weds

Sat: 30-45 minute strength training, and maybe either the rowing or elliptical or no cardio at all

Sounding better?? Where do you think this will put me for activity level to compute for TDEE? Moderate? I promise this is the LAST question... well... until next time!! lol THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR ALL YOUR REPLIES!! You have been very helpful and it is truly appreciated!:happy:

As a minimum Moderate Activity (3-5 hrs/week). However, I don't see any rest days unless it is Sunday. if you are going to be that active then make some of your cardio an active rest day by walking or keeping your heartrate in the low aerobic zone. Keeping your heart elevated 6 days a week is not my ideal way to lose weight. Exercise is a stressor as is eating at a deficit. The bigger the deficit and the huge amount of exercise will retard fat loss, not lose it.

natini

Wow! I am exhausted just looking at your schedule. I think when you get the book (New Rules of Lifting for Women) and read it will be clearer to you. I still think you have an opportunity to cut out one day of cardio completely and have two rest days.

Also, I observed that you are on your last 10lbs to loose. You should consider eating at TDEE -10% since you are so close to goal.

Good luck!

heybales

Ok. I'm going to get the Rules for Lifting book today and start reading. In the mean time I will do this:

Mon: 30-45 minute strength training, push-ups, tricep dips, planks, crunches, and then either 10 minutes on rowing machine or 1 mile on elliptical (which takes me about 10 minutes to do)

Tues: Either 1 mile on elliptical or 10 minutes rowing, 55 minute spin class, planks, crunches

Weds: Same as Tues

Thurs: 30-45 minute strength training, 60 minute Body Pump class, push-ups, tricep dips crunches, might not do any cardio on this day

Fri: Same as Tues and Weds

Sat: 30-45 minute strength training, and maybe either the rowing or elliptical or no cardio at all

Sounding better?? Where do you think this will put me for activity level to compute for TDEE? Moderate? I promise this is the LAST question... well... until next time!! lol THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR ALL YOUR REPLIES!! You have been very helpful and it is truly appreciated!:happy:

Your strength training session on Mon, Thu, Sat. No upper body stuff being done, like pushing or pulling things?
Or you mean the push-ups and others ARE the strength training?

When you switch to real strength training as suggested and you seem to wisely want to follow, suggest you get HRM for that Spin class. You can kill the repair from that lifting with legs by the normal intense Spin class, you'll need to back that down to a Active Recovery HR zone, which may end up being so difficult to keep in, you'll skip it.
But if you view it as a different challenge, keep HR low, you can do it. Instructor may be yelling at you, but keep your personal workout.

Wed Spin class can be up into the Aerobic HR zone though. But really don't want to go over that, as you'll be getting tired muscles for your Thu strength training.

Fri would be Recovery again.

And with that much cardio, you for sure want to get best estimates of that calorie burn and balance it out well.

Use this to do so, plus a tab for HRM stuff, like your zones.

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/961054-spreadsheet-for-bodyfat-bmr-tdee-progress-tracker

Also, just to emphasis a point I saw you make several times.

The weight and hopefully only fat loss comes from the diet, done right just fat.
Exercise is for heart health and body improvements, and may help or hinder the fat only loss depending on how it's done.

The extra cardio just gives you more to eat, if you are having a reasonable deficit. But it's still more stress and more risk of burning off muscle mass.
Those back to back Spin classes especially.

Think back to how long you have been doing it. Let's say good 700 calories burned because you are intense at the class.
Good 85% of those calories is carbs - so about 600 calories of carbs burned just for session.
You been even eating 600 carb calories daily? And that's just burned from the exercise, count in rest of the day.
2 days in a row doing that, very easy to go low on carbs and start burning some muscle - I've done that even when I thought I was eating enough carbs. About 6 weeks in a row, of double day spins and cardio day before. Burned off a good lb of LBM, some was muscle.

The other encouragement.
Exercise tears down, rest, recovery, and repair is what builds back up, if you got food to go along with it. Get the most from your exercise by allowing rest.

tracieangeletti

Ok. NO cardio on strength days!! So that's Mon, Thurs, and Sat with no cardio. Not real sure what to do about spin. Maybe in Tues spin class I will take it a lot easier but continue to push in Wed and Fri classes. Although Friday spin looks like it might interrupt recovery from Thurs lifting. :-( Sunday is, for right now, my only rest day. My strength training program I'm doing now has you doing things like squats, sumo squats, dead lifts, lunges, bicep curls, rows, chest flys, etc... All that kind of stuff. It is called Chalean Extreme. I just started on the last month of the three month program. On arms I'm using 12 1/2 -15 lb dumbbells and on legs 25 lb dumbbells. I'm sure new rules will be more intense and in depth. Don't have money for a hrm now but maybe in the next few weeks. The spreadsheet looks awesome and I will have to have someone come over and show me how to set it up because I'm completely computer illiterate!! lol I'm 47 years old and after a lifetime of dieting I'm so surprised to find how little I know about doing it, especially correctly. As if you can't tell already, I have a tendency to have OCD issues and I now find myself obsessing over every calorie and exercise I do. Once I'm on the right path I will be able to loosen up some and not stress over it quite as much. It has become extremely draining on my psyche. I'm still not sure if I should lower my activity level to moderate or not because of the reduced cardio but heybales made it sound like I might be burning a lot in spin class. The instructor says you're burning a lot but I just assumed they said that so you'll keep coming back!! I do push hard in those classes though. I'm hoping the book helps to make this much clearer to me. Right now I sorta feel overwhelmed and like crying. UGH. Thanks again for all of your help. I'm going to get this right and I'm going to feel comfortable in my own skin. I have to.