Is patience the key??

greenmeena

Hi all,
Just want to say how grateful I am for this group! I started my reset journey back in early December 2012. Since I had been on a VLCD for about 2 years (accidentally, due to grief) I knew I was going to gain weight, and I sure did. I am 5'5 or so, started out at 135 and went up to 150 during my reset!! Yikes. Anyway, I've always been a runner and maybe played on some weight machines, but after reading all I could I also started NRL4W at that time as well.

Soooo...

I did a reset for something like 10 or 12 weeks, and so far with a cut nothing has happened. I even did the Whole 30, but discovered within that time that I have Fructose Malabsorption and have had to tweak what I eat even further. I only lost some inches when I made that discovery- mostly water and gas (lol!) so I'm grateful. However, I'm frustrated because the inches are not moving. Hell, I weigh more- 155- but I'm not necessarily worried about that because I am clearly building lean mass. I just want my pants to fit again!

I logged faithfully during my reset. During the Whole 30 I did not log, but followed their criteria very closely. I still do. I bet you're all gonna say- start logging again, girl! And I get that- but I will be honest, logging was making me a little too OCD and I'm way too prone to getting obsessive over that stuff. I'm still mostly following the Whole 30, except I added back in some kefir and 4 pieces of dark chocolate every day to stay sane...

So the question is: does it just take longer for some folks to show change? It never ever used to be a problem for me to shed pounds or inches when I was younger; run a little extra, cut out the ice cream and voila. Even though I feel I am eating quite a lot, is it really that big a difference if you under eat? Let's say I'm supposed to be eating 2300 for TDEE -20% but I"m only eating 1900, does your body really go on strike that hard, and keep all that extra fat weight?

Just some curiosity questions really. If the best advice is that I truly log again I will. I've faithfully taken photos- no real change. I just feel sad and discouraged because I'm lifting 3x a week, eating "clean" and here comes bikini season... I'm the biggest I've been in years and yet I'm eating the healthiest. Not a great way to reinforce healthy behavior when it does not seem to make a difference.

Over and over I've read some people say, "right about when you want to give up, the change happens" or something like that. So I have not and will not give up. I like eating 3 meals a day- so much better than just a smoothie in the morning- but what gives???
many many thanks, you guys are amazing.

heybales

So TDEE should always be based on what you are doing now, and if starting from a good known high side of the scale, lowered.

So if your routine was the same during last 4 weeks as it always had been, you can do the following.
So if that 15 lbs was gained right up until the end, take the last 3-4 weeks and how much gained during that time?
How much did you eat daily on avg?

Lbs Gained x 3500 / 21 or 28 days (3-4 wks) = avg daily excess.

Avg eaten daily - avg daily excess = avg daily TDEE.

Now take that best estimate TDEE / current weight BMR (on MFP Apps) = your personal multiplier.

Keep this workout routine the same, that's your multiplier as your weight drops and BMR goes down.

Now take deficit.

Weight drops, get new BMR, use multiplier, there's new TDEE, take deficit.

greenmeena

That's brilliant. I hadn't known how to back-door that TDEE that way. I've done all the calculations, even went to that excel file you posted... and was following that tightly to no success. This makes much more sense to me! I haven't gone up at all in weeks, just haven't budged either. Excellent advice. I knew you'd have some trick up your sleeve. Well done.

heybales

Ahhhh, no budging for weeks then, the weight gain was earlier in the process.

Different story then.

You easily could be at suppressed metabolism and TDEE right now then.

You need 2 week test.

Eat 250 calories more daily for 2 weeks, that should ONLY cause 1 lb of weight gain in that time slowly. No instant water weight if really at TDEE.

If you gain 1 lb (and if exercising not all fat) in 2 weeks, then current level was TDEE.

If you do not, or fast water weight only, then you are still suppressed, and need to eat more.

Now, even eating at TDEE if you have been, with exercise, should be showing inches lost, as body makes improvement.
If you haven't seen that either, that again says suppressed TDEE, because body isn't going to spend energy making as many improvements if it still isn't getting what it needs for basic stuff.

greenmeena

Oh god I hope it isn't suppression! I thought I did a nice long reset. You're right though. I like this 2 week test, that sounds reasonable. I'll give that a try and see if it changes things. Hey it means I eat more, that's nothing but fun anyway! Thank you so much, Haybales, I see you on here helping folk out quite a lot- that's a wonderful way to be.

faeriewings1

Sorry to butt in, but haybales, why does an instant gain of water weight mean your metabolism is suppressed? Thanks

heybales

Sorry to butt in, but haybales, why does an instant gain of water weight mean your metabolism is suppressed? Thanks

The only instant gain you can get is water that stores with glucose (barring the sodium and exercise and lifting that causes an invalid weigh-in day), to the tune of 1lb for 500 calories worth. 1 gram of glucose stores with 2.7 grams water. 3.7 grams has 4 calories therefore, math after that.

Now, the only reason why glucose stores would not be topped off until you finally eat more, is because they are always in a depleted state. Eating more finally topped them off.

Why always in depleted state?
Because never eating enough.

It would be like claiming your gas tank is filled up. Why?
Well, I always put 10 gal back in it, no matter how much I drive.
But it's a 15 gal tank, and the amount you drive varies.
So the weight of the car is 2 tons and 36 lbs always.
Ya, but go ahead and wait until the nozzle clicks this time.
Huh, 15 gal, 2 ton and 50 lbs weight now.

faeriewings1

Thank you for answering, I think I get it, though maybe I don't.....So I have gained over 1kilo (2.2lb) weight each weekend for the last two weekends, I know that it's water weight as most of the gain dissappears by the end of the week, I don't know why it's happening the only thing that changes on the weekend is a couple of glasses of wine each day, but I try to remain in my calorie target. Are these gains suggesting my metabolism is still suppressed? I ask because I'm thinking about cutting soon. Thanks again

redraidergirl2009

Maybe? I am quitting because no matter what the heck I eat nothing changes. I have seen too many people post that the tdee method didn't work for them and they either gained a ton of weight or didn't lose any after going to their cut for months.

faeriewings1

Maybe? I am quitting because no matter what the heck I eat nothing changes. I have seen too many people post that the tdee method didn't work for them and they either gained a ton of weight or didn't lose any after going to their cut for months.

Sorry to read your quitting, you must feel very frustrated. The science behind this method kinda makes sense to me, so it should provide results. I hope whatever you choose to do you reach your goals.

heybales

Maybe? I am quitting because no matter what the heck I eat nothing changes. I have seen too many people post that the tdee method didn't work for them and they either gained a ton of weight or didn't lose any after going to their cut for months.

Too many don't understand the whole concept, nor the nuances that must be known.

Majority that don't work when they provide enough info, didn't pick honest activity level, so they stay suppressed and plateaued, just eating more at least, hopefully not losing muscle mass then.

If they got that right to come in from the high side of the estimate, they used a BMR that was totally inflated, and with deficit in the numbers, didn't really have one in reality.

Or they did massive or new exercise, and don't realize that exercise when eating enough causing body improvements which is weight gain, but combined with fat loss as inches, causes no weight loss, or little.

But guess what?

Every single one of those cases, if they started on the high side, if they understood the basic concept of eating correctly for your level of activity and taking a reasonable deficit - would understand these are estimates, and even with the inaccuracies, if you just lowered calories then - you would lose.

How long have you held at any one method, and did you measure too?

heybales

Thank you for answering, I think I get it, though maybe I don't.....So I have gained over 1kilo (2.2lb) weight each weekend for the last two weekends, I know that it's water weight as most of the gain dissappears by the end of the week, I don't know why it's happening the only thing that changes on the weekend is a couple of glasses of wine each day, but I try to remain in my calorie target. Are these gains suggesting my metabolism is still suppressed? I ask because I'm thinking about cutting soon. Thanks again

You also get to deal with hormone issues in the month so it takes longer to see a trend.

So alcohol can't be stored as glucose.

Sure you don't have invalid weigh-in days?

So outside current hormone changes and invalid weigh-ins, yes big water weight gain like that would indicate not at TDEE. Perhaps Sat/Sun are rest days from Fri workout, and takes 2 days to top off again.
And then slowly day by day you deplete the tank without really filling it up again.

faeriewings1

Thank you for you advice haybales