Rhetoric, I think not. If this is government intervention as you put it, then you libs should have noting against it seeing you agree that the gov can force people to buy a product.

I'm a conservative, but I believe people should have a drivers license. Does that make me a fraud? Voter ID doesn't grow the government. Your statement is a reach.

did you read what i wrote? I was stating it was hypocritical.. period..

Im so glad i got to read fox news today..

And I pointed out how your statement is ridiculous and void of thought. But don't let me stop you with the ridiculous comparisons. Why don't you accuse conservatives for being hypocritical for wanting a small government but wanting roads.

This I have to disagree with. You have to have an ID to buy booze or cigarettes. You have to have an ID to drive. I can imagine that very few people actually cannot get an ID unless they are illegal. For the SMALL majority of those who can't, candidates can bus those people to voting booths for their votes, why not get them ID's. That could be very easy to fix. I'd rather force someone to find an ID, it's not like they don't have 4 years between elections to get one, than have illegal immigrants voting for OUR president.

Yep. Sounds just like a republican (or in your case Mandy libertarian).

Why is the party (parties) who beat their chest most about government getting out of people's lives suddenly interested in requiring forms of identification to exercise rights we've always had to fix a problem that doesn't exist? Hmmmm....

I laugh at this notion that it doesn't happen much. Would you say there are more people who get away with speeding than those that don't?

Why are you against making sure every vote is counted and none are cancelled out due to fraud? People can get ID's, it's not that hard. If you can take the time to vote, then you can take the time to do your part in upholding the integrity of the process.

There have been 10 cases of in-person voter fraud since 2000. DMVs do not maintain the same hours as polling places. If someone is living paycheck to paycheck and is forced to chose between missing work to getting a state ID, it is unfortunate that they will be forced to chose work.

http://www.drudge.com/news/159919/person-voter-fraud-non-existent

Your example is flawed. Any person that is working legally filled out an I-9 form and provided proof of identity and proof of employment eligibility.

the proof they provided was a foreign passport..

Exactly, so they should not be voting in our election.

If ID doesn't prevent fraud, then why do so many businesses require them before they serve you? Would you go to a bank if said it takes people at their word to access an account? Do you think the bank would lose money if it didn't verify who you were? If it's racist and designed to keep people from participating in a process, then why are you not calling out the companies that require ID"s.

Someone show me the difference.

Exactly, so they should not be voting in our election.

umm.. the law states if they are a permanant resident they can... which is the path to citizenship..

but..

this isnt what voter fraud is about.. it isnt the issue of immigration, it is the issue that people are voting twice (supposedly. or dead people voting or some else voting in place of..).. go check each resolution passed none of them state this argument.. know why? .. because any stab against immigration would inflame the very voters both parties are trying to get..

I can't believe I need to post this:

U.S. citizenship provides many rights, but also involves many responsibilities. Thus, the decision to become a U.S. citizen through naturalization is important. In most cases, a person who wants to naturalize must first be a permanent resident. By becoming a U.S. citizen, you gain many rights that permanent residents or others do not have, including the right to vote. To be eligible for naturalization, you must first meet certain requirements set by U.S. law.

http://www.uscis.gov/USCIS/Resources/B3en.pdf

You have to be a citizen to vote.

Exactly, so they should not be voting in our election.

umm.. the law states if they are a permanant resident they can... which is the path to citizenship..

but..

this isnt what voter fraud is about.. it isnt the issue of immigration, it is the issue that people are voting twice (supposedly. or dead people voting or some else voting in place of..).. go check each resolution passed none of them state this argument.. know why? .. because any stab against immigration would inflame the very voters both parties are trying to get..

I can't believe I need to post this:

U.S. citizenship provides many rights, but also involves many responsibilities. Thus, the decision to become a U.S. citizen through naturalization is important. In most cases, a person who wants to naturalize must first be a permanent resident. By becoming a U.S. citizen, you gain many rights that permanent residents or others do not have, including the right to vote. To be eligible for naturalization, you must first meet certain requirements set by U.S. law.

http://www.uscis.gov/USCIS/Resources/B3en.pdf

You have to be a citizen to vote.

I have read in the past that some local governments allow green card holders to vote on a local level. Not really relevant for the presidential election though.

Exactly, so they should not be voting in our election.

umm.. the law states if they are a permanant resident they can... which is the path to citizenship..

but..

this isnt what voter fraud is about.. it isnt the issue of immigration, it is the issue that people are voting twice (supposedly. or dead people voting or some else voting in place of..).. go check each resolution passed none of them state this argument.. know why? .. because any stab against immigration would inflame the very voters both parties are trying to get..

I can't believe I need to post this:

U.S. citizenship provides many rights, but also involves many responsibilities. Thus, the decision to become a U.S. citizen through naturalization is important. In most cases, a person who wants to naturalize must first be a permanent resident. By becoming a U.S. citizen, you gain many rights that permanent residents or others do not have, including the right to vote. To be eligible for naturalization, you must first meet certain requirements set by U.S. law.

http://www.uscis.gov/USCIS/Resources/B3en.pdf

You have to be a citizen to vote.

IM SO GLAD you called me on this.. plays right into the point that you were trying to make about how you need an id to vote, as voter fraud is making illegals able to vote..

The drinking of the kool aid is making it so that they are getting the points all twisted!

"but you stated this: " the law states if they are a permanant resident they can... which is the path to citizenship" go check the laws.. you can provide those cards as proof of id.. so this is how rediculous the WHOLE laws are..

This I have to disagree with. You have to have an ID to buy booze or cigarettes. You have to have an ID to drive. I can imagine that very few people actually cannot get an ID unless they are illegal. For the SMALL majority of those who can't, candidates can bus those people to voting booths for their votes, why not get them ID's. That could be very easy to fix. I'd rather force someone to find an ID, it's not like they don't have 4 years between elections to get one, than have illegal immigrants voting for OUR president.

Yep. Sounds just like a republican (or in your case Mandy libertarian).

Why is the party (parties) who beat their chest most about government getting out of people's lives suddenly interested in requiring forms of identification to exercise rights we've always had to fix a problem that doesn't exist? Hmmmm....

I laugh at this notion that it doesn't happen much. Would you say there are more people who get away with speeding than those that don't?

Why are you against making sure every vote is counted and none are cancelled out due to fraud? People can get ID's, it's not that hard. If you can take the time to vote, then you can take the time to do your part in upholding the integrity of the process.

I have always had to show an ID when I went to vote and never once did I question it. And for the record you don't have to show an ID you can show your electric or cable bill as well.

You need an ID for everything so what is the issue with having to present an ID to vote? I show my ID to buy booze. I show my ID to get into a bar. I show my ID if I am cashing a check at a bank the check is drawn on and I don't have an account there. I show my ID when I go through security at the airport. Government issued ID's are free and, as one can see, you need an ID for pretty much everything that you do now days so why should voting be excluded? If it's not discriminatory to ask for an ID when someone is cashing a check or buying booze why is it that way for voting? I think the entire issue is ridiculous.

The worker born here cannot work legally if they never had an ID. If they chose to disenfranchise themselves while breaking the law working illegally then so be it.

umm.. you can show ss card and birth certificate and work.. both of which not on the approved id listing..

A SS Card or birth certificate can be used to prove Employment Authorization.
You still need another ID to prove identity.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/i-9.pdf

why do you keep going back to the i9? thats not the issue.. the issue was about someone who was a CITIZEN having this happen to them..

This I have to disagree with. You have to have an ID to buy booze or cigarettes. You have to have an ID to drive. I can imagine that very few people actually cannot get an ID unless they are illegal. For the SMALL majority of those who can't, candidates can bus those people to voting booths for their votes, why not get them ID's. That could be very easy to fix. I'd rather force someone to find an ID, it's not like they don't have 4 years between elections to get one, than have illegal immigrants voting for OUR president.

Yep. Sounds just like a republican (or in your case Mandy libertarian).

Why is the party (parties) who beat their chest most about government getting out of people's lives suddenly interested in requiring forms of identification to exercise rights we've always had to fix a problem that doesn't exist? Hmmmm....

I laugh at this notion that it doesn't happen much. Would you say there are more people who get away with speeding than those that don't?

Why are you against making sure every vote is counted and none are cancelled out due to fraud? People can get ID's, it's not that hard. If you can take the time to vote, then you can take the time to do your part in upholding the integrity of the process.

I have always had to show an ID when I went to vote and never once did I question it. And for the record you don't have to show an ID you can show your electric or cable bill as well.

You need an ID for everything so what is the issue with having to present an ID to vote? I show my ID to buy booze. I show my ID to get into a bar. I show my ID if I am cashing a check at a bank the check is drawn on and I don't have an account there. I show my ID when I go through security at the airport. Government issued ID's are free and, as one can see, you need an ID for pretty much everything that you do now days so why should voting be excluded? If it's not discriminatory to ask for an ID when someone is cashing a check or buying booze why is it that way for voting? I think the entire issue is ridiculous.

These laws make it so you have to have a photo ID to vote. electric and cable bills will not do.

The worker born here cannot work legally if they never had an ID. If they chose to disenfranchise themselves while breaking the law working illegally then so be it.

umm.. you can show ss card and birth certificate and work.. both of which not on the approved id listing..

A SS Card or birth certificate can be used to prove Employment Authorization.
You still need another ID to prove identity.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/i-9.pdf

why do you keep going back to the i9? thats not the issue.. the issue was about someone who was a CITIZEN having this happen to them..

Do you even read the threads before you respond?

I was pointing out that an earlier example of a worker being disenfranchised was bad because a worker would have an ID. That's it. I really have no horse in this debate.

The worker born here cannot work legally if they never had an ID. If they chose to disenfranchise themselves while breaking the law working illegally then so be it.

umm.. you can show ss card and birth certificate and work.. both of which not on the approved id listing..

A SS Card or birth certificate can be used to prove Employment Authorization.
You still need another ID to prove identity.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/i-9.pdf

why do you keep going back to the i9? thats not the issue.. the issue was about someone who was a CITIZEN having this happen to them..

Do you even read the threads before you respond?

I was pointing out that an earlier example of a worker being disenfranchised was bad because a worker would have an ID. That's it. I really have no horse in this debate.

Look at the list of acceptable documents. You have the option of providing non-photo materials for identification.

Which document in list A or list B does not have a photo?

Exactly, so they should not be voting in our election.

umm.. the law states if they are a permanant resident they can... which is the path to citizenship..

but..

this isnt what voter fraud is about.. it isnt the issue of immigration, it is the issue that people are voting twice (supposedly. or dead people voting or some else voting in place of..).. go check each resolution passed none of them state this argument.. know why? .. because any stab against immigration would inflame the very voters both parties are trying to get..

I can't believe I need to post this:

U.S. citizenship provides many rights, but also involves many responsibilities. Thus, the decision to become a U.S. citizen through naturalization is important. In most cases, a person who wants to naturalize must first be a permanent resident. By becoming a U.S. citizen, you gain many rights that permanent residents or others do not have, including the right to vote. To be eligible for naturalization, you must first meet certain requirements set by U.S. law.

http://www.uscis.gov/USCIS/Resources/B3en.pdf

You have to be a citizen to vote.

IM SO GLAD you called me on this.. plays right into the point that you were trying to make about how you need an id to vote, as voter fraud is making illegals able to vote..

The drinking of the kool aid is making it so that they are getting the points all twisted!

"but you stated this: " the law states if they are a permanant resident they can... which is the path to citizenship" go check the laws.. you can provide those cards as proof of id.. so this is how rediculous the WHOLE laws are..

They can vote right now so it doesn't enable them anymore than before. What your point does prove is the need for us to actually do something about the illegal immigration problem. I never said Illegals were the only people voting who shouldn't. ID helps the problem more than hurts it.

The worker born here cannot work legally if they never had an ID. If they chose to disenfranchise themselves while breaking the law working illegally then so be it.

umm.. you can show ss card and birth certificate and work.. both of which not on the approved id listing..

A SS Card or birth certificate can be used to prove Employment Authorization.
You still need another ID to prove identity.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/i-9.pdf

why do you keep going back to the i9? thats not the issue.. the issue was about someone who was a CITIZEN having this happen to them..

Do you even read the threads before you respond?

I was pointing out that an earlier example of a worker being disenfranchised was bad because a worker would have an ID. That's it. I really have no horse in this debate.

Look at the list of acceptable documents. You have the option of providing non-photo materials for identification.

Which document in list A or list B does not have a photo?

Voter's registration card, report cards, school records, Hospital records.

I am pretty sure you can vote with a voter's registration card. The other items were listed in the under 18 section so you can't legally vote anyway.

Nope, you will now also need a photo ID at the polling place.

The worker born here cannot work legally if they never had an ID. If they chose to disenfranchise themselves while breaking the law working illegally then so be it.

umm.. you can show ss card and birth certificate and work.. both of which not on the approved id listing..

A SS Card or birth certificate can be used to prove Employment Authorization.
You still need another ID to prove identity.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/i-9.pdf

why do you keep going back to the i9? thats not the issue.. the issue was about someone who was a CITIZEN having this happen to them..

Do you even read the threads before you respond?

I was pointing out that an earlier example of a worker being disenfranchised was bad because a worker would have an ID. That's it. I really have no horse in this debate.

ok.. so a citizen that goes to work has to show what? because in my state a ss card and a birth certificate is enought.. no photo id..

i posted that.. you then posted that to get an i9 you have to have id.. an i9 is for immigrants.. not for citizens.. so i know you have no horse in this.. so.. im just trying to be clear..

Either you are trolling me or you really have no idea what you are talking about. Everyone that works legally in the U.S. including citizens has to fill out an I-9 form to work. I posted a link to the form. Your state requires the same information as every other state.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/i-9.pdf

Either you are trolling me or you really have no idea what you are talking about. Everyone that works legally in the U.S. including citizens has to fill out an I-9 form to work. I posted a link to the form. Your state requires the same information as every other state.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/i-9.pdf

so you have filled one of these out to work?

Yes. If you have a job and live in the states you did too.