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The Case For Settling
Replies
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This kind of drivel really bothers me!!! Ageist/Sexist crap!! DM I am pretty damn sure that my prospects are better now than they were 20 years ago!! For every single middle age woman, there is a guy. Not all older guys want young girls, and certainly, not many young girls want old guys!!! And you'd be surprised how many younger guys want older women!! So, the articles logic is clearly flawed!
If Madonna can pull a 19 year old, so can I!!!! :laugh:
As the lady herself said "what do you do at 50 then, just curl up and die?"
It's evident to me that you settle LESS as you get older!! Perhaps when you've finished settling now, get divorced by the time you're 40, you'll be able to understand why
Anna, I think I have a girl crush on you
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I don't think of it as settling...more of a compromise. You'll never find the "perfect" match and neither will the other person, so it's a compromise as to what's really important and the superficial.0
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Granted, I didn't even read the article, but I can tell where this is heading just by all the responses.
I view it less as "settling" and more as "finally being realistic". I think a lot of women, mostly younger, have such a flooring sense of self entitlement that they think they deserve to be swept off her feet by Prince Charming. Then, when they are in their 30's and it still hasn't happened yet, they view all their potential dates as "settling". When in reality, they are finally finding a decent match for themselves.
Prince Charming doesn't exist. But I'd like to meet "Prince Doesn't Cheat, Gamble, Drink Heavily, Blow Money He Doesn't Have, Non-Suicidal, Acts His Age, and Is Trustworthy". Until then, I think I'll stay single, thanks!
I so agree!!! If I were younger, I probably would have settled, but I would have been miserable. But the older I get the more I refuse to settle, because I do not want to end up resenting the person I end up with, let alone the wonder factor of "What if?"0 -
This kind of drivel really bothers me!!! Ageist/Sexist crap!! DM I am pretty damn sure that my prospects are better now than they were 20 years ago!! For every single middle age woman, there is a guy. Not all older guys want young girls, and certainly, not many young girls want old guys!!! And you'd be surprised how many younger guys want older women!! So, the articles logic is clearly flawed!
If Madonna can pull a 19 year old, so can I!!!! :laugh:
As the lady herself said "what do you do at 50 then, just curl up and die?"
It's evident to me that you settle LESS as you get older!! Perhaps when you've finished settling now, get divorced by the time you're 40, you'll be able to understand why
Anna, I think I have a girl crush on you
:laugh: :laugh: haha! PJ!!
See DM, middle aged women even attract gorgeous women, as well as 19 year old boys!!! :bigsmile:
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BS articles like this one continue to crush weaker minded female's self esteem. Making them believe that they have to settle because someone said so. BLAH BLAH BLAH!0
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Today I have settled...
...on a turkey sub for lunch and it was yummy.0 -
There have been many provocative articles posted in this forum and discussion of them is always interesting.
Lets not discourage the posting of them whether in agreement or not by assuming the one doing it completely agrees with all the premises of them.
The initial discussion centered on the article until PJ took personal offense.
That is her right but I think it has errantly steered the course of discussion off into thinking this was something written by DM and is promoting his feelings.
I do not see anywhere that it is.0 -
This kind of drivel really bothers me!!! Ageist/Sexist crap!! DM I am pretty damn sure that my prospects are better now than they were 20 years ago!! For every single middle age woman, there is a guy. Not all older guys want young girls, and certainly, not many young girls want old guys!!! And you'd be surprised how many younger guys want older women!! So, the articles logic is clearly flawed!
If Madonna can pull a 19 year old, so can I!!!! :laugh:
As the lady herself said "what do you do at 50 then, just curl up and die?"
It's evident to me that you settle LESS as you get older!! Perhaps when you've finished settling now, get divorced by the time you're 40, you'll be able to understand why
Hey Anna, you are right on this one.
I don't view age as being a bad thing at all. I've dated older and younger and while each has it's perks and downfalls, I'd rather date someone bit older than myself. I find them to be more sincere, less moody, and wilder in bed. That's just been my experience, though I'm probably in the minority when it comes to this.0 -
This kind of drivel really bothers me!!! Ageist/Sexist crap!! DM I am pretty damn sure that my prospects are better now than they were 20 years ago!! For every single middle age woman, there is a guy. Not all older guys want young girls, and certainly, not many young girls want old guys!!! And you'd be surprised how many younger guys want older women!! So, the articles logic is clearly flawed!
If Madonna can pull a 19 year old, so can I!!!! :laugh:
As the lady herself said "what do you do at 50 then, just curl up and die?"
It's evident to me that you settle LESS as you get older!! Perhaps when you've finished settling now, get divorced by the time you're 40, you'll be able to understand why
Anna nailed it, yet again.
I DID settle... at 26. I was married to an azzhat for 10+ years. I'm done settling. I want epic. I've also had younger guys approach me and as I've discussed here before and with some in private a 28 year old guy that would have me in a second. The hangup is mine... not his. I do not believe for one minute that as we age our prospects dwindle. There are great men out there that are looking for wonderful women. It's just finding the one you match well with.
Anyway... Anna, woman... marry me?! LOL :flowerforyou:
Nobody should ever settle.... it's just sad...
I for one am going to hold out for someone that mirrors my soul.0 -
Honest question here.
How many of those that said they settled early upon reflection really just got caught up in the emotion of the whole dating thing rather then evaluating the guy?
I have observed many have an emotional reaction and value to the process to the exclusion to making a judgment of the person.
If that happened did you settle or just make a poor choice that now have learned from?0 -
...I think it has errantly steered the course of discussion off into thinking this was something written by DM and is promoting his feelings.
I do not see anywhere that it is.
I would hope no one thinks this is Dave's opinion. I didn't take it as such but admittedly see some irony in him posting it as I can't see him settling. I actually enjoy the occasional controversial conversation on here so I hope we can all not take it personally enough to think and discuss appropriately. Kudos to Dave for stepping out to share something that strikes me as SO unlike him :flowerforyou:0 -
Honest question here.
How many of those that said they settled early upon reflection really just got caught up in the emotion of the whole dating thing rather then evaluating the guy?
I have observed many have an emotional reaction and value to the process to the exclusion to making a judgment of the person.
If that happened did you settle or just make a poor choice that now have learned from?
Raises hand.......Looking back I was high on the emotion and didn't evaluate the ex husband as I should have. But, being a teenager didn't help the situation any either. Have I learned from it? You bet!!! I look at people in a much different way now than I did 15+ years ago. I have found that as I've gotten older, I realize what is really important. I went for the emotional part and forgot about the logical/character part when I was younger. Oops! Live and learn I suppose.0 -
...I think it has errantly steered the course of discussion off into thinking this was something written by DM and is promoting his feelings.
I do not see anywhere that it is.
I would hope no one thinks this is Dave's opinion. I didn't take it as such but admittedly see some irony in him posting it as I can't see him settling. I actually enjoy the occasional controversial conversation on here so I hope we can all not take it personally enough to think and discuss appropriately. Kudos to Dave for stepping out to share something that strikes me as SO unlike him :flowerforyou:
I didn't take it that the article was Dave's personal opinion either.
I scanned it over and watched the 6 minute video and thought it was pretty interesting. It's a woman author (Lori Gottlieb) writing to a primarily woman audience, which is pretty evident. From the male perspective, she does touch on a few very good points though.
If you are lazy like me, just watched the 6 minute video and that should give you a good general idea on what the article is about.0 -
Honest question here.
How many of those that said they settled early upon reflection really just got caught up in the emotion of the whole dating thing rather then evaluating the guy?
I have observed many have an emotional reaction and value to the process to the exclusion to making a judgment of the person.
If that happened did you settle or just make a poor choice that now have learned from?
Carl in my case... I was raised in a family where my sister got married early... like 19 & 20. I was 25 when my ex proposed. We'd broken up several times but honestly, I thought that if I wanted a marriage and kids (which I did) I'd better just get married and start. I felt like I was getting old. I KNEW straight up he was not good for me BEFORE I married him. I ignored my feelings. I wasn't sure anyone else would ever want me. Looking back I feel sorry for my old "self". I'm very worthy of being wanted... and I wish I would have known that then. It would have saved years of pain.0 -
...I think it has errantly steered the course of discussion off into thinking this was something written by DM and is promoting his feelings.
I do not see anywhere that it is.
I would hope no one thinks this is Dave's opinion. I didn't take it as such but admittedly see some irony in him posting it as I can't see him settling. I actually enjoy the occasional controversial conversation on here so I hope we can all not take it personally enough to think and discuss appropriately.
Since I'm the one who supposedly took the discussion off course, I will say that I understand DM did not write the article. However, I know enough of him through what he has written previously that I can infer his point of view and find the irony just like NC does.0 -
Honest question here.
How many of those that said they settled early upon reflection really just got caught up in the emotion of the whole dating thing rather then evaluating the guy?
I have observed many have an emotional reaction and value to the process to the exclusion to making a judgment of the person.
If that happened did you settle or just make a poor choice that now have learned from?
Carl in my case... I was raised in a family where my sister got married early... like 19 & 20. I was 25 when my ex proposed. We'd broken up several times but honestly, I thought that if I wanted a marriage and kids (which I did) I'd better just get married and start. I felt like I was getting old. I KNEW straight up he was not good for me BEFORE I married him. I ignored my feelings. I wasn't sure anyone else would ever want me. Looking back I feel sorry for my old "self". I'm very worthy of being wanted... and I wish I would have known that then. It would have saved years of pain.
That could be the topic of an entirely different thread and would encourage it if you wanted to maybe help others avoid that.
Don`t feel you are alone there Shel...have heard that basic thing many times,often from a person still in the loveless marriage.
It is sad.0 -
That could be the topic of an entirely different thread and would encourage it if you wanted to maybe help others avoid that.
Don`t feel you are alone there Shel...have heard that basic thing many times,often from a person still in the loveless marriage.
It is sad.
Agreed. Shelley is way too cool of a girl to ever settle! 0 -
Honest question here.
How many of those that said they settled early upon reflection really just got caught up in the emotion of the whole dating thing rather then evaluating the guy?
I have observed many have an emotional reaction and value to the process to the exclusion to making a judgment of the person.
If that happened did you settle or just make a poor choice that now have learned from?
Carl, seeing as LOVE is an emotion, I dont see how any partner choice can be WITHOUT emotion!!
Doesnt matter how young or old you are, male or female, you still get emotional!! However, I would say that as you get older you are less forgiving!! Although, you're also more tolerant!! Hmm! I guess it just depends; mistakes happen throughout life, its just if you live with them or how quickly you kick them out!!! :bigsmile:0 -
Just recently finished a relationship.. and finally realized I had been settling for over 5 years (all of my friends have confirmed this NOW - thanks guys). He was so nice, and good and honestly a great guy.. but no real spark/romantic-sexual connection/ no sense of amazement and wonder how did I get so lucky...
I told myself for years that those things didn't matter because he was my best friend and supportive and great..and those things can fade in relationships anyway.
I started losing weight, valuing/loving myself differently, changing (a lot!), wanting to do different things and live life differently and eventually realized that I had been selling myself, really both of us, short.
As much as I'm a realist..and don't believe in the concept of one "soulmate".. I hold out hope that one day I do find someone that compliments all the parts of me.. who I honestly do have that undescribable connection with..who wants and desires to be with and know me in every way.0 -
The opinions expressed in the article in The Atlantic are solely of that author. Keep in mind that article was written in 2008, and this lengthy article was later fleshed out into a full book. I believe my perspective overlaps with hers, but we are not 100% in concordance.
I think the article has relevance for both men and women.
The major theme that I see in this discussion is a misunderstanding of what settling is versus what settling is not, at least in terms of how I believe Gottlieb defines settling and how I define settling. In my definition of settling, I believe that no one should settle for a bad relationship. It’s not worth going through life miserable. At the same time, I believe that there are people, both women and men, who are too finicky and end up spending their lives alone because they wouldn’t settle for anything else than perfection on a long laundry list of items.
I believe that the point Gottlieb is making is to not be overly choosy. A degree of choosiness is fine. But I believe Gottlieb is saying not to lose sight of the forest in the trees. Both men and women do that.
I believe it is better to have someone adequate (not bad or malevolent) on a permanent basis than no one at all.
I also believe that the best, most marriageable prospects are off the market early, even in this era of delayed marriage. In my original scenario, I envisioned a scenario of me settling at some point in the future. It’s about the big picture. I’d rather someone meet 70-75% of what I desire right now rather than hold out for someone who is a 90-100% match for me. 70-75% is good enough, provided that 70-75% includes being a good person who will ultimately be a faithful marriage partner.
The quote of how "Marriage ultimately isn’t about cosmic connection—it’s about how having a teammate, is better than not having one at all." really resonated with me. There have been times in my life where I realized that the support of a teammate is better than singlehood. It is quite a grind to have full working responsibility and household maintenance responsibility, even if it a household of one in a one bedroom apartment, which is a very minimalist living arrangement.
The point of this post, and the post of a lot of the posts I make, is to stir discussion. I try to think and write in short, sound bite format that will provoke a logical and/or emotional response.0 -
I don't think of it as settling...more of a compromise. You'll never find the "perfect" match and neither will the other person, so it's a compromise as to what's really important and the superficial.
Yes, this is a lot of what I believe in!0 -
Honest question here.
How many of those that said they settled early upon reflection really just got caught up in the emotion of the whole dating thing rather then evaluating the guy?
I have observed many have an emotional reaction and value to the process to the exclusion to making a judgment of the person.
If that happened did you settle or just make a poor choice that now have learned from?
Carl, seeing as LOVE is an emotion, I dont see how any partner choice can be WITHOUT emotion!!
Doesnt matter how young or old you are, male or female, you still get emotional!! However, I would say that as you get older you are less forgiving!! Although, you're also more tolerant!! Hmm! I guess it just depends; mistakes happen throughout life, its just if you live with them or how quickly you kick them out!!! :bigsmile:
My question Anna was on the second part where I have sensed with many ladies the love was not in the person but as I said the process.
Emotional value equated to being asked and taken out,a guy one finds attractive at the side.
I knew of a lady once that confessed she had the dream of a house,kids,a white picket fence (her exact words) and she picked the first guy that was not just looking for sex and plugged him into it despite that he was a non functioning alcoholic.
Her love was the dream and the giddiness having a boyfriend brought...not in him as a person.
It of course did not end well.
Now looking back did she settle or did she do exactly as she planned to a bad result?
I can see where many would say the former but in my opinion it was the latter.
In another situation a month before her wedding day and the guy was drunk regularly and already throwing things (soft,a small pillow) at her in an argument.
Despite much advice she could not get herself free of the high of getting married.
It didn`t last a year.0 -
My question Anna was on the second part where I have sensed with many ladies the love was not in the person but as I said the process.
Emotional value equated to being asked and taken out,a guy one finds attractive at the side.
I knew of a lady once that confessed she had the dream of a house,kids,a white picket fence (her exact words) and she picked the first guy that was not just looking for sex and plugged him into it despite that he was a non functioning alcoholic.
Her love was the dream and the giddiness having a boyfriend brought...not in him as a person.
It of course did not end well.
Carl.. got to agree. I think a lot of women do this all the time. Actually I find it to generally be the younger ones who are so in love with love.. and the perfect dream life that end up settling and often getting divorced in their 40's..0 -
I definitely agree that when you are younger you are searching for "someone to marry" .. While I loved my exhusband more than he ever deserved, if I was older I would never have married him. And he would probably say the same thing about me. We were very much in love .. but very very different. I really wanted to get married and have kids and have that family and live happily ever after .. while not any guy would fit that bill .. but he shouldn't have either. If I was older and really knew what I wanted out of a marriage then I wouldn't have married him at all.
Now the only way I would get married again would be because it was someone that I wanted to spend my time with, someone I wanted to do things with and include in all the parts of my life. Someone that makes me laugh and doesn't put me last. I don't need the family and the kids and the park and the fence.
Which is what I think this article is trying to get you to buy into. You need that stuff to be happy .. so settle for someone to get that rather than go through life alone. I have realized I don't need that to be happy. I am happy all by myself .. but would love for someone to enhance my life.0 -
Interesting that most women on here say they were less picky when they were younger. My experience with my friends indicates the exact opposite. Most girls I know were especially picky when they were in their 20's and had guys hitting on them left and right. They would blow guys off constantly because they thought something was better right around the corner.
Fast forward 10 years, most of them are in their mid 30's, single, and wish they gave more guys a chance when they were younger. The guys who use to hit on them are now happily married to younger women. These 30-something women, who could have easily married in their mid 20's, are now racing against the clock to find a decent guy because they still want a family.
Whenever I run into these girls, they constantly talk about their dating past. How guys would pursue them to the nth degree and how they would juggle guys left and right when they were younger. They remind me of the guys who still talk about their glorious high school football days. I just smile and roll my eyes...0 -
^^^^ Yup....those girls do exist. But there is also a breed of us who look, feel and act a thousand times better than we did in our 20's.. and have the confidence and emotional maturity to finally properly navigate dating and relationships. A big part of that is probably not caring if I ever have children, having my own career and not be willing to completely sacrifice myself or my dreams for a life that others have told me I should want.0
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My experience with my friends indicates the exact opposite. Most girls I know were especially picky when they were in their 20's and had guys hitting on them left and right. They would blow guys off constantly because they thought something was better right around the corner.
Fast forward 10 years, most of them are in their mid 30's, single, and wish they gave more guys a chance when they were younger. The guys who use to hit on them are now happily married to younger women. These 30-something women, who could have easily married in their mid 20's, are now racing against the clock to find a decent guy because they still want a family.
Whenever I run into these girls, they constantly talk about their dating past. How guys would pursue them to the nth degree and how they would juggle guys left and right when they were younger. They remind me of the guys who still talk about their glorious high school football days. I just smile and roll my eyes...
This has been my experience in the limited amount of interaction that I have had with 30+ women who have never married. Perhaps Mike and I run in similar social circles in our respective cities.0 -
My experience with my friends indicates the exact opposite. Most girls I know were especially picky when they were in their 20's and had guys hitting on them left and right. They would blow guys off constantly because they thought something was better right around the corner.
Fast forward 10 years, most of them are in their mid 30's, single, and wish they gave more guys a chance when they were younger. The guys who use to hit on them are now happily married to younger women. These 30-something women, who could have easily married in their mid 20's, are now racing against the clock to find a decent guy because they still want a family.
Whenever I run into these girls, they constantly talk about their dating past. How guys would pursue them to the nth degree and how they would juggle guys left and right when they were younger. They remind me of the guys who still talk about their glorious high school football days. I just smile and roll my eyes...
This has been my experience in the limited amount of interaction that I have had with 30+ women who have never married. Perhaps Mike and I run in similar social circles in our respective cities.
Mine out here in the sticks is completely different.
Most paired up in high school and eventually married or they found someone at college as that greatly widened the pool for each.
After that,as I mentioned before,those that broke up and divorced simply recycled themselves to another man or woman that had done the same.
Not sure if the early marriage was a settling or the second marriage/LTR one is.
Some of course just enter into a continued series of several months to a couple years thing and then move on again.0 -
My experience with my friends indicates the exact opposite. Most girls I know were especially picky when they were in their 20's and had guys hitting on them left and right. They would blow guys off constantly because they thought something was better right around the corner.
Fast forward 10 years, most of them are in their mid 30's, single, and wish they gave more guys a chance when they were younger. The guys who use to hit on them are now happily married to younger women. These 30-something women, who could have easily married in their mid 20's, are now racing against the clock to find a decent guy because they still want a family.
Whenever I run into these girls, they constantly talk about their dating past. How guys would pursue them to the nth degree and how they would juggle guys left and right when they were younger. They remind me of the guys who still talk about their glorious high school football days. I just smile and roll my eyes...
This has been my experience in the limited amount of interaction that I have had with 30+ women who have never married. Perhaps Mike and I run in similar social circles in our respective cities.
I agree it must be a social circle thing because so many women I know were all in long term relationships during their 20s and are just figuring the dating thing out again in their 30s.0 -
My experience with my friends indicates the exact opposite. Most girls I know were especially picky when they were in their 20's and had guys hitting on them left and right. They would blow guys off constantly because they thought something was better right around the corner.
Fast forward 10 years, most of them are in their mid 30's, single, and wish they gave more guys a chance when they were younger. The guys who use to hit on them are now happily married to younger women. These 30-something women, who could have easily married in their mid 20's, are now racing against the clock to find a decent guy because they still want a family.
Whenever I run into these girls, they constantly talk about their dating past. How guys would pursue them to the nth degree and how they would juggle guys left and right when they were younger. They remind me of the guys who still talk about their glorious high school football days. I just smile and roll my eyes...
This has been my experience in the limited amount of interaction that I have had with 30+ women who have never married. Perhaps Mike and I run in similar social circles in our respective cities.
A few points:
1 - "Whenever I run into these girls, they constantly talk about their dating past." That's already super strange to me right there. How does that conversation go?
Bob: Hey Sally, is that you? Long time no see! It's been years!
Sally: Hey Bob, yeah, it's been a while. Gosh, I'm so depressed that I'm not dating. I had boys hitting on me left and right 10 years ago. I guess I blew it by being such a stuck up biyatch.
Bob: Um, er, yeah, I guess. I just came here to buy some duct tape. I guess I'll be seeing ya. Greetings to your Mom.
2 - Perhaps it's a generational thing, but the girls you are describing just did not exist in my high school/university. Even the super pretty and popular girls had steady boyfriends by choice. Usually it was with a guy who was playing the field, no matter how popular the girl was. In other words, the guys had the options, or at least looked for other options.
3 - It's always nice to think someone who has previously rejected us (or with whom we never approached, fearing he/she was out of our league) is getting his/her just rewards. "Ha! You didn't give me the time of day then, and now your're a middle aged woman with practically zero options. Haven't you seen the statistics? Guess you need to settle!"
It's a great fantasy, not sure how much it conforms to reality.
--P0
This discussion has been closed.