Exercise Calories.

ShannonKirton
ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
So these days I THOUGHT I got the hang on this healthy fat situation and I upped my calories to 1400 minimum, but should I be consuming all of my exercise calories? I'm not a runner, I just use the gym and do some classes and weights. All of the classes I do are in the MFP database, so I just use them to calculate (roughly obviously) how many calories I've burnt. Some days I reach 1400, some days are just under and some days are over.

At the end of the day I feel like I've eaten enough and I'm quite full. My weigh day is tomorrow and I'm very worried that I won't have lost any weight but I fear that adding in even more healthy fat will start to take me in the next direction and gain again.

HELP!!

Replies

  • SnicciFit
    SnicciFit Posts: 967 Member
    What are your goals specifically? Do you want to be leaner or just see a special number on the scale? What sort of activity are you doing and why? Do you go to the gym just to lose weight or so that you can be stronger, faster...etc?
  • SnicciFit
    SnicciFit Posts: 967 Member
    My point with asking the above questions is this. At one time, I just thought I needed to see a certain number on the scale. I did see that number, but I wasn't thrilled with my body and it's abilities. Later that number crept back up.

    Now, I see things a little differently regarding nutrition and activity. I see a similar number on the scale (when I actually weigh myself, which is very rarely), but my clothing size is quite a bit smaller (2-3 sizes), I have more muscle and less fat and my health is MUCH improved. My energy is better, I sleep better and I no longer have nagging health issues dragging me down.

    Obviously my method & focus changed this time around.
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    My goals are to be lean, fit and toned. I do want to see a magic number as well though to be honest. But I am still looking to get the maybe a size 6 clothing wise, as right now I'm between a 10 and an 8 depending on the clothes.

    Don't get me wrong, I have come a long way so far, but my ultimate goals are those listed above. But I do wish to be more toned as my tummy still has some lose skin from baby about 4 years ago, and my legs, hips and butt are not quite where I would like them yet, so yes I suppose I still have a few more pounds to lose before I start my maintenance.

    Originally when I started, I had trouble reaching 1000 calories a day because I was not eating all the healthy fats and only having fruits, veg and meat, but now I can reach 1400 or close without to many issues, but I find it hard to understand and believe that eating this much food and fat (even though its good for you) will help me to lean out. When I look at how much I'm eating compared to what I used to have, it's hard to fathom that this will get me where I want to go.

    Hope this all makes sense.
  • SnicciFit
    SnicciFit Posts: 967 Member
    If you got to a size 6, but didn't hit that "magic number", how would you feel about it?
  • TriLifter
    TriLifter Posts: 1,283 Member
    Shannon, I'm 5'6, am a size 0, and weigh roughly 120 lbs (I'm in the middle of a Whole30 so I haven't weighed myself in three weeks) and eat 2300 cals/day. I run 4x/week, do TapouT XT, and play softball (starting next month I'm hitting the gym again to lift) Granted I'm not trying to lose weight, but with those stats I am maintaining. Come mid-November I'm going to start a bulk.

    You have to fuel your body so that it works for you.
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    I think I would still be pretty over the moon. The tiniest part of me would be a bit sad, but generally I would be in heaven.
  • SnicciFit
    SnicciFit Posts: 967 Member
    Basically, what I've learned is that to get the body you REALLY want (not the number on the scale, necessarily), you need to fuel it. With good stuff. Period. I suggest staying off the scale. At least for a little while so you can really focus on your performance in the gym and the new way of eating without getting sidetracked by your weight. As your body adapts to the new way of eating and the increased activity, you might (gasp!) gain some pounds. Who cares? You're moving your body in the right direction...
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    Shannon, I'm 5'6, am a size 0, and weigh roughly 120 lbs (I'm in the middle of a Whole30 so I haven't weighed myself in three weeks) and eat 2300 cals/day. I run 4x/week, do TapouT XT, and play softball (starting next month I'm hitting the gym again to lift) Granted I'm not trying to lose weight, but with those stats I am maintaining. Come mid-November I'm going to start a bulk.

    You have to fuel your body so that it works for you.

    Those are some amazing measurements! You seem plenty more active than I am though. I don't run NEARLY as often as you do. If I get in a good 5K once every other week, I'm lucky. My classes at the gym are things like Super Circuit, Spin, Pilates, Hot Stretch and Gravity Unleashed. Between those classes, right now I do 6 classes in 4 days and on Sundays I tend to go and either do a run or some targeted areas with some weight training.

    I'm just worried that eating all the extra food to fill up my exercise calories will send me back into the 160's or 170's (or above) and I never want to go back there again!

    I was under the impression that you were to leave the exercise calories alone to create a deficit so that your body would continue to lose weight. Am I wrong?
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    Basically, what I've learned is that to get the body you REALLY want (not the number on the scale, necessarily), you need to fuel it. With good stuff. Period. I suggest staying off the scale. At least for a little while so you can really focus on your performance in the gym and the new way of eating without getting sidetracked by your weight. As your body adapts to the new way of eating and the increased activity, you might (gasp!) gain some pounds. Who cares? You're moving your body in the right direction...

    Having said all of that (which I tend to agree with) shouldn't I give my body an chance to settle into this for about a month or so? I recently changed my macros but I have no idea so far if they're benefitting me or not.
  • TriLifter
    TriLifter Posts: 1,283 Member
    I was under the impression that you were to leave the exercise calories alone to create a deficit so that your body would continue to lose weight. Am I wrong?

    You've already created a defecit when you told MFP how much you want to lose and at what rate. The only way you wouldn't eat back your calories is if you did it the way I did--find your TDEE and cut a % off from there. Then, when you work out, you either don't log it or you log it as 1 calorie burned.

    Example Stats:
    1800 cals burned during regular activity
    Average 500 extra calories burned per day working out

    MFP Example:
    Set to sedentary or mildly active or whatever and get 1600 cals per day
    Add your exercise cals of 500
    Eat 2100 cals (200 cal defecit)

    TDEE Example:
    Set to very active: 2100 cals per day
    Don't log workouts or log as 1 cal burned
    Eat 2100 cals (200 cal defecit)

    It works out the same, it's just all in how you want to track. Personally, I like to eat approx. the same amount every day and not have my macros change on me where I set carbs low but they rise during the day because I'm adding back in the workout cals.
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    Ok I see what you're saying. Is 200 calories a day enough of a deficit? I let MFP calculate my previous goals and all I did was adjust my macros and my calories at a later date. I too don't like the fact that my macros change due to exercise.
  • TriLifter
    TriLifter Posts: 1,283 Member
    Ok I see what you're saying. Is 200 calories a day enough of a deficit? I let MFP calculate my previous goals and all I did was adjust my macros and my calories at a later date. I too don't like the fact that my macros change due to exercise.

    Just an example. How much do you have to lose? If it's 1-10 lbs, I'd do .5/week, if it's more, I'd do 1 lb/week. You have to be realistic about what your normal, nonworkout activity is, though. MFP says for desk job sedentary, but I sit at a desk all day and without exercise my numbers put me even higher than lightly active.

    Go here, read this, and follow it for calculating your calories:

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/975025-in-place-of-a-road-map-short-n-sweet?hl=road+map
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    I've probably got anywhere between 10-15 pounds left to lose. Right now it's set at 1lb per week. Ill take a look at the link properly when I get back from lunch. It looks very interesting though.
  • SnicciFit
    SnicciFit Posts: 967 Member

    Having said all of that (which I tend to agree with) shouldn't I give my body an chance to settle into this for about a month or so? I recently changed my macros but I have no idea so far if they're benefitting me or not.

    right.. give it a month to see if it's working. Meaning, stay off the scale for a month. You won't necessarily see the benefits (on the scale) within a week. That's not long enough.
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    I'll give this a month before I make any other changes then. I think that's the best plan. I'll also try my best to stay off the scale for a month! LOL
  • The "give it a month" advice is the best advice you are getting!

    Here's the deal - make a plan for food and fitness, have it be one you can realistically stick with. Don't worry too much about TDEE, BMR, Deficits, Exercise Calories, etc. Honestly, right now your goal is fairly general, improve fitness and lose body fat. You are not training for any sort of competition, nor are you at the cutting edge of fitness and body composition. The stress of continuously trying to figure out all of that sort of thing is really not going to be worth it.

    I'd highly recommend following something like Gary Taubes or Mark Sisson's diet plans and using MFP as a way to be accountable to yourself. Do that for 30 days and see what your outcome is. My two cents worth.
  • TriLifter
    TriLifter Posts: 1,283 Member
    The "give it a month" advice is the best advice you are getting!

    Here's the deal - make a plan for food and fitness, have it be one you can realistically stick with. Don't worry too much about TDEE, BMR, Deficits, Exercise Calories, etc. Honestly, right now your goal is fairly general, improve fitness and lose body fat. You are not training for any sort of competition, nor are you at the cutting edge of fitness and body composition. The stress of continuously trying to figure out all of that sort of thing is really not going to be worth it.

    I'd highly recommend following something like Gary Taubes or Mark Sisson's diet plans and using MFP as a way to be accountable to yourself. Do that for 30 days and see what your outcome is. My two cents worth.

    The reason I'd suggested TDEE is because she's only netting about 750 cals.
  • In general, I don't disagree. I think that Shannon, however, should just learn how to eat Primal right now. Her best bet is to build a food plan that doesn't have her struggling with calorie counting, etc.
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    Honestly, I'm just not sure how much more I can eat. I have the healthy fats covered like the nuts, avocados, butter etc. The other foods are not really an issue, but by the time I'm done eating dinner, I'm quite full and I can't imagine eating any more.

    Should I double up on my snacks or something? My morning snack is usually fruit and my afternoon snack before my workouts is usually some cashews or almonds. Do I need to eat more of these? My meals are already quite big.
  • TriLifter
    TriLifter Posts: 1,283 Member
    Your stuff looks good overall. On a big workout day try to have nuts AND fruit and both snacks maybe? Your other days look nice, just today kinda concerned me.
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    I will keep that in mind Primal. Tomorrow is a big day for me so I will have both fruit and nuts at both snacks and see how that goes. As usual I pre-plan my days so by tonight after I get back home, I'll know how tomorrow looks. :)
  • Dragonwolf
    Dragonwolf Posts: 5,600 Member
    I've probably got anywhere between 10-15 pounds left to lose. Right now it's set at 1lb per week. Ill take a look at the link properly when I get back from lunch. It looks very interesting though.

    Your profile says you're 5'9" and 157lbs, which puts you at a 23.5 BMI, which is in the normal range. Given that, perhaps you should consider focusing on body recomposition, instead of just plain "weight loss".

    What I mean by body recomp is that you focus on building muscle, instead of losing weight so much. Get a good strength training plan and work it. Eat at maintenance (yes, that means you're probably looking at 2000 calories, you have to fuel this stuff).

    Doing this won't change the number on the scale much (if at all, and most likely not down), but you'll be able to get into that size 6 that you want. You'll also probably look more like what you're wanting, have a lower body fat percentage, and be stronger. Don't believe me? Go over to the "Success Stories" forum and search for any term related to women lifting weights and check out their before and after pics.

    Once you've built a good solid, strong base, if your body fat percentage is still too high for your liking, you can go into a "cut" phase that's designed to lower body fat with minimal reductions to lean body mass. I suggest doing it after some muscle gain so that you can put that extra lean body mass to good use (while it's a small amount, muscle requires more energy than fat, giving you a tiny bit more food to work with).

    Also, don't underestimate the calorie burn from a spin class. Running isn't the only thing that burns calories. Even though MFP is probably overestimating the number, you're burning no small amount of calories doing it. As a result, and if you're not eating more than 1400, you're probably starving your body of nutrients it needs. Make sure to eat at least some of those calories back if you use MFP's calculations for your total calories. If you need help getting calories in, because you're not hungry, make sure to eat calorie-dense foods - oils, avocados, milk/cream, cheese and nuts are great ways to add calories to a meal or snack, without adding a lot of bulk.

    I know most people frown on this, but when you need to add calories, you need to add calories - drink a glass or two of milk. A 16oz glass of whole milk packs 300 calories, 24g of carbs, 16g of fat, and 18g of protein (goat milk comes in a little heftier at 340, 22g, 20g, and 18g, respectively). It's a pretty good post-big-workout refuel without filling you up too much.
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    Dragonwolf, you have some very good points. I will certainly have a good long think on everything you've put forward. I do wish I could ultimately see 145 or even 140 on the scale, but more than that I would like to see a firm and toned body without looking muscular.

    Having said that, I know nothing about lifting and I'm not willing to give up my cardio classes as I enjoy them a great deal and often have in some strength training as well. I'm hoping that the cardio won't really be an issue. I am also a bit tight on money and don't have the extra cash to spend on a personal trainer who will teach me to lift and tone, so any tips there? That would be great.

    I have started to focus more on my core and legs recently with some of the machines, so maybe I've started already and I just don't know it. I'm quite happy with my upper body but I'm still trying to push my limits to see if I can get any more weight pushed.
  • asoeung
    asoeung Posts: 41 Member
    Having said that, I know nothing about lifting and I'm not willing to give up my cardio classes as I enjoy them a great deal and often have in some strength training as well. I'm hoping that the cardio won't really be an issue. I am also a bit tight on money and don't have the extra cash to spend on a personal trainer who will teach me to lift and tone, so any tips there? That would be great.

    Does your gym have any weight-lifting/strength-type group classes? I teach Les Mills BodyPump, which is a group class focused on strength training - we lift weights with a barbell and work all the major muscle groups. You might not have this specific program, but I'm willing to bet your gym has something similar (it could be with barbells, dumbbells, even body weight exercises). If anything, taking these types of classes would at least introduce you to the basic weight-lifting movements so you could continue on your own if you didn't particularly enjoy the class.
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    Having said that, I know nothing about lifting and I'm not willing to give up my cardio classes as I enjoy them a great deal and often have in some strength training as well. I'm hoping that the cardio won't really be an issue. I am also a bit tight on money and don't have the extra cash to spend on a personal trainer who will teach me to lift and tone, so any tips there? That would be great.

    Does your gym have any weight-lifting/strength-type group classes? I teach Les Mills BodyPump, which is a group class focused on strength training - we lift weights with a barbell and work all the major muscle groups. You might not have this specific program, but I'm willing to bet your gym has something similar (it could be with barbells, dumbbells, even body weight exercises). If anything, taking these types of classes would at least introduce you to the basic weight-lifting movements so you could continue on your own if you didn't particularly enjoy the class.

    I do Gravity Unleashed which is a cardio and weight class (more focused on weights and body weight) which I enjoy immensely. I wish we were able to use the gravity machines outside of class but that is a no-no. we also only have this class once a week which is a bit of a disappointment, but I'll see if we can't persuade the instructor to try and fit in another one at some point.
  • Dragonwolf
    Dragonwolf Posts: 5,600 Member
    Dragonwolf, you have some very good points. I will certainly have a good long think on everything you've put forward. I do wish I could ultimately see 145 or even 140 on the scale, but more than that I would like to see a firm and toned body without looking muscular.

    Having said that, I know nothing about lifting and I'm not willing to give up my cardio classes as I enjoy them a great deal and often have in some strength training as well. I'm hoping that the cardio won't really be an issue. I am also a bit tight on money and don't have the extra cash to spend on a personal trainer who will teach me to lift and tone, so any tips there? That would be great.

    I have started to focus more on my core and legs recently with some of the machines, so maybe I've started already and I just don't know it. I'm quite happy with my upper body but I'm still trying to push my limits to see if I can get any more weight pushed.

    Getting firm and toned pretty much only comes with strength training. "Steady state" cardio (ie - cardio that elevates your heart rate and keeps it there) is well known for destroying lean body mass, due to the body's need for fuel once glycogen stores are depleted (protein is the next easiest to burn after the glycogen is used up). Therefore, there's a very good chance you'll have to make some concessions somewhere. You don't necessarily have to give up everything, but do know that you will need to a) fuel all your workouts, and b) cut down some on the cardio so that you can retain your lean body mass.

    As for getting starting, I recommend checking out the books Starting Strength and/or New Rules of Lifting for Women. They're both good books to get you started into strength training, and you should be able to get them from your library.

    You can also find dozens of online videos that demonstrate proper form. For the big movements (weighted or bodyweight), check out Nerd Fitness (bodyweight stuff, such as pushups) or Mark Riptoe ("the big 3" barbell stuff - squats, bench press, deadlift; the squat form is important even if you're only doing bodyweight, though), for solid information on form. There are also a bunch of lifting groups here on MFP, who can provide recommendations for specific videos.

    The weight machines are a good start, but they limit range of motion and needlessly isolate muscles. Assuming you're not doing rehab work, muscle isolation doesn't really make for realistic strength gains. You don't just lift something with your biceps, you use your chest, shoulders, legs, and back as well, so why not train them the same way? If you're worried about your form, feel free to ask someone that's also training if they could help watch your form. Most people will be nice enough to do so, since they understand the importance of good form while lifting in order to prevent injury. If you can't do that, then consider saving up for a single session with a personal trainer to show you the proper form for lifting, or see if your gym has a complimentary session with their on-site personal trainer.
  • TriLifter
    TriLifter Posts: 1,283 Member
    ^ I agree with everything said here.

    When I started I did StronLifts 5x5 and I took my free PT session at the gym and had him show me how to do all the lifts. Best $0 I ever spent LOL. Seriously, it was worth doing.
  • ShannonKirton
    ShannonKirton Posts: 304 Member
    All very good advice Dragonwolf. I will explore my options (and friends) at the gym and see if I can get anyone to help me. It's all going to be a bit slow though. I've just injured a finger yesterday (yes I know it sounds sad) which I pinched between two weights but it's right in my grip so I'll wait for that to heal up.

    I'm also still going to give myself a few more weeks as I am right now to let my body settle into the routine I've just put it into so that I know where I stand. Once I'm settled I will start going hard core, but my research will surely start from now. I'll speak with my gym buddies and some trainers and see what I can get out of them and hopefully start from the middle of next month :)