But I'm not sure I could date someone who allowed themselves to abuse alcohol until it became an addiction. That's lack of self-control, which is a huge turn off.

Just to throw in an interesting perspective, your profile states that you were 50 pounds overweight. Curious if you would date yourself, given your unsexy lack of self control and abuse of food.

I'm 6'3". I was never massively overweight. At my peak I weighed 234 or so. Also, I was never addicted to food. And perhaps most relevant to this discussion, now that I'm much thinner, I still eat food. I still have chocolate, beer, etc. I didn't decide to quit eating cake or drinking Scotch because I lost weight. I just did it in moderation.

I just don't like extremism of any type. Yes, there are some exceptions. But in general, if it tastes good, and you like it, why stop cold turkey?

--P

You obviously can pick apart any comparison that is not exact for exact instead of trying to open yourself up to a new point of view. 50 pounds overweight is overweight. You knowingly put things in your body that were damaging your health, lowering the respect of those around you, and chipping away at your self esteem. If this was not the case, you wouldn't have made a change. I'm not using the term "addiction" but am referring to "abuse", which is what I would call this.

My point is you realized you were doing something that was unhealthy and decided to make a change for the better. Instead of thinking "Oh man, this guy was a little chunky before. He obviously has no self control and will probably end up back there again" one might think "Wow, this guy saw an error in his ways and decided to make a correction. That is commendable and he is probably a better person for having learned this lesson."

EVERYONE has something in their history that might turn someone off if held up by itself and out of context. In my opinion, people that have been to a dark place and returned end up better for having the journey. They are forced to really look deep inside and learn about themselves and what they want out of life.

The concept of what addiction is, whether it exists, is genetic, etc, is irrelevant. I don't hope to change your mind, but it would be great if one person read this and spent a little time considering this point of view.

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That said, I disagree that P's extra 50lbs necessarily makes him the same kind of overweight as someone who lost 200lbs. Not everyone who is overweight is plagued by insecurity and stuffing their face (abusing their body or calming insecurities with a food addiction). It can be little things that take effect over time like not noticing that metabolism changes as you get older and things like learning the food we eat out is not the same calorie or nutrition profile as the same dish at home.
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I wasn't implying that, merely trying to draw a parallel of someone halting a string of poor decisions. I'm exaggerating P's experience to try to make a point. Honestly, I'm taking it a little too personally and going off on unnecessary tangents. There are a million reasons to not date someone with any sort of psychiatric condition - those reasons are personal and can't really be argued with.

I just have a really hard time seeing how someone who is diagnosed by a medical professional to have a condition related to substance abuse and is then able to abstain 100% from that substance could possibly be seen as now having poor self control.

I just have a really hard time seeing how someone who is diagnosed by a medical professional to have a condition related to substance abuse and is then able to abstain 100% from that substance could possibly be seen as now having poor self control.

One of the top two answers guys gave me about why not drinking is bad was that it could mean that I'm a recovering alcoholic. I can understand the too religious/not enough fun/no sex angle but why would recovering alcoholic be a bad thing. When I asked "why" I was told because it's like losing a lot of weight or overcoming any significant problem that society sees as a detriment: people are too scared that you'll fall back into it and if they have a multitude of other options (i.e. plenty of girls to chose from who never were alcoholic) they'd rather not deal with the potential of you falling back into it. IDK if that's true or an excuse, but it's plausible enough to me

Yes, I think that is very valid and even proven statistically. I'm not a fan of the whole "alcoholic / addict" label and the 12-step culture it usually refers to, but that's jut me and a whole other topic.

yeah, the guys that i have met that barely or never drink are really into training and fitness, or coaching, and want to set the best example they can.

i think i was only asked once if i was a member of AA. In my experience, once a guy gets comfortable with me, or goes out on a couple dates with me, they realize why me NOT drinking is not a big deal, at all!!

i do find it amusing that some people are so narrow-minded that they will automatically cast one aside for NOT drinking.......... their loss :-)

As already mentioned, the simplest ways to handle the pressure are to find an 'excuse' that your peers find valid (Designated driver/medication interaction/work tomorrow - whatever works in your situation) and/or to make sure your drink looks like it's alcoholic. Most bartenders, if asked, are perfectly happy to put your soda in a glass that they'd normally use for a mixed drink, and/or put a slice of fruit on the side of the glass, so that you don't have any hassle to deal with.

I enjoy a glass of good wine, or a well-made cocktail, but drink sparingly, in general, for professional and personal reasons - one, or maybe two, is plenty for me in most circumstances, then I'll swap to soft drinks. It was definitely tricky when I was your age, but take heart - as I've got older, people are less inclined to make a big deal out of it, though it can sometimes be an issue for certain individuals.

Perfectly worded.

It may be a problem when you're 21 but trust me even at 23 people have stopped caring for the most part.

I wasn't a big drinker at your age, and I am not now.

I basically skipped the binge phase and went straight to the artisan drink phase.

I have some friends that drink more than I do, but everyone knows me and my low tolerance are only going to have 1-2 cocktails and call it a night.

The harder part is finding more friends that have the limited drinker attitude. I was lucky, and half of my friends are also limited drinkers. Find like minded friends. And all types of places to hang out. The bar is one option, but there are many more.

I also find, generally speaking, the more expensive the drinks the less people drink. Go to nicer bars.

People generally just want to find a partner with the same interests as them. If you are into working out, you want to find someone to run with, bike with, go to the gym with, etc. You want to find someone to share your experiences, you probably wouldn't be into someone that sits around watching movies and playing video games while you're out hiking and mountain climbing.

It's the same with drinking. I like going to wineries, breweries and places like that. I like to go out with my friends or my girlfriend and tie one on with them and laugh all night. And I've been the sober person surrounded by drunk people enough times to know that it isn't fun. Maybe it's fun for some people, but not me. And I wish I could go to the bar and not drink, I just hate crowds and drunk people normally so it's the only way I can deal with it.

People generally just want to find a partner with the same interests as them. If you are into working out, you want to find someone to run with, bike with, go to the gym with, etc. You want to find someone to share your experiences, you probably wouldn't be into someone that sits around watching movies and playing video games while you're out hiking and mountain climbing.

It's the same with drinking. I like going to wineries, breweries and places like that. I like to go out with my friends or my girlfriend and tie one on with them and laugh all night. And I've been the sober person surrounded by drunk people enough times to know that it isn't fun. Maybe it's fun for some people, but not me. And I wish I could go to the bar and not drink, I just hate crowds and drunk people normally so it's the only way I can deal with it.

I'm mostly the same ( except I don't have a problem going to bars sober although its more fun to drink). I love trying new wines, beers, etc..

People generally just want to find a partner with the same interests as them. If you are into working out, you want to find someone to run with, bike with, go to the gym with, etc. You want to find someone to share your experiences, you probably wouldn't be into someone that sits around watching movies and playing video games while you're out hiking and mountain climbing.

It's the same with drinking. I like going to wineries, breweries and places like that. I like to go out with my friends or my girlfriend and tie one on with them and laugh all night. And I've been the sober person surrounded by drunk people enough times to know that it isn't fun. Maybe it's fun for some people, but not me. And I wish I could go to the bar and not drink, I just hate crowds and drunk people normally so it's the only way I can deal with it.

But I want to find someone who is into all that! Into fitness, video games,and still likes to sit around watching stuff, etc etc... I guess I want to have my cake and to eat it too. :sad: I'm screwed....time to adopt some animals! What's the male equivalent of "crazy cat lady", anyone know? :laugh:

Oh you'll be fine. I've found you really just need to be with someone who is into some of the same things you are, it doesn't have to be all of them. I don't need to be with someone 24/7 or essentially date myself, I like time to myself and to try new things once in a while. And once you find the right person you just make it work.