frustrated. feedback please?
lebowski8
Posts: 55 Member
the weight isn't melting away, as the books claim. I have no intention of stopping the keto diet, though. I'm convinced a keto diet will help me manage my metabolic syndrome without pills. But... I'm really frustrated! This is my first post.
I have to talk to somebody, and I don't know anyone else who is dieting at the moment. Because, yes, I want to lose weight and look good too. Call me vain.
I've read Taubes, Atkins, the Reddit Keto FAQ, and Eating Academy. I'm well versed in the science.
I've been on a keto diet for 35 days. So far, I've been tracking carbs, protein, and total calories with MFP. The tracking is stressing me out a lot. I stopped logging exercise because I was eating back calories. I set my calorie intake using the lowest of several calculators I've tried. I set my macros at Carb 5% Protein 20% and Fat 75% (though the first week I had carbs at 10%)
But weight isn't really coming off, melting away, as so many poetically claim. Those statements conjure up images of watching the needle drop a pound or two every week.
And, I think the 3 pounds I've lost is probably water, isn't it?
Before this round of keto that I started a weeks before joining MFP, I'd been on South Beach since January 2012. I started at 259 pounds with worrisome bloodwork. I lost 25 pounds over 10 months, and then basically plateaued for many months later. In september 2013, at 234 pounds, I decided to change things up since nothing was working on South Beach program anymore.
I did intermittent fasting for a month (16:8, plus one 500 calorie day a week). Then I started a keto diet (again). I'm using the urine strips again because I can't afford the blood strips. The strips are almost always in the slight to middle range.
I'm at 229 today. My goal is 160-165. I average 4 miles of walking a day, with light intensity.
Now, I did Atkins in 2001, and the fat did melt away back then. In 12 months, I lost 45 pounds, with 20 in the first 90 days. My physical activity was roughly the same then, though about once a week I did do some intense aerobic for 30 minutes. Back then, all I did was count carbs. I kept it under 35 grams 95% of the time. I used keto sticks only for the first 60 days. I drank a lot of bourbon and occasionally lower carb beer. And I remember never paying attention to portion size. I remember a lot of giant steaks. Big 4 egg omelettes with extra cheese. And full racks of ribs without sauce. It was pretty easy, except for the friends who kept telling me I'd die eating that way. I never got bloodwork done at that time though. And eventually I convinced myself that I might be thinner but I'd die sooner. The science wasn't so robust back then.
I guess I'm frustrated because I'm watching my diet intensely with MFP, more intensely than I did a decade ago. I'm using a scale to weigh all my portions which is time consuming. But the attention to detail isn't paying off. I feel like I could be doing better things with my time rather than tracking all this.
And maybe it's because I'm stressed out from setting my expectations too high, expecting my body to work like it did when I was 26. And today, at 38, I'm also concerned about my metabolic syndrome. My bloodwork was fair in 2012 & 2013, but alarming in November 2011, which was the kick I needed to start dieting.
I don't know what I'm asking for. Support? Encouragement?
Thanks in advance to anyone who answers this post.
I have to talk to somebody, and I don't know anyone else who is dieting at the moment. Because, yes, I want to lose weight and look good too. Call me vain.
I've read Taubes, Atkins, the Reddit Keto FAQ, and Eating Academy. I'm well versed in the science.
I've been on a keto diet for 35 days. So far, I've been tracking carbs, protein, and total calories with MFP. The tracking is stressing me out a lot. I stopped logging exercise because I was eating back calories. I set my calorie intake using the lowest of several calculators I've tried. I set my macros at Carb 5% Protein 20% and Fat 75% (though the first week I had carbs at 10%)
But weight isn't really coming off, melting away, as so many poetically claim. Those statements conjure up images of watching the needle drop a pound or two every week.
And, I think the 3 pounds I've lost is probably water, isn't it?
Before this round of keto that I started a weeks before joining MFP, I'd been on South Beach since January 2012. I started at 259 pounds with worrisome bloodwork. I lost 25 pounds over 10 months, and then basically plateaued for many months later. In september 2013, at 234 pounds, I decided to change things up since nothing was working on South Beach program anymore.
I did intermittent fasting for a month (16:8, plus one 500 calorie day a week). Then I started a keto diet (again). I'm using the urine strips again because I can't afford the blood strips. The strips are almost always in the slight to middle range.
I'm at 229 today. My goal is 160-165. I average 4 miles of walking a day, with light intensity.
Now, I did Atkins in 2001, and the fat did melt away back then. In 12 months, I lost 45 pounds, with 20 in the first 90 days. My physical activity was roughly the same then, though about once a week I did do some intense aerobic for 30 minutes. Back then, all I did was count carbs. I kept it under 35 grams 95% of the time. I used keto sticks only for the first 60 days. I drank a lot of bourbon and occasionally lower carb beer. And I remember never paying attention to portion size. I remember a lot of giant steaks. Big 4 egg omelettes with extra cheese. And full racks of ribs without sauce. It was pretty easy, except for the friends who kept telling me I'd die eating that way. I never got bloodwork done at that time though. And eventually I convinced myself that I might be thinner but I'd die sooner. The science wasn't so robust back then.
I guess I'm frustrated because I'm watching my diet intensely with MFP, more intensely than I did a decade ago. I'm using a scale to weigh all my portions which is time consuming. But the attention to detail isn't paying off. I feel like I could be doing better things with my time rather than tracking all this.
And maybe it's because I'm stressed out from setting my expectations too high, expecting my body to work like it did when I was 26. And today, at 38, I'm also concerned about my metabolic syndrome. My bloodwork was fair in 2012 & 2013, but alarming in November 2011, which was the kick I needed to start dieting.
I don't know what I'm asking for. Support? Encouragement?
Thanks in advance to anyone who answers this post.
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Replies
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I wouldn't mind having a look at your food diary to see what advice I could possibly offer. Send a friends request and I'll be happy to support you and take a look. Any alcohol will set you back some, but if it is pure "vodka, Gin" then the setback would only be for the time in which it takes to burn the alcohol calories and you would not slip out of ketosis.0
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Likewise, I'm happy to help however I can.
Have you seen an endocrinologist and/or had your thyroid tested? What about a nutritionist?0 -
Thanks, I'll send a friend request0
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Likewise, I'm happy to help however I can.
Have you seen an endocrinologist and/or had your thyroid tested? What about a nutritionist?
My thyroid tests came back in normal range. I've not seen an endocrinologist nor a nutritionist.0 -
I'm not sure what kind of metabolic syndrome you have, but I have one too, and I'm in a similar boat; I lost a ton of weight on Atkins 6 years ago, and I'm very strict about my keto'ing now, but I'm stalled.
Macronutrient ratios are important, and yours seem good. Mine are similar, but I've noticed that this time around calories are actually starting to matter a little. And not JUST calories, but overall gram amounts of carbohydrates, not just the 5% ratio I've got it set at here. I could theoretically eat 70+ grams of carbohydrate and it still be only 5% of my overall caloric intake, but it's still too high.0 -
Agree with the thyroid testing. Did you test just tsh? if so ask for free t3 and free t4 and make sure they are at least in the middle range and see an endocrinologist.
And I have also lost 10lbs in 10 days the first time I went on a low carb diet 6 years ago. And had kept if off for a long time. But never after that I was able to do lose this much weight in this short time. Maybe , the first time the body had a major shock or something and then it got used to it.
I have been on keto for 4 days and haven't lost anything yet. I have only 15-20 lbs to lose, that could be why. I also have hypothyroidsm, but taking meds.0 -
I'm not sure what kind of metabolic syndrome you have, but I have one too, and I'm in a similar boat; I lost a ton of weight on Atkins 6 years ago, and I'm very strict about my keto'ing now, but I'm stalled.
Macronutrient ratios are important, and yours seem good. Mine are similar, but I've noticed that this time around calories are actually starting to matter a little. And not JUST calories, but overall gram amounts of carbohydrates, not just the 5% ratio I've got it set at here. I could theoretically eat 70+ grams of carbohydrate and it still be only 5% of my overall caloric intake, but it's still too high.
Thanks for the reply.
. My timeline might be off somwehat in my venting, but in the past 5-6 weeks I've generally (90%) kept my carbs under 35 g , and on the 3 or 4 "off" days, under 60 g.0 -
Agree with the thyroid testing. Did you test just tsh? if so ask for free t3 and free t4 and make sure they are at least in the middle range and see an endocrinologist.
When I have the next visit, I'll ask for the additional tests. I'm going to get a glucose meter this month. My last fasting test came out at 86, and that was back in May, when I was still doing the low GI diet. I'm curious to see what it is like now, and to get many points of data, not just 2 per year.0 -
I'm not sure what kind of metabolic syndrome you have, but I have one too, and I'm in a similar boat; I lost a ton of weight on Atkins 6 years ago, and I'm very strict about my keto'ing now, but I'm stalled.
Macronutrient ratios are important, and yours seem good. Mine are similar, but I've noticed that this time around calories are actually starting to matter a little. And not JUST calories, but overall gram amounts of carbohydrates, not just the 5% ratio I've got it set at here. I could theoretically eat 70+ grams of carbohydrate and it still be only 5% of my overall caloric intake, but it's still too high.
Thanks for the reply.
. My timeline might be off somwehat in my venting, but in the past 5-6 weeks I've generally (90%) kept my carbs under 35 g , and on the 3 or 4 "off" days, under 60 g.
I hate to say it, but you might want to drop down to 25 for a bit and see how it goes.0 -
I'll be sure to keep it under 25 g. It isn't that hard, if I cut back on yogurt. I'm counting total carbs also, not net carbs.
I know that many say you can subtract the fiber, but I don't want to bother with the extra math.0 -
I got the friend request, but your food diary is not open to friends either. I had to really cut my carbs deep (less than 10g a day) to start kicking in the fat loss when I stalled out. I was still in a calorie deficit, but didn't want to cut it so low that I started to burn muscle. Once I cut the carbs this low I was actually able to up the calorie intake on fat and protein and start the weight loss back up. This link may give you some help:
http://www.ketogenic-diet-resource.com/weight-loss-plateau.html0 -
I got the friend request, but your food diary is not open to friends either. I had to really cut my carbs deep (less than 10g a day) to start kicking in the fat loss when I stalled out. I was still in a calorie deficit, but didn't want to cut it so low that I started to burn muscle. Once I cut the carbs this low I was actually able to up the calorie intake on fat and protein and start the weight loss back up. This link may give you some help:
http://www.ketogenic-diet-resource.com/weight-loss-plateau.html
I have fixed the privacy setting, thanks for letting me know. And thanks for the tips & link.0 -
Hey it's The Dude!
I can relate to your frustrations. A couple of things that helped me on my way:
1) get all thyroid hormones checked and evaluated for optimal levels
2) get a blood work panel if possible that will check food allergens and sensitivities, these can stall or stop weight loss entirely (once I eliminated the foods I found out I had allergies to, I was able to push forward)
3) get hormonal factors checked, things like low testosterone will kill your attempts at weight loss or in building muscle
Hope that helps!0 -
Hey it's The Dude!
I can relate to your frustrations. A couple of things that helped me on my way:
1) get all thyroid hormones checked and evaluated for optimal levels
2) get a blood work panel if possible that will check food allergens and sensitivities, these can stall or stop weight loss entirely (once I eliminated the foods I found out I had allergies to, I was able to push forward)
3) get hormonal factors checked, things like low testosterone will kill your attempts at weight loss or in building muscle
Hope that helps!
Thanks for the tips. I'll ask my doctor for these tests at the next visit.0 -
I'll be sure to keep it under 25 g. It isn't that hard, if I cut back on yogurt. I'm counting total carbs also, not net carbs.
I know that many say you can subtract the fiber, but I don't want to bother with the extra math.
I've had to do a deep cut in carbs to see weight come off & when it comes off, it does so almost imperceptibly. In the last few weeks, I've lost inches, NOT weight. I have metabolic issues & don't do well with sugars & starches.
I had to cut out nuts in exchange for the occasional spoonful of peanut butter (cause I'm greedy, lol) every now and then. I also had to cut out greek yogurt, but only after about 3 months of keto, and 2 months of a stall did I start to reassess.
The more activity I get, the quicker I need to buy new jeans. I have a fairly active job (dog walker) so with 6 30 minute dog walks per day, I can get 10k steps easily but when I get upwards of 12k, I seem to get smaller quicker.
Currently I'm at meat & veggies and do best at this way of eating.
I would say to decrease carbs further, and increase activity. If this doesn't do the trick, I would question the type of metabolic disturbance you have & pin it down. Good luck.0 -
I am facing the same as you, but what works for me is turn up the crease. Less of the rest and more fat like coconut oil, pork rinds etc do the trick. I also noticed some food sources don't work well for me. If I eat hard cheese I gain even tho it's low carb, so I skip that completely now.0
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I don't have good advice regarding weight loss, because that is secondary to me, but I do know that our metabolism does tend to slow down as we age. You got some good advice here regarding medical tests and cutting carbs. I've had luck actually increasing calories and making sure I have very high amounts of saturated fats in my diet.
Also, I've learned in reading labels and ingredients, that sometimes manufacturers will change the way they make a product. For instance, some mayonnaise brands now contain sugar when they did not before. My best suggestion is to double-check the ingredients of what you eat - sometimes there are surprises that can halt your progress.
I really wish you luck on your journey.0 -
I think i will try to eliminate one common "problem" food just one at a time, on a week by week basis, to see what happens.
I eat a lot of dairy foods, for example, especially hard cheese and yogurt. I could start with the hard cheese next week.I am facing the same as you, but what works for me is turn up the crease. Less of the rest and more fat like coconut oil, pork rinds etc do the trick. I also noticed some food sources don't work well for me. If I eat hard cheese I gain even tho it's low carb, so I skip that completely now.0 -
I don't have good advice regarding weight loss, because that is secondary to me, but I do know that our metabolism does tend to slow down as we age. You got some good advice here regarding medical tests and cutting carbs. I've had luck actually increasing calories and making sure I have very high amounts of saturated fats in my diet.
Also, I've learned in reading labels and ingredients, that sometimes manufacturers will change the way they make a product. For instance, some mayonnaise brands now contain sugar when they did not before. My best suggestion is to double-check the ingredients of what you eat - sometimes there are surprises that can halt your progress.
I really wish you luck on your journey.
Thanks.
I agree about the double-checking of ingredients. I was looking for no HFCS / no sugar added tomato sauces. I went to 3 supermarkets before I found some. I've also found HFCS and sugars in most brands of sausage / wurst / hotdogs. Finding brands without those additives is time consuming.0 -
Thanks for the feedback. Maybe I've been losing inches?? I haven't even thought of remeasuring myself! thanks for the Good ideaI'll be sure to keep it under 25 g. It isn't that hard, if I cut back on yogurt. I'm counting total carbs also, not net carbs.
I know that many say you can subtract the fiber, but I don't want to bother with the extra math.
I've had to do a deep cut in carbs to see weight come off & when it comes off, it does so almost imperceptibly. In the last few weeks, I've lost inches, NOT weight. I have metabolic issues & don't do well with sugars & starches.
I had to cut out nuts in exchange for the occasional spoonful of peanut butter (cause I'm greedy, lol) every now and then. I also had to cut out greek yogurt, but only after about 3 months of keto, and 2 months of a stall did I start to reassess.
The more activity I get, the quicker I need to buy new jeans. I have a fairly active job (dog walker) so with 6 30 minute dog walks per day, I can get 10k steps easily but when I get upwards of 12k, I seem to get smaller quicker.
Currently I'm at meat & veggies and do best at this way of eating.
I would say to decrease carbs further, and increase activity. If this doesn't do the trick, I would question the type of metabolic disturbance you have & pin it down. Good luck.0 -
I think i will try to eliminate one common "problem" food just one at a time, on a week by week basis, to see what happens.
I eat a lot of dairy foods, for example, especially hard cheese and yogurt. I could start with the hard cheese next week.I am facing the same as you, but what works for me is turn up the crease. Less of the rest and more fat like coconut oil, pork rinds etc do the trick. I also noticed some food sources don't work well for me. If I eat hard cheese I gain even tho it's low carb, so I skip that completely now.
Sometimes the answer can be that simple. I have no problems with cream cheeses and whipped cream, but I had gouda cheese the day before yesterday and BANG 700 grams up, again and it takes me several days to get that off, so yeah when I was eating it constantly I was not loosing an ounce. I also have been reading when you don't loose weight it could be you eat too much diary.0 -
I found the link back, maybe you should read this:
http://authoritynutrition.com/15-reasons-not-losing-weight-on-a-low-carb-diet/0 -
if you've been doing this for 35 days I think it's fair to assume you are into ketosis anyway already, so why don't you try fat fasting for a few days? For people where calories intake made not much difference, and going on a free carb day didn't do much either, it seems to be the best way to kickstart weight loss. Just try put your macros on 5% carbs, 10% protein and 85% fat, trying to keep it within 1200cal per day. if you're in to try solutions, this might be an option to try as well I know it worked for me when I hit a plateau and that is apparently the suggested option for the ones on Atkins induction who can't really lose weight still.
http://www.carbsmart.com/fatfast.html0 -
Thanks for that link, I will take that adviceI think i will try to eliminate one common "problem" food just one at a time, on a week by week basis, to see what happens.
I eat a lot of dairy foods, for example, especially hard cheese and yogurt. I could start with the hard cheese next week.I am facing the same as you, but what works for me is turn up the crease. Less of the rest and more fat like coconut oil, pork rinds etc do the trick. I also noticed some food sources don't work well for me. If I eat hard cheese I gain even tho it's low carb, so I skip that completely now.
Sometimes the answer can be that simple. I have no problems with cream cheeses and whipped cream, but I had gouda cheese the day before yesterday and BANG 700 grams up, again and it takes me several days to get that off, so yeah when I was eating it constantly I was not loosing an ounce. I also have been reading when you don't loose weight it could be you eat too much diary.0 -
That's a good idea too! When I read that link, I suddenly remembered doing that fat fast when i did atkins 12 years ago. I can't remember the results, but what I remembered was dividing up a couple jars of Macadamia nuts into 250 calorie portions.if you've been doing this for 35 days I think it's fair to assume you are into ketosis anyway already, so why don't you try fat fasting for a few days? For people where calories intake made not much difference, and going on a free carb day didn't do much either, it seems to be the best way to kickstart weight loss. Just try put your macros on 5% carbs, 10% protein and 85% fat, trying to keep it within 1200cal per day. if you're in to try solutions, this might be an option to try as well I know it worked for me when I hit a plateau and that is apparently the suggested option for the ones on Atkins induction who can't really lose weight still.
http://www.carbsmart.com/fatfast.html0 -
I hear ya on the frustration. I was in a similar situation but got back to losing again just a day or two ago. But I was definitely stalled for a week or so, and I've been at keto for about a month, so also fairly new to the game (and this is my first go at it.) The only thing I can suggest since you're pretty well versed in the science is that you should track your measurements and not just your weight. We all know that weight can fluctuate with water retention or if you gain muscle while burning fat (a reasonable expectation if you're working out regularly) but measurements don't lie. Keep it up, and I hope you break through your plateau soon!0
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Thanks for the encouragement!
I want to keep on going. I'm doing keto for reasons beyond weight loss, but really that's most of it. The other part is hypothesis-- I want to see if I can get the blood work to move into the correct range. I really believe that keto can put my metabolism right-- better than all the other diet approaches. I want to avoid statins & diabetes meds.
... and I might have to find a new doctor who agrees with Peter Attia, Jeff Volek, Gary Taubes & Robert Atkins.
I've got a lot of tools for measurement-- MFP, keto sticks, a scale, a tape measure, a blood pressure cuff. Soon I will be adding the blood glucose monitor to my arsenal.
The keto sticks are showing light to moderate most days, which is fine with me. I've been in ketosis 24 of the last 30 days (80%). I didn't test the first 2 weeks.
In any case, I will be sticking to keto at least until I get my next blood test, which should be in February. If the test results are decent, I'm going to continue until the next blood test, and so on.... . If they are bad, I've got to try something else.
But yeah, I'd like to be thinner too!I hear ya on the frustration. I was in a similar situation but got back to losing again just a day or two ago. But I was definitely stalled for a week or so, and I've been at keto for about a month, so also fairly new to the game (and this is my first go at it.) The only thing I can suggest since you're pretty well versed in the science is that you should track your measurements and not just your weight. We all know that weight can fluctuate with water retention or if you gain muscle while burning fat (a reasonable expectation if you're working out regularly) but measurements don't lie. Keep it up, and I hope you break through your plateau soon!0 -
Hi
I understand your frustration, it has taken me 2 years to get into ketosis. I'm now in the groove after reading a book about low carbing for athletes. I realised that I wasnt eating enough fat and too many grams of protein. I've cut my carbs from 50g to 30g and reduced my proteins to 0.6g per lb of lean mass.... the rest of my cals are working out to about 120g of fat. I realy hadn't realised just what a change I had to make in my diet to get into ketosis. That happened about a week ago and I'v lost 6lb this week, having struggled with an upward trend this summer, even though I cycled across europe for 8 weeks.0 -
2 years ?!? That's real determination and grit.
I think my carbs were too high the first 2 weeks. I've since relaxed since posted my ranty frustration. I realized my expectations were set too high. Also I got a lot of great tips from the folks on the keto message boards.
Glad to hear your diet adjustments are working better for you.Hi
I understand your frustration, it has taken me 2 years to get into ketosis. I'm now in the groove after reading a book about low carbing for athletes. I realised that I wasnt eating enough fat and too many grams of protein. I've cut my carbs from 50g to 30g and reduced my proteins to 0.6g per lb of lean mass.... the rest of my cals are working out to about 120g of fat. I realy hadn't realised just what a change I had to make in my diet to get into ketosis. That happened about a week ago and I'v lost 6lb this week, having struggled with an upward trend this summer, even though I cycled across europe for 8 weeks.0 -
Here are a few mor tips you may find helpful:
1) if you eat too much protein, your body will convert excess into sugar, and then that counteracts the ketosis metabolic reaction as by indirectly adding more sugar to your diet. Don't eat more than 1.5 grams protein per kg of lean body mass. That's all you need to survive.
2) drink several glasses of water per day. I'm on a lchf diet too and notice that I don't do well on days that I skip drinking water. Helps to flush out the crap.
3) take a multivitamin supplement like centrum, omega 3 fish oil and vitamin D, I do that so my body doesn't go into freak out mode thinking it's not getting nutrients
4) you mention that you got your calorie set point from a variety of calculators on the internet, but didn't clarify wether or not you used a calorie deficiency in your formula. For example, to lose about a pound per week, you need a calorie deficiency of approx 3500 calories per week. Calculate the number of cals you need to survive in a week, and then minus the 3500. That should be your calorie set point for the week.
5) don't base your macronutrient % without considering how many carbs and protein you should limit yourself to. First figure out your daily calorie target using the 3500 calorie deficiency as described in (4). Then set your limit to 30 carbs max per day. Figure out how many calories 30 carbs are (120 calories), and minus that from your daily calorie max. Then figure out how much calories in protein you should be eating (1.5 grams protein per kg lean body weight, and there are 4 calories per gram protein) and minus that from your daily calorie target. In the end, the remaining calories after minussing the carbs and protein allowance are the calories you should be consuming as fat. This is a more accurate way to calculate your macronutrient needs. The 10/20/70 % rule is a rough rule of thumb, only works for people within a certain height and weight category. If you are outside that window (like I am) it will throw off your numbers.
Sincerely hope this helps. Hang in there tiger.0
