Book "Always Hungry?"
JessicaLCHF
Posts: 1,265 Member
I have a lot of diet book but not this one. Anyone have it? Worth the money? It looks intriguing. https://proteinpower.com/drmike/2016/01/05/always_hungry/
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Interesting review of it here:
http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2016/01/always-hungry-its-probably-not-your.html0 -
Ah, thanks. Reading the comments he looks to be a low calorie advocate dressed up in low carb garb. 40% carbs is not very low carb. Guess I'll skip it. Too bad. Attractive cover art! Lol.0
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Ludwig is usually pretty low carb and anti insulin spikes. Most of his stuff is anti sugars and he is usually against calorie counting. I usually like his books, but I think his insulin theories are a bit simplistic. Insulin plays a role in obesity but I doubt it is THE cause of obesity.
I have a hold on it at the library and plan to read it this winter.0 -
There's also a doc named Lustig. He's the anti-sugar guy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Lustig0 -
Ludwig is usually pretty low carb and anti insulin spikes. Most of his stuff is anti sugars and he is usually against calorie counting. I usually like his books, but I think his insulin theories are a bit simplistic. Insulin plays a role in obesity but I doubt it is THE cause of obesity.
I have a hold on it at the library and plan to read it this winter.
I believe it could be "the cause". It's pretty convincing when you see a non insulin resistant T1D (not overweight by BMI) that goes on an insulin pump, eats the "healthy" foods, keeps blood sugar under pretty good control and reaching their A1C goal of under 7%, but puts on over 60lbs in a year.0 -
I'm convinced it's the biggest player due to converting the sugars to fat but also due to strong cravings when sugars drop.
Based on nothing more than personal experience, but my high willpower seems to be in direct correlation to how stable my blood sugar is.0 -
Ah geez. Thank you! I mixed them up!There's also a doc named Lustig. He's the anti-sugar guy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Lustig
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Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »Ludwig is usually pretty low carb and anti insulin spikes. Most of his stuff is anti sugars and he is usually against calorie counting. I usually like his books, but I think his insulin theories are a bit simplistic. Insulin plays a role in obesity but I doubt it is THE cause of obesity.
I have a hold on it at the library and plan to read it this winter.
I believe it could be "the cause". It's pretty convincing when you see a non insulin resistant T1D (not overweight by BMI) that goes on an insulin pump, eats the "healthy" foods, keeps blood sugar under pretty good control and reaching their A1C goal of under 7%, but puts on over 60lbs in a year.
Wow. That's just not fair at all...T1D and then that.
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Ludwig posted a response to Guyenet's critique:
https://medium.com/@davidludwigmd/ludwig-responds-to-whole-health-source-article-93d8e1667477#.oseuiacqo
Worth a read. Similar to Taubes' arguments, but perhaps a bit more nuanced.
TL;DR: High-GI food causes insulin spike, 5 hours later too much energy is stored as fat, body senses low energy, stimulates hunger, and we get fatter. Once we're fat and insulin resistant, we no longer have this problem.
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I heard an interview with him on NPR just over the weekend. My SO, who is doing Keto with me (and convinced me to try it as well), really wants the book. He has no idea it's on it way from Amazon!! I am looking forward to giving it a read as well.0
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Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »Ludwig is usually pretty low carb and anti insulin spikes. Most of his stuff is anti sugars and he is usually against calorie counting. I usually like his books, but I think his insulin theories are a bit simplistic. Insulin plays a role in obesity but I doubt it is THE cause of obesity.
I have a hold on it at the library and plan to read it this winter.
I believe it could be "the cause". It's pretty convincing when you see a non insulin resistant T1D (not overweight by BMI) that goes on an insulin pump, eats the "healthy" foods, keeps blood sugar under pretty good control and reaching their A1C goal of under 7%, but puts on over 60lbs in a year.
Wow. That's just not fair at all...T1D and then that.
Here is a paragraph from the article Wab linked that says exactly what I described
"A simple model of primary hyperinsulinemia is insulin administration. People with type 1 diabetes who receive inadequate insulin treatment invariably lose weight, no matter how much they consume. Conversely, insulin initiation in type 2 diabetes or overtreatment in type 1 diabetes predictably causes weight gain. A component of this effect is metabolic, not simply differences in glucose loss in urine [Carlson]."
This is why my daughters Aunt has gained 60 lbs in a short time she's been on an insulin pump but has achieved an A1C of about 6.5 and her doctors are thrilled! Her Aunt also has Celiac, so she doesn't even eat wheat!
My daughter wants to attempt lower carb once she goes back on the pump starting next week to prevent this. Her diabetes nurse wants to put her on U200 insulin (twice as strong) so that she can wear the pump for 3 days without running out of insulin and having to change it more often. She insists that there's no reason to reduce carbs in order to simply use less insulin. That the answer is to use double strength insulin and eat "normally"!
Needless to say, my daughter understands how this works and will not be getting the U200. She will be forced to reduce carbs or she will run out of insulin before the 3 days and will have to remove and insert a new infusion set, which is a little painful. Pretty good motivation to reduce carbs. And pretty interesting "controlled insulin" model for observing as she makes absolutely no insulin at all. I hope to be able to track her insulin usage and compare to her weight over time. I've instructed her that she should eat to satiety and not try to go hungry in an effort to not gain weight. But simply reduce insulin usage as the method to control weight. I don't believe she will have any issue with overeating to any degree that would be any issue as long as she's not overeating carbs. Unfortunately there's no way I will be able to convince her to track all foods for data purposes.
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Reading through the book and highlighting certain areas for perspective and clarity he doesn't or hasn't in the first 100 pages discussed just moving after a meal. The GI and insulin sensitive foods he mentions seem to avoid discussing protein and their effect on rapid insulin response versus say a piece of white bread. He does provide quizzes to get people thinking about low or high GI foods versus slow carbs which is interesting.Ludwig posted a response to Guyenet's critique:
https://medium.com/@davidludwigmd/ludwig-responds-to-whole-health-source-article-93d8e1667477#.oseuiacqo
Worth a read. Similar to Taubes' arguments, but perhaps a bit more nuanced.
TL;DR: High-GI food causes insulin spike, 5 hours later too much energy is stored as fat, body senses low energy, stimulates hunger, and we get fatter. Once we're fat and insulin resistant, we no longer have this problem.
Similar to the response he provided above he spends quite a bit of time referencing certain things like insulin but avoids any depth of discussion of cortisol and some of the other factors people have a tendency to avoid discussing.
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There are so many theories of obesity, I've started to collect them.
When I get time, I'll list a few, but it's clearly a multi-factorial problem, which is probably why we have such a poor handle on it.
I'm looking forward to Guyenet's book which looks at the neurological factors.
Hunger is obviously a key factor, but most authors don't even enumerate all the different kinds of hunger, much less address the hormonal and nutrient triggers.0 -
There are so many theories of obesity, I've started to collect them.
When I get time, I'll list a few, but it's clearly a multi-factorial problem, which is probably why we have such a poor handle on it.
I'm looking forward to Guyenet's book which looks at the neurological factors.
Hunger is obviously a key factor, but most authors don't even enumerate all the different kinds of hunger, much less address the hormonal and nutrient triggers.
Maybe, eventually, the hormonal issue is addressed along with nutrient triggers. Then again, maybe getting down that road is going to take longer and more money.
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Guyenet fired another shot:
http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2016/01/testing-insulin-model-response-to-dr.html
TL;DR: It's leptin, not insulin. Insulin only leads to too much fat when action is high, not when levels are high (e.g., when too much is given to T1D pts who are insulin-sensitive). No evidence for high-GI diets causing obesity or for low-GI diets leading to weight loss.0 -
Guyenet fired another shot:
http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2016/01/testing-insulin-model-response-to-dr.html
TL;DR: It's leptin, not insulin. Insulin only leads to too much fat when action is high, not when levels are high (e.g., when too much is given to T1D pts who are insulin-sensitive). No evidence for high-GI diets causing obesity or for low-GI diets leading to weight loss.
Ha! This man is a moron! Every insulin pump wearing T1D eating a "normal" diet I know has gotten fat on their pump. It's widely known in T1D communities that people gain weight on the pump. Teenage girls run high blood sugars on purpose to stay thin because they avoid taking insulin because they know it makes them gain. They just don't know about cutting carbs as a method to use less to stay more thin. Constant supply of insulin is over treatment. Simple as that. If they don't eat enough carbs, then the pump setting for basal rate usually needs to be adjusted and of course meal time bolus will be lower. But then you know what will happen? Diabetes educator will be asking why the patient isn't eating? Then they will be telling them about how they need carbs to avoid DKA. Mark my words. My daughter goes back on her pump in Tuesday. This talk will be in my future. I hope I'm wrong, but I doubt I am. My daughter is dead set on not gaining weight. She's s good weight right now and doesn't want to ruin it.0 -
Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »Ludwig is usually pretty low carb and anti insulin spikes. Most of his stuff is anti sugars and he is usually against calorie counting. I usually like his books, but I think his insulin theories are a bit simplistic. Insulin plays a role in obesity but I doubt it is THE cause of obesity.
I have a hold on it at the library and plan to read it this winter.
I believe it could be "the cause". It's pretty convincing when you see a non insulin resistant T1D (not overweight by BMI) that goes on an insulin pump, eats the "healthy" foods, keeps blood sugar under pretty good control and reaching their A1C goal of under 7%, but puts on over 60lbs in a year.
Wow. That's just not fair at all...T1D and then that.
Here is a paragraph from the article Wab linked that says exactly what I described
"A simple model of primary hyperinsulinemia is insulin administration. People with type 1 diabetes who receive inadequate insulin treatment invariably lose weight, no matter how much they consume. Conversely, insulin initiation in type 2 diabetes or overtreatment in type 1 diabetes predictably causes weight gain. A component of this effect is metabolic, not simply differences in glucose loss in urine [Carlson]."
This is why my daughters Aunt has gained 60 lbs in a short time she's been on an insulin pump but has achieved an A1C of about 6.5 and her doctors are thrilled! Her Aunt also has Celiac, so she doesn't even eat wheat!
My daughter wants to attempt lower carb once she goes back on the pump starting next week to prevent this. Her diabetes nurse wants to put her on U200 insulin (twice as strong) so that she can wear the pump for 3 days without running out of insulin and having to change it more often. She insists that there's no reason to reduce carbs in order to simply use less insulin. That the answer is to use double strength insulin and eat "normally"!
Needless to say, my daughter understands how this works and will not be getting the U200. She will be forced to reduce carbs or she will run out of insulin before the 3 days and will have to remove and insert a new infusion set, which is a little painful. Pretty good motivation to reduce carbs. And pretty interesting "controlled insulin" model for observing as she makes absolutely no insulin at all. I hope to be able to track her insulin usage and compare to her weight over time. I've instructed her that she should eat to satiety and not try to go hungry in an effort to not gain weight. But simply reduce insulin usage as the method to control weight. I don't believe she will have any issue with overeating to any degree that would be any issue as long as she's not overeating carbs. Unfortunately there's no way I will be able to convince her to track all foods for data purposes.
Let us know how it goes with your daughter. You two sound like you have a solid plan in place! 0 -
It's cool to watch the back and forth. FWIW, Guyenet has been called a moron by many low-carbers.
He believes it's all about "food reward." I.e., the obesity epidemic is due to foods engineered to taste better than any foods we'd find in nature. And that's why low-carb and paleo diets both work: due to eating natural whole foods that aren't hyperpalatable.
There's probably an element of truth there, but perhaps not the whole truth. 0 -
I wish there was a way to test the big picture. I too think there is probably truth in both arguments. How to prove that is a problem though.
I wish they'd hurry up - I wanna know!0 -
It's cool to watch the back and forth. FWIW, Guyenet has been called a moron by many low-carbers.
He believes it's all about "food reward." I.e., the obesity epidemic is due to foods engineered to taste better than any foods we'd find in nature. And that's why low-carb and paleo diets both work: due to eating natural whole foods that aren't hyperpalatable.
There's probably an element of truth there, but perhaps not the whole truth.
I don't know anything about this guy, so I'm not weighing in on him being a moron or not, but the idea of whole foods not being hyper palatable is definitely why I'm happy to have one tiny square of 90% cocoa versus my desire to devour a King size Snickers bar. The 90% cocoa is enjoyable, but it's not that good that you want the whole bar, kinda like not wanting to eat 3 apples in a row.0
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