Glycogen stores?
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MEG924
Posts: 37 Member
I read an article that said it only takes about 70 grams of carbs to replenish glycogen stores and make you gain water weight. I'm not sure how much truth there is to this, and was wondering if anyone knew? As I get closer to my goal weight, I'm wondering how many carbs I can mantain on. I'm currently around 10-20 (some days lately have been up to 40).
I am also going back to my home state next week to visit family and was thinking of having a slice of eggplant sicilian pizza (because I haven't had it in a long time and there's no good pizza where I live now). And my bf and I used to go to a small diner that has amazing french toast so I was thinking of having 1 slice of that as well (most likely on a different day). I'm wondering if I stick to l.c. the rest of the day and rest of my trip, if I'll be okay? Is there a difference in reactions in your body based on where your carbs come from, bread/pasta vs sugary foods? I'd like to hit my goal on my 1 yr anniversary of l.c. which is in June.
I am also going back to my home state next week to visit family and was thinking of having a slice of eggplant sicilian pizza (because I haven't had it in a long time and there's no good pizza where I live now). And my bf and I used to go to a small diner that has amazing french toast so I was thinking of having 1 slice of that as well (most likely on a different day). I'm wondering if I stick to l.c. the rest of the day and rest of my trip, if I'll be okay? Is there a difference in reactions in your body based on where your carbs come from, bread/pasta vs sugary foods? I'd like to hit my goal on my 1 yr anniversary of l.c. which is in June.
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So you lost weight by restricting carbs, right? How did you originally gain the extra weight?
If you don't think pizza or french toast had anything to do with the initial weight gain, then indulge. Personally, I blame pizza for some of my weight gain.
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Yes. 71 lbs so far, still have between 14 - 19 to go. I was overweight my whole life and I think just general bad eatting habits are to blame. Not caring and emotional eatting. I tend to do better when things are out of sight/out of mind as well. I know those 2 foods I wouldn't have after my trip so I'm not fearing the cheat meals turning into weeks, months, etc. I'm just nervous of any weight gain, though if I did gain it should be water weight from the excess carbs, right?0
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Right. Those foods will knock you out of ketosis, and you'll retain more water for sure. Not totally due to the glycogen stores, but that's part of it.
I guess I'm more concerned with your long-term success, though. I'm sure you've heard the horror stories of weight regain. That comes from going back to old habits. So if you can, maybe try to find a way to indulge while staying in the framework of low-carb? I mean pizza still tastes great without the crust, right? 0 -
I'm all about compromise. Why don't you pick one or the other as your special treat. Then get the bf to order the other dish on a different day and make him give you one bite just to taste. Personally, I would indulge in the pizza as you can eat one proper slice and then scavenge some fatty/yummy toppings off of another. French toast rarely has any sort of protein or fat and is covered in some sort of sugar. You may find that it would be too sweet for you now that you've been avoiding such things for so long.0
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I agree that you will probably get bumped out of ketosis by eating pizza and French toast but that may not be a problem for you. I was away staying with family this past weekend and I was certain,y bumped out of ketosis. The scale moved up a pound. Not a big deal. My problem is that it sets me up for carb cravings and a larger appetite. I rarely bounce back immediately unless I just went a bit over in one meal. A week later I am still dealing with hunger and snackiness, mainly because I indulge it a bit.
Anyway, I would say to go for it if you can get right back on the wagon. If you have doubts, don't do t or do less, like just one piece of pizza and skip the French toast. Good luck.0 -
Thanks for all the responses!
In terms of long term maintenance with this woe, what's a good carb level to aim for once I've gotten to my goal weight? What has worked for you?0 -
I say as long as you can emotionally deal with any possible setback and increase on the scale and can control it, then it's not a big deal to plan to do something like this on such an occasion.
I think the problems occur when people get bummed out about it or it creates a downward spiral. Also, if it's not limited to vacations and holidays and such special occasions.0 -
In terms of long term maintenance with this woe, what's a good carb level to aim for once I've gotten to my goal weight? What has worked for you?
I've been maintaining for a few months, and I no longer track macros. As I was losing weight, I tried to figure out which foods were driving me to overeat. And now I try to avoid them. So back to one of your original questions, yes, the kind of food matters. Not necessarily due to macro content, though.
I can eat veggies and berries all the time without worrying about carb levels or overeating. Pizza? Warm bread? French toast? I will not go there. Not even for a special occasion. Simply because I'm aware of their power, and I respect that power.
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Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »I say as long as you can emotionally deal with any possible setback and increase on the scale and can control it, then it's not a big deal to plan to do something like this on such an occasion.
I think the problems occur when people get bummed out about it or it creates a downward spiral. Also, if it's not limited to vacations and holidays and such special occasions.
Do you think it's best to really restrict carbs before/after cheat meals?
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In terms of long term maintenance with this woe, what's a good carb level to aim for once I've gotten to my goal weight? What has worked for you?
I've been maintaining for a few months, and I no longer track macros. As I was losing weight, I tried to figure out which foods were driving me to overeat. And now I try to avoid them. So back to one of your original questions, yes, the kind of food matters. Not necessarily due to macro content, though.
I can eat veggies and berries all the time without worrying about carb levels or overeating. Pizza? Warm bread? French toast? I will not go there. Not even for a special occasion. Simply because I'm aware of their power, and I respect that power.
So that power is over cravings, not necessarily weight gain from the food itself, if I understand correctly?
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Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »I say as long as you can emotionally deal with any possible setback and increase on the scale and can control it, then it's not a big deal to plan to do something like this on such an occasion.
I think the problems occur when people get bummed out about it or it creates a downward spiral. Also, if it's not limited to vacations and holidays and such special occasions.
Do you think it's best to really restrict carbs before/after cheat meals?
Well, yes. Because you're eating low carb as your long term or lifelong plan, so you need to get right back on plan. Which is restricting carbs...
I should say though, I don't actually personally allow any cheats. At all. I am like Wab in the way that I respect their power. Plus, I am all about Keto and how I feel. Nothing tastes good enough for me to trade one minute of ketosis for. I love the food I eat. What I eat on special occasions or holidays are the low carb versions of desserts. And I pretty much only eat those for those reasons.
There's plenty of great things to eat that don't bend the rules at all. There's no reason to ever feel deprived. It's just food. My plan is always to pick another food that won't negatively affect my body.
If you just want to remember the taste of something you used to have, just have a very small bite of it for the taste. That's all we really want right? The taste of it? So why isn't just getting the taste enough? Why do we feel the need to keep tasting it? Why do we have to have multiple bites and eat the whole thing for it to be satisfying?
I'll tell you why. The craving it causes! The response that is created when dopamine and insulin is signaled in preparation for what your brain recognizes as a high carb item. Thats why I respect what a cheat can do. You're literally going to be working against a hormonal reaction that will be telling you to EAT IT ALL.
SO, now I sound very unsupportive in saying that. And that's not it at all. That's why I said that if you can stop yourself and you won't be upset if the scale doesn't move, then it will only be a temporary setback that you will surely get over very quickly assuming you get right back on plan. Ultimately, it's just one meal. It's got a limited possible affect if it's truly a limited occurrence.
It's ok to choose that if you can make it work for you.0 -
Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »I say as long as you can emotionally deal with any possible setback and increase on the scale and can control it, then it's not a big deal to plan to do something like this on such an occasion.
I think the problems occur when people get bummed out about it or it creates a downward spiral. Also, if it's not limited to vacations and holidays and such special occasions.
Do you think it's best to really restrict carbs before/after cheat meals?
Well, yes. Because you're eating low carb as your long term or lifelong plan, so you need to get right back on plan. Which is restricting carbs...
I should say though, I don't actually personally allow any cheats. At all. I am like Wab in the way that I respect their power. Plus, I am all about Keto and how I feel. Nothing tastes good enough for me to trade one minute of ketosis for. I love the food I eat. What I eat on special occasions or holidays are the low carb versions of desserts. And I pretty much only eat those for those reasons.
There's plenty of great things to eat that don't bend the rules at all. There's no reason to ever feel deprived. It's just food. My plan is always to pick another food that won't negatively affect my body.
If you just want to remember the taste of something you used to have, just have a very small bite of it for the taste. That's all we really want right? The taste of it? So why isn't just getting the taste enough? Why do we feel the need to keep tasting it? Why do we have to have multiple bites and eat the whole thing for it to be satisfying?
I'll tell you why. The craving it causes! The response that is created when dopamine and insulin is signaled in preparation for what your brain recognizes as a high carb item. Thats why I respect what a cheat can do. You're literally going to be working against a hormonal reaction that will be telling you to EAT IT ALL.
SO, now I sound very unsupportive in saying that. And that's not it at all. That's why I said that if you can stop yourself and you won't be upset if the scale doesn't move, then it will only be a temporary setback that you will surely get over very quickly assuming you get right back on plan. Ultimately, it's just one meal. It's got a limited possible affect if it's truly a limited occurrence.
It's ok to choose that if you can make it work for you.
Thank you for your views! I haven't thought about some of your points so it's definitely given me a new perspective! I may even change my mind about the meal(s) between now and my trip, but I now know regardless of my decision to stay on track. How have you managed any carb cravings you've had?
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Macros or cravings? Both. Carbs have metabolic effects. Insulin is important.
You've had great success by restricting carbs. That suggests that you were probably insulin resistant when you started the diet, and now you are likely cured.
If you are no longer insulin resistant, you can probably eat quite a load of carbs without any short-term consequences (other than temporary water weight gain).
But you weren't always insulin resistant. You fell into a pattern of eating that got you there. How did that pattern get started? It wasn't a few hundred grams of carbs that got you into trouble. It was a chronic behavioral pattern. Food has both metabolic effects and behavioral effects.
I'm saying that if you avoid the slippery slope that leads to those behavioral patterns, then you'll maintain your new-found ability to handle a few more carbs if you want to. You can maintain that for the rest of your life if you can avoid the old traps.
So, yeah, pizza will knock you out of ketosis. You'll gain up to 5 lbs of water. You'll lose that weight in about 4 days. You'll be able to get back into ketosis in 1-2 days by restricting carbs again.
You will be fine. You can recover from the "cheat." But what's your framework for long-term maintenance? Is pizza and french toast part of that framework? If not, why bother even going there.
@Sunny_Bunny_ has a great framework. There are only two categories: food and not-food.0 -
Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »I say as long as you can emotionally deal with any possible setback and increase on the scale and can control it, then it's not a big deal to plan to do something like this on such an occasion.
I think the problems occur when people get bummed out about it or it creates a downward spiral. Also, if it's not limited to vacations and holidays and such special occasions.
Do you think it's best to really restrict carbs before/after cheat meals?
Well, yes. Because you're eating low carb as your long term or lifelong plan, so you need to get right back on plan. Which is restricting carbs...
I should say though, I don't actually personally allow any cheats. At all. I am like Wab in the way that I respect their power. Plus, I am all about Keto and how I feel. Nothing tastes good enough for me to trade one minute of ketosis for. I love the food I eat. What I eat on special occasions or holidays are the low carb versions of desserts. And I pretty much only eat those for those reasons.
There's plenty of great things to eat that don't bend the rules at all. There's no reason to ever feel deprived. It's just food. My plan is always to pick another food that won't negatively affect my body.
If you just want to remember the taste of something you used to have, just have a very small bite of it for the taste. That's all we really want right? The taste of it? So why isn't just getting the taste enough? Why do we feel the need to keep tasting it? Why do we have to have multiple bites and eat the whole thing for it to be satisfying?
I'll tell you why. The craving it causes! The response that is created when dopamine and insulin is signaled in preparation for what your brain recognizes as a high carb item. Thats why I respect what a cheat can do. You're literally going to be working against a hormonal reaction that will be telling you to EAT IT ALL.
SO, now I sound very unsupportive in saying that. And that's not it at all. That's why I said that if you can stop yourself and you won't be upset if the scale doesn't move, then it will only be a temporary setback that you will surely get over very quickly assuming you get right back on plan. Ultimately, it's just one meal. It's got a limited possible affect if it's truly a limited occurrence.
It's ok to choose that if you can make it work for you.
Thank you for your views! I haven't thought about some of your points so it's definitely given me a new perspective! I may even change my mind about the meal(s) between now and my trip, but I now know regardless of my decision to stay on track. How have you managed any carb cravings you've had?
I went head on, full steam into Keto from day one. I read about it for a few months before I started and I knew that it was a common thought that it was best to just not go there when it came to cheats. I was fully aware of my personal weaknesses too, which I think helped. So, the only time I've actually had cravings since starting were right in the beginning, of course, which I was able to deal with using will power because within a few days, they passed. And I've had them when I would have too much artificial sweetener or sweet flavored foods, even if they fit the plan. The sweet taste does me in! I've fought to eliminate sweetener and the lower I got, the better everything else tasted!
So my method to control cravings was to eliminate what was causing them. Initially it was carbs and sugar in general. Then after I started Keto, it was artificial sweetener and low carb desserts. Oh, and quest bars! They're literally the devil! lol
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Thank you @wabmester!
I've always beat myself up in the past when I've had a cheat meal (there was even a time I considered an apple to be a "cheat" but I really wanted one).. thinking that if I ate one thing off plan I'd start gaining. Now I realize how silly that thinking was, because it's really the emotional effects from a cheat that cause some people to spiral out of control and go back to old habits that led to the initial gain. I think I'll allow myself the pizza with the understanding it's a "one time thing". I did ok the last time I was home and had a few cheat meals so I'm not sure why I'm so crazy about it this time. Maybe because I'm a lot closer to goal? I guess it's a good thing to be hard on yourself sometimes if it means you'll stay on track.0 -
I haven't had quest bars but I definitely know the cravings from having atkins products a few times. The sugar alcohols don't mix well with me and then I have intense cravings so I stopped those a while ago.
I sometimes have random cravings for chocolate or even cereal. I haven't "given in" but I'm wondering if there's anything to eat in place of those cravings.0 -
Something I can tolerate that hasn't caused me any cravings and I have no trouble at all having just the right amount is 80% or higher dark chocolate.
Or having some berries with or without whipped cream made from heavy cream. (Not store bought)
I also like having flavored hot tea with a little heavy cream in the evenings. The flavors kind gives it sweetness without sweetener. But, earlier on, I was adding stevia or Splenda. If you're able to tolerate the sweeteners, then go for it. Lots of people on here are able to have certain sweeteners regularly with no increased hunger. Doesn't seem to work for me.0 -
The cure for chocolate cravings is dark chocolate.
The cure for cereal cravings is toasted coconut flakes.
Frankly, I think some people restrict carbs a little too much and could cut themselves some slack. But pizza and french toast might be crossing the line. 0 -
Yes! Forgot about coconut flakes.
Gotta buy unsweetened. It's trickier to find.
I love them toasted or not.
I've also put them in a baggie with just enough unsweetened cocoa powder to dust them. That's not caused me any cravings either.0 -
Thanks for the suggestions!!!
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