Enough is enough?

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Deena_Bean
Deena_Bean Posts: 906 Member
This morning my squats were 135. It was pretty heavy, it was hard and my lower back and right knee noticed. I didn't hurt anything, but I could feel those 2 body parts sort of reminding me that they're capable of injury in a jiffy.
Here's the thing. I'm not lifting to be like the strongest woman in the world or anything. My goal here is to have muscle vs. fat, and to make sure I'm lifting for the benefits of aging/bone loss. I'm not looking for an award, I don't have any desire to lift cars or pull semi's :) I think it's completely awesome for women to lift and be strong, and I think each of us probably has our own idea of what we're here for (and the reasons for it).
I'm wondering now, in my case, is there a point of 'enough is enough'. It's not worth it to me to keep inching up and risking injury due to failure. I've seen back injuries happen and then the person (read: my husband, playing basketball more than 10 years ago) that have caused permanent damage - and therefore permanent recurrence of pain. Not interested in all that - I've seen his pain resulting from a sports injury and it ain't pretty (like taking off work for a few days to lay on the couch). I know, good form prevents it, but accidents happen. Like I said, I could tell what I lifted this morning was quite heavy (to me anyways) - and I could also see that it wouldn't be too hard to screw myself up with one wrong move, balance failure, shift in a leg, a hip dip...whatever.
At this point, if I were to max out now (or soon), will I continue to reap the benefits of lifting at this amount? It seems like that should be fine, right? Obviously I won't lose muscle by not going up in weight...I just theoretically won't get "stronger" right? What are the best reasons (aside from being stronger) to keep inching up? Feel free to unload opinions or facts - I'm up for it all. Just bouncing around ideas and whatnot...
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  • whmscll
    whmscll Posts: 2,254 Member
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    I am only squatting 70 pounds, deadlifting 75, benching 60, rowing 65 and OHP 50. I am trying to perfect my form, but I keep injuring myself. I am lying on the couch with back strain and trigger finger as I type this. I would hold at your current weight until lifting it is easy, and then increase in tiny increments, with 1.25 pound fractional plates even. I thought my form was good (a muscular guy even complimented me on it) and two days later BAM, can barely walk. So be careful.
  • sixpacklady
    sixpacklady Posts: 582 Member
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    I have heard that when you hit a wall like this, you have to deload like 10% and increase reps/sets. Or if you are in a deficit, eat more or at maintenance for a while. But I will let the experts chime in...
  • canadianlbs
    canadianlbs Posts: 5,199 Member
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    i don't think you get weaker if you just stay at weights that you're happy with . . . :)
  • DDHFree
    DDHFree Posts: 502 Member
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    This is an awesome questions. I'd like to know too.
  • Deena_Bean
    Deena_Bean Posts: 906 Member
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    I think my guy is getting nervous for me - he knows how badly he can hurt and he doesn't want to see it happen to me. I agree with him, I just need to decide if I've reached my 'enough" stage now. That's not to say that I will never increase..but it may be months if ever. Hmmmm....
  • DDHFree
    DDHFree Posts: 502 Member
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    I was hoping there would be a lot of input on this thread because it's definitely a question that I anticipate down the road. Thanks to those who responded.
  • ninenines
    ninenines Posts: 197 Member
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    There are so many ways for you to get stronger that don't include heavy squats. They are just one (very effective) exercise. If you get to a point where you don't want to go heavier you might try different variations like a front squat, split squats, lunges, or body weight squats through to pistol squats. Depending on your concerns and/or goals any of those variations can further your progress.
  • Deena_Bean
    Deena_Bean Posts: 906 Member
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    There are a few of the lifts that concern me the heavier they get - the kind that involve bending to lift (squats, deadlift and rows). The OHP doesn't concern me as much because if I can't get the weight over my head to begin with I doubt I'll injure myself (and I can tell if I can manage to get it up there or not). Same with the bench...not as concerning to me. I'm still thinking on this...
  • xcalygrl
    xcalygrl Posts: 1,897 Member
    edited February 2016
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    Progressive overload is the key. That can be done in 2 ways: more weight or more volume. If you have no desire to lift more than 135#, you can increase the volume of work (more reps or sets) you're doing and do it with lighter weights. Either way will allow you to get stronger, retain the muscles you have, and build muscle (if you want and eat to support that goal down the line).

    ETA: also, if you want to just continue at the weight you're at, you can. Overtime, your body will become more efficient at lifting it. When that happens, you can look into the above (more weight or more volume), if you desire. Either way, continuing to lift at a weight you're happy with won't cause you to lose muscles because they are going to be worked and developed.
  • alasin1derland
    alasin1derland Posts: 575 Member
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    I find this thread interesting because 135lb was my enough is enough squat weight. It was "I am no longer enjoying my workout" weight. Bench press 102.5, overhead press 82.5, deadlift 165, rows 105. I feel like I could have gone heavier on the deadlift but I lift alone and the idea of injury absolutely held me back. Husband was constantly asking me not to push it. Same as you I am lifting for health and bone density. Not looking to win any contests. I decided to try body beast to see if it increased my strength with the idea I would absolutely go back to strong lifts. But... I decided to do another round of body beast as I saw changes much faster with body beast. I still think I will go back to 5x5's in the future, just not yet. Before changing programs I did try the deload and work back up on squats but as soon as I got back to 135lb I didn't look forward to jumping into the workouts. I agree with others, enjoying lifting is much more important than increasing weight. I also agree deloading and doing more reps is still moving forward. Even just shorter rests between sets is still moving forward. My motto is if it feels like a workout, its a workout.
  • christch
    christch Posts: 238 Member
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    This is kind of where I am at at the moment too. I've just finished 3 months of hypertrophy work where I started at 8 reps,then 12 and finally 15, now switched back to some power work because the volume was becoming too much. But I'm finding that DL are stalling at 75kg because I've become anxious about the weight. I've had lifting sessions with my trainer and form is good. I'm at the point that I'm starting to actually avoid it. My brain tells me just drop the weight back to 60 -65kg and do a couple more sets but my heart tells me that's a cop out to just stop mucking around and do it.
    I lift because I enjoy it but as the weights get heavier or at least they are for me, that pleasure seems to be waining.
  • DDHFree
    DDHFree Posts: 502 Member
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    Xcalygrl, alasin1derland, and christch, thanks for sharing your perspectives. I know that I will find it very useful when it happens me me down the road.
  • Deena_Bean
    Deena_Bean Posts: 906 Member
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    Thank you all for your words of wisdom :)
    This morning I kept my squats at 135 - it was a hard day, it felt harder than the last day I lifted 135. I think I'm going to deload a bit and re-work back up to this. My form is sketchy anyways, so I'm only hurting myself by not correcting it. So on Saturday I'll drop down a bit. Also, I'm starting to get to that "I hate squats" frame of mind, and that's not going to be conducive to continuing. Better to de-load and continue feeling good about keeping the lifts in my schedule :)
  • krokador
    krokador Posts: 1,794 Member
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    As a disclaimer before I answer: I am the complete opposite right now. I want to get stronger. I would like to compete in powerlifting one day. I do obstacle races more than once a year. So to me, performance is important. Going up in weight motivates me. Yet I also find myself running into certain walls (almost literally) doing what I do, so I have recently been drawn back to a more fundamental approach to movement.

    So that is the perspective I am coming from with my answer.

    If you get to a point where you no longer enjoy what you are doing or your training does not line up with your goals, then perhaps it is time you switch it up. Like some people mentioned, you can try different variations of the squat that will challenge you in different ways. And doing that you could still stick to 5x5, but somewhere down the line, it is and will remain this: a "begginer's" weight lifting routine.

    To be honest, if your goal is bone density, overal health and a body that is strong and "ready" to face life, what you should be looking at is something a lot more "functional". And by that I don't mean crossfit, so don't go ringing alarm bells haha. You want to focus on body control and mobility. Lifting weights is a good "base" per se, strength-wise, but most people will have skipped the step that I think should come first in every case: bodyweight exercise mastery. Squats, lunges, push-ups, pike presses, planks, pull-ups... The kind of stuff that you may find yourself doing repeatedly in real life.

    I'm not saying you should drop barbell work completely. In fact, deadlifts are a very functional exercise and honestly, if you're smart about them your chance of injury is basically none (if you can't get the darn bar off the floor, it won't move. Yanow?).

    But from the list of reasons why you lift/workout I think what you should be looking into is something that incorporates more body-aware movements. Stuff that teaches your body how to move the way it did when you were younger. And then the barbell stuff can come as an accessory to that, which means the focus would be much less about increasing the weight on the bar, and more on building up that balance in your body that alllows you to lift more weight almost seamlessly because you have found new strength in a different "environment".

    You don't need to want to ever shoot for being able to do what they do, but look up a few parkour videos (not free running. The flips and jumps are impressive but do not illustrate my point very well xD). Look at how they move from point A to point B almost effortlessly. That is what the human body is supposed to be doing. That is how you "prevent injuries and pain". Barbell training is only one of many tools you can use to get there, so if you feel you have reached a point where putting more weight on the bar will actually take you further from that goal, then go look at the other tools at your disposition and make the best of what you have.

    But don't leave it out completely, especially if you enjoy it. Even if you need a saw for this particular project, it doesn't mean that the screwdriver has become useless!

    Here, so nobody gets the wrong idea, this is what parkour looks like.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMppD-bUNWo
  • alasin1derland
    alasin1derland Posts: 575 Member
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    Wow! great video! It would be amazing to be able to move like that. I feel like gravity has different rules for me vs that guy. lol
  • Ariadnula
    Ariadnula Posts: 435 Member
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    That's so great! Funny, I was just thinking the other day that what I really need is gymnastics or acrobatics.

    Man, if people look at me funny as an older woman in the gym, just wait till I start jumping over walls :smiley:
  • ninenines
    ninenines Posts: 197 Member
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    I love that you brought up parkour @krokador because I was actually something I had been thinking about when I read this post and I have looked into a bit for myself. I'm yet to incorporate it in any meaningful way beyond crawling around in various ways on occasion.
  • Deena_Bean
    Deena_Bean Posts: 906 Member
    edited February 2016
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    Those guys are pretty amazing - my kids are fascinated by parkour - how hysterical would it be if their mom could do it?! LOL. I'm pretty agile, but nothing like that. I think you're on to something here krok - I need to maybe expand my horizon's some and use the lifting as supplemental. I definitely don't want to stop lifting because it has done things to my body that have been SO amazingly helpful. Some examples 1. I can run faster and with more ease than before..my legs are powerhouses 2. Same applies to my biking - Rob and I love to bike through the more temperate months and I noticed last summer (after I had been lifting for a few months) that the hills that I used to be barely make it up were not hard at all anymore...that totally blew my mind! 3. My shape has changed for the better, fat's melting off slowly and I can feel some pretty badass abs in there (although they haven't poked through, they're definitely in there!).

    So right now I lift Tue/Thur/Sat mornings doing the SL routine and on Wed/Fri (or Mon/Wed) I am on the treadmill. I mix the treadmill up with jogging and walking on an incline. In the vain of what you're saying - do you have any recommendations on switching things around? Maybe one of the SL days could be different types of lifts or body movements? Thoughts??

    And that's awesome that you want to compete!! I watch your videos on instagram and I'm all :o -- how she do dat?! ---
  • DawnEmbers
    DawnEmbers Posts: 2,451 Member
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    I've been meaning to chime in for a while, but had some long work days and such.

    While it's fun at times to be lifting near max weight on a regular basis, I do think there is a lot to be said about branching out and taking steps back sometimes. It's okay to have different goals, to not always be about lift the most weight possible.

    Even doing PHUL was a challenge because the power days, while fun, were always so close to my one rep max and after a while that changes at a much slower pace. Doing this cycle with peaking at the meet in focus, has been a nice little break. I can see why some lifters and routines go through different cycles instead of just doing the same sets and reps indefinitely.

    Just got to do what you will enjoy and focus on your own goals, whether it be lift heavy stuff or do any other realm of program and option available. I wouldn't mind even trying crossfit some time out of curiosity, if the class would ever fit (here the introduction class is required) in my schedule and budget.
  • Deena_Bean
    Deena_Bean Posts: 906 Member
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    I'm a very schedule-oriented person, so I have a fear (from past experience) that if I do not have a plan I will just do nothing. It's stupid of me, but it's just some hard-wire programming I haven't been able to overcome. So doing a program like SL where everything is simply laid out for me is the kind of regimen I respond best to (in terms of staying on task). With my running my goal is always in my head that I'm improving speed for my next 5K. I'll have to think about this, I guess. Make a plan of action :)