Kidney pain

I'm only at the end of day four and for the past two days I have been having fleeting kidney pain. Nothing horrible, but enough to be concerning. I can't even remember the last time I had a kidney infection, it's been years, and I drink zero caffeine, the only thing I can think of that may cause it is the keto. I usually drink at least 64oz of water a day, does keto diet require more?

Replies

  • MyriiStorm
    MyriiStorm Posts: 609 Member
    I'm not a medical professional, but my first thought was what is your protein intake? And do you have any kind of impaired kidney function? Are you a diabetic? Kidney function can be affected by diabetes, and if that is the case, it is usually recommended to lower you protein intake.

    As for the water intake, you may need more on keto, especially in the beginning. Carbs help us retain water, so when you reduce your carbs you tend to lose a lot of water weight (and electrolytes). There is a lot of good info in the Launch Pad about it.

    I hope you get it figured out soon!
  • grafixfrh
    grafixfrh Posts: 46 Member
    Yes you need more on Keto and also need sodium and lack of both will cause kidney pain kind of fleeting in the lower back to side. As Storm mentioned if have kidney issues may want to get checked medically before going deep into Ketosis as the diet will put a strain on them and your liver especially in the beginning as the body adjusts. You will also want to stock up on magnesium and potassium as they will be needed with this lifestyle as well. I always tell people especially just starting Keto to at least shoot for 128 oz or 1 gallon of water a day and if above 225 may want to be closer to 180 oz. This amount of water flushes kidneys and also the excess fat and gunk that Keto liberates from your body and cells.
  • Sunny_Bunny_
    Sunny_Bunny_ Posts: 7,141 Member
    I sort of disagree with the water recommendations. It wasn't long ago that someone developed kidney pain because they were drinking too much water because of the idea that it was so good to do. Not really. Drinking beyond your thirst needs is uneccessary. If you're going to the bathroom every 2 to 3 hours or less then you're either drinking too much water or you aren't getting enough sodium. Or both!
    Have you noticed any difference in frequency of urination?
    It's true that you lose a lot of water when you initially go keto but much of that is from using up stored glycogen and doesn't need to be replaced. The problem is that the water takes sodium with it and once you're producing ketones you will be losing a bit more water and sodium with that, and by day 4 of following at low enough carbs, you'll be making plenty of ketones. So, there is some increased need for fluids but it's not enormous. If sodium is replaced you'll be able to retain water better, which you don't do much of without inflammatory carbs in your diet. You need to be able to retain the fluids you take in. You need sodium to do that. Once sodium gets low enough, you'll start to lose magnesium in an effort to preserve sodium, then potassium will follow as magnesium gets depleted. If you keep sodium up and drink to thirst, you don't have to worry about potassium and a magnesium supplement will quickly get that up to a good level.
  • rntcooper
    rntcooper Posts: 3 Member
    I usually consume more than the recommended amount of sodium so hopefully that's not it. I could be consuming too much protein though? I am getting 90+ grams a day which is over my keto calculator recommended amount of 70g.
  • emaline2210
    emaline2210 Posts: 57 Member
    I sort of disagree with the water recommendations. It wasn't long ago that someone developed kidney pain because they were drinking too much water because of the idea that it was so good to do. Not really. Drinking beyond your thirst needs is uneccessary. If you're going to the bathroom every 2 to 3 hours or less then you're either drinking too much water or you aren't getting enough sodium. Or both!
    Have you noticed any difference in frequency of urination?
    It's true that you lose a lot of water when you initially go keto but much of that is from using up stored glycogen and doesn't need to be replaced. The problem is that the water takes sodium with it and once you're producing ketones you will be losing a bit more water and sodium with that, and by day 4 of following at low enough carbs, you'll be making plenty of ketones. So, there is some increased need for fluids but it's not enormous. If sodium is replaced you'll be able to retain water better, which you don't do much of without inflammatory carbs in your diet. You need to be able to retain the fluids you take in. You need sodium to do that. Once sodium gets low enough, you'll start to lose magnesium in an effort to preserve sodium, then potassium will follow as magnesium gets depleted. If you keep sodium up and drink to thirst, you don't have to worry about potassium and a magnesium supplement will quickly get that up to a good level.

    Hmmm. I've always been a water drinker. In highschool, I had to go between every class, and I still go about every hour. I drink at least 128 Oz of water daily, but I also have never been big on other fluids. I find water comforting.

    I don't even know how my body might react to lowering my water intake, but I have noticed that I have to be very cautious of my sodium intake. And I've made the connection that I most likely used to get nightly headaches due to not enough sodium. Very interesting!
  • Sunny_Bunny_
    Sunny_Bunny_ Posts: 7,141 Member
    rntcooper wrote: »
    I usually consume more than the recommended amount of sodium so hopefully that's not it. I could be consuming too much protein though? I am getting 90+ grams a day which is over my keto calculator recommended amount of 70g.

    Going over protein to that degree is. I big deal. That's not the "high protein" that might be causing kidney issues. At least not without PRE existing kidney issues to consider.

    I'm still curious about how often you're urinating. I wonder if you're overworking the kidneys
  • rntcooper
    rntcooper Posts: 3 Member
    I don't think I'm urinating quite as often as before, I haven't kept track though. I don't have a specific kidney disorder, but I did have unexplained chronic kidney infections and stones for several years that randomly vanished. I am barely pre-diabetic ( fasting glucose only 101 ) but I am on a natural metformin replacement.
  • cedarsidefarm
    cedarsidefarm Posts: 163 Member
    Funny you said you have a history of Kidney stones and infections because that was the 1st thing that popped into my head that you needed to look at.

    If I were getting kidney pain, no mater what diet I was on, I would see a doctor immediately. My husband is on dialysis from kidney failure and it started with pain. NO kidney pain is NOT a common side affect of this or any diet. You really need to see a doctor right away.
  • KETOGENICGURL
    KETOGENICGURL Posts: 687 Member
    I agree with cedarsidefarm...kidney issues are silent until they are not. Like HBP it can affect you when least expected.

    Livestrong.com recommends the baseline of 46 gr protein for women..and anyone with kidney issues has a harder time processing the waste products of meat protein. ( also LC appeals to many due too the unlimited meat idea..Americans already coondume much more meat than needed, so you can see where it can affect someone with hidden kidney issues.

    I know because I have just one kidney now, with CKD, not stones, but my LC diet was too high in meat initially and I dropped to a low function stage and scared my kidney doc after 2 months on LCHF..as soon as I ate no meat, more veggies/cheese/eggs/hempseed other protein I raised function.

    Cedar can you tell us ( or me by message) about the need for dialysis and what led to that, how fast did ESRD occur? It is estimated 30 million US Americnas have some range of CKD..and MDs think you can't DO anything, so they don't mention it until you hit stage 4..and it is seriously worrying! I hope he is tolerating his treatments well.
  • MyriiStorm
    MyriiStorm Posts: 609 Member
    @rntcooper , has your issue been resolved? I hope so, and I hope you can share with us what has helped.
  • kmn118
    kmn118 Posts: 313 Member
    At around 2 months in, I experienced what I thought was passing kidney stones. Turns out it was muscle cramps/spasms. My electrolytes were out of whack, so MAGNESIUM is necessary.
  • hookilau
    hookilau Posts: 3,134 Member
    Hope your issue is on it's way to resolved if not already ;)

    I'm interested in this 'natural metformin replacement' you're taking.
    Exactly what is it please?

  • VKetoV
    VKetoV Posts: 111 Member
    hookilau wrote: »
    Hope your issue is on it's way to resolved if not already ;)

    I'm interested in this 'natural metformin replacement' you're taking.
    Exactly what is it please?

    Likely referring to berberine; yes, HbA1C lowering is roughly 0.7-1.2%. Improves insulin sensitivity
  • hookilau
    hookilau Posts: 3,134 Member
    Bah! I don't react well to it.
    Berberine raises my blood pressure :#

    heh, heh ;) grabbed my attention though B)
  • treehugnmama
    treehugnmama Posts: 816 Member
    don't mess with the kidneys with your history if you are experiencing pain I'd go to the doc. I used to get chronic uti and kidney infections but since I nolomger have insulin resistance haven't had any. I'd get checked!.