Warning - Folks with High Blood Pressure, please read

KnitOrMiss

Well, I found out today completely by accident, mind you, that apparently most ACE inhbitors, most beta blockers, and pretty much any basic traditional medication for high blood pressure may cause high blood potassium in those supplementing potassium in any non-food way. So lo-salt, no salt, potassium pills, etc.

High blood potassium can have deadly consequences. Now, I don't have the majority of the warnings on that list, I'm in the process of changing medications (due to extreme sun sensitivity - blistering/allergic reaction after literally only moments in sunlight), and finding all this out AFTER THE FACT has really made me upset.

Also, if you have uncontrolled diabetes, supplementing potassium can be really bad for you, as can taking NSAIDS, and any number of medications. PCOS NOTE: spironolactone (Aldactone) is on the dangerous interactions list.... This is the one you are generally given to help stop hair growth...

Now, don't freak out - because this kind of thing isn't overly common, but the fact that I've been doing Keto for almost two months now, and LCHFMP in the month before that, that this diet was recommended to me medically and that doctor had at least a loose knowledge of my overall medications, and all this - yet I have never once heard to be careful with that supplement - aside from the obvious - "don't use too much, it can be deadly" from some of our more experienced members.

I hate all of the interactions in medications, and this one in particular set me back a few mental paces, so I wanted to pass on the awareness. For the record, the one medication I'm on in particular is Lisinopril - generic for Zestril, I think. So please, make sure your pharmacist knows everything you take, including your dietary habits - by law and trade, pharmacists are required to have a far deeper knowledge of medicine interactions than doctors (for whom medications are only a portion of overall treatment)....

PSA over... Thanks!

saraphim41

Thanks for the warning. And thanks for confirming that pharmacists actually know (or should know) more about medicine vs nutrition than most doctors. (At least my present doctor has not tried to tell me that eating a balanced diet should negate the need for vitamin/mineral supplement.)

spush

Thanks, I was in lisinopril, but stopped due to a cough, so far my lchf diet coupled with a bit of extra walking has brought my bp down naturally. But good to know for future defence.

KnitOrMiss

If my blood pressure issue was caused normally, I would probably feel the same, @spush. However, it is a direct consequence of taking hormonal birth control (which is not an option to stop taking at this point in my life, not without excessive risks for taking it, which are not indicated at this time). I am actually planning to talk to the pharmacist tonight about whether I should go ahead and switch or stay off the other for a week and test my numbers daily to keep an eye on it... It's all about to make me mental!

@saraphim41 I didn't mean that pharmacists should know about nutrition, as that is beyond the field of study for most of them, but yes, even nutritional conflicts/counter indications should be in their studies... I found your other statement odd. It is possible to fulfill your vitamin/mineral needs with the proper diet, but there are a million arguments as to what that "magical" diet is.

I'm of the opinion that over-supplementing is as much of a problem as under-supplementing. I prefer to have regular blood work done and adjust from there, rather than just throw the medicine cabinet at myself. Many folks absorb things differently, so it is good that there are a huge number of options available so that everyone can find the best combination of things that work for them!

glossbones

Thank you for reminding me about the blood pressure effects of birth control. I don't use an awful lot of the NoSalt, but it's enough to make me look into how much I'm getting from my food before I decide to add extra.

Dragonwolf

FYI, Spiro's probably on that list because it's a potassium-sparing diuretic. That means it helps reduce water retention without causing the body to dump potassium with it. Less water = higher concentration of potassium.

I'm pretty sure there's an unspoken "if you're taking medications for any reason, be sure to research the effects of low carb on those medications before diving in," around here.

KnitOrMiss

Dragonwolf wrote: »

FYI, Spiro's probably on that list because it's a potassium-sparing diuretic. That means it helps reduce water retention without causing the body to dump potassium with it. Less water = higher concentration of potassium.

I'm pretty sure there's an unspoken "if you're taking medications for any reason, be sure to research the effects of low carb on those medications before diving in," around here.

I've been so focused on other factors, the fact that my doctors, both of them, sent me on this path, aware of all my medications, as well as the pharmacists made aware, it didn't occur to me to research this yet. I've been focused on the more immediate functions of exhaustion and "food narcolepsy" issues, as well as addressing my PCOS... And then, if I did read the first two pages of anything to hit the highlights, then find the potassium nuggets buried on page 5 that I didn't even know was there, I felt sufficiently blind sided. Add to that I'm on nearly triple the number of medications I was when I weighed around 350 pounds, and sometimes, it is simply more than I can handle to deeply research every single thing. I barely have enough time to sleep as it is... SIGH I chalk it up to being overwhelmed by everything. I felt hit by a mac truck today.

And yes, that is why Spiro is on that list...

Dragonwolf

*hugs* Yeah, I can understand. Your doctors definitely should have at least given you a head's up about the potassium thing if you're on something like Spiro.

KnitOrMiss

Dragonwolf wrote: »

*hugs* Yeah, I can understand. Your doctors definitely should have at least given you a head's up about the potassium thing if you're on something like Spiro.

Thankfully I'm not on it, but I do remember them saying something when I started on it. I was only on it about 6 weeks, and for me it cause major dehydration. I couldn't get enough water... it was the weirdest thing. My doc agreed after the fact that stopping it was a good idea.

I'm just frustrated because they should have said something equally as much on the blood pressure med, and they didn't because everyone was all freaked out over my numbers, so the bad stuff didn't register... sigh

yeswehave8

I'm actually on HCTZ, so I need extra potassium and supplement it to keep cramps at bay. I'm hoping the weight loss will allow me to come off BP meds entirely.

GrannyMayOz

I found out the night before last that it was supplementing potassium that has given me these heart palpitation episodes. The final realisation came because I'd used a little lite salt on Monday's dinner and had palpitations in the night. Then I had slightly more lite salt on Wed and had palpitations bad enough to wake me. I'm a heavy sleeper, it takes a lot to wake me. But that made the penny finally drop as to the cause. The bout of palpitations that took me to the hospital several weeks ago was after taking a combined magnesium/potassium/other stuff supplement so it's not just the lite salt, it's potassium in general. I will never take a single grain of that stuff again!

I don't take medications of any kind at all, not even pain killers. The last OTC or script I took would be at least 20 years ago so there's no interaction to blame.

Now to try and figure out the reason for this slight tightness across my chest that makes it nearly impossible for me to wear even a loose bra for any length of time without feeling crushed. I love LCHF but there have been times during the palpitations, breathlessness (which has finally mostly passed) and chest crushing that have made me wonder if I'm doing the right thing. My energy is no better than it was when I ate everything the supermarket has to offer, but I'm now sane around food, fat is almost literally falling off me, and I am slowly losing weight so I'm still in until there's further proof one way or another.

I do hope you get everything sorted to your satisfaction Carly, I really feel your frustration and fear!

wheatlessgirl66

@Granny I'm so glad you discovered the problem with the potassium! That's a relief. Do you think the chest tightness could be from anxiety? I get that sensation, too, but the cardiologist says it's not from issues with my heart. The simplest kind of life worry/anxiety can do weird things, then if I/you worry about the tightness, it makes it even worse. Just a thought b/c I'm dealing with the same thing. Hope it gets better soon, dear May.

GrannyMayOz

@Wheatless thank you so much. No, the tightness isn't anxiety. I know all about anxiety and suffered really bad panic attacks for 27 years (to the point of vomiting and diarrhoea when they hit), so it's definitely not that. I'm grateful for the suggestion though in case that was the answer. It's weird - usually I can get on a treadmill and jog and sprint without any issues at all. If my heart was in trouble I'd know it. And my heart was checked out in hospital when I had the first really bad palpitation attack. I'm completely fine until I do a bra up, and I was wearing these exact same bras when I was 15 lbs heavier without any problem. It's a real pain.

Sorry Carly, I wasn't meaning to hijack your thread.

Twibbly

GrannyMayOz wrote: »

I'm completely fine until I do a bra up, and I was wearing these exact same bras when I was 15 lbs heavier without any problem. It's a real pain.

I know it's a crazy idea, but what about buying new bras and getting fitted?

GrannyMayOz

Twibbly wrote: »

I know it's a crazy idea, but what about buying new bras and getting fitted?

LOL A fair suggestion, but these all fit me fine when I was 5 kgs (11 lbs) heavier and I have most certainly lost fat around my midriff, so they should be loose if anything. They're not tight at all, it's just that the least resistance around there makes me feel as if I'm being chest-strangled and induces the feeling of tightness. I could believe it's fear/psychologically induced since the palpitations episode. I seem to be OK for the first few hours but then it sets in and gets worse and worse until I free myself. Fortunately I'm not big-busted, and am at home a lot where I can go without restriction. Just seems like an odd situation though. I'll just be patient and see what more fat loss will bring.

cindytw

Well, I guess everyone is different because I have actually had LOW blood potassium on any number of the drugs mentioned here. I have had high blood pressure pretty much my whole life and been on a ton of different things. I also had potassium deficiencies on most of them. So it is not a one size fits all thing. But a caution certainly.

DonPendergraft

Hmmm. Maybe I can quit the Lisinopril after I drop 20lbs. I just bought my first container of Natural Calm yesterday.

KnitOrMiss

Started on the Altenolol. First day, as expected was tired. After that, no problems. It lowered my heart rate as expected that first day, but it seems to be leveling off. Will keep y'all advise.

Bloodwork to come back this week, too.

@GrannyMayOz No worries. I figure anything blood pressure related - even tangentially, is game here. If we're worried, easily can be high, low, side effects, etc.

@cindytw Low blood potassium can be a side effect, too, but is much rarer. I started googling, then confronted my pharmacist! She was very helpful and helped me make the best plan to adjust to my med. Also told me another test to add to be certain I had all my bases covered for any potential changes...

GrannyMayOz

Thank you Carly I hope you get all this worked out soon, and successfully!

Jbarnes1210

@DonPendergraft you can do it!!
I've been on 20mg of lisinopril and 25mg of HCTZ for years, and yesterday my doctor told me she wanted to decrease the lisinopril to 10mg. My blood pressure was 118/80, I go back in 3 months to have my BP rechecked to see if I can possibly be discontinued from my BP meds. I requested to stay on the same dose of HCTZ due to my ankles swelling after standing on my feet 12+ hours.

DonPendergraft

Thank you for the encouragement @Jbarnes1210 I appreciate it!
I stopped my Lisinopril today after 2 full days on the diet. Part of "keto flu" as I understand it is that along with dropping the water weight, you lose sodium, etc and a side effect is low blood pressure. Yesterday it was 110/83. I imagine I will be fine for the first few weeks. At that point, I will need to continue to monitor just to make sure it doesn't start going up without medication. But I'm thinking dropping some lard will help in this area as well. My doctor is all for me getting rid of the drug. I've tried before, but had to get back on it. But I'm thinking doing this keto thing will be the ticket to saying goodbye to it hopefully for good.

wabmester

Great BP, DP. What was it before the diet?

KnitOrMiss

I know y'all were asking for DP, but I thought I'd give my numbers for reference, too.


Before I got on medication, mine was around 165+ / 90+. I had one reading that I don't really count that was 170/110, but it was determined that it was taken incorrectly.

Prior to starting the triggering medication, it was around 110-120 / 70-78. Regularly. Like clockwork. Then I started getting spikes like ^. After reading literature, I decided it was too dangerous not to medicate.

With the lowest dose of Lisinopril (5 mg, I think?), it went down to about 130ish/85ish, or lower, regularly.

So far an on the Altenolol, also lowest dosage, it has been 120/78 or so again, but I don't have much data on this. Will be getting suggestion from doctor Friday, and adjust as I can...

Jbarnes1210

Are you taking Atenolol and lisinopril ? Atenolol is what is called a low pressor, it will help control your bp, along with heart rate, lisinopril (ace inhibitor) works just at controlling bp. A common side effect of lisinopril is dry cough, I never developed that, but those who do are usually switched to a different medication.

KnitOrMiss

Jbarnes1210 wrote: »

Are you taking Atenolol and lisinopril ? Atenolol is what is called a low pressor, it will help control your bp, along with heart rate, lisinopril (ace inhibitor) works just at controlling bp. A common side effect of lisinopril is dry cough, I never developed that, but those who do are usually switched to a different medication.

I was taking Lisinopril, and stopped last Friday. I had extreme sun sensitivity develop as a result (blistering in 2-3 minutes outside with an allergic rash or full on burn). This one is an ACE. Never got the cough.

I started Atenolol on Saturday. It's a beta blocker. Supposedly different side effects. I know this one works by slowing heart rate (which it did the first day, but came back up to the level on Lisinopril on Sunday and thereafter) as opposed to loosening the artery walls as Lisinopril does...

DonPendergraft

wabmester wrote: »

Great BP, DP. What was it before the diet?

It's perfectly under control and usually about 130/88. But the systolic likes to shoot up to the 150's without meds. But I was heavier. I'm less heavy (and shrinking by the day) and my carbs are very low so I'm hopeful that will be enough.

Jbarnes1210

My bottle does have a warning about sun sensitivity, I never experienced that side effect either, I guess we're all just different. Hopefully atenolol will work better for you.

KnitOrMiss

Jbarnes1210 wrote: »

My bottle does have a warning about sun sensitivity, I never experienced that side effect either, I guess we're all just different. Hopefully atenolol will work better for you.

Apparently it is not the most common problem, but admittedly, I'm of European ancestry and don't ever tan. I am either pale white or lobster red and have very sensitive skin, so there was likely an underlying sensitivity. but literally in minutes I would geta painful itchy sun rash. it was insane!

wheatlessgirl66

I find it odd that my blood pressure seems to have risen since being keto. Also, I had an incident of elevated pulse. I woke from a nap and boom---128! My face, neck and chest felt like they were going to explode. Very scary. I did relaxing things, drank water and it went down after a few minutes. The cardiologist didn't know what caused it. He said if it happens again I should take an extra hbp pill even if I've just had one. Good to know. I see a heart rhythm specialist today. Have any of you had this happen?

Edited to say the cardiologist also told me to call 911 or get myself to the ER to be checked out. I had a calcium score test done two years ago and my score was 0. My arteries aren't clogged.

GrannyMayOz

wheatlessgirl66 wrote: »

I find it odd that my blood pressure seems to have risen since being keto. Also, I had an incident of elevated pulse. I woke from a nap and boom---128! My face, neck and chest felt like they were going to explode. Very scary. I did relaxing things, drank water and it went down after a few minutes. The cardiologist didn't know what caused it. He said if it happens again I should take an extra hbp pill even if I've just had one. Good to know. I see a heart rhythm specialist today. Have any of you had this happen?

Edited to say the cardiologist also told me to call 911 or get myself to the ER to be checked out. I had a calcium score test done two years ago and my score was 0. My arteries aren't clogged.

Some of that is sounding similar to me Wheatless. Have you had your immune system checked? Is it even possible *to* have it checked? My naturopath looks in my eyes to do his diagnosis, it's like 'inspired iridology' I suppose, so I don't know what mainstream medicine offers. Is it an endocrinologist? I'm glad, and relieved that you sought help and now know what to do if it happens again. Let's hope it doesn't!

KnitOrMiss

Interesting side note, the Altenolol (beta blocker) seems to be having better effects on my blood pressure (bringing into my previous levels of normal rather than mid-normal). Will see what doc says Friday.