Keto: Fringe or Mainstream?
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wabmester
Posts: 2,748 Member
I was telling a friend how I went back to a LC diet after trying it 10 years ago, and how this time everyone on the interwebz doing LC is now a biohacker during a ketogenic version of it.
She said "Biohacker? Like Dave Asprey? I love his bulletproof coffee! And, yeah, everybody is into ketones now."
Ooookay. So I guess it's just me who's old-fashioned.
So a poll of sorts: do you consider keto fringe or mainstream?
And how about LC in general? I'm starting to see posts entitled "The Wall is Coming Down!" making the analogy that the old low-fat dietary guidelines are crumbling like the Berlin wall, and low-carb is driving a revolution.
Do you think the low-fat wall is coming down soon? Already down?
She said "Biohacker? Like Dave Asprey? I love his bulletproof coffee! And, yeah, everybody is into ketones now."
Ooookay. So I guess it's just me who's old-fashioned.
So a poll of sorts: do you consider keto fringe or mainstream?
And how about LC in general? I'm starting to see posts entitled "The Wall is Coming Down!" making the analogy that the old low-fat dietary guidelines are crumbling like the Berlin wall, and low-carb is driving a revolution.
Do you think the low-fat wall is coming down soon? Already down?
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Yes, it will be fully down in five - ten years. Bariatric surgery will be bankrupt. Carb industry will fight back and put out studies that Keto is bad for you. But the internet and fantastic results of the diet will prevail.
Ya know how people make fun of "Big Tobacco" "Big Pharma" "Big Oil", what do you think about:
"Big Carb"
"Carbage Industry"
Dan the Man from Michigan
It's Ketogenic or Bariatric! How I Found the Ketogenic Diet
Blog #10 Keto: Abbreviations, Acronyms & Terminology Used on the LCD & Keto Discussion Groups
Blog #13 DittoDan's Milestone's, First's And Good Changes Since Starting the Ketogenic Diet
DittoDan's Keto Blogs
How I got Off of Diabetic Prescriptions Drugs Since I Started Keto
Blog #11 Really Good Keto Websites
Low Carb Discussion Group on MFP (LCD)
Ketogenic Diet Discussion Group on MFP0 -
It is kind of new to me.
I'm a lower carb guy. 60ish has been my magic number for a while.
But I am interested in learning more on keto and what happens that makes it work.
I know my body does not like sugar.
Lots of reading to do!0 -
There's some backsliding on the official stance on fats but plenty of resistance. I see acceptance of olive oil but reluctance to embrace bacon and egg for breakfast.
In addition to vested industry and professional interests the opposition includes veg*ans, animal rights and environmental activists who see keto as heavy on the meat.0 -
Q. So a poll of sorts: do you consider keto fringe or mainstream?
A. Fringe, but I enjoy that. I enjoyed it when I was a poor excuse for a raw vegan too.
Q. And how about LC in general? I'm starting to see posts entitled "The Wall is Coming Down!" making the analogy that the old low-fat dietary guidelines are crumbling like the Berlin wall, and low-carb is driving a revolution.
A. Still fringe. It's starting to be heard about, from surprising sources in my life; people I never would have expected to listen to anything other than solid mainstream. So far, nobody has tried to tell me I'm endangering myself. Though I've avoided telling the pushiest folks in my life. I would agree with the Berlin wall analogy, and I feel as if it's beginning slowly but will gain force and effectiveness.
Q. Do you think the low-fat wall is coming down soon? Already down?
A. Definitely not down yet. The people who agree with high fat would be what, 5% to 10% of the population at the absolute most? And about 2% of the medical professionals. I could be wrong but, once trained, I think medical professionals are like old dogs who can't learn new tricks. Especially not if they come from 'alternate' sources.0 -
I think it's just something you gravitate towards once you discover low carb. It's not for everyone and I only dabble in it but there's something in it - I just know that after 15+ years of CICO didn't work and made me miserable and fat.
It's not that fringe any more. Everyone has heard of low carb and no-one raises an eyebrow in restaurants when you tell them to hold the fries or you want the burger with no bun. It's here to stay. Even if most people aren't into the science and the biohacking.
As for doctors, well mine told me I'd be best off looking into a low fat diet this week. I nearly laughed. Yeah, loads of 'whole grain carbs' and a little lean chicken? Road to miserytown!0 -
Maybe getting towards mainstream in the nordic countries (I have family in Norway and they tell me it's widely accepted there) but definitely fringe elsewhere I've been.
Yes, restaurants will accept our requests but they're used to plenty of nutjobs, it doesn't mean they don't comment we're crazy later. And (most) doctors will not move from what's safe to recommend (what they were taught) until they get official guidelines saying so.
Fortunately the amazing power of the internet will force changes much sooner than it would otherwise be the case. But mainstream? Only after the FDA changes their official guidelines. They will be forced to do it but it will be one tiny step at a time. And the rest of the world will follow, as they've been doing with the sad SAD.
Things look differently to us but we here, taking responsibility for our own health, many times going against the recommendation of doctors, we are a rare breed, most people would not dream of doing the same. At least not until they see a friend doing it.0 -
Still fringe, for now, but will be mainstream soon. I look at our Group numbers here. When I joined the group, in February this year, there were 11,000, or so, members and now it's over 16,000! That tells me that times are changing! My parents, a sister, and a niece have jumped on just this weekend after watching me these last few months! So yea, people are watching and ultimately they want some of what you are having!
I've been to two doctors, primary care physician and neurologist, this past week and neither one poo pooed my woe, at all! So, I don't feel it will be very long before it becomes mainstream. If the doctors in super small town Mississippi are getting on board, then the rest of the country is there too.0 -
There's some backsliding on the official stance on fats but plenty of resistance. I see acceptance of olive oil but reluctance to embrace bacon and egg for breakfast.
Eggs seem to be back on the "OK" list as the mainstream orgs have given up on the premise that eating cholesterol is bad for you.
Here's an example of a "the Wall is coming down" blog post:
http://drmalcolmkendrick.org/2015/05/20/sorry-seems-to-be-the-hardest-word/- Cholesterol is to be dropped from the ‘nutrients of concern’ list. [I love that phrase ‘nutrient of concern’].
- Saturated fat will be… ‘de-emphasized’ from nutrients of concern, given the lack of evidence connecting it with cardiovascular disease.’ [Whatever de-emphasizing may be. Pretending you never said it in the first place, I suppose].
- There is concern over blanket sodium restriction given the… ‘growing body of research suggesting that the low sodium intake levels recommended by the DGAC (Dietary Guidelines Advisory Committee) are actually associated with increased mortality for healthy individuals.’
- And…’ The identification and recognition of the specific health risks posed by added sugars represents an important step forward for public health.’
I'm also hearing reports of doctors recommending low-carb diets to their patients.
Personally, I think we're on the cusp of a revolution. Previously, low-carb dieters represented about 6% of the dieting public (according to one report I read). It's probably still smallish, but seems to be gaining momentum.
I kinda like the fringe aspect of it, though. It'll seem strange to me once it's more widely accepted. No more "fight the power!" after that.0 - Cholesterol is to be dropped from the ‘nutrients of concern’ list. [I love that phrase ‘nutrient of concern’].
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The study looked at diets for weight loss. Most vegetarians do it for other reasons.0
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I think it's still fringe, but gaining momentum. I admit that I was afraid of the negative comments from others when I first turned Primal 5 years ago, but throughout the years I came to enjoy being a food rebel, especially now that I am keto.
It is interesting to me that although we see more evidence of an increasing level of acceptance of this woe in the media, especially online....not many people I know in my personal life have any knowledge of a keto diet, and I work in the health care sector. Medical professionals know of it, but seem to want to cling to conventional dietary recommendations.
Some of the people who know me ask what I am doing to lose weight, because they see that I am shrinking in size before their eyes, and I tell them honestly how I eat. Only a small fraction of these people appear willing to really listen to me tell them that sugar is bad and that fat helps the body lose weight. However, as soon as I mention the amount of fat I eat, these people lose interest in what I am telling them, stating that this diet not good for me. It is a start I suppose, but if my experience with the people I know is any indication, then probably less than 5% of the population I know have any knowledge of keto. I think it will take much more exposure of this topic in the media etc before people will actually start to pay attention.0 -
I was at hubby's shop the other day, & somehow conversation turned to carbs in foods. I said I was eating <20g/day & one guy said "oh you're doing keto". I thought "wow" he actually knew about it. Still definitely fringe here (population 500 on good day), but thought this was proof it's getting out there.0
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I had one staff member out of probably more than 300 people where I work ask me the other day, "so your body is pretty much in ketosis all the time?", but he is an exception in my experience. It's unfortunate that he is with the CICO crowd, but at least he is aware of the process with keto, and he's also very smart. It's a start.0
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The study looked at diets for weight loss. Most vegetarians do it for other reasons.
I recall someone saying more people were on Atkins than were vegetarian in the US some years ago. UK stats - "2% of both adults and children reported that they were vegetarian. Less than 1% reported following a vegan diet".0 -
I'm going to be having an involved procedure and overnight stay at the hospital this week and I'm a little more than hesitant about telling my cardiologist what my diet is. If my cholesterol has raised, I know I'll have the statin fight again. And what in the world will I eat from the hospital cardiac menu? Yikes. I'm hoping I can fake it and keep my dietary info to myself.
Which means that people in my world are still of the low-fat-healthy-grains variety. My sister thinks I'm about killing myself not eating carbs. And so much fat!! I don't mention it anymore. I haven't lost enough weight for anyone to notice, so they're not asking questions.0 -
Bring a stash of keto foods and put them in your locker! Brief relatives to bring them when they visit too!0
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That's a great idea SlimBride ! Or Wheatless, you could pack some emergency rations to help you through. Or eat well prior to your procedure and choose to fast afterwards.....or both. They may not even use real butter at the hospital. In that case, I'd probably skip eating or just eat the foods that fit with your plan.0
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Ellen....I was just thinking to suggest taking some things in with you!
I wish people would trash the Statin brigade too. Every few days I read in the UK paper that statins do this or statins reduce that when in reality they are killers!!!
I have a Dr friend who tried Atkins tears ago and after 2 weeks had her cholesterol checked and it had gone up so she stopped and has rubbished it to everyone since and won't believe any data I show her!! The older Dr's are going to be a hard nut to crack!
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jumanajane wrote: »I wish people would trash the Statin brigade too.
I thought at first it said the Stalin brigade, and I was wondering what communism had to do with anything. Lol
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Change is happening. It's slow, but steady. This is actually a huge step: https://www.eatrightpro.org/resource/advocacy/take-action/regulatory-comments/dgac-scientific-report
What a lot of people don't seem to realize is that the anti-LC sentiment is a new creation on its own. This isn't a case of new science trying to override how it just always was. There's a specific time frame of about 15-30 years where doctors, dietitians, and other medical related professions were grossly misinformed while being trained. Everyone before them knew better. Everyone after them is starting to learn better. It's basically a "lost generation" that's screwing things up by killing one patient at a time with bad information.0
