Question about making your meals Ketogenic

me_ona_diet

If I'm eating something that is not super ketogenic - let's say some strawberries and whipping cream, which only rates about 1.22 on my ketogenic ratio calculator - can I just do something like add a tablespoon of coconut oil to the the cream to increase the grams of fat in the meal - now making it a 2.36 on the ketogenic ratio calculator - is that how it works?

totaloblivia

I don't think so... ketosis runs on limiting absolute amount of carbs. I learned this on this board! So if you go over your carb limit, you can't correct it by eating more fat. You do need fat however to feel full!

me_ona_diet

I don't mean going over your carb limit, I just mean making the whole meal itself more ketogenic. I would still be staying under my daily carb allowance.

wabmester

Yeah, the more dietary fat, the more ketogenic, but why would you want to do that? It's a concept borrowed from treating epilepsy, and they don't want to lose weight. The more fat you eat, the more ketones you make. But the more fat you eat, the less your adipose tissue needs to supply. For weight loss, wouldn't you want to maximize adipose lipolysis? You do that by reducing insulin (carbs), reducing ketones made from dietary-fat, and, of course, reducing calories.

totaloblivia

I agree with Wab, but don't try and do low carb and low fat as it's not sustainable... the quickest diet is not eating anything but you already know that's not a good idea! Fasting can be helpful for some though, but I like to eat!

me_ona_diet

I am confused. How do you reduce dietary fat on a low carb, high fat diet?

DittoDan

me_ona_diet wrote: »

If I'm eating something that is not super Ketogenic - let's say some strawberries and whipping cream, which only rates about 1.22 on my Ketogenic ratio calculator - can I just do something like add a tablespoon of coconut oil to the cream to increase the grams of fat in the meal - now making it a 2.36 on the Ketogenic ratio calculator - is that how it works?

I have been Keto for 8+ months, studied it and read many books/websites on the subject and I don't relate to your question. Forget using keto ratio calculators. It isn't that scientific.

Here is the short version of how you do the diet:

1) Religiously log your food as best you can with the MFP app/website
2) Learn (Google) what foods are lo-carb. There are many lists.
3) Learn how to read labels and serving sizes on all packaged products.
4) If you have a choice on the way to log ~ always use the info from the barcodes. Much more reliably accurate.
5) Limit your grams of carbs to absolutely no more than 50, preferable less than 40 grams a day.
6) Eat fatty meats, butters, certain oils, and your protein will probably play out fine.
7) Never eat "skinless" or Lo-fat, or fat free anything.
8) Never trim fat off anything, eat it with your meat. The more fat you eat, the less hungry you'll be.

Using MFP App to help you choose what to eat:

1) Set your macros in MFP to: 5% carb, 20% Protein, 75% fat (please note that 40 grams carbs will make Carbs about 10% of total. BUT, shoot for a lower amount.)
2) Whether you eat two or three meals a day, eat you first meals normally. Pick what you want. Remember to not to too many carbs, tend to eat 0-10 max per meal.
3) Open your MFP app and look at the "Nutrition" pie chart of your macros for your first meals. Look at this:



Notice that my carbs are too much and my protein is a little short. So for dinner, I would stay away from carbs, and pick a meat that isn't so fatty like ham or turkey or other meat. NO need to calculate anything, it isn't that critical. What's critical, is not eating too much carbs. 40g MAX. Protein is a goal, some days you'll be under, some days you'll be over. Fat is what you have to eat a lot of so you don't feel hungry all the time. If you eat less than the 70%, but you aren't hungry, don't eat more fat to "make the ratio right".

Of course, you would monitor the caloric intake, but the above is the most important. Calories are easy to track, just divide your daily goal and divide by the amount of meals you eat and try to stay under that.

I hope this helps,

Dan the Man from Michigan
It's Ketogenic or Bariatric! How I Found the Ketogenic Diet
Blog #10 Keto: Abbreviations, Acronyms & Terminology Used on the LCD & Keto Discussion Groups
Blog #13 DittoDan's Milestone's, First's And Good Changes Since Starting the Ketogenic Diet
DittoDan's Keto Blogs
How I got Off of Diabetic Prescriptions Drugs Since I Started Keto
Blog #11 Really Good Keto Websites
Low Carb Discussion Group on MFP (LCD)
Ketogenic Diet Discussion Group on MFP

yarwell

me_ona_diet wrote: »

If I'm eating something that is not super ketogenic - let's say some strawberries and whipping cream, which only rates about 1.22 on my ketogenic ratio calculator - can I just do something like add a tablespoon of coconut oil to the the cream to increase the grams of fat in the meal - now making it a 2.36 on the ketogenic ratio calculator - is that how it works?

yes, that's how the ratio approach works

KnitOrMiss

I think she is merely trying to optimize her ratios on a meal by meal basis to maintain the highest levels of ketosis and therefore increasing her fat burn. I don't think this would increase her calories overall, as another meal would likely balance it out.

Personally, @me_ona_diet I don't think it is overly necessary to have that balance at every meal. I find that for me, the big picture is much more important than each tiny detail, because let's face it, maintaining that ratio anytime something crosses your lips is going to get exhausting and annoying quickly! I find that in any given week, some days I eat more, some days I eat less, and the weekly caloric deficit balances out. As long as your overall carbs are in balance, I don't think I'd worry about making each meal more closely resemble "optimal" because your body will burn the carbs first. By having cream with the berries, you're already pairing the carbs with a fat to help your body learn more efficient processing...

me_ona_diet

Thanks yarwell and KnitOrMiss. That's basically what I'm talking about.

GaleHawkins

Basically no carbs, limited protein and a ton of fat is how I remember and trust no ones numbers of carbs in any food.

I do use a ton of coconut oil because the 62% MCT oil making up coconut oil gets converted into ketones by the body even if you eat 200 grams of carbs as I understand. You can buy ketones and have your brain on ketones like the Navy does some of its divers using the rebreath systems that is on 100% oxygen. Ketones protect the brain from neurological damage it seems.

Ketosis is not required to fuel the brain with ketones. Alzheimer's patients do not have to get into ketosis but they will need like a tablespoon of coconut oil every 3-4 hours I think to keep them flowing in the blood stream so the brain is getting them.

bengreenfieldfitness.com/2013/10/deep-dive-ketosis-navy-seals-extreme-athletes-busy-executives-can-enhance-physical-mental-performance-secret-weapon-ketone-fuel/

This is some cool uses of oral supplement taken ketones.

KnitOrMiss

There was also advice a while back for how to search on the USDA listings specifically. It was from @Dragonwolf. If she doesn't chime in here with it, I'll look it up for you later.