Dr. Tim Noakes facing censure for recommending LCHF
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camtosh
Posts: 898 Member
The hearing has begun: http://www.biznews.com/health/2015/11/24/tim-noakes-why-ive-been-waiting-for-this-trial-for-years-banting-lchf/
Cape Town University emeritus professor Tim Noakes has explained at a media conference why he welcomes the ‘nutrition trial of the century’. and in fact has been waiting for years to present the science on an international platform. So far, the hearing against him by the Health Professions Council of South Africa (HPCSA) on behalf of dietitian Claire Strydom, former president of the Association for Dietetics in SA (ADSA) has gone well in his favour.
Cape Town University emeritus professor Tim Noakes has explained at a media conference why he welcomes the ‘nutrition trial of the century’. and in fact has been waiting for years to present the science on an international platform. So far, the hearing against him by the Health Professions Council of South Africa (HPCSA) on behalf of dietitian Claire Strydom, former president of the Association for Dietetics in SA (ADSA) has gone well in his favour.
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I have been watching this story with interest as I am following his "banting" WOE. I hope that it starts to get people to really take a look at the diet advice they have been handing out in recent years. I was a sceptic when I began this WOE convinced it would be another waste of my time but 27.5kgs down in 11 months and a "normal" bmi for the first time since my college days I am now firmly in his corner.0
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Great to hear the science come out. Hopefully the legal teams wont be able to twist words, so we get the "facts" on the table. Thanks for sharing.0
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Sure, let them keep making "noise" against LCHF! Will only put it in front of more people. Thanks for posting!0
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It's hard not to love that guy. Always smiling in the face of the onslaught.
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Ooh, interesting! I'll definitely be keeping an eye on how this goes.0
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He's in trouble for recommending it for infants. I'd be interested in seeing what degree of LCHF he's recommended for infants, since there is evidence that ketogenic diets can inhibit growth in juveniles, and what evidence he's based his recommendation upon.
Aside from that, of course carb restriction is helpful for diabetes! I thought that was standard advice these days.0 -
lithezebra wrote: »He's in trouble for recommending it for infants. I'd be interested in seeing what degree of LCHF he's recommended for infants, since there is evidence that ketogenic diets can inhibit growth in juveniles, and what the evidence is.
Aside from that, of course carb restriction is helpful for diabetes! I thought that was standard advice these days.
This is what i understood: that he was recommending it for infants.0 -
From the article...Earlier this year Noakes, in a message posted on Twitter, advised a mother to wean her child on low carbohydrate, high fat foods – commonly abbreviated as LCHF.
The Tweet read, “Baby doesn’t eat the dairy and cauliflower. Just very healthy high fat breast milk. Key is to wean [sic] baby onto LCHF.”
According to the HPCSA, he acted in a manner not in accordance with the norms and standards of the profession, by providing “unconventional advice on breast feeding babies”.0 -
bluefish86 wrote: »From the article...Earlier this year Noakes, in a message posted on Twitter, advised a mother to wean her child on low carbohydrate, high fat foods – commonly abbreviated as LCHF.
The Tweet read, “Baby doesn’t eat the dairy and cauliflower. Just very healthy high fat breast milk. Key is to wean [sic] baby onto LCHF.”
According to the HPCSA, he acted in a manner not in accordance with the norms and standards of the profession, by providing “unconventional advice on breast feeding babies”.
I'm curious as to why he thinks that going off breast milk, which is about 40% carbohydrate (by calories), and onto LCHF, is appropriate, unless he meant a moderate LCHF.
There are kids who need to be on ketogenic diets, for seizure disorders that can't be treated with meds, and a lot of kids who would benefit from lower carb diets than they're eating. I'd be extremely wary of putting a child on the diet that I'm eating.0 -
All kids need to be weaned onto solid food eventually. I think what he is suggesting is to wean them onto a LCHF diet instead of the SAD woe.
At least that was my interpretation.0 -
Kids need to synthesize a lot of proteins for growth, and that requires a lot of ATP as well as amino acids. I'd want to see multiple sources of evidence showing that all growing tissues in the body can readily utilize ketones as a source of energy for the rapid rates of protein synthesis that normal growth entails. Kids shouldn't be the subject of experimentation. I could see weaning children onto no more than 40% carbs, which is neither LCHF nor SAD.0
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I really really wish I had weaned my kids onto meats and then veggies rather than that rice cereal and mashed fruits. What was I thinking? Let's start them on sugars instead of real foods first? Ugh.
If I could turn back time my kids would have been raised on extremely limited grains and no added sugars. They would have been low to moderate carb. Now? Changing diets is a lonnnng, slow process.0 -
I really really wish I had weaned my kids onto meats and then veggies rather than that rice dereal and mashed fruits. What was I thinking? Let's start them on sugars instead of real foods first? Ugh.
If I could turn back time my kids would have been raised on extremely limited grains and no added sugars. They would have been low to moderate carb. Now? Changing diets is a lonnnng, slow process.
Limited grains and no added sugar, with plenty of food, seems like a very sensible diet for children.0 -
lithezebra wrote: »I really really wish I had weaned my kids onto meats and then veggies rather than that rice dereal and mashed fruits. What was I thinking? Let's start them on sugars instead of real foods first? Ugh.
If I could turn back time my kids would have been raised on extremely limited grains and no added sugars. They would have been low to moderate carb. Now? Changing diets is a lonnnng, slow process.
Limited grains and no added sugar, with plenty of food, seems like a very sensible diet for children.
Yeah... I don't think I would have the kids eat keto. I don't know enough to trust their development to it.
I know a ketogenic diet, and IF, lowers growth hormone and IGF-1 which is not what I would want for my boys. I end to have too high of levels of IGF-1 though so it suits me (but I'm 30 years older). That could be over simplifying things, but a paleo like diet seems to make sense for developing kids... 40 years from now I'm sure my kids will look back on our dietary choices and think, "Mom, what were you thinking?" LOL0 -
I know a ketogenic diet, and IF, lowers growth hormone
Fasting increases growth hormone, not lowers it:
https://intensivedietarymanagement.com/fasting-and-growth-hormone-physiology-part-3/
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I know a ketogenic diet, and IF, lowers growth hormone
Fasting increases growth hormone, not lowers it:
https://intensivedietarymanagement.com/fasting-and-growth-hormone-physiology-part-3/
Fasting isn't recommended for children. Besides the fact that kids are growing, they're a lot more prone to dehydration than adults, and they may not say anything, or even be able to say anything, if they have a problem.0 -
lithezebra wrote: »bluefish86 wrote: »From the article...Earlier this year Noakes, in a message posted on Twitter, advised a mother to wean her child on low carbohydrate, high fat foods – commonly abbreviated as LCHF.
The Tweet read, “Baby doesn’t eat the dairy and cauliflower. Just very healthy high fat breast milk. Key is to wean [sic] baby onto LCHF.”
According to the HPCSA, he acted in a manner not in accordance with the norms and standards of the profession, by providing “unconventional advice on breast feeding babies”.
I'm curious as to why he thinks that going off breast milk, which is about 40% carbohydrate (by calories), and onto LCHF, is appropriate, unless he meant a moderate LCHF.
There are kids who need to be on ketogenic diets, for seizure disorders that can't be treated with meds, and a lot of kids who would benefit from lower carb diets than they're eating. I'd be extremely wary of putting a child on the diet that I'm eating.
According to http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3586783/, it's 1.2g protein (4.8 calories), 3.6g fat (32.4 calories), and 7.4g lactose (29.6 calories) per deciliter. That comes out to a roughly 20/40/40 split, so still fairly high fat, though not technically "low" carb.
However, observational evidence suggests that kids don't need much, if any carbs, as long as they have enough energy from fat and food overall. And keto isn't a requirement of LCHF, either, remember. There might not be giant, double-blind studies on the matter, but I wouldn't consider his advice "experimenting," either.lithezebra wrote: »He's in trouble for recommending it for infants. I'd be interested in seeing what degree of LCHF he's recommended for infants, since there is evidence that ketogenic diets can inhibit growth in juveniles, and what evidence he's based his recommendation upon.
Eh...kind of. Aside from the fact that he's not recommending a ketogenic diet, but rather a more conventional LCHF diet, the type of ketogenic diet shown to have such side effects in kids in studies is the clinical ketogenic diet, which was very often calorie, protein, and fluid restricted, not to mention often consisting of what essentially amounts to little more than artificially fortified soybean oil.I really really wish I had weaned my kids onto meats and then veggies rather than that rice cereal and mashed fruits. What was I thinking? Let's start them on sugars instead of real foods first? Ugh.
If I could turn back time my kids would have been raised on extremely limited grains and no added sugars. They would have been low to moderate carb. Now? Changing diets is a lonnnng, slow process.
I know, right?! They've finally changed the recommendation away from cereals as the first foods, but I've been kicking myself for years now and wishing I knew then what I know now. I was fortunate that my son never really took to the cereals, so I had to go the pureed fruits and veggies route, but I wish I'd introduced meat so much sooner! Now, I'm struggling with getting him to eat meat and keeping him from eating nothing but starches (thankfully, he's not a big sweets fan usually, and would just as soon go for bell peppers or strawberries as candy, but those starches, man...).0 -
@Dragonwolf: since Noakes' tweet read “Baby doesn’t eat the dairy and cauliflower. Just very healthy high fat breast milk. Key is to wean [sic] baby onto LCHF,” it isn't clear what he meant by LCHF. If he was advising against cauliflower, the advice seems excessive.0
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Not sure if it was on MFP or not but I read an article by a woman who when LCHF several years ago and had a set of twins. She breast fed and then weaned them to LCHF. She when 7 years before going in for new blood work and her lipid panels were awesome across the board and the kids age 3-4? appeared to be in great health per photos.
Most kids are put on a diet that is the road to diabetes. I say this both times that I ate at McDonald's yesterday.
The trial will be good for the cause of health.0 -
But if he had suggested weaning the kids onto Frosted Flakes it would be fine- it provides your calcium needs when served with a cup of milk0
