Training advice

ka97

Full disclosure.....I am also posting this question in the long distance runner's forum as I really would like some advice from both perspectives.

I would consider myself primarily a runner, but a runner who really enjoys lifting. I typically run 20-30 miles a week, depending on time of year and weather. I had been doing upper/lower body part splits for my lifting, and that seemed to work well in terms of scheduling everything. Recently however I seemed to stop progressing. A trainer at one of my gyms suggested I switch to whole body lifting sessions. It seemed like a good idea to change things up, so I did that around the second half of December. During January and February my weekly running mileage was in the 25-30 miles per week range. I did notice right away that I felt like I was constantly running on tired legs, but I figured I could work through it. I was trying for 3 days per week of lifting, but it was tough and some weeks I could only get in two days. By about mid February, I was having more and more "bad" workouts, I was constantly tired (but not sleeping well), I was increasingly dreading both running and lifting, and just overall felt tired, sore, and sluggish. There were some good days, but they were fewer and farther between. I did an extended taper for my half marathon, which was last weekend, and then took most of this past week completely off.

So here are my questions....
1. Could the change in lifting have been the reason for hitting such a rough patch in February?
2. After coming of a rest/recovery week, what would be the best plan of attack for this coming week? On the one had I'm worried about losing fitness, but on the other hand I don't want to push too much too soon.
3. Should I stick with the full body workouts, or go back to a body part split? If I can only get in two days a week of a full body workout is that enough? I don't have any races in the near future. My next event will most likely be a sprint triathlon in early June, with the possibility of some local 5k or 10k races if they fit my schedule.

Please do not tell me that I can't or shouldn't do both. I fully understand that I can not maximize progress in either by splitting my time between the two, and I am ok with that. I enjoy both for different reasons, and just want to get the most out of it that I can.

Thanks!

_benjammin

My thoughts in bold

ka97 wrote: »

So here are my questions....
1. Could the change in lifting have been the reason for hitting such a rough patch in February? Likely yes, as well as life stress, poor sleep, and assuming diet was appropriate and consistent
2. After coming of a rest/recovery week, what would be the best plan of attack for this coming week? Reduce previous weight training load and volume 10-20%, ramping load and volume back up over a week or 2 to where you left off. As far as running, I'd assume similar ramp up but I have no real life or google experience/knowledge. On the one had I'm worried about losing fitness, but on the other hand I don't want to push too much too soon.
3. Should I stick with the full body workouts, or go back to a body part split? If I can only get in two days a week of a full body workout is that enough? Full body is generally better if training less than 4 days a week. With your running and time constraint I'd bet 2x full body would be exponentially better.

Thanks!

Congrats on your marathon and good luck in your next event.

SideSteel

^ I agree with those answers just for what it's worth ^

ka97

@_benjammin - very helpful feedback - Thank you!

heybales

Great advice above too.

I'll add as someone that trains and attempts to maintain lifting (at some point the 2 just won't work together well - you'll have to pick priority) - if you have a hill sprint or interval day - do the 3rd set of upper body lifting on that day.

Your full-body lifting 2 x weekly can be great if you know how to proceed and follow them with the correct types of runs.
Picking a medium distance run at Active Recovery HR zone the day after is great - extra blood flow aids healing - you train the fat burning system for longer runs, ect, but hopefully don't impact getting a great repair from a good lifting workout.
Rest day prior is great so you can really lift heavy, but a short aerobic level run could be useful too - if you don't see any impacts to the lifting.

So that's 4 days, then 1 day sprint intervals, then perhaps 1 long day run. If you have that kind of flexibility in schedule.

That's the other hard one - you kind of need fresh legs for long run, and you need recovery day after.

That's where you usually find the issue with doing both when that long run gets long enough.

Then you might switch to 1 day full body lifting, and 2 other days upper only. Your intervals or hill sprints counts as almost a lifting day for legs too, just sport specific.

JenHuedy

I'm glad I found this. I'm currently having the same issue with running and lifting. I think I'll drop my current 3Xweek of Stronglifts 5x5 to 2Xweek 3x5 until after I run my half marathon in June. I may also have to revisit the idea of cutting a few more pounds and bump up the calories.

ka97

Thank you @heybales. I typically do two runs at 5-7 miles, a long run of 10-14 miles, and a shorter recovery run of about 3-4 miles. And some weeks I was also doing a spin class. I had stopped doing sprints and hills because of a bad ankle, and it was just too much strain and too much time to recovery - though I keep telling myself I'm going to give it another try. But yeah, the long run was a big issue. Trying to do three days of full body lifting meant I was lifting either the day before or after my long run. I typically went with the day after, prioritizing the long run.
The last few weeks I've cut the lifting down to twice per week. It's sort of a mental struggle because I feel like I'm not doing enough. I'm thinking once the weather gets nice and I'm really back into triathlon training, I will probably go back to the 3x/week body part split. I find that works well with the tri training in terms of scheduling and having to do double workouts.

heybales

Wow - tri training for me is when the lifting generally all falls apart in attempting a good schedule, early July usually as time ramps up. Even the 1 lifting day drops, perhaps 1 or 2 days upper depending on when swimming is.
Just going into lifting day too tired to accomplish anything close to normal, so I don't even bother wasting time when the muscles are already tired and can't lift what they could.

Then again, I have 2 day rests days a week because of schedule that just about doesn't allow anything then. So even harder to squeeze too much into 5 days.

ka97

heybales wrote: »

Wow - tri training for me is when the lifting generally all falls apart in attempting a good schedule, early July usually as time ramps up. Even the 1 lifting day drops, perhaps 1 or 2 days upper depending on when swimming is.
Just going into lifting day too tired to accomplish anything close to normal, so I don't even bother wasting time when the muscles are already tired and can't lift what they could.

Then again, I have 2 day rests days a week because of schedule that just about doesn't allow anything then. So even harder to squeeze too much into 5 days.

I schedule in 8-10 day blocks during tri season, with at least 1 day of full rest and another day either rest or "easy" workout. I know it's not ideal or recommended, but I'm too stubborn to give up anything. And it's not like I'm looking to get on the podium. I also have the luxury of working only part time in the summer.