Uh oh. Ditching the stevia.
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I also think it makes a huge difference if he's talking about powdered sweeteners versus liquid. Since I get postprandial somnolence (crashing/narcing out after I have carbs at a meal), and I did this BADLY with splenda packets, but it doesn't happen to me with the Sweet Leaf brand stevia (powdered or liquid), I'm using the narcing out episodes as a way to pseudo-measure my insulin responses, since there isn't a way to test that at home...
And any time I've had the insulin response, it hasn't had much of a measurable impact on my blood sugars, at least not in a time window I've checked or been told to check, etc.
Yeah, somewhere a while back I listed out my reactions to different sweeteners...I'm sure I saved it somewhere...but my basic theory is - if it causes me to narc out or to have cravings, it's gotta go!0 -
^Right.
It bears repeating that for powdered sweeteners, there's a 99.9% chance there is a bulking agent involved and those are sugar, whether the label says dextrose, maltodextrin, or whatever. It's sugar. So glucose and insulin response. The label is lying. They're allowed to say zero if it's under 1g. So you often get 1 carb per teaspoon. And some calories as well, 4 or 5ish.
Liquid versions are concentrated. No sugar bulkers. Just the sweetener so no hidden carbs.0 -
This quote concerned me when I started reading the book last week because I recently began using Stevia as an alternate to sucralose. Therefore, I obtained a copy of journal article cited regarding this point and reviewed the actual study. My review of the study gave me pause regarding Dr. Fung's work. First, let me clarify that I am a social scientist not a medical professional.
While Dr. Fung's statement has an element of truth, it is in fact quite misleading and in my opinion sensationalized. The researchers measured insulin levels at multiple points for three groups, one group that consumed Aspartame, one that consumed Stevia, and one that consumed sucrose (table sugar) with specific meals fed to them by the researchers. At all points but the last, the insulin levels of the participants who consumed Stevia were MUCH lower, statistically significantly lower, than the insulin levels of those who consumed Aspartame or sucrose. It was only at the last measurement, which if I am recalling correctly was 2 hours postparandial (that is 2 hours after eating) that insulin was higher those who consumed Aspartame and Stevia. However, at this point, the insulin levels of all groups had leveled out and were almost the same. The differences in insulin levels among the three groups at that point were statistically insignificantt at the 95% confidence level. Furthermore, if you compare all three groups across each of the other points when insulin levels were measured, the insulin levels of those who consumed Aspartame and Stevia were MUCH lower than the levels of the group that consumed sucrose and differences were statistically significant. Stevia had by far the lowest levels of insulin spike among the three groups across all measures except the last which again as I noted above was statistically insignificant.
Reading this gave me great concern regarding how carefully Dr. Fung reads the studies he cites. I have found his videos and blogs interesting and informative. But, at least in this case, I am concerned that he has mislead his readers to support his stated concerns about artificial sweeteners. Please note that I am not suggesting anyone should run out and start using artificial sweeteners or natural sweeteners like Stevia.This is just one study, and like all studies, it has its limitations, which the scholars identified. It has however, given me pause, regarding Dr. Fung's book and recommendations.3 -
I rarely use any sweetener. I have some of the Sweet Leaf liquid stevia which I use on very rare occasions. Maybe once a month if that and so far I've not noticed any reaction or increase in cravings. I don't use aspartame, sweet n' low, or splenda because it makes my RA flare up. As far as I know I'm not insulin resistant or having any pre-diabetic stuff going on so that could be a factor as well.
You can get used to unsweetened coffee and tea really quick. Just give it a week or so. Once you are used to it any sweetened drink will really gross you out. If I get a sweetened tea or coffee it's like sipping on maple syrup! haha0 -
My doctor said my gut would respond to the sweeteners similar to sugar so don't do it. Consistent with insulin response story. I dodge sweet else I want to eat a lot of everything. Turns off my capacity to feel full (i suspect)0
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Purely anecdotal...
I switched to truvia for a month in my tea. I drank my instant tea with truvia all day (replacing splenda). I started seeing stars a lot, nearly blacking out. I would be hiking (while gulping my tea) and get so dizzy I couldnt walk and would panic about being able to get home.
Got a glucose meter to confirm - I do not have diabetes, in fact my "normal' blood sugar has always been on the low side - 70 to 80 fasting, 90-100 eating. Within an hour of drinking a half bottle of tea with stevia, my BG was 40-50. I even went to the doctor and the blood test they drew came back at 40 (they called me quick
especially since I drove home!).
So my theory is that stevia is touted as being good for diabetics because not only does it not usually raise your BG, but it can lower it - great for diabetics! Not so much for hypos or low "normal" people!!!
I now still use stevia in rotation with other sweeteners (swerve/erythritol, monk front/lo han) but I never use it unless there are some carbs present to counteract it. I.e. not in 0 calorie tea But ok for baking stuff, or eating oatmeal, etc.
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SamandaIndia wrote: »My doctor said my gut would respond to the sweeteners similar to sugar so don't do it. Consistent with insulin response story. I dodge sweet else I want to eat a lot of everything. Turns off my capacity to feel full (i suspect)
Yeah, I've always wondered about sweeteners and their capacity to make less fullness. Drink 1 bottle of water and I feel full pretty fast. Drink 1 bottle of diet soda and I don't feel full the same way. Moreover, I get snacky or wanna eat more after a short while. This is my experience and it may not apply for other people.0 -
This quote concerned me when I started reading the book last week because I recently began using Stevia as an alternate to sucralose. Therefore, I obtained a copy of journal article cited regarding this point and reviewed the actual study. My review of the study gave me pause regarding Dr. Fung's work. First, let me clarify that I am a social scientist not a medical professional.
While Dr. Fung's statement has an element of truth, it is in fact quite misleading and in my opinion sensationalized. The researchers measured insulin levels at multiple points for three groups, one group that consumed Aspartame, one that consumed Stevia, and one that consumed sucrose (table sugar) with specific meals fed to them by the researchers. At all points but the last, the insulin levels of the participants who consumed Stevia were MUCH lower, statistically significantly lower, than the insulin levels of those who consumed Aspartame or sucrose. It was only at the last measurement, which if I am recalling correctly was 2 hours postparandial (that is 2 hours after eating) that insulin was higher those who consumed Aspartame and Stevia. However, at this point, the insulin levels of all groups had leveled out and were almost the same. The differences in insulin levels among the three groups at that point were statistically insignificantt at the 95% confidence level. Furthermore, if you compare all three groups across each of the other points when insulin levels were measured, the insulin levels of those who consumed Aspartame and Stevia were MUCH lower than the levels of the group that consumed sucrose and differences were statistically significant. Stevia had by far the lowest levels of insulin spike among the three groups across all measures except the last which again as I noted above was statistically insignificant.
Reading this gave me great concern regarding how carefully Dr. Fung reads the studies he cites. I have found his videos and blogs interesting and informative. But, at least in this case, I am concerned that he has mislead his readers to support his stated concerns about artificial sweeteners. Please note that I am not suggesting anyone should run out and start using artificial sweeteners or natural sweeteners like Stevia.This is just one study, and like all studies, it has its limitations, which the scholars identified. It has however, given me pause, regarding Dr. Fung's book and recommendations.
I was wondering if there was a citation.
People can be myopic when they want something to support their position.
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baconslave wrote: »This quote concerned me when I started reading the book last week because I recently began using Stevia as an alternate to sucralose. Therefore, I obtained a copy of journal article cited regarding this point and reviewed the actual study. My review of the study gave me pause regarding Dr. Fung's work. First, let me clarify that I am a social scientist not a medical professional.
While Dr. Fung's statement has an element of truth, it is in fact quite misleading and in my opinion sensationalized. The researchers measured insulin levels at multiple points for three groups, one group that consumed Aspartame, one that consumed Stevia, and one that consumed sucrose (table sugar) with specific meals fed to them by the researchers. At all points but the last, the insulin levels of the participants who consumed Stevia were MUCH lower, statistically significantly lower, than the insulin levels of those who consumed Aspartame or sucrose. It was only at the last measurement, which if I am recalling correctly was 2 hours postparandial (that is 2 hours after eating) that insulin was higher those who consumed Aspartame and Stevia. However, at this point, the insulin levels of all groups had leveled out and were almost the same. The differences in insulin levels among the three groups at that point were statistically insignificantt at the 95% confidence level. Furthermore, if you compare all three groups across each of the other points when insulin levels were measured, the insulin levels of those who consumed Aspartame and Stevia were MUCH lower than the levels of the group that consumed sucrose and differences were statistically significant. Stevia had by far the lowest levels of insulin spike among the three groups across all measures except the last which again as I noted above was statistically insignificant.
Reading this gave me great concern regarding how carefully Dr. Fung reads the studies he cites. I have found his videos and blogs interesting and informative. But, at least in this case, I am concerned that he has mislead his readers to support his stated concerns about artificial sweeteners. Please note that I am not suggesting anyone should run out and start using artificial sweeteners or natural sweeteners like Stevia.This is just one study, and like all studies, it has its limitations, which the scholars identified. It has however, given me pause, regarding Dr. Fung's book and recommendations.
I was wondering if there was a citation.
People can be myopic when they want something to support their position.
So true. Personal biases are an Achilles heel for the world of nutrition. I have read a lot of the 'best selling' books by doctors recommending this diet or that diet, from vegan to primal, and I don't think there is one book that didn't have some questionable recommendation(s) that appeared to stretch the interpretation of one study or another. It doesn't mean these doctors are not excellent in their field, nor that any of these diets are thus fundamentally unhealthy, but reading-between-the-lines is always going to be important. Personal biases are going to creep into their recommendations even with the best intentions, and Stevia may be Dr Fung's bias. However, from my own experience high quantities of Stevia knocked me way out of keto ( It may have been the powder filler not the actual stevia, I don't know, I drank a lot of a stevia flavored water enhancer in one day so no idea what the manufacture used), so he is not completely wrong either. His citation may have been enough just to satisfy his editors, but who knows the full body of evidence he is basing his theory on. Maybe he also had a lot of patients like me, which cannot be cited. *Sigh* I have no plans to cut it out completely, but I never want to relive that day I over consumed it. I was starving!! Hated it.
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Also, am I mistaken, or aren't there multiple types of Stevia? I remember reading somewhere that some forms are artificially extracted or reconstructed or something, whereas others are naturally extracted (something comparative to Virgin and Refined coconut oil perhaps?).
Also I know that erithrytol is supposed to not affect blood sugars, but I would narc out badly with Truvia, too. Perhaps that was the fillers, since there were three sugar alcohol carbs per packet?0 -
baconslave wrote: »This quote concerned me when I started reading the book last week because I recently began using Stevia as an alternate to sucralose. Therefore, I obtained a copy of journal article cited regarding this point and reviewed the actual study. My review of the study gave me pause regarding Dr. Fung's work. First, let me clarify that I am a social scientist not a medical professional.
While Dr. Fung's statement has an element of truth, it is in fact quite misleading and in my opinion sensationalized. The researchers measured insulin levels at multiple points for three groups, one group that consumed Aspartame, one that consumed Stevia, and one that consumed sucrose (table sugar) with specific meals fed to them by the researchers. At all points but the last, the insulin levels of the participants who consumed Stevia were MUCH lower, statistically significantly lower, than the insulin levels of those who consumed Aspartame or sucrose. It was only at the last measurement, which if I am recalling correctly was 2 hours postparandial (that is 2 hours after eating) that insulin was higher those who consumed Aspartame and Stevia. However, at this point, the insulin levels of all groups had leveled out and were almost the same. The differences in insulin levels among the three groups at that point were statistically insignificantt at the 95% confidence level. Furthermore, if you compare all three groups across each of the other points when insulin levels were measured, the insulin levels of those who consumed Aspartame and Stevia were MUCH lower than the levels of the group that consumed sucrose and differences were statistically significant. Stevia had by far the lowest levels of insulin spike among the three groups across all measures except the last which again as I noted above was statistically insignificant.
Reading this gave me great concern regarding how carefully Dr. Fung reads the studies he cites. I have found his videos and blogs interesting and informative. But, at least in this case, I am concerned that he has mislead his readers to support his stated concerns about artificial sweeteners. Please note that I am not suggesting anyone should run out and start using artificial sweeteners or natural sweeteners like Stevia.This is just one study, and like all studies, it has its limitations, which the scholars identified. It has however, given me pause, regarding Dr. Fung's book and recommendations.
I was wondering if there was a citation.
People can be myopic when they want something to support their position.
Dr. Fung cited and provided a reference for his statement on Stevia that the original poster quoted. I got a copy of the journal article and read it. His statement on Stevia is inconsistent with the findings of the study he cited. Reading his statement would make you think that sucrose had the least impact on insulin levels but that is not what the study found. Stevia, by far, had the least impact on insulin levels.0 -
Completely anecdotal evidence based on muscle testing, but my chiro told me to give the Truvia to someone I don't like, but I was OK with Swerve (which is another erythritol/stevia blend).0
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baconslave wrote: »This quote concerned me when I started reading the book last week because I recently began using Stevia as an alternate to sucralose. Therefore, I obtained a copy of journal article cited regarding this point and reviewed the actual study. My review of the study gave me pause regarding Dr. Fung's work. First, let me clarify that I am a social scientist not a medical professional.
While Dr. Fung's statement has an element of truth, it is in fact quite misleading and in my opinion sensationalized. The researchers measured insulin levels at multiple points for three groups, one group that consumed Aspartame, one that consumed Stevia, and one that consumed sucrose (table sugar) with specific meals fed to them by the researchers. At all points but the last, the insulin levels of the participants who consumed Stevia were MUCH lower, statistically significantly lower, than the insulin levels of those who consumed Aspartame or sucrose. It was only at the last measurement, which if I am recalling correctly was 2 hours postparandial (that is 2 hours after eating) that insulin was higher those who consumed Aspartame and Stevia. However, at this point, the insulin levels of all groups had leveled out and were almost the same. The differences in insulin levels among the three groups at that point were statistically insignificantt at the 95% confidence level. Furthermore, if you compare all three groups across each of the other points when insulin levels were measured, the insulin levels of those who consumed Aspartame and Stevia were MUCH lower than the levels of the group that consumed sucrose and differences were statistically significant. Stevia had by far the lowest levels of insulin spike among the three groups across all measures except the last which again as I noted above was statistically insignificant.
Reading this gave me great concern regarding how carefully Dr. Fung reads the studies he cites. I have found his videos and blogs interesting and informative. But, at least in this case, I am concerned that he has mislead his readers to support his stated concerns about artificial sweeteners. Please note that I am not suggesting anyone should run out and start using artificial sweeteners or natural sweeteners like Stevia.This is just one study, and like all studies, it has its limitations, which the scholars identified. It has however, given me pause, regarding Dr. Fung's book and recommendations.
I was wondering if there was a citation.
People can be myopic when they want something to support their position.
Dr. Fung cited and provided a reference for his statement on Stevia that the original poster quoted. I got a copy of the journal article and read it. His statement on Stevia is inconsistent with the findings of the study he cited. Reading his statement would make you think that sucrose had the least impact on insulin levels but that is not what the study found. Stevia, by far, had the least impact on insulin levels.
Right. I was just saying I wondered where he got the information, and if he bothered to cite the source of the info in his book.
Hmmmm...Definitely myopic behavior from the dear Dr. Fung.0
