God Damn America
Espressocycle
Posts: 2,245 Member
You know, I used to think America was a pretty great country. However, at this point I feel as though we can no longer claim superiority over other countries that have affordable universal healthcare, lower unemployment rates, better education systems, etc. We spend more on our armed forces than all the other countries in the world combined, yet we are failing in Afghanistan and Iraq can only barely be called a success. We have a higher percentage of our population in prision than every other democracy and still have sky high crime. We actually have lower social mobility than Europe. We have high levels of obsesity. Our political system is gridlocked. Seriously, I used to be proud to be an American, but as far as I can see, we are at best a mediocre country and certainly nothing special. The only thing keeping me here is the fact that my lousy American education placed such a low priority on learning another language.
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One of my favorite speeches from V for Vendetta- "And the truth is, there is something terribly wrong with this country, isn't there? Cruelty and injustice, intolerance and oppression. And where once you had the freedom to object, to think and speak as you saw fit, you now have censors and systems of surveillance coercing your conformity and soliciting your submission. How did this happen? Who's to blame? Well certainly there are those more responsible than others, and they will be held accountable, but again truth be told, if you're looking for the guilty, you need only look into a mirror."
It is so very true though, we the people keep voting the same people into office. Bush=Obama, if Romney wins the next election he will be just like the two before him, if not, well we have Obama. Pretty much until people start looking at the voting record and true character of these idots, we will get the same results. Increased spending, more policing the world with our military, Etc. Oddly enough, polls show that Americans are greatly opposed to these things yet they keep voting in Democrats and Republicans who do the same damn things.
With all that being said, I love this country. I love the platform I support and the candidate that I support and my hope is that "WE THE PEOPLE" can go back to the consitution and the what America once was. Needing Congress to declare war rather than sending troops whereever the commander wants them. Giving people rights and privacy, not policing the world and arresting harmless people for natural plants and most of all, separating church and state for REAL(allowing gay marriage).0 -
It makes me pretty sad. Love the V though!0
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You know, they speak English in Canada.0
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I would not live in the USA if someone paid me......0
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I have visited much of the world, still would chose the USA if I had the choice and no matter where this nation ends up, it's where I will die. But if I had to chose the one thing that bugs me about my fellow citizens more than economic blunders, it's our majorities unwavering support of diminishing our civil liberties in the hope of attaining a little more security. After all the threats and triumphs of this nation, it seems a little sad that 4,000 goat herders in the caves of Afghanistan scared us into practically finger banging our grandmothers at our airports. That....and how we vote. Two party systems suck.0
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So who is to blame, the politicians playing the game and keeping in their inner circle/families intact or the American public only concerns about today (and not their future generations)?0
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So who is to blame, the politicians playing the game and keeping in their inner circle/families intact or the American public only concerns about today (and not their future generations)?
The blame always falls on our shoulders. The politicians are elected by us. We have no excuse. Don't like them? Get involved and change something. But that's hard, so we don't. And we're left with what we have.
I take great pride in my country. But I'm a realist. I see the cracks in the mirror. We have done great things. Things that inspire, things we can be proud of. We've also committed terrible acts which no amount of rationalization can ever excuse. We should always be striving to be better. History will judge as at the end.0 -
I would not live in the USA if someone paid me......
Thank You, we are at quota for people on high horses, so we won't be needing any extras but thanks for letting us know anyway0 -
I too get pretty disillusioned with the way our country works. However, after spending six months living in China, I came home and practically kissed the ground at the airport.
However, like Brett mentioned, I am a realist. Our politicians are voted in by us, and if we take issue with them, then it is up to us to change. It's one thing for people to complain about the way things are - it's another to put in the effort to start making a difference.0 -
I'm not crazy about the way things are either, but I deal with it. I vote. I make differences where I can. If you don't like it here, do something constructive to change it or get the hell out.0
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I would not live in the USA if someone paid me......
I was offered the chance. I declined the offer. (big part was being so far from my family, but the biggest part was I don't want to live there)
As an Aussie we have all America supposedly offers (except Disneyland. How I would KILL for Disneyland here!) but more freedom, the population better taken care of and safer. JMO.0 -
This reminds me of a topic from the main message boards last week.....
It filled up and locked pretty fast.....but I blasted out my opinions before......Canada is not perfect either, but the US seems to have A LOT of problems.....here is the long and short of it from that post....will explain why I said I would not live there if I was paid....one thing I want to say is that this was posted a week or so ago, before Zimmerman was arrested, as that is included in this post.....
Let me start by saying I am Canadian......however, most of my family is American....in fact, I am the only Canadian born person in my family other than my children...even my siblings were American born....
As far as America the country goes, there are many things I find very wrong, I would not live there if someone was paying me....
I agree 150% with this statement that was made:
"I can't get over the fact that someone like Rick Sanitorium could run for president and spread his hateful views on gays, black people and women, and name it all as a religious virtue."
That pisses me off like you would not believe.....in the same token, I also do not understand how you can have someone like Ron Paul running as well, after seeing a Q&A with him where he was asked about health care for the poor, and his reply was something along the lines of 'why is it our responsiblity to take care of everyone'......I almost got sick....
My sister is a hardcore Republican, although when asked, she will claim she is 'undecided', however, she liked Bush, HATES Clinton and Obama, and thought "Socialized" medicine is a terrible idea.....
I do not understand the idea behind the very rich getting the biggest tax breaks.....capitalism is a nightmare it seems.....
I also do not understand what is up with health care over there, why do they seem to have so much money for the military but none to take care of its most in need citizens....
I know our military here in Canada is a joke compaired to lots of other countries, and when war starts, we send our one boat over with our 12 soilders, but personally, I would rather have other perks......
Speaking of war and such, why do guns seem to be such a giant problem in the states? Why does it seem like everyone has a gun? And its easy for any nutjob to get one it seems to.....
And not only does it seem that everyone needs a gun, but you even have people that make it their mission to make sure everyone has the right to a gun....really? REALLY?? Are their not better things to fight for.....like perhaps health care? Blows my mind.....
Also, why does it take so long to make sure everyone has human rights over there? Like seriously, what is the hold up? Not only in history was America way behind the times with the end to slavery and civil rights for black people, but I cannot get understand why it is 2012 and homosexuals do not have equal rights yet.....what is the deal with that?
Speaking of human rights, I also cannot believe that America still has capital punishment.....with, the saddest part of that, again, being rights for those with less.....most people that have been murdered by the state that were innocent were people that did not have enough money to pay for proper defence, and in many cases, black males....so I guess that falls right in line with all the other human rights issues America seems to have. And it even STILL happens....Troy Davis anyone??
Speaking of the justice system.....Canada's is not perfect either, but why is it that Casey Anthony and George Zimmerman are still walking free and Troy Davis is dead and Buju Banton is rotting away in jail? Makes NO SENSE.....something is wrong there, and I hate to say it, but it seems like the darker your skin, the more likely you are to be found guilty, if you committed the crime or not....
Alright, I could go on and on about the flaws of the US as a whole, but let me bring something else to the table....
I work in retail and Americans are the only ones, that not only will routinely ask if the prices are in US dollars, (like seriously, I would NEVER go to another country, and expect that the prices are in MY homelands currency), but will then also get upset I do not have US money in the til to give them change....really? REALLY?? In general though, I love American people, and do not see a difference really between Americans and Canadians.....just this one thing blows my mind....
All this said, one last gripe I have about America as a whole is if it was not for Bush, we would have legalized weed in Canada by now....but he threathened to close the borders....so after only ONE day of being legal, we all went back to being criminals....why are Americans so up tight about weed? Its an herb, grown in the ground, by God.....it seems like a lot of Americans think it is a drug equal to crack or something.....trust me, the only thing in danger when someone is high on pot is leftovers.....here in Canada, though it is not legal per se, one can smoke pretty openly, I basically smoke anywhere that people are smoking cigarettes and have never had a problem....you could never do that in the states.....0 -
I would not live in the USA if someone paid me......
Thank You, we are at quota for people on high horses, so we won't be needing any extras but thanks for letting us know anyway
EXACTLY! Your tellin me!!0 -
Those who are born in America, even those who are critical of many things about America, tend to still have a belief in American exceptionalism. I would probably have to include myself in that number.
We believe in America's ideals and feel that those ideals excuse a lot of the wrong that Americans have done in her country's name and a lot of the wrong that exists within our borders.
Americans put a premium on individual liberty--often at the cost of a better society. We also tend to think that OUR government and our way of living is the ideal to which everyone else in the world should strive to achieve. That is one of our bigger shortcomings as a so-called "world superpower".
I got an interesting perspective on this a number of years ago. I had just graduated from college and my first wife and I had moved to a large housing complex in an "exurban" part of Cincinnati--away from the high rents and roach-infested housing near the university. This complex was relatively close to a neighborhood with a large, mostly conservative Jewish population and a large Jewish Community Center. This was a time, in the mid-1970s, when Jewish groups were working to arrange for other Jews to be allowing to emigrate from the old Soviet Union. A number of Soviet Jews emigrated to the Cincinnati area and most of them ended up in our complex--because of the many units available, the reasonable rents and the proximity to the Jewish community.
We had the opportunity to speak with many of these people -- we used a couple of the women as babysitters for our infant daughter-- and gained some interesting insights. While all were appreciative of having the freedom to freely practice their religion, and no one wanted to go back to the Soviet Union, their reaction was not the enthusiastic happiness most Americans would expect from someone who had not only lived in the Soviet Union, but lived as a persecuted minority in the Soviet Union.
For all of the lack of personal freedom, the government provided education, medical care, and a generous support for the arts. Everyday citizens had access to world class ballet, symphony, and art museums. To them, there was an overall emptiness and shallowness to American life compared to what they had known.
The point I am trying to make is not to say that one system was better than the other, but things that we considered of paramount importance--personal liberty, freedom of the press, etc--were not automatically #1 on everyone's priority list. For these Russian Jews, some of those freedoms were less important than more accessible medical care, education, and cultural institutions. It was an interesting perspective.
It is important to keep this in mind as we deal with a world that is both expanding in terms of population and economy, and shrinking in terms of easier communication and travel. The United States will no longer be able to automatically dominate foreign policy discussions, nor have "first dibs" to world resources. We can't understand why, with all of its shortcomings and economic hardships, many if not most Cubans prefer the Castro government because of the pride they feel in being independent of a neighbor they feel has bullied many other nations in the area.
Our future as a nation is severely hampered by the narrow minded parochial thinking of our political leaders.0 -
Our future as a nation is severely hampered by the narrow minded parochial thinking of our political leaders.
This is right on.
Anecdotally, I think we are a nation of "make-doers" with perseverance, too.
On a personal note, I know that no matter what great lengths politicians (or others) would take to deny rights, I get by. My partner and I live in a house we purchased together (though if one of us dies, transfer of property could be considered a "gift" by the IRS). We are also able to use wills and contracts to lay out everything legally. Sure, we can't get one another's Social Security survivor benefits or tax benefits, but we are still allowed to appoint each other as beneficiaries for other plans. While health insurance differs, *my* employer chooses to extend health insurance to her as long as we sign an affidavit. Sure, my tax return says "single" but that's just a formality I guess. Yeah, it sucks, and these things could also be called issues of the privileged first world, but certain folks will fight long and hard against equality just like it has always happened and in the process we'll continue to live and hope their tired voices die down one day..0 -
I love my country and wouldn't consider living anywhere else. We are responsibile for our country and how we live. If you are not satisfied with the way our politicians are working, vote them out and get new ones. I do believe it would help our country if we had term limits so we wouldn't have the "professional" politicians whose only concern is staying in office.
we need to kick *kitten* and take names, we have allowed this country to drift away from the constitution and the founding principles. to get back on line people need to take pride in their county and theirselves again. No one is ENTITLED to have free housing, free food, free money, free medical. You earn it or work for it.
Our military was once the greatest in the world and so was our education system. This has all gone down the tubes because of personal agendas of people that we keep electing and the apathy of the general populace.
Take pride, stand up for what is right.0 -
I love my country and wouldn't consider living anywhere else. We are responsibile for our country and how we live. If you are not satisfied with the way our politicians are working, vote them out and get new ones. I do believe it would help our country if we had term limits so we wouldn't have the "professional" politicians whose only concern is staying in office.
we need to kick *kitten* and take names, we have allowed this country to drift away from the constitution and the founding principles. to get back on line people need to take pride in their county and theirselves again. No one is ENTITLED to have free housing, free food, free money, free medical. You earn it or work for it.
Our military was once the greatest in the world and so was our education system. This has all gone down the tubes because of personal agendas of people that we keep electing and the apathy of the general populace.
Take pride, stand up for what is right.
:drinker:0 -
America has all the talent it needs. I'm not so sure it has the will. While nations like India and China turn out millions of scientists and engineers, half of Americans want to relitigate the Scopes Monkey trial. Instead of investing in new infrastructure and green technology, we are just ceding new markets to the rest of the world so that our corporations can protect their subsidies and rig the market system to guarantee their short-term profits.
To the absolute astonishment of the rest of the world, we are trying to go back to the 50s and 60s and re-start the fight about contraception.
It's hard to face the future when one of your major political parties wants to repeal the entire 20th century.0 -
America has all the talent it needs. I'm not so sure it has the will. While nations like India and China turn out millions of scientists and engineers, half of Americans want to relitigate the Scopes Monkey trial. Instead of investing in new infrastructure and green technology, we are just ceding new markets to the rest of the world so that our corporations can protect their subsidies and rig the market system to guarantee their short-term profits.
To the absolute astonishment of the rest of the world, we are trying to go back to the 50s and 60s and re-start the fight about contraception.
It's hard to face the future when one of your major political parties wants to repeal the entire 20th century.
I love that! i am so tired of hearing about "contraception" and wether a Mom works or not. is that something that should be in our political discussions/actions?0 -
I love that! i am so tired of hearing about "contraception" and wether a Mom works or not. is that something that should be in our political discussions/actions?
It's all a tactic to keep blinders on the public. If you're bickering about abortion and gay marriage, then you're probably not paying attention to the things that SHOULD be discussed and solved through politics. Keep the herd busy, and you can do whatever you like without fear of consequence.0 -
I think of my country as I do my marriage. I am not always going to agree with our leaders, I may even think they are idiots at times, however, I enjoy the freedoms we do have that most countries don't and I want to die in my country as a free, Black American. I agree that our country needs drastic improvement but much of the problems we are facing are self-inflicted. We have this sense of entitlement that made us believe we deserved that newly constructed house that we knew we really couldn't afford but, you must uphold an image and kept several credit cards that gave us a false sense of wealth. It was bound to come to a head sooner or later.0
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I love my country and wouldn't consider living anywhere else. We are responsibile for our country and how we live. If you are not satisfied with the way our politicians are working, vote them out and get new ones. I do believe it would help our country if we had term limits so we wouldn't have the "professional" politicians whose only concern is staying in office.
we need to kick *kitten* and take names, we have allowed this country to drift away from the constitution and the founding principles. to get back on line people need to take pride in their county and theirselves again. No one is ENTITLED to have free housing, free food, free money, free medical. You earn it or work for it.
Our military was once the greatest in the world and so was our education system. This has all gone down the tubes because of personal agendas of people that we keep electing and the apathy of the general populace.
Take pride, stand up for what is right.
I totally agree!0 -
To all the people saying "vote them out if you don't like them" well, it's not quite that simple. As pointed out by the above quotes there are too many people who will vote against this country and their own best interests simply because they are issue (gays/abortion typically) or party line voters. I wish I could vote them out but my vote gets cancelled by someone who is pro fetus/anti gay who votes for someone who will sell us all out to the best lobbyist simply because they claim to be pro life.I love that! i am so tired of hearing about "contraception" and wether a Mom works or not. is that something that should be in our political discussions/actions?
It's all a tactic to keep blinders on the public. If you're bickering about abortion and gay marriage, then you're probably not paying attention to the things that SHOULD be discussed and solved through politics. Keep the herd busy, and you can do whatever you like without fear of consequence.
America used to be a great country. We aren't anymore. We sacrifice the poor and children to give the rich more then criticize those poor when they dare ask "Please sir, may I have some more?" No country where a person can be educated, hard working, law abiding, and upstanding their entire lives but lose everything including their life simply because they lost their job and got sick or were in an accident when they lost their insurance is a "great country". A great country takes care of all of it's citizens, not just the elite. A great country runs the government, not people's bedrooms and marriages.
We lived in Germany for 1 1/2 years. I had my blinders torn off while we were over there. I'd go back to Europe in a heart beat. I like a lot of America's perks (cheap housing, convenient shopping, being able to converse with my neighbors, etc) but there is an awful lot wrong. With the righties trying to repeal the entire 20th century (love that line!) I don't see how anyone can actually think it's going to get better to jump back into Puritanism instead of moving forward with the rest of the 1st world.0 -
To all the people saying "vote them out if you don't like them" well, it's not quite that simple. As pointed out by the above quotes there are too many people who will vote against this country and their own best interests simply because they are issue (gays/abortion typically) or party line voters. I wish I could vote them out but my vote gets cancelled by someone who is pro fetus/anti gay who votes for someone who will sell us all out to the best lobbyist simply because they claim to be pro life.I love that! i am so tired of hearing about "contraception" and wether a Mom works or not. is that something that should be in our political discussions/actions?
It's all a tactic to keep blinders on the public. If you're bickering about abortion and gay marriage, then you're probably not paying attention to the things that SHOULD be discussed and solved through politics. Keep the herd busy, and you can do whatever you like without fear of consequence.
America used to be a great country. We aren't anymore. We sacrifice the poor and children to give the rich more then criticize those poor when they dare ask "Please sir, may I have some more?" No country where a person can be educated, hard working, law abiding, and upstanding their entire lives but lose everything including their life simply because they lost their job and got sick or were in an accident when they lost their insurance is a "great country". A great country takes care of all of it's citizens, not just the elite. A great country runs the government, not people's bedrooms and marriages.
We lived in Germany for 1 1/2 years. I had my blinders torn off while we were over there. I'd go back to Europe in a heart beat. I like a lot of America's perks (cheap housing, convenient shopping, being able to converse with my neighbors, etc) but there is an awful lot wrong. With the righties trying to repeal the entire 20th century (love that line!) I don't see how anyone can actually think it's going to get better to jump back into Puritanism instead of moving forward with the rest of the 1st world.
as you pointed out it isn't easy to make a change, like voting people out. but it has to begin somewhere. if your vote gets cancelled out by someone who is voting the opposite, then the majority wins the election, which is the way the process works. sorry if you don't like it. just don't give up on voting, which is what many people do because of that attitude, my vote doesn't count.
moving back to Germany won't fix America, but feel free.....0 -
I think if you read A People's History of the United States, the notion that this was once a great country a long time ago turns out to be rather absurd. Perhaps the people were just a little less distracted by benign Hollywood bull****, the government a little less bought and paid for, the news media a little less sensationalistic, and the country as a whole a little less spineless and cowardly.
I'd gladly leave and never look back if it were as simple as the morons who trumpet this idea thought.0 -
So who is to blame, the politicians playing the game and keeping in their inner circle/families intact or the American public only concerns about today (and not their future generations)?
The blame always falls on our shoulders. The politicians are elected by us. We have no excuse. Don't like them? Get involved and change something. But that's hard, so we don't. And we're left with what we have.
I take great pride in my country. But I'm a realist. I see the cracks in the mirror. We have done great things. Things that inspire, things we can be proud of. We've also committed terrible acts which no amount of rationalization can ever excuse. We should always be striving to be better. History will judge as at the end.
ITA with this.0 -
America has all the talent it needs. I'm not so sure it has the will. While nations like India and China turn out millions of scientists and engineers, half of Americans want to relitigate the Scopes Monkey trial. Instead of investing in new infrastructure and green technology, we are just ceding new markets to the rest of the world so that our corporations can protect their subsidies and rig the market system to guarantee their short-term profits.
To the absolute astonishment of the rest of the world, we are trying to go back to the 50s and 60s and re-start the fight about contraception.
It's hard to face the future when one of your major political parties wants to repeal the entire 20th century.
This.
I can't tell you how many foreign nationals are in graduate schools at the top US universities because they CAN'T find qualified Americans to fill those spots. I was the ONLY American woman in my entire program in my first year of grad school. We only had two American men, and 20+ Chinese, European, and Indian students. So few Americans are going into hard sciences anymore, especially women. Only 13% of Ph.D. mathematicians are women, and of that number, only 30% are American women.
Our focus as a nation is on stupid superficial content (what Hollywood bimbo wore what to the Oscars, spending $1billion on a failing baseball team, etc.), not solving the very real and imminent problems we, as a world society, face: energy shortages, food shortages, the skyrocketing cost and insufficient quality medical care, very serious long-term damage to the environment with potentially catastrophic outcomes for our children and grandchildren, etc.0 -
I think if you read A People's History of the United States, the notion that this was once a great country a long time ago turns out to be rather absurd. Perhaps the people were just a little less distracted by benign Hollywood bull****, the government a little less bought and paid for, the news media a little less sensationalistic, and the country as a whole a little less spineless and cowardly.
I'd gladly leave and never look back if it were as simple as the morons who trumpet this idea thought.
If you really hate where you are, but won't leave, who's the moron?
Maybe it's not easy, but staying in this country and enjoying all the perks of citizenship, while b!tching about how awful it is at the same time is just lame on your part.
If you want to change things, work to change them. If you can't stand it and want to leave, leave. People do it all the time. My father fought hard just to get to this country. He knew he'd have a better life here.
Or continue blaming Hollywood and the news, and calling others spineless cowards from the comfort of wherever you're at. :yawn:0 -
I think if you read A People's History of the United States, the notion that this was once a great country a long time ago turns out to be rather absurd. Perhaps the people were just a little less distracted by benign Hollywood bull****, the government a little less bought and paid for, the news media a little less sensationalistic, and the country as a whole a little less spineless and cowardly.
I'd gladly leave and never look back if it were as simple as the morons who trumpet this idea thought.
If you really hate where you are, but won't leave, who's the moron?
Maybe it's not easy, but staying in this country and enjoying all the perks of citizenship, while b!tching about how awful it is at the same time is just lame on your part.
If you want to change things, work to change them. If you can't stand it and want to leave, leave. People do it all the time. My father fought hard just to get to this country. He knew he'd have a better life here.
Or continue blaming Hollywood and the news, and calling others spineless cowards from the comfort of wherever you're at. :yawn:
^^^This.0 -
On a side note, could it be that us americans have turned into professinal malcontents and whiners? I keep hearing how bad things are, and to be sure, we have issues. But I have even heard people go as far as to say we are in a new Depression. Really? With your internet access, air conditioning, plentiful food, and every other major benefit that people take for granted, we are in a depression. I think it's great that Americans demand more of their government, but we have to get away from this "the world is ending" attitude everytime something doesn't go our way.0
This discussion has been closed.