About independence, relationships and dating.
Replies
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The lady I'm currently talking to, we've discussed a few things. I can honestly say that with her I don't feel like I'm going to lose my freedom with her in my life.
I forgot that guys worry about this too- dont understand why though, seems harder to take that away from a man. Dont you just say No?0 -
Why do you think you'll lose your freedom and/or independence?
If it's important to you, you'll find someone that values that as much as you do. I was married for over 10 years and never felt my individuality or independence threatened by my kids or husband. I'm a pretty free spirit and I found someone that was as well and in that regard, things worked out well. I never felt tied down.
I'm just saying that it can be done... a LTR AND keeping your freedom to a certain extent. You have to make time for your guy/girl friends (but make sure your companion isn't jealous of your "you" time). It's important not to lose your identity.0 -
The lady I'm currently talking to, we've discussed a few things. I can honestly say that with her I don't feel like I'm going to lose my freedom with her in my life.
I forgot that guys worry about this too- dont understand why though, seems harder to take that away from a man. Dont you just say No?
I wouldn't say I worry about it, it's something I think about, but most of what I do I can do with a girlfriend. I'm not spending every other weekend in a strip club or something along those lines. Baseball games? check. She can come, hopefully she likes baseball. etc.
Of course you're always going to want boys nights, or girls nights, and every couple should have those. But finding the girl/guy who meshes with your likes & interests won't take away your freedom.
Unless you're just totally opposed to the idea of hanging out w/ your gf/bf aside from a night or two a week. In that case, you need a new one.
If I don't want to do something, I'll say no. I'm a man. I can stand up for myself. But you pick and choose, because sometimes you're going to want them to do something they might not want to do, it's a compromise.
Maybe I'm just different, who knows.0 -
The lady I'm currently talking to, we've discussed a few things. I can honestly say that with her I don't feel like I'm going to lose my freedom with her in my life.
I forgot that guys worry about this too- dont understand why though, seems harder to take that away from a man. Dont you just say No?
Yes guys worry about this and I think is a big, if not the biggest reason, we (me) dont do well in relationships that look like they could go long term. For me, I just assume I am selfish because everytime I date someone that it could become serious, I bail. My freedom and self identity thus far has been more important and satisfying than the possible benefits of a long term blending of identities (relationship).
I was impressed and a bit shocked with your original post in this thread UV! If I were half as eloquent that post could have been written by me. In my tiny little corner of the world, I was amazed to realize women think that way!
Learning has occured here for me today! Thank You and goodnight!0 -
commitment and long term relationships and the potential for marriage scares the love out of me.
I am so terrified that I wont be allowed to stay out all night with my friends anymore, do the things I love by myself or with other friends without him, flirt, drink, leave spontaneously, visit other countries alone, have guy friends, have personal goals and ambitions, move for an awesome job, stay here in the city if I want to, dress how I want, cook what I want to eat, and a million other things. I like having my own room, my own bed, my own bathroom mess. I like having only my own laundry and dishes and dont want to be someone's servant jsut because I gave them my heart.
I dont want to spend my life compromising out of love only to end up being old news when he leaves me for the next shiny new toy.
I cant even say I love you because Im so goddamned terrified that saying it out loud is the same thing as saying, I care about you so much that I just dont matter anymore.
You'll get over those phases. They get old very quickly.
GOING ON 9 YEARS.
I didn't say you would stop tomorrow. But it gets old. Maybe it won't for you, if that's what makes you happen, then that's all that matters. For me, it's old.0 -
The lady I'm currently talking to, we've discussed a few things. I can honestly say that with her I don't feel like I'm going to lose my freedom with her in my life.
I forgot that guys worry about this too- dont understand why though, seems harder to take that away from a man. Dont you just say No?
I think guys give up there freedom with less of a fight... my brother for instance has his fishing trip and opening hunting weekend... other than that he is a b*tch to his wife, he doesn't seem to mind though so maybe when it's right your just willing to let some freedom go.0 -
My brother is pretty much the same way, and I never thought he'd be the type to cave. But his wife rules their roost with an iron fist. I think he realized early on that when the wife is miserable, so is everyone else.
Frankly, it's nauseating to me. I honestly have no desire to be married to a man who lets me kick him in the balls repeatedly.0 -
My brother is pretty much the same way, and I never thought he'd be the type to cave. But his wife rules their roost with an iron fist. I think he realized early on that when the wife is miserable, so is everyone else.
Frankly, it's nauseating to me. I honestly have no desire to be married to a man who lets me kick him in the balls repeatedly.
My brother is pretty worthless without her, so I think he is pretty ok with it... he will battle her on stupid things too. But I have a much more independent streak in me than he does, I can take care of myself and rebel against people telling me what to do... so I guess not everyone is the same.0 -
My brother is pretty much the same way, and I never thought he'd be the type to cave. But his wife rules their roost with an iron fist. I think he realized early on that when the wife is miserable, so is everyone else.
Frankly, it's nauseating to me. I honestly have no desire to be married to a man who lets me kick him in the balls repeatedly.
I think this fear is the biggest reason I am single. I've seen so many friends totally emasculated by the woman they chose. My last serious relationship ended because of a fight over me chewing ice. (Rather that was the pretext. It was really over control.)
She'd commented a few times how it annoyed her. We were watching TV one night and I started chewing ice again. She gave me a dirty look and I commented that it really bothered her. A few minutes later I started chewing it again and she finally yelled at me about it. I told her it was just ice. It was her problem and she needed to get over it. A few minutes later she sprung this guilt riddled female BS question about what she is supposed to think about our relationship and my respect for her if I am so insensitive to her feelings. On the inside I said that I valued maintaining keeping my balls and spine a lot more than her feelings. My actual response was probably only slightly more polite but the end was pretty much near after that.0 -
A lot of women are pretty passive aggressive about things like that. They take the smallest thing and turn it into "If you really cared about me, you'd stop doing that" or "If you loved me, you'd be more excited about the things I'm excited about," and it is nearly always about something stupid, like chewing ice or your head not exploding properly, like hers did, over the shoes she just bought. I could understand if it was something important, but it rarely is.
If she's that way a few days a month, you'll probably just have to excuse it. But if it's all the time, move on because you're not ever going to be able to breathe again without wondering if you just did something wrong.0 -
My brother is pretty much the same way, and I never thought he'd be the type to cave. But his wife rules their roost with an iron fist. I think he realized early on that when the wife is miserable, so is everyone else.
Frankly, it's nauseating to me. I honestly have no desire to be married to a man who lets me kick him in the balls repeatedly.
What about gentle touches?0 -
A lot of women are pretty passive aggressive about things like that. They take the smallest thing and turn it into "If you really cared about me, you'd stop doing that" or "If you loved me, you'd be more excited about the things I'm excited about," and it is nearly always about something stupid, like chewing ice or your head not exploding properly, like hers did, over the shoes she just bought. I could understand if it was something important, but it rarely is.
If she's that way a few days a month, you'll probably just have to excuse it. But if it's all the time, move on because you're not ever going to be able to breathe again without wondering if you just did something wrong.
The sad thing is neither of the partners are happy in this situation. The woman might pride herself in running the show or how her man "pleases her" but I call BS.
I was like this in my marriage, I will admit. I think it had to do with the fact that I resented him for so long- quietly. I had forgiven him for the cheating but the way he still treated me after the fact, wasn't loving. So I think over time, I grew resentful to the point of just his breathing got on my nerves. Scary!! And even though he'd listen to my griping and most of the time succumbed to my requests, I was miserable, as was he.
Love is about freedom. I understand that now. I might have my freak outs because bf doesn't do certain things the way he used to or the way I want... but I'll just vent to my gfs, or on special occasions, I'll communicate about my needs/ desires to him but I want him to be free. I want him to never feel pressured. Just yesterday he was hanging up some pictures for me at my new apt and he was tired. I told him "baby, you don't need to do it if you don't want to, you know that." He replies, "I know that but it makes me happy to make you happy." :blushing:
(oh man!!)
It has to be all him. I've never loved like that and so far, it feels GOOD.
So if bf wants to chew ice in an annoying way, I'll remember all this that I'm typing right now.0 -
My brother is pretty much the same way, and I never thought he'd be the type to cave. But his wife rules their roost with an iron fist. I think he realized early on that when the wife is miserable, so is everyone else.
Frankly, it's nauseating to me. I honestly have no desire to be married to a man who lets me kick him in the balls repeatedly.
What about gentle touches?
I don't planning on asking for permission for that.0 -
My brother is pretty much the same way, and I never thought he'd be the type to cave. But his wife rules their roost with an iron fist. I think he realized early on that when the wife is miserable, so is everyone else.
Frankly, it's nauseating to me. I honestly have no desire to be married to a man who lets me kick him in the balls repeatedly.
What about gentle touches?
I don't planning on asking for permission for that.
Me-ow!!!!0 -
My brother is pretty much the same way, and I never thought he'd be the type to cave. But his wife rules their roost with an iron fist. I think he realized early on that when the wife is miserable, so is everyone else.
Frankly, it's nauseating to me. I honestly have no desire to be married to a man who lets me kick him in the balls repeatedly.
I think this fear is the biggest reason I am single. I've seen so many friends totally emasculated by the woman they chose. My last serious relationship ended because of a fight over me chewing ice. (Rather that was the pretext. It was really over control.)
She'd commented a few times how it annoyed her. We were watching TV one night and I started chewing ice again. She gave me a dirty look and I commented that it really bothered her. A few minutes later I started chewing it again and she finally yelled at me about it. I told her it was just ice. It was her problem and she needed to get over it. A few minutes later she sprung this guilt riddled female BS question about what she is supposed to think about our relationship and my respect for her if I am so insensitive to her feelings. On the inside I said that I valued maintaining keeping my balls and spine a lot more than her feelings. My actual response was probably only slightly more polite but the end was pretty much near after that.
You pick and choose your fights. It's ice. Not worth fighting for. You should have just dumped her instead of being an *kitten*.0 -
You pick and choose your fights. It's ice. Not worth fighting for. You should have just dumped her instead of being an *kitten*.
Sure because you always keep your cool while sitting on the couch next to a woman you've been dating for 14 months. Snide responses never happen and it's so much less mean to say sorry you've got to go we just aren't going to work out than it is to make a snide comment.0 -
I was afraid of losing my independence and upsetting my routine until I finally figured out what I was looking for in a man. Once I had fully realized that, I was ready to find him and have him in my life.
I think you will always be scared of "the right person" in the sense that you'll know he/she is capable of destroying you, and there's nothing you can do about it. You just have to trust that they won't. But when you find the right person, I don't think you'll be scared to give up your "freedom." I think you will realize she makes you feel like the man you've always wanted to be, and there is plenty of freedom in that.
^^^BRAVO!0 -
You pick and choose your fights. It's ice. Not worth fighting for. You should have just dumped her instead of being an *kitten*.
Sure because you always keep your cool while sitting on the couch next to a woman you've been dating for 14 months. Snide responses never happen and it's so much less mean to say sorry you've got to go we just aren't going to work out than it is to make a snide comment.
Actually, I do. If I'm going to fight w/ her, it's going to be something worth fighting for. Like I said, I'm different. I wouldn't say something intentionally that I know is going to piss her off.0 -
I never heard that. the right person has the ability to 'destroy you'
brb to break up0 -
You pick and choose your fights. It's ice. Not worth fighting for. You should have just dumped her instead of being an *kitten*.
Sure because you always keep your cool while sitting on the couch next to a woman you've been dating for 14 months. Snide responses never happen and it's so much less mean to say sorry you've got to go we just aren't going to work out than it is to make a snide comment.
Actually, I'd rather a guy break up with me than to intentionally anger or upset me, which is what you are doing when do or say things for the sole purpose of angering or upsetting someone. It's like when a guy realizes the relationship is over, but he doesn't have the balls to call it quits, so he just starts acting like a *kitten*, hoping the woman will do the dirty work for him. That's passive aggressive, too.
It's one thing when you just happen to be dating an emotionally immature woman, with whom a battle for the upper hand in the relationship manifests itself as an argument over chewing ice. It's entirely another to pick a fight with her by chewing ice in hopes that she will get pissed at you, and you can act out some drama about the problems in your relationship and then tell her you've had enough. I'm not sure which of these scenarios applies to you. Just expressing my opinion on the matter.0 -
You pick and choose your fights. It's ice. Not worth fighting for. You should have just dumped her instead of being an *kitten*.
Sure because you always keep your cool while sitting on the couch next to a woman you've been dating for 14 months. Snide responses never happen and it's so much less mean to say sorry you've got to go we just aren't going to work out than it is to make a snide comment.
Actually, I'd rather a guy break up with me than to intentionally anger or upset me, which is what you are doing when do or say things for the sole purpose of angering or upsetting someone. It's like when a guy realizes the relationship is over, but he doesn't have the balls to call it quits, so he just starts acting like a *kitten*, hoping the woman will do the dirty work for him. That's passive aggressive, too.
It's one thing when you just happen to be dating an emotionally immature woman, with whom a battle for the upper hand in the relationship manifests itself as an argument over chewing ice. It's entirely another to pick a fight with her by chewing ice in hopes that she will get pissed at you, and you can act out some drama about the problems in your relationship and then tell her you've had enough. I'm not sure which of these scenarios applies to you. Just expressing my opinion on the matter.
Ummmm the two girls that broke up with me in my dating career checked out long before they ever actually told me... the passive aggressive thing goes for both genders0 -
I didn't intentionally start chewing ice. I was chewing it out of habit, noticed I was doing it and she was upset, said something about her being annoyed and put it down. A few minutes later, I grabbed it again and started chewing. I didn't realize I was doing it until she started getting mad. I would have been fine with something like dammit stop that. I was not okay with what felt like 10-15 minutes of being berated only to get the what am I supposed to think about your feelings for me line when I said enough is enough. I wasn't planning to break up with her at that point and wasn't trying to get her to do the dirty work for me. It just happend that things got progressively worse after that point. When I figured trying to talk just ended up in an argument followed by the silent treatment I did end it.0
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Ummmm the two girls that broke up with me in my dating career checked out long before they ever actually told me... the passive aggressive thing goes for both genders
A relationship often effectively ends long before it officially ends (breakup conversation, divorce papers).0 -
She gave me a dirty look and I commented that it really bothered her. A few minutes later I started chewing it again and she finally yelled at me about it. I told her it was just ice. It was her problem and she needed to get over it.
While it sounds like ice was only a pretext for the real issue of control, I have to say I would be hard pressed to keep dating a guy who crunched ice (or anything crazy loud) while I'm watching TV. Or constantly talk to me. It's hard enough for me to hear and understand the TV as it is, and once I communicate that to him he's either gonna have to stop or we'd have to take TV off our list of stuff to do together. I have a friend I won't watch stuff with because she doesn't get that I can't process 20 different convos and sounds like she can while watching TV. Seriously. I guess we all have our quirks.0 -
The conversation on ice chomping turned into this annoying sound in my head of my XXX husband doing this phlem hocking sound...thanks guys! :grumble:0
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The conversation on ice chomping turned into this annoying sound in my head of my XXX husband doing this phlem hocking sound...thanks guys! :grumble:
You have 3 x husbands? That is a Turkey in bowling terms!0 -
The conversation on ice chomping turned into this annoying sound in my head of my XXX husband doing this phlem hocking sound...thanks guys! :grumble:
You have 3 x husbands? That is a Turkey in bowling terms!
Sttttttrike! Speaking of bowling, great date idea. When your date gets up to bowl it's an excellent butt shot! Phlem hocking sound gone now, thank you. :flowerforyou:0 -
Hey Florian :flowerforyou:
You know what? You worry too much.
1. if you meet someone that stifles you and moans at you all the time about how you chew ice, you will dump her in a few weeks (maybe even days) :laugh:
2. if you meet someone that is frustrated by your lack of marraige talk, baby talk and plans for the future then she will dump you in a couple of months!
3. if you meet someone that is fun and happy to be with you, is a free spirit and gives you the freedom to be who you are, you will stay together for years!! Or at least until such time as one of you that wants more, if ever!
Number three is your COMPATIBLE other!
Just a case of finding her
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I didn't intentionally start chewing ice. I was chewing it out of habit, noticed I was doing it and she was upset, said something about her being annoyed and put it down. A few minutes later, I grabbed it again and started chewing. I didn't realize I was doing it until she started getting mad. I would have been fine with something like dammit stop that. I was not okay with what felt like 10-15 minutes of being berated only to get the what am I supposed to think about your feelings for me line when I said enough is enough. I wasn't planning to break up with her at that point and wasn't trying to get her to do the dirty work for me. It just happend that things got progressively worse after that point. When I figured trying to talk just ended up in an argument followed by the silent treatment I did end it.
I think the ice was a red herring. You already had communication issues long before that. IMHO small things like that only start to cause annoyance when bigger things are an issue. Built up resentment on both sides which is why you didnt stop and she then went on and on about your feelings......anyway, she was not the girl for you :flowerforyou:0 -
Thanks everyone. Lots of great answers, and it was interesting to read everyone's point of view.
I think the consensus is more or less on: shut up and date. Fair enough.
I guess my fear comes from the fact that I'm so awesome ( ) that the girls are instantly addicted to me! :laugh: Yeah.
Definitely not ready for LTRs... But still want to enjoy my time. I don't want to change one bit for a girl at this stage, so I can already see the drama coming, but I like my life enough to not want it to change (I don't intend to get married, ever... so I'm safe from this side!
).
I guess next time I see the girl, we shall see what happens - I'll probably be drunk anyway, so I'll be groping her all the way.
Then I'll play it so low profile that it's going to be only a shadow of a relationship... (or as usual, I'll fall in love too quickly and just end up dumped :laugh: )
@Natx83: it's true that you have a baby face. And no, I can't be Good Luck Chuck, I'd have had sex with the goth girl.0
