Is Homosexuality a Choice?

TheRoadDog

I sent this story to a friend. Got me thinking about the people that say that Gay is a conscious choice/ Do you think so?

"Steve was a very good guy. He was my youngest brother and I joined the Marines while he was still very young. We didn't really spend too much of our adult life together, but when I was going through the worst part of my life and trying to make some difficult decisions, he showed up and helped me. We spent an afternoon in a Mexican bar talking things out. From that day forward, he was always there.

When I told him that Jan was pregnant, he was the happiest for me. It was a turning point in my life. By that time, Steve has already been diagnosed with AIDS. As he got sicker, the only thing he was determined to do was attend Holland's 1st birthday. He was on a morphine drip by then and I had to carry him into the party. He was very happy. It was the last family event he attended as he died a week later.

A lot of people will tell you that being gay is a choice. Steve led a hard life and faced a lot of diversity for being gay. He told me once that being gay was no choice. If he could have made a choice, he wouldn't have chosen a life that caused him so much pain. "

MaraDiaz

Straight people die of HIV, too. So I wish you hadn't brought that part into it, I don't see how it applies.

No, I don't think it's a choice. I've been attracted to males since I was in preschool, I have no trouble believing a woman who says she was attracted to females from early childhood.

TheRoadDog

Straight people die of HIV, too. So I wish you hadn't brought that part into it, I don't see how it applies.

No, I don't think it's a choice. I've been attracted to males since I was in preschool, I have no trouble believing a woman who says she was attracted to females from early childhood.

I cut and pasted a note I sent to a friend. HIV is irrelevant.

fbmandy55

No. I don't see it as a choice just as some people are born heterosexual. It's not a man's choice to love a woman or a woman's choice to love a man.

And some are born to love both. :happy:

MaraDiaz

Straight people die of HIV, too. So I wish you hadn't brought that part into it, I don't see how it applies.

No, I don't think it's a choice. I've been attracted to males since I was in preschool, I have no trouble believing a woman who says she was attracted to females from early childhood.

I cut and pasted a note I sent to a friend. HIV is irrelevant.

Whoops, sorry, need more coffee before I start reading and posting!

k8blujay2

I was going to stay away from this and after I post this I am going to continue to stay away, because this is my opinion and my opinion only...

I don't understand how someone can know their sexuality when they are children.... I don't remember ever being "attracted" to anyone when I was 5 so I cannot fathom statements such as this... they make no sense to me based off of my own experience... I didn't even know what sex was until I was 8 and the school I went to started harping on it... I had heard the term gay when I was around that same age, because I supposedly had a gay male as a teacher who (again supposedly) hated girls... and my uncle and his life partner (both of whom I love so very dearly and do hate to see the suffering they are in with their health) came to visit us, but that's all beside the point...

To be honest, I don't know.... I don't know either way... I know that in my own personal experience with love, sexuality and the like, that I have made conscience decisions... decisions on who to date (even when I met my husband I made a conscience decision to date him and then to love him, because I was waiting for someone else at the time and then decided to give that person up).... So I don't know if you have a choice to be sexually attracted to certian people or not.... I do believe however that you do make the choice to act on it, whether subconsciously or consciously... I find it akin to the many other things that we are supposedly biologically predisposed to do...

But in the end, I just don't know... and as a result, I just live and let live.

MaraDiaz

I didn't know what sex was, either, but for some reason I knew what attraction was.

Grimmerick

It's not a choice unless you are bisexual, then maybe you could say it's a choice. I have always been attracted to guys ever since I was old enough to be attracted to anything, and never had thoughts about women, I would imagine it's the same for a gay person.

MadeOfMagic

I think for most people it's not a choice, but very very few people do choose typically because of traumatic experiences or because they swing both ways. My best friend is gay, and I love him to death, he has told me numerous times how he felt he was attracted to men since he was very very young; I don't think people would put with life of opression if they weren't just born that way. I know so many gay people, and none of those that I know of chose to be gay, it's just a natural attraction to the same sex. There is hundreds of animal species who are gay as well, it's as natural as everything else is on this planet. I think most people are born that way but there will always be a few people who weren't and chose.

summertime_girl

No, I don't think it is a choice at all. I think people are born with a genetic predisposition a certain attraction. I do think women tend to have more fluidity with their sexuality, and can form emotional attractions to other women that end up sexual, even though they primarily identify as heterosexual. But I still don't think it is a choice. I didn't "choose" to become attracted to anyone that I have ever had feelings for. I just had those feelings, for whatever reason, physical attraction, intelligence attraction, humor, etc. The fact that they were all male just means that is where my predisposition is.

summertime_girl

I didn't know what sex was, either, but for some reason I knew what attraction was.

Exactly. I remember being 5 or so, not knowing what sex was, but planning a wedding with a white dress, flowers, and all to a boy. And I know a little boy now who is six, who is adamant that he will marry a boy when he grows up. Maybe he won't, but I don't think he's making it up.

alpha2omega

I don't believe it is inherent. Many factors can play a role in making this decision such as being molested at a young age by someone of the same sex. I know of someone who this happened to yet they fail to make the connection and somehow believe the experience opened their eyes to their own sexuality.

adrian_indy

I think as Americans, or maybe as human beings, we often get roped into believing their are only two choices on an issue. Democrat or Republican. Libearl or Conservative. Gay by choice or geneitcs. In areas of sexuality, it must be acknowledged that there is homosexuality and homosexual behavior, and the two are not always linked. Humans are broadly sexual, and societal constraints do play a part on how we view homosexual behavior. It has always been my thought that a small minority of the population are true, genetic homosexuals who show no preference for the opposite sex. On the other spectrum are people who are completely hetero and show no leanings as a gay person.

But there are those, I dare say a vast majority of people, who are either mostly gay or mostly straight who can be swayed to participate in behavior not of their normal alignment. The things I think that most influence a persons exploration of their own sexuality is tolerance, time, and luxury. If you look at ancient times in the Middle East, it would be easy to see how gay behavior would be frowned upon because of a persons obligation to marry and precreate for the survival of the tribe. Not a lot of people in the frontiers of newly founded America would have the time to experiment with sexuality when they worked hellacious hours carving a meager existance out of the wilderness.

But now we have luxury, a person is not bound to procreate for survival, we work drastically shorter hours, and tolerance of homosexuality is increasing. This leads people who are mostly straight to really explore their boundries. You see it all the time inc young women who have full approval to fool around with other girls. Those girls will never marry another woman or be in a long term relationship with one, but they exhibit the behavior because it's fun to them, maybe makes them popluar, satisfies the need to experiment, feels good, ect.

You need to look no further than the ancient myths of Herakles (the real myths) to see that culture dictates our views on the whole matter. No doubt that Herakles was mostly heterosexual. He married twice, had kids, and was heralded as a great lover of women and a great lover in general. But part of his mythology (the ones they don't put in Disney films) was that his sexual appetites and skills also included men. Sex with another man was not taboo in that culture, but rather manly because he was dominating another man.

So you can see how complex the issue becomes. But to me, in the end, choice or genetics, doesn't matter since I think everyone has the right to live their life as they see fit.

EvanKeel

The HIV thing does seem a little relevant, at least in a historical context. It goes to that man's experience being gay. While it's true that HIV doesn't care what orientation you are, it was largely ignored as a disease because it was seen as primarily affecting gay men; there's a reason AIDS was initially called GRID. That's what happens when an STD affects a fairly small community that's forced by society to be somewhat insular. It becomes and epidemic. I have no particular doubt that Ronnie boy let it go because his social conservative base would have crucified him for not ignoring it.

Politics aside, it wasn't a choice for me, and I don't really like the claim that a lot of people make about "why would anyone choose this?" I get why it's said, but people make choices for all kinds of f'ed up reasons. Why people might make the choice isn't the point. Then there's the hypothetical, I get asked from time to time, "if you did have a choice, would you choose to be straight?"

And my initial response is always something like, why would I choose to be something I'm not? That's the point of asking people about the alleged choice: what we really want to know is how people feel about their identity.

Sexual orientation is a pretty darn complex. This isn't a very comprehensive answer to the question that was asked, but I think it may just not be quite the right question.

Gilbrod

It's choice. As I have said many time, live and let live.

EvanKeel

It's choice. As I have said many time, live and let live.

Are you stating this as an opinion or as if it were a fact? It's hard to tell without additional information.

ItsCasey

I was going to stay away from this and after I post this I am going to continue to stay away, because this is my opinion and my opinion only...

I don't understand how someone can know their sexuality when they are children.... I don't remember ever being "attracted" to anyone when I was 5 so I cannot fathom statements such as this... they make no sense to me based off of my own experience... I didn't even know what sex was until I was 8 and the school I went to started harping on it... I had heard the term gay when I was around that same age, because I supposedly had a gay male as a teacher who (again supposedly) hated girls... and my uncle and his life partner (both of whom I love so very dearly and do hate to see the suffering they are in with their health) came to visit us, but that's all beside the point...

To be honest, I don't know.... I don't know either way... I know that in my own personal experience with love, sexuality and the like, that I have made conscience decisions... decisions on who to date (even when I met my husband I made a conscience decision to date him and then to love him, because I was waiting for someone else at the time and then decided to give that person up).... So I don't know if you have a choice to be sexually attracted to certian people or not.... I do believe however that you do make the choice to act on it, whether subconsciously or consciously... I find it akin to the many other things that we are supposedly biologically predisposed to do...

But in the end, I just don't know... and as a result, I just live and let live.

I also do not believe we are born with a "sexuality." I think it is something that develops later on. I had a "boyfriend" at the age of 4, but it wasn't because I was sexually attracted to him. It's because I "knew" boys had girlfriends and girls had boyfriends, so I told one of my daycare friends that he was my boyfriend, and he said "okay." I think that's pretty much the extent of "attraction" at that age.

I have a few friends I've known since I was a small child and who are now "out." But it took all three of them (two girls, one guy) until adulthood to realize (not to publicly acknowledge but to realize) that they were attracted to members of the same sex. And in all three cases, I believe it was a byproduct of how they were raised.

One of the girls was quite attractive and always had boyfriends through high school, just like any other attractive girl at our school. But during senior year, she and her dad started to have very different opinions about what she should do with the rest of her life, and after a few years of a strained relationship with him, she moved to California and started dating women. I firmly believe this was a natural rebellion against the primary male figure in her life.

The same is true (in reverse) about one of my guy friends. He had some traditionally more feminine hobbies (he was into theater, sang opera, etc.), but he always dated girls and had crushes on girls (including my sister). But his dad and his older brother, who were into more masculine pursuits (hunting, fishing, etc.), never accepted him really. They always made light of his interests, went on father/son trips without him, etc.. And after he graduated from college, he, too, moved away and started dating other men. I think this was a manifestation of the fact that he never gained the approval of the male figures in his life.

So, to summarize, I think sexuality is a psychological thing. I don't think it is a conscious choice, but neither do I think we are born one way or the other. And of course as a practicing Christian, I believe the Bible's guidance is in regards to behavior. Even in the New Testament, there are stories of men with homosexual tendencies who remained celibate because the Christian precept is that the act of one man having sex with another is sinful. There are even instances in the New Testament of homosexuals turning from their previous lifestyles and having loving, successful heterosexual marriages. Considering that, along with the issue of bisexuality, people being straight and turning gay, etc., I cannot believe that people are "born this way."

EvanKeel

I was going to stay away from this and after I post this I am going to continue to stay away, because this is my opinion and my opinion only...

I don't understand how someone can know their sexuality when they are children.... I don't remember ever being "attracted" to anyone when I was 5 so I cannot fathom statements such as this... they make no sense to me based off of my own experience... I didn't even know what sex was until I was 8 and the school I went to started harping on it... I had heard the term gay when I was around that same age, because I supposedly had a gay male as a teacher who (again supposedly) hated girls... and my uncle and his life partner (both of whom I love so very dearly and do hate to see the suffering they are in with their health) came to visit us, but that's all beside the point...

To be honest, I don't know.... I don't know either way... I know that in my own personal experience with love, sexuality and the like, that I have made conscience decisions... decisions on who to date (even when I met my husband I made a conscience decision to date him and then to love him, because I was waiting for someone else at the time and then decided to give that person up).... So I don't know if you have a choice to be sexually attracted to certian people or not.... I do believe however that you do make the choice to act on it, whether subconsciously or consciously... I find it akin to the many other things that we are supposedly biologically predisposed to do...

But in the end, I just don't know... and as a result, I just live and let live.

I also do not believe we are born with a "sexuality." I think it is something that develops later on. I had a "boyfriend" at the age of 4, but it wasn't because I was sexually attracted to him. It's because I "knew" boys had girlfriends and girls had boyfriends, so I told one of my daycare friends that he was my boyfriend, and he said "okay." I think that's pretty much the extent of "attraction" at that age.

I have a few friends I've known since I was a small child and who are now "out." But it took all three of them (two girls, one guy) until adulthood to realize (not to publicly acknowledge but to realize) that they were attracted to members of the same sex. And in all three cases, I believe it was a byproduct of how they were raised.

One of the girls was quite attractive and always had boyfriends through high school, just like any other attractive girl at our school. But during senior year, she and her dad started to have very different opinions about what she should do with the rest of her life, and after a few years of a strained relationship with him, she moved to California and started dating women. I firmly believe this was a natural rebellion against the primary male figure in her life.

The same is true (in reverse) about one of my guy friends. He had some traditionally more feminine hobbies (he was into theater, sang opera, etc.), but he always dated girls and had crushes on girls (including my sister). But his dad and his older brother, who were into more masculine pursuits (hunting, fishing, etc.), never accepted him really. They always made light of his interests, went on father/son trips without him, etc.. And after he graduated from college, he, too, moved away and started dating other men. I think this was a manifestation of the fact that he never gained the approval of the male figures in his life.

So, to summarize, I think sexuality is a psychological thing. I don't think it is a conscious choice, but neither do I think we are born one way or the other. And of course as a practicing Christian, I believe the Bible's guidance is in regards to behavior. Even in the New Testament, there are stories of men with homosexual tendencies who remained celibate because the Christian precept is that the act of one man having sex with another is sinful. There are even instances in the New Testament of homosexuals turning from their previous lifestyles and having loving, successful heterosexual marriages. Considering that, along with the issue of bisexuality, people being straight and turning gay, etc., I cannot believe that people are "born this way."

People can be born one way and change without it being a choice. Sexuality can be fluid in that sense. Its fluidity doesn't necessarily indicate the possibility of choice, however.

Obviously you know your friends better than I do, but let's consider the possibility that your male friend was trying to convince himself (or perhaps just other people) that he wasn't gay by dating women. It doesn't strike me as being too odd for someone who loves theater to try and a play a role in order to gain the acceptance of his father and brother. I could always be wrong, though.

Gilbrod

It's choice. As I have said many time, live and let live.

Are you stating this as an opinion or as if it were a fact? It's hard to tell without additional information.

What does it matter? I was asked what I thought. Without getting into a tirade of arguments, I have made my mind known and I can move on. Live and let live :flowerforyou:

EvanKeel

It's choice. As I have said many time, live and let live.

Are you stating this as an opinion or as if it were a fact? It's hard to tell without additional information.

What does it matter? I was asked what I thought. Without getting into a tirade of arguments, I have made my mind known and I can move on. Live and let live :flowerforyou:

Because your opinion is your opinion. You're allowed to have it, and there's nothing really to discuss at that point. It's like saying Red is an ugly color. If on the other hand, you're stating it as a fact, then you've basically just contradicted anyone who says it wasn't a choice for them, and that's worthy of further discussion if you feel you have supporting information you find compelling.

I wasn't looking for a tirade of arguments, nor have I presented any--on this thread so far, at any rate. This is, however, a debate group. There's nothing to say that you can't treat it as a "Drop my opinion and get out of dodge" group, of course :drinker:

KimmyEB

I have a few friends I've known since I was a small child and who are now "out." But it took all three of them (two girls, one guy) until adulthood to realize (not to publicly acknowledge but to realize) that they were attracted to members of the same sex. And in all three cases, I believe it was a byproduct of how they were raised.

Did they actually, specifically tell you that? Or is that just your assumption?

One of the girls was quite attractive and always had boyfriends through high school, just like any other attractive girl at our school. But during senior year, she and her dad started to have very different opinions about what she should do with the rest of her life, and after a few years of a strained relationship with him, she moved to California and started dating women. I firmly believe this was a natural rebellion against the primary male figure in her life.

I've never had a good relationship with my father. To this day, we barely speak to each other, and argue almost constantly. Same goes for my older brother. Yet neither of us are gay. I see what you're trying to say here, but I know a LOT of people with strained relationships with one or both parents, and it has had absolutely nothing to do with their sexuality in any way. I'm sure for some people it might, but I'd really, really wager that that is not a contributing factor for a majority of people's sexuality.

The same is true (in reverse) about one of my guy friends. He had some traditionally more feminine hobbies (he was into theater, sang opera, etc.), but he always dated girls and had crushes on girls (including my sister). But his dad and his older brother, who were into more masculine pursuits (hunting, fishing, etc.), never accepted him really. They always made light of his interests, went on father/son trips without him, etc.. And after he graduated from college, he, too, moved away and started dating other men. I think this was a manifestation of the fact that he never gained the approval of the male figures in his life.

You're limiting your exposure to your friends. My personal experience is the opposite--I dated a guy for years who was the complete opposite of the males in his family, yet he was not gay. To reverse the situation, I have gay friends who, in fact, share a lot of hobbies and interests with their families.

So, to summarize, I think sexuality is a psychological thing. I don't think it is a conscious choice, but neither do I think we are born one way or the other. And of course as a practicing Christian, I believe the Bible's guidance is in regards to behavior. Even in the New Testament, there are stories of men with homosexual tendencies who remained celibate because the Christian precept is that the act of one man having sex with another is sinful. There are even instances in the New Testament of homosexuals turning from their previous lifestyles and having loving, successful heterosexual marriages. Considering that, along with the issue of bisexuality, people being straight and turning gay, etc., I cannot believe that people are "born this way."

So if the Bible was written differently and said that homosexuality is acceptable, you'd agree with that, simply because it's in the Bible? Or would it be because your own senses and thoughts agree with the statement? I'm sorry, I'm having an extremely hard time taking you seriously when you present an argument based on "Because the Bible says so" and limiting your "research" on a small group of friends whose lives may or may not be as you've presented.

As for my stance: I know I was attracted to boys and men at a very young age ("crushes" on boys and men, fantasizing about boys and men, etc.). I felt differently about my boy friends as I did my female friends. When I started dating and experimenting sexually, it was with boys and men. My thinking goes along the lines of what Summertime presented earlier. Honestly though, if someone is gay and tells me they've always been, who am I to argue? I can't possibly know their thoughts and feelings, or their complete life history and experiences. It's like someone telling me "You're straight, yes, but certain things in your life lead you to believe that." I don't know...I'm not presenting my case well. I hope it comes across.

summertime_girl

Ah, the Bible said it. Better not eat shellfish or wear pants then.

And of course, whatever a Christian (or any one else) may believe about the morality of homosexuality, has zero to do with the debate at hand regarding it being a choice or genetic hardwiring.

KimmyEB

It's choice. As I have said many time, live and let live.

Are you stating this as an opinion or as if it were a fact? It's hard to tell without additional information.

What does it matter? I was asked what I thought. Without getting into a tirade of arguments, I have made my mind known and I can move on. Live and let live :flowerforyou:

It matters because you stated a fact without any evidence, or even an opinion, to back up what you said. Like Evan stated, there's no "rules" saying you can't do that, but I feel it's "Debatable Debating Etiquette" to, you know, elaborate on such a vage opinion you state as fact.

Gilbrod

Alright, I'll bite. It's a choice to me. I find it hard to believe that if people are meant to be gay, evolution would've created a race of a-sexual beings yet. No "gay gene" has yet to be found. When I was in highschool in the 90s, I have asked ALL of my gay friends if they were ever molested as kids. ALL of them said yes. To my surpirse, 3 of them now have heterosexual relationships with families and the whole nine yards. Why the sudden change? None of them have ever gotten back to me as of now. But I find it extremely difficult to accept it as it not being a choice if you can go from straight to gay and back to straight. You can shout and yell till you're blue, but you won't convince me other wise.

Gilbrod

Ah, the Bible said it. Better not eat shellfish or wear pants then.

And of course, whatever a Christian (or any one else) may believe about the morality of homosexuality, has zero to do with the debate at hand regarding it being a choice or genetic hardwiring.

I agree with your statement. But jq did mention this:
Even in the New Testament, there are stories of men with homosexual tendencies who remained celibate because the Christian precept is that the act of one man having sex with another is sinful. There are even instances in the New Testament of homosexuals turning from their previous lifestyles and having loving, successful heterosexual marriages.

It shows a choice. Let's say they wanted to follow The Dhali Lama, they chose to refrain because of their new beliefs. It's a choice. They could've said "I can't do anything about it. It's not my choice."

fbmandy55

Alright, I'll bite. It's a choice to me. I find it hard to believe that if people are meant to be gay, evolution would've created a race of a-sexual beings yet.

Yet this is found in animals..

No "gay gene" has yet to be found. When I was in highschool in the 90s, I have asked ALL of my gay friends if they were ever molested as kids. ALL of them said yes. To my surpirse, 3 of them now have heterosexual relationships with families and the whole nine yards. Why the sudden change? None of them have ever gotten back to me as of now. But I find it extremely difficult to accept it as it not being a choice if you can go from straight to gay and back to straight. You can shout and yell till you're blue, but you won't convince me other wise.

Without a doubt I think there is a link between molestation and sexual behaviors.But there are also plenty of gay or bisexual people who were NOT molested as children or suffered through any other kind of traumatic event.

Also, being a teen and having raging hormones, it's not uncommon for people to be confused or experiment. To be honest, I remeber several occasions growing up where girls, including myself, messed around at sleepovers and such. That kind of thing was going on with my Christian school classmates AND public school friends as early as 7th grade.

EvanKeel

Alright, I'll bite. It's a choice to me. I find it hard to believe that if people are meant to be gay, evolution would've created a race of a-sexual beings yet. No "gay gene" has yet to be found. When I was in highschool in the 90s, I have asked ALL of my gay friends if they were ever molested as kids. ALL of them said yes. To my surpirse, 3 of them now have heterosexual relationships with families and the whole nine yards. Why the sudden change? None of them have ever gotten back to me as of now. But I find it extremely difficult to accept it as it not being a choice if you can go from straight to gay and back to straight. You can shout and yell till you're blue, but you won't convince me other wise.

Noted

In an effort to offer a varying perspective, I will give some counter evidence of my own however. Please keep in mind, I have no intention of trying to convince you of anything. Be comfortable in the knowledge that while I have quoted you, I am not speaking to you, or at least not just you, and I certainly wouldn't think of yelling...or turning blue. Blue skin and a red beard? That's all kinds of wrong.

I know very few of my gay friends who claim to be molested. The number is roughly equivalent to the number of straight friends I have that claim to have been molested. I can therefore draw no correlation between orientation and that particular trauma. Clearly we have different sets of data. And again, I have yet to see someone clearly state the relationship between the potential for orientation being changeable and the necessity that it must therefore be driven by choice on some level. The two aren't linked by logic that I've seen yet.

The more this topic comes up, generally not necessarily here, the more I think the topic is just a red herring. People want it to be a choice because then they believe it is wholly within the realm of behavior. For whatever reason, some people either cannot or really don't want to think of orientation as an identity.

Thankfully, SCOTUS (in lawrence v texas) has ruled that behavior and identity can't be made distinct in that way when it comes to sexual orientation.

Gilbrod

Alright, I'll bite. It's a choice to me. I find it hard to believe that if people are meant to be gay, evolution would've created a race of a-sexual beings yet.

Yet this is found in animals..

No doubt. Snakes, certain fish and insects. Nature itself shows that. I won't dispute it. But not in the human world. And those who are hermaphrodites in the human species, cannot reproduce without hormonal help.

No "gay gene" has yet to be found. When I was in highschool in the 90s, I have asked ALL of my gay friends if they were ever molested as kids. ALL of them said yes. To my surpirse, 3 of them now have heterosexual relationships with families and the whole nine yards. Why the sudden change? None of them have ever gotten back to me as of now. But I find it extremely difficult to accept it as it not being a choice if you can go from straight to gay and back to straight. You can shout and yell till you're blue, but you won't convince me other wise.

Without a doubt I think there is a link between molestation and sexual behaviors.But there are also plenty of gay or bisexual people who were NOT molested as children or suffered through any other kind of traumatic event.

Also, being a teen and having raging hormones, it's not uncommon for people to be confused or experiment. To be honest, I remeber several occasions growing up where girls, including myself, messed around at sleepovers and such. That kind of thing was going on with my Christian school classmates AND public school friends as early as 7th grade.

Yeah, my wife would tell me those kinds of stories. I sometimes think Christian schools are worse than regular schools. But that's a different topic.

LuckyLeprechaun

I don't understand how someone can know their sexuality when they are children....

You don't necessarily view it as a child in terms of "sex" but there are still thoughts that demonstrate orientation. I loved fantasizing about my dream wedding I would someday have........and in my child's imagination, I had no idea about any of the things that would take place on a honeymoon....but I did know that I wanted to find a groom for my someday wedding, not a bride.

That's what I believe is meant when someone says they've "always" known.

CasperO

My pal Jim says he knew when he was 7 years old. Most of the other boys had a crush on Miss Jones the reading teacher, and he had a crush on Mr. Smith the math teacher. Straight up natural attraction, gay as an easter bonnet and always was. Born that way, no doubt in my mind.

SO - straight folks who believe it's a choice. Can you describe how you "Chose" to be hetero? The day you weighed your options and made a rational decision?

LuckyLeprechaun

imho, gay:

1. is, in a majority of cases, of biological origin. There are exceptions where it's chosen/experimented with/etc. But I definitely DO believe it is something genetically inherent.

2. is never a good enough reason to discriminate against someone or curtail their rights.


When society makes it such a hard path to be gay, why would someone choose that? I get that there are always folks who choose exactly what society deems to be unacceptable, (for example, a person who has facial tattoos has chosen something society dislikes, and they give no ****s).

The very high incidence of suicide among gay youth is an indicator in my mind of how many young people struggle with this, and suffer because of it. If it were just a choice, then I doubt it would be such a difficult struggle.