I wouldn't supplement without evidence of a deficiency first. I don't want to paint with a broad brush, but the whole industry is basically a scam. There are very few people who need a supplement, and those would be very specific to the person. My father-in-law, for example, needs a magnesium supplement due to the effects of chemo. He gets IV Mg but it's not enough without the supplement.

greenautumn17 wrote: »

I myself take a multivitamin, D3, and a Cal/Mag/Zinc tab. I am 48, but postmenopause, so my multi is 50+ (no iron). I try to get the best quality brands - not some cheapo dollar store ones (I can't believe people actually buy those! They are basically corn starch shaped like a pill, IMO )

I was surprised to see how many pills use corn starch as their binder. The multivitamin I used to take has glucose in its list, that's the last thing I need!

There are case reports of people on low-carb diets developing scurvy (vitamin C deficiency, even though they were meeting the RDA intake, the low-carb metabolism changes the way vitamin C is recycled in the body so losses are higher). There are also case reports of selenium deficiency, again due to increased excretion and not due to limited intake. At the moment I'm supplementing both of these for a few weeks because of a lingering illness and issues with wound healing.

The other supplements I take are due to other medical concerns. I take manganese and B-vitamin complex to help optimize energy and acetylcholine production for Myasthenia Gravis. I take fish oil to improve my Omega-3 to Omega-6 ratio to decrease systemic inflammation and autoimmune response. I take bone meal for calcium supplementation while I'm avoiding dairy (and because I'm on steroids, which leech minerals from the bones). I take vitamin D due to a deficiency.

I agree with FitGoat regarding establishing if there is a deficiency or need before paying for supplements. There are chances of toxicity for many (for me, I watch my manganese and vitamin D levels). They can interact with other medications, and the pills themselves contain binders and fillers that can affect people. (Personally, I have to watch for soy, magnesium, and corn / maltodextrin fillers because they worsen the MG symptoms).

I take 10,000 mcg's of biotin daily and started the chromium (800 mcg) two weeks ago, along with calcium and d3 (both suggested by my doctor). Other than weight loss seeming to increase, I haven't noticed anything else different. (I'm also not contributing the losses to the supplements either, that is likely purely from my body adapting to the diet.) I started the chromium because of the research showing it is helpful for T2's and insulin resistance. Honestly, I haven't checked my blood sugar in a week so I couldn't tell you if it's working on that front or not.

The biotin is for my hair/nails. I was losing hair insanely bad pre-LC and it's just now starting to ease up a bit. I've tried biotin before with no results, but my stylist and mother insist it works. It was cheap at CVS and easy to swallow. Maybe I just need to give it longer. I'll at least finish the bottle out.

I also take 300-500 mg of magnesium citrate a day before bed. It helps me poop, sleep, and relax LOL.

I have a really really hard time swallowing anything bigger than an advil so most multi's are out of the question, and the gummies/chewables have way too much sugar in them. Took me forever to find a calcium chewable that didn't.

My hubby and I are soon to be TTC, so I'm hoping I can find a decent prenatal that will be easy to swallow.

The chromium picolinate I take is a very small pill. I get it at CVS, it's Nature's Bounty. The biotin is the CVS brand, but I've never seen a large biotin pill. Women's One a Day makes a petite version of a multi, but I can only find it on Amazon. I'm not taking a multi vitamin right now though, but I've used those in the past. Still hard for me to swallow, but better than the horse pills LOL.

I'll have to check that out sweettea next time I head that way. If/When I get pregnant I plan on staying low carb if the Dr. says it's okay. 4 carbs a day aren't too bad I suppose for a baby's well being!

I take a probiotic, potassium, magnesium, selenium, D3 daily and a multi for women every other day. All but the selenium was at the recommendation of my doctor. I read the selenium helps with lymphedema and thyroid and my doctor says it won't hurt.

Thanks @greenautumn17 I will check. I thought it was the opposite, that some high BP meds require supplementation like Lasix.

And one regarding the selenium deficiency:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/22367552/?i=57&from=ketogenic deficiency NOT GLUT1

@Cheesy567 : it's worth noting that your example is a 9yo child with other medical complications. The clinical picture is larger than the information given in the case study paragraph; the reader cannot determine why she tested so low - something else going on in her body, not eating any food with Vit C, how many and what kind of carbs she was regularly eating, etc.
Insulin is the vehicle by which Vit C is recycled back to cells as opposed to being excreted, and Vit C is vital to brain function. The low carb diet reduces the amount of insulin in the blood (or how alters how it works?). So it would seem less Vit C is recycled back to the cells. I think that those people who are zero carb are at the most risk of developing complications due to low blood serum levels. So, I agree with you that some sort of balance needs to be struck between carb intake and Vit C levels, at least in the long run.
The cool thing though, is that you can get your good (and low) carbs with Vit C in the produce section! Broccoli and green veggies have lots.
I would also add though - that some people can be running low without complications and don't realize it, and some people just don't develop low levels. As with everything, knowing your own body is the best way to tell.
This is another source about it:
https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/VitaminC-Consumer/
and another
http://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/bhcv2/bhcarticles.nsf/pages/Scurvy

Have a good night!

If you live near a junior college or university/college you should just be able to go to their library and find articles like that without waiting for an ILL, they take forever. Public colleges don't care(and I doubt they could kick you off for expanding your knowledge) if you're there.

Cheesy567 wrote: »

FIT_Goat wrote: »

This is not true. I would like to see said case reports. I've ingested exactly zero vitamin C for over a year, on the lowest of the low carb diets possible, and I can assure you that I don't have scurvy. In fact, the opposite is true. Vitamin C and glucose compete for the same metabolic pathway, and vitamin C loses this competition. Eating carbohydrates dramatically increases your need for vitamin C, not the other way around.

Here you go:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/18793598/?i=2&from=scurvy low carbohydrate diet

One case resulting from the pediatric keto diet. I am looking for studies and research that shows it is a normal risk and that vitamin c usage is higher among low carbers.

I had found that case, but without reporting what food the child ate, it doesn't give enough information. The medical keto diet for epilepsy is often vastly different from how even the most insane keto dieter would eat.

Edit: The simple fact is that people eating meat-only diets don't get scurvy. That's a low-carb as you go and includes no vitamin C from diet. The concerns about scurvy are fear mongering.

I'm not meaning to be a dick, but the ketogenic diet for treating childhood epilepsy (typically a 4:1 diet compounded with extremely low protein and dehydration) is hardly in the same category as low-carb diets in general. You said there were case reports of people experiencing scurvy on low carb diets, not a medical ketogenic diet. Those children suffered from many other conditions that are unlikely to be related to a more balanced and hydrated low-carb diet.

Note: I would suspect it's the lack of protein in the medical diet (often 30 g/day or less) that causes the extra need for vitamin C. As one of the primary jobs is making collagen. It makes me curious as to whether or not the need for making collagen varies based on diet. There are other possible causes and conditions which consume vitamin C at atypical levels. In any case, the childhood epilepsy diet isn't a typical low carb diet.

I do happen to know of one person who claims to have gotten scurvy from a nutritionally sufficent low-carb diet. The author also gets into selenium deficiency: http://perfecthealthdiet.com/2010/11/danger-of-zero-carb-diets-iii-scurvy/ -- having read it, I just don't buy what he's selling. I actually don't know what his point is, aside from don't do zero-carb, since he developed scurvy while taking vitamin C supplements, much like the girl in the study. If both these people can develop scurvy taking more vitamin C than the RDA, why is the recommendation to do roughly the same thing they did?

From the comments below that link: “Vitamin C is required to form collagen in the body, and it does this – despite being described everywhere as an antioxidant – by oxidation. Vitamin C’s role in collagen formation is to transfer a hydroxyl group to the amino acids lysine and proline. Meat, however, already contains appreciable quantities of hydroxylysine and hydroxyproline, bypassing some of the requirement for vitamin C. In other words, your vitamin C requirement is dependent upon how much meat you do not eat.”

That kind of goes along with my suspicion about why the medical ketogenic diet might cause it.

Scurvy is a very scary sounding disease. But, if you're eating fresh meat and generally consuming whole foods, you are at very low risk of it. I'm not saying that you're intentionally fear-mongering. I believe you're repeating what you've been told or led to believe is an appreciable risk. But, I think this "you'll get scurvy" idea started as fear-mongering. I could be wrong, maybe it started as just a misunderstanding. Who knows.