Is it really just Calories In, Calories Out? What do you think?
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For losing weight CICO works. I lost over 60 lbs. following it. Yes, for a healthy bod, we need to pay attention to lots of other stuff. I still eat pizza and bacon, but I also eat lots of fruits and veggies. Everything in moderation and working toward a balance. Happy body0
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I planned my quit when I gave up smoking. I started exercising daily, I changed my diet to everything healthy and cut down the portions (used MFP to track) - if CICO was the reason, I should never have put on 20 kgs - but I did. Even the doctor could only offer suggestions i.e. lower dopamine level due to quitting smoking, blood tests showing peri-menopause at the time etc BUT she did say my health was amazing despite the weight gain so she believed me on what I was doing (plus she'd seen me out walking etc a few times).
It was honestly frustrating and depressing - this is where the confusion arises though - the only way I could get the weight to stop going on was to go to what is now the "dieting" calories - the only way I could get it OFF was to go to one of the VLCD (very low carb diets) which equated to 800 calories per day...THIS WORKED, but as we know and I learned - 3 months later & 15kg lower was about all a human can sustain and the minute i started eating normally again it rapidly went back on.
Even with MFP, I suspect my good buddy Menopause, pokes her head in now and then and it is necessary for me to do 2 days a week where I'm well under the recommended daily intake, despite the sirens and flashing lights the programme tells me about
Sounds like an excuse I guess, but I suspect I should've quit smoking well before Mother Menopause decided to mess with my mind
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I read many share the challenges of menopause
I don't have to deal with it but certainly have a compassion for those that do0 -
I've been stuck at a plateau for about 3 months even though I'm walking 3 to 5+ miles a day and have started strength training in the last few weeks. Hope to break the plateau with the strength training. All I read seems to indicate that it does help your metabolism to build muscle tone. My thyroid has just been wreaking havoc with my metabolism and motivation. A couple of years ago I lost about 30 pounds using MFP, working out and then one day I quit logging in and got out of the habit of working out and gained 25 of it back in what seemed like 6 months. Perhaps it was a little longer but it scared the heck out of me. I really think I lost it too fast and my thyroid went wacko on me.0
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sunshine77493 wrote: »I've been stuck at a plateau for about 3 months even though I'm walking 3 to 5+ miles a day and have started strength training in the last few weeks. Hope to break the plateau with the strength training. All I read seems to indicate that it does help your metabolism to build muscle tone. My thyroid has just been wreaking havoc with my metabolism and motivation. A couple of years ago I lost about 30 pounds using MFP, working out and then one day I quit logging in and got out of the habit of working out and gained 25 of it back in what seemed like 6 months. Perhaps it was a little longer but it scared the heck out of me. I really think I lost it too fast and my thyroid went wacko on me.
I have been in the horrors of a plateau for over a month now. I exercise and log and all that. I recently had a complete physical and my thyroid is fine. I am starting on the change of life journey, apparently, but cannot believe it can cause havoc so quickly. My sister and I are starting to alternate our walking with some of the T25 workouts. I hope that helps move things along. She just started MFP yesterday. I invited her to join our group but she says "I am 49 1/2. I am not going near anything for 50 year olds til that sad day comes.' We are dramatic in our family and are railing against middle age. I am just about halfway to goal. I want my body to get with the program and start acting so obstreperously.
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Such a wealth of experience, knowledge and understanding of lifestyles in all the above posts. You humble me with all your determination to succeed despite numerous obstacles. I think that is what the young people on the main forum don't understand. They have healthy, fit bodies and are at the stage of life where energy should be in abundance. We on the other hand, have aching joints, crook backs and a history of goodness knows what types of past injuries and illnesses to incorporate into our exercise regime.
So yes, CICO is very important and so is exercise but I think most of us know that it is only a small part of the overall picture.
Unbelievable, a whole two pages on this subject without one snide, nasty remark.
I haven't been around lately because of a busy time at work but is it my imagination but has the main forum changed a bit? It doesn't seem quite as nasty or did I just pop in on a good day???? 0 -
Unbelievable, a whole two pages on this subject without one snide, nasty remark. I haven't been around lately because of a busy time at work but is it my imagination but has the main forum changed a bit? It doesn't seem quite as nasty or did I just pop in on a good day????
Yes, it is wonderful to have such a great group of experienced & supportive members.
On the main forums, the powers to be came in last week and tried to put the hammer down on some of those few that ruin it for everyone else. They even closed a couple of the worst out of control discussions and lectured the participants. Hopefully it does some good. Maybe they can learn something from the example this group puts out. 0 -
There is a lot to be said for maturity.0
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I was lifting hard two days a week and biking hard three days a week
The scale was bouncing up and down and I did see some tape measure changes.
But I took two light exercise days and watched my calorie intake to be lower carb those two days....
And then the couple pound whoosh happened. 3 weeks of essentially a plateau ended with 3 pounds and change drop.
It is easy to get discouraged. I was getting frustrated but hung in there.
Sometimes I think my body is just as stubborn as my mind! It does not like to change too much too soon!
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It's nice to have this island of civility and maturity here. I occasionally look around the main forums, and it reminds me of a phrase we use at the fire department, 'Not my circus, not my monkeys'.
PS Congrats on the drop Pro. Do you find the high cardio load affects moving up the numbers with your lifting?0 -
nice thread good thoughts, alot has to be said for reduced to no sugar, no whites and sensible portions, i refuse the piece of meat my wife does not eat, I used to be a garbage can lol!!0
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It's nice to have this island of civility and maturity here. I occasionally look around the main forums, and it reminds me of a phrase we use at the fire department, 'Not my circus, not my monkeys'.
PS Congrats on the drop Pro. Do you find the high cardio load affects moving up the numbers with your lifting?
Honestly sleep is the biggest determinant to my lifting strength and gains. I'm predisposed to add muscle easily but have a terrible time losing fat. It is a constant struggle.
Maybe just being older? But I need my rest days. I can't burn the candle at both ends. The body just says no!
The higher cardio helps everything. Resting heart rate, blood pressure, burning fat, 127 total cholesterol.
I hated running. Cycling is fun and I see more 50 year old people riding.
I talked to a guy day before yesterday about his grandkids and how he got them some bikes. I think he is in his early 60's and was just pulling in the parking area from a 25 mile ride.
I found my cardio of choice. And low impact on the joints so I do it longer.
Very positive all the way around.
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^^^ I've started taking to biking too. I'm just starting again so I'm not close to being in your league. However, I've found I really enjoy it more than walking or jogging. It's easier on my body but I still am getting a good workout. I also enjoy the scenery and the distance I can cover. Reminds me of riding when I was young, I lived on my bike back then.0
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^^^ I've started taking to biking too. I'm just starting again so I'm not close to being in your league. However, I've found I really enjoy it more than walking or jogging. It's easier on my body but I still am getting a good workout. I also enjoy the scenery and the distance I can cover. Reminds me of riding when I was young, I lived on my bike back then.
You popping any wheelies yet, BRaye? It's funny how once you get started exercising and seeing some results you start to want to do more and different exercises. I loved riding when I was a kid. Haven't had a bike in years. Should contemplate getting one. 0 -
nikkib0103 wrote: »You popping any wheelies yet, BRaye? It's funny how once you get started exercising and seeing some results you start to want to do more and different exercises. I loved riding when I was a kid. Haven't had a bike in years. Should contemplate getting one.
No wheelies for me, but I am surprised at how quickly my pace has picked up. I can also really tell improvement in my leg strength. I found a bike at a local garage sale for $30 - someone's abandoned exercise commitment. I even got up an hour early today and did my ride before work, it was really enjoyable and I set a new fastest pace.0 -
Is weight just CICO?
Long term yes, short term weight change isn't just fat which confuses the picture - I can gain weight short term with a huge calorie deficit, I can also typically gain 1lb a day when I'm away on holiday (but only about half that is fat). Let's face it just drinking a pint of water adds a pound!
Further confusing items are that calculators are just a rough average and there's few people who are truly average - think bell curves....
Then add that people are dreadful at logging intake accurately (just look at all the threads on the main forums "I'm only eating 1200/day and not losing" - vast majority are simply hopeless at logging).
Then add that exercise and activity burns are estimates and most people either have blind and uneducated faith in gadgets or websites and unrealistic overestimates of their effort level.
Yes it's just CICO - but that doesn't make it simple.
Adherence is complex and individual. My recipe for success was stopping blaming someone else for me staying fat, taking responsibility for what/how much I put in my mouth and overcoming hurdles which has prevented me from dedicating enough time to the exercise I enjoy (injuries and "me time").
But that's my recipe and of those elements taking responsibility for how much we eat is really the only constant that applies to everyone.0 -
Bravo!!! I keep preaching that, but sometimes I feel like I am talking to the walls. Well said.0
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Technically yes, but if your CI consist of beer, pizza, and donuts, you're going up reach your calorie goal very quickly, will be unlikely to be satisfied, be subject to cravings and binges, all of which diminishes your likelihood of long term success.0
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@lorrpb - What she said.0
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Is weight just CICO?
Long term yes, short term weight change isn't just fat which confuses the picture - I can gain weight short term with a huge calorie deficit, I can also typically gain 1lb a day when I'm away on holiday (but only about half that is fat). Let's face it just drinking a pint of water adds a pound!
Further confusing items are that calculators are just a rough average and there's few people who are truly average - think bell curves....
Then add that people are dreadful at logging intake accurately (just look at all the threads on the main forums "I'm only eating 1200/day and not losing" - vast majority are simply hopeless at logging).
Then add that exercise and activity burns are estimates and most people either have blind and uneducated faith in gadgets or websites and unrealistic overestimates of their effort level.
Yes it's just CICO - but that doesn't make it simple.
Adherence is complex and individual. My recipe for success was stopping blaming someone else for me staying fat, taking responsibility for what/how much I put in my mouth and overcoming hurdles which has prevented me from dedicating enough time to the exercise I enjoy (injuries and "me time").
But that's my recipe and of those elements taking responsibility for how much we eat is really the only constant that applies to everyone.
As a core principal, yes, totally agree 100%, but for women there are hormones that enter the big picture and unfortunately makes the process more complex. Low estrogen alone can make a women gain weight.0 -
I do believe that it's basically CICO that matter in weight loss. However, I also think it matters (for each individual) where those calories come from. I've been really working hard the last couple of months and the results haven't been anything that I want. So, I'm tweaking the plan. This week I'm upping the protein and decreasing the carbs. I'm going to do this for about a month and see if the results improve. Fingers crossed!!
I also firmly believe (for me) that water is extremely necessary. If I don't drink enough water I don't see any results. I also have to exercise, because it makes me feel better and most importantly it lets me eat more food. 0 -
Agreed! I really don't care for exercise. but it is no longer optional And yes, I get more food. YAY!0
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This conversation has been delightful! I am a believer in CICO, but I eat low carb (more like low glycemic) because I can manage my blood sugar and cravings better this way. And I suspect that this also helps me discipline myself to plan meals for the week.0
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I think it's probably complicated. Some of each. Not simple as a checking/savings account but more like a Goldman financial instrument, especially as we age. So inputs matter, and outputs matter, and finding our right individual mojito of inputs and outputs is essential!0
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CICO is working for me so far (34 pounds down, 20-some to go). I'm 59, have been quite active for a dozen years (rowing, spinning, biking, etc.), but overweight most of my life (in the obese BMI range in recent years).
I'm waaay menopausal (went into menopause around age 45 due to chemotherapy), hypothyroid, and have bad knees (torn meniscus in one. general yuck in both).
I'm lucky enough to be retired now, which makes regular exercise easier. I miss it if I don't do it (feel cranky and generally poor), and I love, love, LOVE rowing - I do most other things just to stay in good shape for it. It would be harder to be active without that "love" thing going on. But being active didn't budge my weight - I could always, and easily, out-eat my activity level, even as a long-term (since 1974) vegetarian.
I sometimes wonder if my active life for the past decade-plus has helped my metabolism (more muscle?) so that being menopausal doesn't seem to be a problem for me. But I also didn't experience much weight gain when I was taking anti-estrogen drugs on account of the breast cancer, pre-active-life. (Just lucky for some reason, with respect to weight gain & hormones, I guess.)
It does seem like getting good sleep helps the weight loss (oh, yeah - I have sleep apnea & sleep interruption insomnia since chemo, too . . . heh).0 -
I think the inherent limits of MFP sometimes sets inconsistent goals. For example, whether I plug in .5 lbs per week or 2 pounds per week, MFP sets my calorie goals at 1200. Logic dictates that I cannot eat the same number of calories to lose two pounds as to lose half a pound. I know that as long as I eat less than 1100 calories a day and do not eat back my exercise calories (and most days, I walk/jog/step for about 2 hours) I will lose between 1.5 and 2 lbs a week. If I followed the calorie goals of MFP and relied on being able to eat back exercie calories, I am fairly sure I would stall. I think part of the trick with CICO is figuring out how your body works, and adjusting MFP recommendations to take that into account. That said, after I had part of my thyroid removed, it took a long time to figure out what dose of thyroid medicine allowed me to function properly, and for awhile, I could eat 700 calories a day and walk on the treadmill an hour each evening, and not lose an ounce.0
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I think the inherent limits of MFP sometimes sets inconsistent goals. For example, whether I plug in .5 lbs per week or 2 pounds per week, MFP sets my calorie goals at 1200. Logic dictates that I cannot eat the same number of calories to lose two pounds as to lose half a pound. I know that as long as I eat less than 1100 calories a day and do not eat back my exercise calories (and most days, I walk/jog/step for about 2 hours) I will lose between 1.5 and 2 lbs a week. If I followed the calorie goals of MFP and relied on being able to eat back exercie calories, I am fairly sure I would stall. I think part of the trick with CICO is figuring out how your body works, and adjusting MFP recommendations to take that into account. That said, after I had part of my thyroid removed, it took a long time to figure out what dose of thyroid medicine allowed me to function properly, and for awhile, I could eat 700 calories a day and walk on the treadmill an hour each evening, and not lose an ounce.
I have found similar things. However, I have noticed that I get more exercise calories if I lower my weight loss weekly goal. That is probably where the difference is. MFP will not allow us to go under 1200 calories a day. However, I have tried to lower my carbs and increase my protein and all I get for it is frustration. I like my carbs too much, I guess. Although I do keep it set a bit lower than what MFP sets for me. I have found that I need to keep my calories within 100 calories of the 1200 to keep up a weight loss. If I eat too many of my exercise calories back I will stall. I save those for special occasions now. Also, even though my tracking is pretty accurate (I weigh my food, etc, etc) we do eat out a couple of times a week and I figure that the uneaten exercise calories helps compensate for the hidden calories in restaurant meals.0 -
Sometimes it is a real struggle to find the correct calories. Sometimes the same food and amounts will be listed at different calorie amounts. And some stuff, all you can do is estimate at best. If there is a disagreement in the database on the same food item I will plug in the higher. Still while I may be off here and there I find that tracking and keeping as accurate account of CICO is the only way I am going to be successful.0
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Personally, I could never do the 1200 limit. I admire those that can. I had to settle for losing slower, but I got there.0
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I could lose at 1500 when I started, but now if I want the scale to move, I have to stay below 1200. I don't think I eat any less, but I am always looking for ways to cut a few extra calories and have my little vices like sugar-free jello, and frozen juice pops that feel like a treat without adding a lot of calories.0
