Want to be a fat burner? Exercise!
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I guess I'm the only one sitting back with eyes glazed over repeating to myself 'bonk-proof marathon, bonk-proof marathon, bonk-proof marathon' like some sort of a magical mantra. I will run my half marathon fasted, with no icky gels, at a steady rate, while burning FAT. Squee! Now here is a question... they only ran the athletes for 3 hours. I wonder if over longer distances the LCHF athletes wouldn't have an advantage of keeping a steadier pace due to a steadier supply of energy, unlike LFHC guys who would have to re-fuel and whose energy levels would spike and crest?0
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Christine_72 wrote: »@auntstephie321, your body is designed to provide you with all the fat you need. Every gram of fat you eat is a gram less of body fat that you'll burn
@wabmester Am I reading this right?? It comes across as eat less fat to burn more fat.
This is why people say to eat until satisfied, but not til full.
And that you don't HAVE TO meet the fat goal. But, it's still important to get enough... You shouldn't be hungry on low carb. If you are, you're probably not eating enough fat or enough in general. Could be one or the other... Or even both.0 -
Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »Christine_72 wrote: »@auntstephie321, your body is designed to provide you with all the fat you need. Every gram of fat you eat is a gram less of body fat that you'll burn
@wabmester Am I reading this right?? It comes across as eat less fat to burn more fat.
This is why people say to eat until satisfied, but not til full.
And that you don't HAVE TO meet the fat goal. But, it's still important to get enough... You shouldn't be hungry on low carb. If you are, you're probably not eating enough fat or enough in general. Could be one or the other... Or even both.
Yeah true. I've often seen people grumbling that they can't hit their fat goal without shoveling in more food even though they're not hungry...0 -
@Lillith32, I think Zach Bitter was one of the athletes in the study. He runs for what, 11 hours at a time?
You've probably heard his interviews already, but here they are:
http://www.enduranceplanet.com/pt-1-dr-jeff-volek-and-zach-bitter-introducing-the-faster-study-and-low-carb-fueling-for-athletes/
http://www.enduranceplanet.com/pt-2-dr-jeff-volek-and-zach-bitter-inside-the-faster-study-and-low-carb-fueling-for-athletes/
http://www.enduranceplanet.com/pt-3-dr-jeff-volek-and-zach-bitter-practical-implications-from-the-faster-study-and-low-carb-fueling-for-athletes/0 -
who can run for that long. there must be something wrong with me, I can't run for more than like a minute.1
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@wabmester, no I haven't, but now I got something to listen to for the two hours I'll be stuck in traffic on my way home.0
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Stephie, you can only run for a minute, but it sounds like you have good endurance for indoor exercise.
I think in the interview he says his "forever pace" is something like 7:30 per mile. That's my sprint pace.
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I'm working on it! I feel like exercising more, since I feel better. I've actually been wondering if I would benefit from some HITT (is that right?). Might be good for me to do these shorter exercises, and adjust it to fit my ability until I can do it all. Pain is a huge downer to the exercise motivation! 0
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A couple of benefits of HIIT: less time (more efficient), and less post-exercise hunger.
Just be careful of injury. I wouldn't start with HIIT, but work up to it. I like low-impact HIIT, like a stationary bike with the resistance cranked up high.0 -
I'm working on it! I feel like exercising more, since I feel better. I've actually been wondering if I would benefit from some HITT (is that right?). Might be good for me to do these shorter exercises, and adjust it to fit my ability until I can do it all. Pain is a huge downer to the exercise motivation!
HIIT but I know nothing about it.
I'm loving how much stronger I feel especially in my back and I'm starting to get over the fear of pain because I haven't had any other than the usual muscle soreness from working underused muscles0 -
Christine_72 wrote: »Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »Christine_72 wrote: »@auntstephie321, your body is designed to provide you with all the fat you need. Every gram of fat you eat is a gram less of body fat that you'll burn
@wabmester Am I reading this right?? It comes across as eat less fat to burn more fat.
This is why people say to eat until satisfied, but not til full.
And that you don't HAVE TO meet the fat goal. But, it's still important to get enough... You shouldn't be hungry on low carb. If you are, you're probably not eating enough fat or enough in general. Could be one or the other... Or even both.
Yeah true. I've often seen people grumbling that they can't hit their fat goal without shoveling in more food even though they're not hungry...
Totally unnecessary in my opinion. Also why I think it's ok to be over in protein (compared to fat) when you have a lot to lose. If you are eating in a deficit you still will be pulling a lot of calories from fat.0 -
Thank you @wabmester! I have a good recumbent bike I haven't used for a long time! Thanks!0
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Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »Omg! Why does everything in the universe constantly keep telling me that I need to exercise at this point if I want to keep making progress?!?!
Quit telling me what I am trying so hard to ignore darn you!
I just cannot find any joy in any exercise. I don't wanna do not fun stuff! Ugh!
Sadly, this is me too. All exercise "gurus" say "find something fun". Reading is fun, watching the clouds move is fun, exercise is not fun, sorry.
What I found less difficult for me:
1. I got a mini trampoline and just go there and bounce for a few minutes now and then when I'm home. I have it on the balcony so that counts as going out too.
2. I love to dance so if I feel energetic enough I follow bollywood workouts, at least until I get too exhausted to move (which sometimes is little past the warm up routine). It's so silly that it doesn't feel like exercise if done occasionally but I'm yet to be able to schedule it.
3. I was once a certified Yoga teacher so I reintroduced the practice very slowly. It makes me sad how far my mobility deteriorated but I would like to be able to do at least the basic routines.
4. I program visits to museums or other attractions that force me to walk. I need a "reason" to walk, a carrot to keep me interested.
But still, what I would like would be to be able to disconnect my mind from my body and have the body exercising while my mind was occupied with more interesting things (that's why the museums work for me, I can easily walk the whole afternoon and only notice I'm exhausted when I leave).
Anyone ever tried one of those Vibraslim plates? Something like this: https://youtu.be/SXqvW-EZ4Do
It looks like the kind of passive exercise I'd do while watching TV without much effort but the machines are very expensive and I hesitate to buy one only to find that's all hype.0 -
Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »Omg! Why does everything in the universe constantly keep telling me that I need to exercise at this point if I want to keep making progress?!?!
Quit telling me what I am trying so hard to ignore darn you!
I just cannot find any joy in any exercise. I don't wanna do not fun stuff! Ugh!
Dancing, yardwork, dog walking, volleyball, tennis, walks in nature, walks in malls, walks in picturesque parts of a city, walks in parks with friends, stationary bike while watching a movie or answering email on your phone or tablet ..... there are a lot of ways to be more active without calling it exercise, and a lot of ways to make cardio, at least, more entertaining.
@KetoGirl83 I read on a recumbent bike and it's fun.
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lithezebra wrote: »@KetoGirl83 I read on a recumbent bike and it's fun.
LOL, your idea of fun and mine are very different. I know a recumbent bike is supposed to be better for your health than a regular bike but it takes a lot of space and bikes... urghh!
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@auntstephie321, your body is designed to provide you with all the fat you need. Every gram of fat you eat is a gram less of body fat that you'll burn.
Exercise does increase ketone levels, and that + sweat will cause sodium losses. I need a sodium fix before and after runs, even at 100g carbs.
I saw your OP and immediately went out for a run, my first since going LCHF and losing 50 lbs. I felt the sodium depletion about a mile in. I'll definitely keep this in mind next time!
Thanks for posting! I'll need to read up more on running keto now.0 -
annalisbeth74 wrote: »I saw your OP and immediately went out for a run
I went for a run immediately after posting it.
A few more interesting tidbits from the study. The 10 LC athletes were all clearly keto-adapted. They were low-carb for an average of 20 months.
Their average carb intake was 82g (range 20-144g). Higher than the typical levels around here, but a testament to the ability to burn excess carbs and to make ketones with exercise.
Volek found some unexpected results in terms of muscle glycogen, and since the glycogen handling differed from his own earlier studies, he attributed it to the long-term adaptation of these athletes. I won't go into the details, but there's some interesting speculation and analogies in there, like....
The muscle glycogen responses in the LC athletes share some similarities to that of highly trained Alaskan sled dogs. Sled dogs have an innately high endurance capacity and often perform several hours of running at submaximal intensity while consuming a high-fat/low-carbohydrate diet.
This will add more mystique to the already-mysterious concept of "keto-adaptation."
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sault_girl wrote: »The major point is that "fat-adapted" is almost meaningless for the sedentary, but it's hugely meaningful during exercise. If you're going to be LCHF, you might as well exploit it.
It's my understanding that LCHF is a huge advantage for endurance-type exercise, less so for intense (i.e. heavy weight) exercise.
Sort of. Endurance athletes like it because it delays "bonking" -- glycogen depletion.
But you've heard of the "fat burning zone," right? Everybody's muscles primarily burn fat during low levels of exertion, like walking.
LCHF extends that zone, so that higher levels of exertion also burn fat, where it would burn glycogen in sugar burners.
So even weight lifters will burn more fat. The more you exercise, and the higher intensity, the more fat you'll burn. That's the main difference between fat burners and sugar burners. Well, that, and the brain's metabolism.
In keeping with some of the exercise suggestions on this thread, "bonking" means something quite different in the UK. Though it could lead to glycogen depletion under certain circumstances.0 -
totaloblivia wrote: »In keeping with some of the exercise suggestions on this thread, "bonking" means something quite different in the UK. Though it could lead to glycogen depletion under certain circumstances.
Some fun exercise tips in this thread, eh? In the US, we have a similar word: boinking. 0 -
@wabmester there were an interesting discussion about this study elsewhere on the interwebs, they mentioned that the keto-adapted athletes' VO2 maxes were out of the ordinary as well?0
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VO2max was about the same for both groups -- averaged 64. (Mine is estimated at 47).
Maybe they were discussing the fact that peak fat oxidation happened at a high exertion level for the LC group (70% VO2max vs 55% for the high-carbers). That is the magic of fat-adaptation. Not only do you burn fat at a higher rate, but it keeps going up at higher exertion levels. Wider "fat burning zone."0 -
I'd like to see this done with people who are not pro and semi pro athletes to see how this will translate to the general population.1
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I normally do workout fasted, but today I didn't get to the gym in the morning and now it's lunch time (breakfast for my version of IF) and I'm postponing food until after I go to the gym and do my 10k of rowing. (not for 3 dang hours like those bros in the study) 0
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I just finished reading the study, and I agree with @Lillith32. I'd like to see what happens with the average keto-adapted person who's not an elite athlete. Would our rates of fat oxidation be similar? I sure hope so!
At any rate, this fave me the push I needed to start running again, and I am finding it easier now in keto than I did before on a HC diet.0 -
As I'm reading this thread, thinking, "Hey, I should go for a run" (I have barely run since my Thanksgiving 5K), it starts monsooning outside.
Strength it is! I haven't done that in a few weeks since I injured my back doing YAYOG's circuit training workout for the first time.
I really wish I could afford a trainer since I've had so many issues hurting myself with strength training even when I start slowly and try to follow all the best advice! I truly can't right now though; any extra $$ is being put toward a decent car for DH and we keep getting hit the past six weeks with other unexpected expenses.0 -
I would expect that a fat adapted, non elite athlete being compared to a carb eating, non elite athlete would show a similar difference in fat burning ability. Why would it not? Right?0
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The rate might be different. I'd love to know the rate and if it depends on fitness levels or fat adaptation levels.Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »I would expect that a fat adapted, non elite athlete being compared to a carb eating, non elite athlete would show a similar difference in fat burning ability. Why would it not? Right?
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This shows that fat adapted athletes can much, much easier use stored body fat for energy without sacrificing performance. This is huge.Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »I would expect that a fat adapted, non elite athlete being compared to a carb eating, non elite athlete would show a similar difference in fat burning ability. Why would it not? Right?
Yeah. I was just saying to the question of wondering if the same were true of non elite athletes. My thinking was, why wouldn't it be? Just what seems logical to me. Not that I know anything about it, of course.
Maybe a non elite athlete compared to an elite athlete wouldn't be the same. I guess I would expect the athlete to have more muscle and therefore use energy more rapidly, so it makes sense in my head they would still burn more, faster.
But, I would think a regular person is burning more, faster than a carb eating regular person.
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@Sunny_Bunny_ , sorry I misread your original comment. I fixed it. I'm pretty sure both elite athletes and regular people would get similar results, but I'm very curious as to the burn rates and the factors. Basically I want to know if I need to train more or eat less carbs or do something else to increase the efficiency at which my body burns body fat for fuel.0
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Don't we all! LOL
Yeah, I find this stuff very interesting. I would love to see the studies like this done on all kinds of groups of people. There would likely be a lot of valuable information come from it.0
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