Official diabetes diet misinformation - any candidates for the Darwin Awards?
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@RalfLott My endocrinologist graduated from Harvard Medical School. I brought up low carb as a way to stabilize blood sugars (my primary concern is type 1 diabetes). He agreed it would help. So while it wasn't his suggestion, he went along with it when I suggested it.0
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midwesterner85 wrote: »@RalfLott My endocrinologist graduated from Harvard Medical School. I brought up low carb as a way to stabilize blood sugars (my primary concern is type 1 diabetes). He agreed it would help. So while it wasn't his suggestion, he went along with it when I suggested it.
Victory!
(But you're still your own best doctor.)1 -
Here's a candidate for the summer "Huh?!?" trials:
http://www.noahhealth.org/five-most-common-food-myths-associated-with-diabetes
There's something here for almost everybody....
Oops - forgot to damn olives and pickles. Whew, close call!Five Most Common Food Myths Associated With Diabetes
Unfortunately the myths surrounding the “strict” diet those with diabetes must adhere to are many, the truth of the matter is actually that a diabetic can eat everything that someone without diabetes can.
Here are five of the most popular diabetes diet myths:
1. A diabetic’s diet has to be different than the rest of their family’s diet.
People with diabetes are able to eat exactly like the rest of their family does. Modern day nutrition guidelines for those with diabetes offer quite a few choices, they are flexible and allow diabetics to fit in special-occasion or favorite foods. A healthy diet consisting of whole grains, vegetable, fruits, heart healthy fats and lean proteins should be kept by everyone regardless of whether or not they are diabetic. If you are diabetic you do not have to have “special” meals, the whole family can eat the same; healthy.
2. A diabetic should never succumb to cravings.
At some point or another, everyone has food cravings even diabetics, It is common for most diabetics to completely stop eating sweets or even eat smaller portions in an attempt to lose weight. Your body’s response to these changes many times are cravings. Nine out of ten times the choices of foods during these times will be high in sugar and or fat. Many times it is in fact the combination of both.
The healthiest way to deal with these cravings is avoiding them by eating healthy and occasionally allowing sweets within your diabetic meal plans. If you do get cravings allow yourself a small bit of what it is you are craving. This allows you to relish in the flavors being craved and prevents overeating at a later time.
3. Diabetics should avoid starchy foods regardless of whether they have a high fiber content due to the fact that your blood glucose levels can be elevated by starch and you will gain weight.
Foods such as pasta, cereal, bread and rice are considered starchy foods but they provide carbohydrates which are what give the body energy. Other foods that also contain carbohydrates are milk, desserts, yogurt and fruit, carbohydrates are something that everyone needs a bit off, even diabetics. When you consume more carbohydrates than you burn that is when you will gain weight.
As a matter of fact overeating any kind of food will cause weight gain. The important thing is to be aware of the amount of each healthy food groups you need to eat in order to maintain safe blood glucose levels and a healthy weight range. Starchy foods that are high in fiber and whole grain are a great choice for general good nutrition.
4. Eating fat should not be concerning to diabetics being as there is not a real effect on the blood glucose.
Fats that are found in oils, margarine and salad dressings do not immediately affect the blood glucose levels. That being said eating a fatty meal can slow down the process of digestion making it more difficult for your insulin to work, this could possibly cause elevated glucose levels hours after you have eaten.
Your blood cholesterol can be raised by some fats which increases the risk of a stroke or heart attack. These unhealthy fats are called trans fat and saturated fat and should be limited. Shortening, butter, milk, cheese and red meat are all sources of saturated fat. Some snack foods, margarine and fast foods contain trans fats. Fat is also very high in calories so if your are trying to lose weight you should avoid it.
5. A low-sodium diet should always be adhered to by diabetics.
Just because you are diabetic you do not need to completely cut all sodium and salt from your diet. However, being as a diabetic is more likely than someone who is not diabetic to suffer from high blood pressure which can cause heart disease they should consider cutting back on the amount of sodium they consume.
Here are few examples of foods that are high in sodium:- canned vegetables
- salad dressings
- canned soups
- cold cuts
- certain cereals
Regardless of whether or not you have high blood pressure it is important to be careful with the amount of sodium you consume. There are individuals who are “salt sensitive” therefore after eating foods with a high salt content they may be experience a spike in their blood pressure levels.2 -
Oh wow. Should I laugh or cry?!4
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Oh wow. Should I laugh or cry?!
An ages-old dilemma, like the choice of which end to favor during the early phases of dysentery when there's only a toilet in your bathroom and no sink.
Crying makes you get dehydrated, run out of sodium, and come down with the keto flu and that nasty keto rash we keep hearing about.
Laughing, on the other hand, builds abdominal strength; stimulates continence, concentration, and reproductive capacity; boosts 92% of the good hormones; and, due to underdeveloped hepatic multitasking evolution, creates the equivalent of a "time-out" for your liver and pineal gland.
So..... I guess it's a toss-up.4 -
I keep seeing the title "nutritionist" here. This bothers me. Why?
Read this: https://theguardian.com/science/2004/sep/30/badscience.research
TL;DR- The good doctor got his cat certified as a nutritionist.5 -
Heaven help us - his deceased cat, no less!Gallowmere1984 wrote: »I keep seeing the title "nutritionist" here. This bothers me. Why?
Read this: https://theguardian.com/science/2004/sep/30/badscience.research
TL;DR- The good doctor got his cat certified as a nutritionist.
But at least privately -certified "nutritionists" are not bound to follow official guidelines, in contrast to how some here have desccribed the professional responsibilities of registered dietitians in the US.
The official tabloid of the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics generally has nothing better for diabetics than "hire an RD." Perhaps that's no worse than taking the AND's rather skimpy serving of nutritional advice:General healthy eating tips to help manage diabetes include:- Limit foods that are high in added sugar.
- Eat smaller portions, spread out over the day.
- Make your carbs count by choosing whole grains, fruit and vegetables over sugary drinks and refined, processed foods.
- Eat a variety of whole-grain foods, fruits and vegetables every day.
- Eat less saturated fat and focus on healthy fat sources such as avocados, olive and canola oil, and nuts.
- Limit your consumption of alcohol.
- Use less salt.
Is there a War on Salt on?
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Dietitians Say the Darnedest Things
Early condemnation of LC from the spokesperson of the American Dietetic Association....
https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=YQVBAAAAIBAJ&sjid=YKgMAAAAIBAJ&pg=6607,3286289&dq=american+dietetic+association&hl=en (1999)Limiting the intake of carbohydrates to such a dramatically low level starves the body of needed nutrients and causes an artificial metabolic state.
"Bread is the staff of life."2 -
Yeah, the nutritionist thing is a bit of title gymnastics to make peoples' opinions sound more important than they are. "Nutritionist" could be anyone from that guy's cat, to everyone's fat, perverted uncle who swears that whiskey doesn't have calories.
A dietician on the other hand, at least has some amount of studied background that goes a bit beyond reading cereal labels and demonizing any ingredients that they can't pronounce without their wee head hurting (kinda like that retarded lady who makes videos of herself trying to eat yoga mats, because chemistry is hard).3 -
Bwaaahaahaaaa! If it quacks like a quack.....3
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http://www.diabeticconnect.com/diabetes-slideshows/566-learning-and-practicing-carb-countingCombined with the right balance of physical activity and medicine, carb counting can help keep your blood glucose levels in your target range, according to the American Diabetes Association (ADA).
Uh... thanks for that.
( >unsubscribe< )1 -
Lol I am not diabetic. But I'm laughing my *kitten* off at this thread.
My brother and my dad are diabetics. My dad is on insulin, but my brother doesn't need medication anymore. (I guess he was just pre-diabetic).
Every time I mention low carb they look at me like I escaped from a psychiatric ward.
And my dad flat out won't try it. So I literally have to cook 2 different meals for myself and him.
They scare me with their cholestrol and stroke comments. But these days I'm just like: "Ah well, if I die at least I died eating deliciously rich food!" 5 -
Whenever I hear the counting carbs advice it reminds of the method that some use where everything is 15g carbs.
My daughters grandpa is a recent T2, possibly LADA actually, he has been taught to have 3 carbs per meal. Meaning, 3 items like bread, starch or fruit. If one of those is a giant glazed donut, it's only counted as 15g !!! Lol
My daughter has taught him differently however and he's doing well.
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as much as it saddens me, I've come to accept that we are basically guinea pigs in the medical community and Dr's throw meds at us to see which one "sticks"! And all that experimenting can be making us sicker! I'm glad I found a group like this one that advocates for one's own health by reading research and figuring out what works out best for them7
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Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »Meaning, 3 items like bread, starch or fruit. If one of those is a giant glazed donut, it's only counted as 15g !!!
Hahahaaahaaaha!
15g? That's nothing. I got a Magic Carb Wand off eBay that turns doughnuts into super-protein that goes straight to your biceps.
But still. I'm sure I could make room in my plan for a 15g root beer float (minus the fat in the ice cream?) for breakfast now and then!
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Shadowmf023 wrote: »Every time I mention low carb they look at me like I escaped from a psychiatric ward.
But these days I'm just like: "Ah well, if I die at least I died eating deliciously rich food!"
Yikes! Sounds like you actually wormed your way into a booby hatch.... Cooking two meals at a time, small wonder you get funny looks.
Could you start making the stroke meals (oh, wait, I think I mean the no-stroke meals..??
) with sorbitol, mannitol, and maybe a couple shots of polyethylene glycol?
Bet they'd adjust to mashed cauliflower with butter & cream sauce real quick if regular mashed potatoes started giving them the trots. You could tell 'em they must have gotten diabetic "carb flu."
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Shadowmf023 wrote: »Every time I mention low carb they look at me like I escaped from a psychiatric ward.
But these days I'm just like: "Ah well, if I die at least I died eating deliciously rich food!"
Yikes! Sounds like you actually wormed your way into a booby hatch.... Cooking two meals at a time, small wonder you get funny looks.
Could you start making the stroke meals (oh, wait, I think I mean the no-stroke meals..?? ) with sorbitol, mannitol, and maybe a couple shots of polyethylene glycol?
Bet they'd adjust to mashed cauliflower with butter & cream sauce real quick if regular mashed potatoes started giving them the trots. You could tell 'em they must have gotten diabetic "carb flu."
I could but I don't know how changing diet to lchf would influence my dad using his insulin? Plus he snacks on carby stuff and won't listen. So I think that combination might actually be a recipe for a stroke!2 -
Week before last my mom spent two nights in the hospital. She was given what was supposedly a diabetic meal plan....
Breakfast: eggs, bacon, toast, corn flakes, milk, orange juice. Lunch: Roast, mashed potatoes, green beans, roll, and a piece of cinnamon cake. Dinner: Pasta with meat sauce, garlic bread, a slice of lemon pie!
Right before she was released her reading was 262! They were trying to give her 4 units of insulin when she's never needed insulin before, she takes pills. She opted to forego the insulin and just go back to the eating plan I encourage her to be on. She complains but her two days off plan at least showed her my plan works for her!7 -
That's sounds like punishment (if it's not downright criminal).
Fortunately, she's got you for both her lawyer and probation officer.
PS. Did you by chance catch a look at the non-diabetic menu?2 -
Week before last my mom spent two nights in the hospital. She was given what was supposedly a diabetic meal plan....
Breakfast: eggs, bacon, toast, corn flakes, milk, orange juice. Lunch: Roast, mashed potatoes, green beans, roll, and a piece of cinnamon cake. Dinner: Pasta with meat sauce, garlic bread, a slice of lemon pie!
Right before she was released her reading was 262! They were trying to give her 4 units of insulin when she's never needed insulin before, she takes pills. She opted to forego the insulin and just go back to the eating plan I encourage her to be on. She complains but her two days off plan at least showed her my plan works for her!
It's amazing that they recommend such high carb foods for diabetics. I remember a few months ago, someone in a diabetes Facebook group asked for some low carb food ideas. Then someone posted 3 responses with memes of photos and lists of foods, many of which were high in carbs. One of them even included waffle cones. Under each of her photo responses, I made a comment about specific foods in that particular list that is carb heavy. She complained and one of the mods removed 2 of my 3 comments and messaged me about how I shouldn't respond 3 times, that the foods listed were "healthy" (most of them were fruits heavy in carb, except the waffle cones really got me wondering WTH they were really thinking). I responded to the mod explaining that the question was for low carb, not "healthy" foods, and that the OP in that case probably was advised by her dr. to eat low carb and that she was clearly trying to find some ideas for how to comply - the suggestions for nutrient rich foods with heavy carbs still is not the right answer. The mod and I argued back and forth - she was clearly wrong, but was also very stubborn. I'm still in the group, but just rarely follow it anymore because of BS like that. The other mod and I are FB friends and get along well, but I don't understand how you can argue that something is ok as an answer for low carb regardless of carb content, just as long as you consider it to be "healthy." Seriously?!1 -
You don't give booze to alcoholics;
You don't give milk to the lactose intolerant;
You don't feed carbs to diabetic kittycats (see above);
You shove high-carb "treats" into sentient diabetic adult humans in hospitals, then offer insulin for dessert.....
It's a strange world out there.10 -
That's sounds like punishment (if it's not downright criminal).
Fortunately, she's got you for both her lawyer and probation officer.
PS. Did you by chance catch a look at the non-diabetic menu?
But don't you remember? You neeeeed carbs to live and function!You don't give booze to alcoholics;
You don't give milk to the lactose intolerant;
You don't feed carbs to diabetic kittycats (see above);
You shove high-carb "treats" into sentient diabetic adult humans in hospitals, then offer insulin for dessert.....
It's a strange world out there.
We do so many things to humans that we'd never dream of doing to animals (and, likewise, we do things for animals to avoid undue suffering that we consider appalling if applied to humans), it's astounding.2 -
You don't give booze to alcoholics;
You don't give milk to the lactose intolerant;
You don't feed carbs to diabetic kittycats (see above);
You shove high-carb "treats" into sentient diabetic adult humans in hospitals, then offer insulin for dessert.....
It's a strange world out there.
No truer words have been said! Topsy turvy world2 -
Gadzooks, @anglyn1, you may be right!
That hospital probably brags about getting some self-created award for its "nutrition" program (which coincidentally boosts its customer satisfaction ratings in direct proportion to the carb content of its menu.....)
We should probably all have LC Bivouac Kits in our trunks with sufficient LC nutrition to last us a few days in a hostile environment (such as, ironically, your mom's hospital).
(Unfortunately, the diabetes kits I've seen tend to have glucose as the only "food"stuff. )1 -
My dad is diabetic, and they did the same thing to him. They gave in "cranberry" juice, if you can believe it. Water, HFCS, minimal fruit and flavoring. They also gave him grain cereal, pudding, bread, macaroni. I just about had a screaming walleyed cat fit with the dietician. "We're giving him insulin. . ." they said. AAAAAHHHHHHH!2
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@closetlibrarian - This is the steep price patients pay for having their experience affect the hospitals' bottom line. It's got to be a conspiracy to elicit favorable satisfaction scores from the majority of older diabetics who prefer comfort food "recommended by doctors," which comes at the expense of BG control and patient education.
I guess there's no free lunch. At least, no carb-free lunch....0 -
Week before last my mom spent two nights in the hospital. She was given what was supposedly a diabetic meal plan....
Breakfast: eggs, bacon, toast, corn flakes, milk, orange juice. Lunch: Roast, mashed potatoes, green beans, roll, and a piece of cinnamon cake. Dinner: Pasta with meat sauce, garlic bread, a slice of lemon pie!
Right before she was released her reading was 262! They were trying to give her 4 units of insulin when she's never needed insulin before, she takes pills. She opted to forego the insulin and just go back to the eating plan I encourage her to be on. She complains but her two days off plan at least showed her my plan works for her!
Hospitals are a joke!
My daughter went into ICU for DKA with blood sugar over 400... We were completely unable to bring it down. She had taken so much insulin with no progress and naturally became acidotic. Anyway, upon being admitted, patients are immediately restricted from eating or even drinking anything because vomitting is expected. But, you're so thirsty it's like your a zombie and water is the only thing you can think about. So, I always sneak her water. (We've been through this several times). Even when blood sugar is normal again and blood ph is normal again too, they still won't let you eat any food at all. But, they will deliver glucose via IV... To counter the fact that they have you on an IV drip of insulin... I always thought that was so stupid. Like, if blood sugar is going too low, turn the damn drip down! Duh!
Anyway, so you're starving for like 24-36 hours before you're cleared to eat from that lovely diabetic menu. Funny thing is, I sneak her no carb foods, like meat, while she's on restriction and nothing happens to blood sugar, of course and she doesn't need to suffer like the first times this happened before I understood how it all worked.
Her first DKA was actually how I discovered Keto. I was researching how it all worked and came across it. lol
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I recently read an article that cited the ADA as a source; it recommended people with T2 diabetes eat 45-60 grams of carbs PER MEAL!!
Yep it's crazy ! And think of all the kickbacks from big pharma that they get.
More carbs equals more meds.
Insulin, metformin, actos, glipizide... etc, etc =$coldhardcash$3
