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Hi, I'd love some advice on my squat. I've been doing this for almost 2 years but the squat is by far my weakest lift (doesn't help that I have an old lower back injury- though it's tons better than before I started lifting plus a small hernia from my pregnancies). I can't figure out what to change to help it. I try to focus on pushing my knees out and keeping my back from rounding and keeping weight in my heels. Any help would be appreciated!
http://youtu.be/OMgWpaEiAUQ 0 -
Hi, I'd love some advice on my squat. I've been doing this for almost 2 years but the squat is by far my weakest lift (doesn't help that I have an old lower back injury- though it's tons better than before I started lifting plus a small hernia from my pregnancies). I can't figure out what to change to help it. I try to focus on pushing my knees out and keeping my back from rounding and keeping weight in my heels. Any help would be appreciated!http://youtu.be/OMgWpaEiAUQ
Decent high bar squat, you are right to focus on the knees pushed out, also keep that chest up. The weight looked manageable apart from rep 2 they all looked to depth, a couple of tweeks you can try.
1. get your elbows under the bar, you may need to widen your hand placement dependant on shoulder mobility
2. slow your decent, build the tension in your legs, will help you apply more control when you come back up
3. don't let your bum move back, it just wants to go down and then back up. As soon as you bum moves backwards it makes your chest drop making the whole squat more difficult
:drinker:0 -
I'm truly embarrassed to be posting these but am completely new to lifting and I do feel as if I am in need of some good critique. I've been watching the video demos on the SL website, youtube and also video taping myself to try and improve, but I don't feel like I have form down yet. I'm pretty weak as well and not very flexible, and as I kept trying to video over and over to get clear angles you can definitely see the fatigue (especially in the barbell row, which I filmed way too many times). I figured even fatigued videos might be informative though, so here goes.
Tips for flexibility and gaining more depth on squats would be great as well. What you see in the videos is currently as flexible as I can manage.
All of these were at about 45 pounds total, which seemed about right to me except for DL. I can only do about 25 pounds on DL for now, and am planning to film both those and benches later.
Thanks in advance for any advice. I'd much prefer to make corrections before bad form starts to feel "natural". That being said, please remember that I'm *very* new to lifting and thorough explanations are much appreciated.
Barbell Squat - I'm still learning the feel of balancing the bar, and I've been trying each time to achieve depth but I don't think I'm there yet. Advice to improve?
https://flic.kr/p/ok7hb1
Barbell Squat (Second Video)
https://flic.kr/p/omRT7X
Deadlift - Am I supposed to be bending more on these? Looking at my videos I *think* I should be bending down more, but I haven't been able to do so for this lift.
https://flic.kr/p/on7vCW
Barbell Row - I took *so many* videos trying to get a good angle for this, and this video looks like I just should have stopped to me. The first rep is close to my natural form when not fatigued though, so I'd love input on that first rep at least. The rest look like crap to me. Also, I'm not sure if I'm supposed to be bending down more, but if so, that's currently as low as I'm able to do. I also thought I was supposed to have the barbell over the middle of my foot, but unless I step back a smidge, I can't seem to lift the bar without tapping my knees on the way up. Major advice needed on this one please.
https://flic.kr/p/omVXMJ0 -
@violet976 wow, you have some tall, long legs! (At least the videos make it look like such) That may make your form slightly different from other people just because you're taller/have a smaller torso and different leverages than most.
Flexibility: lookup Joe DeFranco's Agility 11 and magic 6 (? I don't quite remember the name atm). It's a lower and upper mobility routine that you should throw in before your workouts, and even on off days if you're really struggling. Covers a lot of areas that most people are "tight" in.
Squats: I think your stance is just too wide. Looks to me like you're squatting high bar-ish? Your feet should be closer together (to me it's barely beyond shoulder width, for you it might be a smidge more but definitely not that much) and toes pointed out might give you the illusion that you're more "flexible" but it also puts a lot of pressure on your knees. I wouldn't suggest to go all the way to a narrow stance squat in one go, but try reducing the distance/angle your toes are pointed at as you progress and get more flexible and see how you go from there?
Deadlifts: Looked okay to me, although you seem afraid to hit your legs - don't be. You're wearing pants, so you could actually just scrape the bar on them the whole way up without chaffing your skin. They actually look easy,, in fact. You might be able to handle more weight!
Rows: Your tall legs are going to affect your position here a bit. I suggest you use blocks (I think you had some for the deadlifts?) here too until you can have a 45 sized plate to support the bar. Next up you want your legs almost straight (just don't lock out the knees), your bum tight and your back straight and parallel to the ground. The bar won't be exactly over the middle of your foot - that's okay. Just retract your shoulder blades while keeping everything else locked in and you should be fine.
Keep up the good work! I hope this helps!0 -
Flexibility: lookup Joe DeFranco's Agility 11 and magic 6 (? I don't quite remember the name atm). It's a lower and upper mobility routine that you should throw in before your workouts, and even on off days if you're really struggling. Covers a lot of areas that most people are "tight" in.
I second this, and the links to the videos are below:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSSDLDhbacc (Limber 11)
http://www.leanbodiesconsulting.com/joe-defrancos-simple-six-upper-body-warm-up (Simple 6)0 -
@Krokador: Hmmm. Ive never thought about it - I simply always thought of myself as very thin with really skinny legs. I have no idea how to verify that, but if it helps I'm 38" up to the highest point of my hip bone, and 27.5" from that point to the top of my head (5.5 feet total). It could also be a combination of the angle in that video and the fact that those sweatpants have a high waist. But that might explain why I've always been told I look very short when driving my cars.
Thank you for the mobility video tips. I definitely think my body is tight, as I work all day sewing from home and really don't stretch/move around much. I'll definitely squeeze those into my workouts.
My squats probably are too wide and I definitely have use a high bar position. I've tried to place the bar lower but can't seem to find another comfortable spot yet so I've simply gone with that bar position. I can definitely try lessening my stance and bringing the toes in. Basically, the toe angle is dependent on how far apart the knees are, correct? I simply point them in the same line the knees are pointing, correct? (so a less wide stance would have less outward angle on the toes, and a wider stand more outward angle?)
I'm so glad to hear the deadlifts look ok, and yes, I can definitely add more weight. I started at 45 pounds on most of the exercises but didn't want to increase until I knew I had form down correctly. That, and filming the videos from multiple angles - well, I wore myself by the time I was done filming. I kept trying to correct issues I saw myself and re-filming.
For the rows, it was actually the same barbell setup in the video as the deadlifts. If you look you'll see both deadlifts and rows had weights propped up under them, and I aimed to have the bar height at 9" from the ground. I read online that the bar should be around 8.5"-9" from the floor, but if that's incorrect please let me know. Blocks definitely would have been nicer than stacked weights though, as I had to focus a lot of my technique on how to set the bar down carefully without it rolling off my stacked weights.
I'm am confused on your barbell row advice though, as in the videos I see the legs are not straight at all. This is the video demo from the stronglift website, and it looks to me as if the bottom of his legs are straight but the upper half is squatting slightly:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQBSRBgRLVI
Unless I have my bar height incorrect (9" from the ground), I'm not sure how else to adjust my stance to still reach down and grab the bar. Is the problem with my form the fact that my back isn't parallel to the ground? Is that why I need to straighten my legs more, so I'm bending more in the back to reach the bar?
Thanks again for taking the time to address my concerns. I definitely want to make sure I'm doing this all correctly.0 -
re: the rows - I guess "straight legs" was a bad way to put it. You don't want your knees to be locked out. What you wanna do is hinge at the hips until your back is parallel to the ground, lock everything in, then grab and row. Your knees will have a slight bend in them and your butt might be a lil further back, but they're definitely not bent with your butt behind like the start of a deadlift.
Squats and foot position: it will depend on your hip insertions and your own body mechanics, but knee angle does not equal foot angle. I forget where I saw this, sadly, but you want to actually be able to push your knee out further than the foot angle (or at least intend to). 20-30 degrees out is about where you want to be, normally.
Thank rugby for the youtube ilnks, I was too lazy to go look for them xD Also another great resource on mobility is KStar https://www.youtube.com/user/sanfranciscocrossfit0 -
Thanks so much. I honestly couldn't understand your description for barbell row/deadlift form differences at first, but I just spend some time watching more youtube videos and finally *see* what you're saying about the straighter legs. I had to really think through the range of motion for each exercise but your explanation makes perfect sense to me now. Thanks for taking the time to explain.0
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@violet
Krok has some good points, have a play about with stance but you don't have to have a closer stance for high bar, I squat high bar with a very wide stance so its just where you are comfortable. (I have long legs so wider stance gives less travel distance, the more flexible you get and the closer your stance gets the more ATG you can get)
You're not quite getting depth so a play around with stance will help, other things to bear in mind with high bar is get your elbows under the bar not behind (you may need to widen your grip on the bar until shoulder mobility allows)
My final point, don't push your bum back, let it just drop down, this way it doesn't put unnecessary angle on the torso and will give you better control and drive out of the bottom.0 -
@violet
For the deadlifts:
I'd say this weight is probs too light to get a good feel of the lift, when you set yourself up drop your bum a little to bring your shoulders over the bar, explode of the floor like you are trying to pull the bar through your shins.
once the bar clears the knees you are no longer pulling but just pushing your hips forward this movement will lock the bar where it needs to finish0 -
@girlie100 : Thanks so much for the input. I've been reading up on form positions for those with long legs/short torsos and have seen it mentioned that a wider stance is quite common, which is great to know as I just tried a narrower stance and it didn't feel nearly as comfortable.
I'm definitely not at depth yet, though my leg muscles feel quite tight even after stretching so I will be incorporating mobility/flexibility exercises to try and help this.
Initially on my squats, I was terribly focused on trying to find a position where my knees didn't go over my toes. That's what I was taught in school, years ago, and now knowing that rule of thumb flew out the door explains a lot of why I always thought I wasn't good at squats with correct form. I'm glad I popped on and learned to toss that little nugget of wisdom to the wind.
Thanks for the input on the elbows pointing back. I actually read that advice many times when studying and still didn't catch that I myself was doing it. I think I have my hands almost as far as they can go, so I'll try to pay more attention to getting those elbows lower on my next sets. For the bum pushing back though, I'm not honestly sure how to correct that. As I'm doing those squats in the video, my only focus is making sure I'm dropping as straight down as possible while making sure my back remains straight. I'm not sure how to bring my butt any closer forward than what's shown in the video. When I'm performing the squat, I certainly feel no conscious effort on my part to be pushing it back - only to be making a downward movement.
Thanks very much for the input on the deadlift. You've given me some very clear details to focus on which is extremely helpful, and I can clearly see my shoulders going past the bar at the start of the lift.0 -
Thanks for the input on the elbows pointing back. I actually read that advice many times when studying and still didn't catch that I myself was doing it. I think I have my hands almost as far as they can go, so I'll try to pay more attention to getting those elbows lower on my next sets.
Something that may not come to mind at first with the elbow position is that you should be pulling your shoulder blades back in order to "lock" the upper body in. (A lot of people cue that with chest up, which is true, too, but it registers better for me to think about the back than the front) Doing so will make it more natural, in a way, to bring your elbows forward. They might not be exactly under the bar, but the intent will help stabilize throughout the lift.
And I don't know if this will help, but perhaps starting the movement by opening up your hips/pushing your knees out as you drop would help you do less of a sitting back motion? Just a thought.0 -
@krokador: That actually makes more sense to me and gives me something to focus on. I just tried holding that position and pulling my shoulders back from where I wanted to start, and my elbows did indeed move down/forward more. Thinking of that in combination with the chest up really does change the feel of how I've been starting.
I'm doing my second day today so we'll see how it goes. I can definitely feel the muscles that were worked two days ago though so I'm curious to see if I do better/worse today. 0 -
Well my 45 pound weighted squats were still feeling like an incorrect pressure on my knees. I actually decided to back off completely, since I've never been one to squat much in daily activities, and instead grabbed a small stepping stool to finally learn what type of squat feels natural for my own body. It probably seems quite silly, but considering I always baby my knees (kneeling down, pulling myself up off the floor, etc) I figured it was best that I learn the natural feel of my own proper squat rather than try to keep tweaking something I obviously don't have the feel of to begin with.
Having done so, I must say something as simple as practicing with that step stool made a world of difference. I was quickly able to hit depth when I squat (without the barbell/weight), which I had thought I wasn't able to do due to flexibility. I then went back to the 45 pound barbell, this time with the stepping stool behind me, and found myself able to touch my butt to the stepping stool without any pains in my knees.
The only issue this has brought up is I can now feel my butt rising first as I struggle to push back up with the additional weight. I'm assuming because I don't yet have the strength in my legs to boost myself up without that extra butt push. For this issue, is it best to deload to a weight where I can raise from the squat without raising my butt first? I'm assuming yes, but didn't know if this was a common issue with some other fixes.
Here is a video of my final set of 45 pound squats today. Please let me know if they've improved or if I've added any new issues. I did try to get my elbows pointed down more (chest up/shoulders pressed back) but they still look like they are pointed back. I can say that these squats felt very comfortable on my knees, but I do feel as if I'm losing form when I try to push the weight up. It feels like I might be using more of my butt to initially push upward and my back might not be holding the correct position at that point. I was able to touch my butt to the stool though, which (I think) is an improvement. ?
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scarletnotion/14698383101/0 -
@violet
They looked fine, you could probably work on getting them elbows under, especially on the drive up from the bottom.
Your form is always going to be slightly different with box squats to normal squats purely because you are anticipating the box. If you positioned the box long ways and straddled over it you could practice what I said about dropping the bum straight down rather than sitting back to find the box.
i don't see an issue with the bum raising quicker, you looked like you could manage the weight fine. When you come out of the bottom you are always going to get a slight lean forward, but concentrate on keeping the chest up and finding the drive from the legs. It becomes a problem when your bum comes up so far your legs are pretty much straight and then you are doing a good morning to get the bar back up.
And the knees not past toes is a training cue for low bar squatters, as a high bar squatter depending on your stance the knees may go past the toes, just focus on keeping your chest up, pushing your knees out and letting the bum drop 0 -
@girlie100: Whew. I'm glad to hear it. These squats really felt much better than my first ones, and I find if I perform each one slowly I can feel any potential knee twinge and stand back up before any issues arise. My first day I had to stand back up a few times, yesterday just once. I'm encouraged, but will be holding the same weight until I can perform them without any hesitance on the knees.
Thanks for the advice on turning the stool. I'm still not convinced that I am able to come down with my butt any closer forward, but perhaps that might come as my squats get stronger and flexibility improves. At the moment. I'm just happy to see that my butt can come down as far as it currently is. Turning the box sounds safer anyways, as it wouldn't be in the way but I'll have more confidence knowing I wont slightly miss it and fall on my bum.
Still working on the elbows as well. I was actually trying to accomplish that in the videos, but so far I'm still not quite achieving that. I'll try to really focus on that at the bottom of the squat and see what happens there.0 -
Aight, I posted these on my profile but I do really wanna know what other people might see that maybe I've missed for myself (a lot of it is in the vid descriptions).
Squats (keep in mind I'm doing high bar, although I noticed it sits a little low for that (but my low bar is much lower). I have created the mid-bar squat! lol)
150x5:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCZaM7AosBs
160x5:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-I5CRtRndI
Any input welcome! 0 -
@krok
the weights looked more than manageable :drinker:
You do a bit of Oly lifting don't you? Well if you do then you defo want to work on getting the bar a little higher for a proper high bar squat it will help with the Oly lifting where a low bar doesn't really add anything.
Get your elbows under the bar :happy:
You might want to try foot placement a little wider to get a bit more depth, also focus on knees out during the lift
These are just little improvements, the squat was fine if you were in a PL comp :bigsmile:0 -
@krok
the weights looked more than manageable :drinker:
You do a bit of Oly lifting don't you? Well if you do then you defo want to work on getting the bar a little higher for a proper high bar squat it will help with the Oly lifting where a low bar doesn't really add anything.
Get your elbows under the bar :happy:
You might want to try foot placement a little wider to get a bit more depth, also focus on knees out during the lift
These are just little improvements, the squat was fine if you were in a PL comp :bigsmile:
Thanks!
This is pretty much what I'd observed myself, but it's good to have confirmation haha. Although I've found getting my feet any wider puts too much torque on my knee and that's still a bit iffy/not fully healed (I tried doing low bar squats with a bit wider stance during my deload and my knee got really angry at me WHILE doing the reps, so I think Im stuck with that width for now).
I'm pretty sure if I put the bar a lil higher up the elbows'll track better. I don't have any wrist issues and my back is still engaged though so I'm not too stressed about that one. I like that spot though. It's comfy. (I think I got used to that "mid-bar" placement after going for a heavy double a few months back and bruising that bump on the back of my neck pretty badly.)0 -
Getting your elbows under the bar might help with what I think looks like a bit of forward lean in the 150lb video? Also, I agree with the wider stance.
Okay, gonna link my squat videos then too I think.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9zOiVUc2pA&list=UUlN1FcZ5g8DFYyHjBRps0Pg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-66pqIpSw8&list=UUlN1FcZ5g8DFYyHjBRps0Pg&index=2
Now that I look at it, I think I can tuck my elbows a little more too, and I know my knees track in a bit.0
