Increasing Calories - What to expect & why you need patience...
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wouldn't u need to lower it as well as u lose weight? because ur bmr and ur tdee lowers as u lose weight. so why when u plateau would u go up again if ur tdee has been lowered?
Yes you should recalc your numbers every 5lbs down. Trust me after doing this for a while you become so in tuned with your body. You will take your own self from cut to tdee to give self a break from dieting...its a natural progression as you learn. But in the beginning just focus on being consistent.
ok thanks. that's what i had planned on doing.
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Thanks for the speedy response! You're fantastic!
-Come to think of it, I hit 159 in february (i remember cuz that was the tip top of my "healthy" BMI
) so I guess I have lost a few pounds since, but its been so slow I didn't realize it!
-In the McDonald article, he suggested a 2 week break at maintenance... would you guys suggest longer??? This is kinda where I am lost. if i've been under eating for too long, reason leads me to believe a longer "break" would be more beneficial.
- I "think" I'm at TDEE! All the calculators put me between 2300-2500, but when Ive ran HRM tests (3 x's) Ive burned 2700-3100 with exercise. (im busy, I have 2 small kids and do day care for 2 more full time) but since im not counting right now, its just a guesstimate!
-And yes, training harder then ever. Always pushing myself for my next PR... Ive never competed in a triathlon and recently ran my first race (where i placed in top 10 female finishers) so I want to do well. I take my training seriously. And I am still weight training. I love new rules and follow it to a T... except I didnt really increase my calories like the book said. I was stubborn. AND i didnt "eat my calories back" like I guess I should have.
- I received the Peele's book via email so I dont know which version it is... but its really good!
I messed up the quotes on this response, sorry... Did you have a chance to read through? I still had a few questions
Well, it depends on if you're doing the diet break or the metabolism reset. They are similar, but not exactly the same. The metabolism reset you eat at maintenance for a longer period of time (think: months), like you said, because you are trying to undo the damage that was done during low cal eating. After the metabolism is "reset" then you drop back down into a reasonable deficit (TDEE -15%) and resume losing.
The diet break is something that you would put into practice once you are back down at a defcit. You will eat deficit for 8-10 weeks or so, then go up to maintenance for 2 weeks, continuing to repeat the process until you reach your goal. So that your body doesn't plateau again.
You may be underestimating your TDEE if you are super active and training. You def do NOT want under eat during the reset process, it will just delay your results, because the body will not stabilize at "true" maintenance.
Kiki0 -
Thanks for the speedy response! You're fantastic!
-Come to think of it, I hit 159 in february (i remember cuz that was the tip top of my "healthy" BMI ) so I guess I have lost a few pounds since, but its been so slow I didn't realize it!
-In the McDonald article, he suggested a 2 week break at maintenance... would you guys suggest longer??? This is kinda where I am lost. if i've been under eating for too long, reason leads me to believe a longer "break" would be more beneficial.
- I "think" I'm at TDEE! All the calculators put me between 2300-2500, but when Ive ran HRM tests (3 x's) Ive burned 2700-3100 with exercise. (im busy, I have 2 small kids and do day care for 2 more full time) but since im not counting right now, its just a guesstimate!
-And yes, training harder then ever. Always pushing myself for my next PR... Ive never competed in a triathlon and recently ran my first race (where i placed in top 10 female finishers) so I want to do well. I take my training seriously. And I am still weight training. I love new rules and follow it to a T... except I didnt really increase my calories like the book said. I was stubborn. AND i didnt "eat my calories back" like I guess I should have.
- I received the Peele's book via email so I dont know which version it is... but its really good!
I messed up the quotes on this response, sorry... Did you have a chance to read through? I still had a few questions
Well, it depends on if you're doing the diet break or the metabolism reset. They are similar, but not exactly the same. The metabolism reset you eat at maintenance for a longer period of time (think: months), like you said, because you are trying to undo the damage that was done during low cal eating. After the metabolism is "reset" then you drop back down into a reasonable deficit (TDEE -15%) and resume losing.
The diet break is something that you would put into practice once you are back down at a defcit. You will eat deficit for 8-10 weeks or so, then go up to maintenance for 2 weeks, continuing to repeat the process until you reach your goal. So that your body doesn't plateau again.
You may be underestimating your TDEE if you are super active and training. You def do NOT want under eat during the reset process, it will just delay your results, because the body will not stabilize at "true" maintenance.
Kiki
Thanks a million, I guess I need more of a reset since I have plateaued for so long. I was going into this as a break... hmmm, ok. I am about a 1/3 of the way through the metabolism repair manual, so i'll keep plugging along.0 -
All I can say is WOW..... I just joined MFP today and think it is great, but when I came across your group it was like an AHA moment. I have lost a total of 120 lbs over the last 8 years but have been struggling to lose anything for about a year now.
I keep losing and gaining the same 5 lbs, and have been seriously thinking that maybe I don't eat enough but then of course all those years and fears of "too many calories" scares me away. I was 27 lbs lighter at my lightest, but that was SUCH a struggle and I barely got there and then slowly climbed back up to where I am now. I had no balance in my life. I wouldn't go to anything where I may be tempted by extra calories and worked out 6-7 days a week and had huge guilt if I missed.
I jog at about a 14 minute mile (I know, not very fast) for usually 50 minutes and then a 5 min warm-up and cool down walk at the beginning and end of that, for a total calorie burn of approx. 550. I aim for that 3 times a week and then was always doing other cardio such as elliptical and Zumba class 2 nights a week otherwise. I do admit my strength training has been lax this past year especially. Reading this I think I don't ever eat back my calories for workouts, but instead always think "well I wasted my run" if I am hungry and eat "too much" that day after. I don't want to give up the cardio as I have come to enjoy it, so I need to know how to do this for sure.
So I did your calculations and came up with a BMR of 1800 (wow!!, that's what I was aiming for total in a day of eating even with a run in there). So my TDEE comes out to 2791!!! So if i have this correct I should be eating 2372 on non-workout days, and on a day where I run and burn let's say 500 calories I should eat to 2791??? It just seems so high, but I feel like something inside me is telling me this is the right answer for me, so just looking for confirmation here.
I am soooo scared, just like many on here have said, as it seems so against my way of thinkning for so long, and the "old way" did seem to work for me obviously when I was a lot heavier, but the proof is in the pudding as to the last 2 years or so that have been such a struggle for me to lose.
Looking for guidance, glad for the info, the support and the light at the end of the tunnel!!0 -
All I can say is WOW..... I just joined MFP today and think it is great, but when I came across your group it was like an AHA moment. I have lost a total of 120 lbs over the last 8 years but have been struggling to lose anything for about a year now.
I keep losing and gaining the same 5 lbs, and have been seriously thinking that maybe I don't eat enough but then of course all those years and fears of "too many calories" scares me away. I was 27 lbs lighter at my lightest, but that was SUCH a struggle and I barely got there and then slowly climbed back up to where I am now. I had no balance in my life. I wouldn't go to anything where I may be tempted by extra calories and worked out 6-7 days a week and had huge guilt if I missed.
I jog at about a 14 minute mile (I know, not very fast) for usually 50 minutes and then a 5 min warm-up and cool down walk at the beginning and end of that, for a total calorie burn of approx. 550. I aim for that 3 times a week and then was always doing other cardio such as elliptical and Zumba class 2 nights a week otherwise. I do admit my strength training has been lax this past year especially. Reading this I think I don't ever eat back my calories for workouts, but instead always think "well I wasted my run" if I am hungry and eat "too much" that day after. I don't want to give up the cardio as I have come to enjoy it, so I need to know how to do this for sure.
So I did your calculations and came up with a BMR of 1800 (wow!!, that's what I was aiming for total in a day of eating even with a run in there). So my TDEE comes out to 2791!!! So if i have this correct I should be eating 2372 on non-workout days, and on a day where I run and burn let's say 500 calories I should eat to 2791??? It just seems so high, but I feel like something inside me is telling me this is the right answer for me, so just looking for confirmation here.
I am soooo scared, just like many on here have said, as it seems so against my way of thinkning for so long, and the "old way" did seem to work for me obviously when I was a lot heavier, but the proof is in the pudding as to the last 2 years or so that have been such a struggle for me to lose.
Looking for guidance, glad for the info, the support and the light at the end of the tunnel!!
Welcome to the group! :flowerforyou:
You would just eat your TDEE -15% every day. All of your activity for the week should already be calculated in, so no need to eat back cals. Just be sure to note your net cals for the first week or so to be sure that you chose the right activity level. If you notice that you consistently burn more that what is figured in already (TDEE -15% minus BMR = exercise cals already accounted for), then the activity level that you chose is too low. However, if you find yourself burning more than that just on "occasion" just eat enough back to make sure you net above BMR....so say your TDEE -15% is 2400, and BMR was 1800, then you have 600 cals figured in for exercise already. If you happen to have an odd day where you burned 800, then you'd eat back 200, make sense?
~Kiki0 -
Ok - I have a question. I have been following the threads for a while and for the past few months I have gradually increased my cals from 1200 to 1600 (as of this past Weds.). Anyway - I am one of the rare ones (don't shoot me) - that have been losing every single week even with the increases.
However - one change besides the increase from 1500 daily to 1600 daily (not including exercise cals) is that I was doing Body Pump classes where I would burn about 280 each one - now I do a NROL4W workout which according to my HRM burns a lot fewer calories. So we will have to see what this weigh in on Wednesday will show.
Anyway- my BMR averages about 1580 (depending on the site) so I felt safe with 1600. Currently I put sedentary and just eat back my exercise cals to be safe. My workouts are 6 days a week (no exercise on Tuesday because I'm in school that night). Besides 3 days of NROL4W - I do a 30 minute run/walk (started C25K last week) and on Friday and Saturday I do group classes (step, kickbox). So I would assume I would choose moderate for activity level.
Here are my stats:
Age: 43
CW - 186.8
GW - 140
Also - I too struggle with getting enough protein. For you all that bring it to the gym - how does that work? Do you just add water to the powder?
Thank you!
Sherry0 -
Been lurking for a while and this is my first post ever on MFP. I am excited to join this group! I am not far away from goal weight, but miles away from a BF% goal. Here are my stats in case any of you can provide any advice:
Female
5' 6.5"
SW 149.5
CW144
GW ~135
BF% 27.3%
BMI ~23%
According to Scooby's:
BMR 1413
TDEE 2191
TDEE-20% 1753
I have been eating clean and somewhat lower carb/sugar - high protein for about 5 months. I feel great! I have never been able to stay at MFP's 1200 goal so I guess that is a good thing ;-) I average 1300-1400 cals a day and more on workout days/weekends.
Questions:
1)Do the numbers look right? My main goal is to lower my body fat %.
2)I entered my activity level as moderate, is that right???? My current workouts are: 2 bootcamp classes/week, 2 body pumps/week, Jillian's 30 day shred if I miss any of those, and the ocassional dog walks - 30-45 min couple of times per week.
3)LOOKING for more suggestions as far as workouts and nutrition in order to loose body fat. I want to loose inches!!!!
EXCITED TO BE PART OF THIS GROUP!0 -
I am sorry to be so needy here , but I need some kind of encouragement or support...
I have been on a "diet break" for 11 days... Went from eating about 1800 cals a day (slowly increase from 1200 in Feb to current 1800) to maintenance (around 2250) although I have not been logging cals, just tracking the food.
Well, in the past 11 days, I have gained 8 WHOLE POUNDS. I am terrified to continue to 14 days, or even go longer which has been suggested.
HELP PLEASE! I am terrified! It has taken me 5 months to loose the 8 pounds I just gained. I know the concepts of eat more to weigh less, I am reading the "metabolic repair manual" but I am still terrified. Seeing all this weight come back is freaking me out.
A side note, I had a Body Composition done on Saturday, found out I was 25% body fat at 158 pounds (18-25 percent is healthy range)... My goals is for 21%, which would place me at 150 POUNDS. I was only 2-3 pounds from there before this break!!!0 -
Thank you....
I needed to read this today. I am so discouraged w/the lack of loss.
Cristina0 -
I am sorry to be so needy here , but I need some kind of encouragement or support...
I have been on a "diet break" for 11 days... Went from eating about 1800 cals a day (slowly increase from 1200 in Feb to current 1800) to maintenance (around 2250) although I have not been logging cals, just tracking the food.
Well, in the past 11 days, I have gained 8 WHOLE POUNDS. I am terrified to continue to 14 days, or even go longer which has been suggested.
HELP PLEASE! I am terrified! It has taken me 5 months to loose the 8 pounds I just gained. I know the concepts of eat more to weigh less, I am reading the "metabolic repair manual" but I am still terrified. Seeing all this weight come back is freaking me out.
A side note, I had a Body Composition done on Saturday, found out I was 25% body fat at 158 pounds (18-25 percent is healthy range)... My goals is for 21%, which would place me at 150 POUNDS. I was only 2-3 pounds from there before this break!!!
Since you have your body fat percentage, you should go and recalculate your TDEE using the Katch-McCardle formula. It is most accurate when you know your BF. The Scooby calculator has a link "The most accurate calculator"...http://scoobysworkshop.com/accurate-calorie-calculator/
Now, please read the What to expect when upping calories. Are you tracking your protein intake, it is important to get in your protein and good fats. Try 40 carb, 30 prot and fat. Also keep in mind a true pound of fat is 3500 calories...8lbs of true fat just isn't possible...that would have been a lot of eating:flowerforyou:0 -
I am sorry to be so needy here , but I need some kind of encouragement or support...
I have been on a "diet break" for 11 days... Went from eating about 1800 cals a day (slowly increase from 1200 in Feb to current 1800) to maintenance (around 2250) although I have not been logging cals, just tracking the food.
Well, in the past 11 days, I have gained 8 WHOLE POUNDS. I am terrified to continue to 14 days, or even go longer which has been suggested.
HELP PLEASE! I am terrified! It has taken me 5 months to loose the 8 pounds I just gained. I know the concepts of eat more to weigh less, I am reading the "metabolic repair manual" but I am still terrified. Seeing all this weight come back is freaking me out.
A side note, I had a Body Composition done on Saturday, found out I was 25% body fat at 158 pounds (18-25 percent is healthy range)... My goals is for 21%, which would place me at 150 POUNDS. I was only 2-3 pounds from there before this break!!!
Since you have your body fat percentage, you should go and recalculate your TDEE using the Katch-McCardle formula. It is most accurate when you know your BF. The Scooby calculator has a link "The most accurate calculator"...http://scoobysworkshop.com/accurate-calorie-calculator/
Now, please read the What to expect when upping calories. Are you tracking your protein intake, it is important to get in your protein and good fats. Try 40 carb, 30 prot and fat. Also keep in mind a true pound of fat is 3500 calories...8lbs of true fat just isn't possible...that would have been a lot of eating:flowerforyou:
Thank you for the reply. I have read it (a few times) but the amount I have gained seemed really high. On the body composition report it gave me a breakdown of ALL caloric burns, including of course TDEE. I still (technically) have through Wednesday until I can lower to my cut value ( 2300-15%= 1955)
The nuritionust said to NEVER eat below my BMR, but of course when taking my training into account, I will eat closer or above my cut value depending on my daily burn.
Thank you ladies for your speedy responses on here and for this group! Your support is awesome! (btw, great youtube vid's as well :happy: )0 -
bump0
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So if my TDEE is 2511, I subtract 15% and get 2134. is THIS what I should be eating if I exercise about 3-4 times a week? I have been at 1360 for 5 months and have been juggling the same 5 lbs. Hoping this helps.
This is after losing about 50 last year on here...0 -
So if my TDEE is 2511, I subtract 15% and get 2134. is THIS what I should be eating if I exercise about 3-4 times a week? I have been at 1360 for 5 months and have been juggling the same 5 lbs. Hoping this helps.
This is after losing about 50 last year on here...
yes. 2134 would be your daily cal goal. exercise cals are already included, though
~Kiki0 -
I just logged into Katch-McCardle since I too found out my body fat% . It tells me my BMR is 1760. Now what do I do?0
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I just logged into Katch-McCardle since I too found out my body fat% . It tells me my BMR is 1760. Now what do I do?
Did you punch in your stats on Scooby using "the worlds most accurate calculator"?
http://scoobysworkshop.com/accurate-calorie-calculator/
It should give you your TDEE reading as well, using your bf% for accuracy. 0 -
What a GREAT post! Thank you for taking the time to post this.
I am struggling with the concept of eating more to lose weight altho' I've plateaued already after only a 15 lb loss. Visited an RD & work out with a great trainer who both advise me to eat more. I'm 56, an RN & in the old days when I attended college, the standard teaching was less calories in to decrease weight. (Unfortunately, many medical professionals still instruct their patients along those lines.)
I'm slowly & cautiously adding calories & hoping that this works for me. I totally changed my habits in March & feel much better eating healthy & working out. Thanks again for sharing your knowledge here.0 -
After reading many post and trying to figure it out - I have the answer on the persons blog: lillebanon (I have lost the page I found this on though). She (I presume) explains it beautifully including step by step instructions on how to work all this out. I now get the whole TDEE / TDEE cut thing. Yay!
Here is a sample of her blog - so happy!! (Not sure about upping my cals from 1400 to 2256 though - this is VERY scary!
Here it is:
My take on eating more to weigh less.
Posted on 05/07/2012 by lillebanon
I decided to post this here for all my friends to read after typing it up as a very lengthy email to one particular friend. For those who don't know, I started eating more (I went from 1200 cal a day to 2200 cal a day) one month ago, and in these first four weeks I have lost 5 lbs, and 5.75" across my upper body, blasting though a months-long plateau. All without depriving myself!
Everything I know about eating more, I learned from the Eat More to Weigh Less group here at MFP. If you like what you read here, make sure you join the group for some great support!
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/forums/show/3834-eat-more-to-weigh-less
Okay, hopefully I don't ramble too much here. If anything I say doesn't make sense, they probably explain it better in the link above. Basically, eating more is all about providing your body with the fuel it needs so that its not reluctant to let go of the fat.
There is a bit of math involved to figure out how much fuel your body needs, but I'll provide links to online calculators that will guide you through.
First a little glossary:
BF% = Body Fat Percentage
BMR = Basal Metabolic Rate. This is basically the number of calories your body would burn if you were in a coma.
TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure. This is the average number of calories burned by your body per day, based on your average weekly activities. Your full TDEE calories is what you should eat to maintain your current weight.
Cut = The percentage of calories below your TDEE you should be eating to lose weight. This will usually be somewhere between 10% to 15%, MAYBE 20%, but should never be below your BMR.
Metabolic Reset = Eating your full maintenance calories for a period (usually 4 to 6 weeks) to allow your body to repair its metabolism.
Okay. So basically, if you have been eating a very low calorie diet for a sustained amount of time, it can damage your metabolism and slow it down, and cause you to stop losing weight. That is what happened to me eating 1200 calories a day and burning tons of calories running. I was working way too hard and eating way too little to not be losing weight and fat... but I wasn't losing weight or fat!
In my case I felt like my metabolism was damaged enough that I needed to do a metabolic reset. If you haven't been eating very low calories for very long, the metabolic reset step can be skipped, and you can just raise your calorie intake to your "cut" level. A lot of people like the 15% cut. In either case, when you first raise your calories, it is not uncommon to gain a few pounds in the first couple of weeks, but don't panic, it isn't fat, and will melt back off very quickly and then some once your body starts trusting you again. Take some starting measurements as well, because even those who see some gain on the scale at first frequently report inches lost during the same time period. Also, you are going to feel stuffed to the gills and bloated for for the first few days, but your appetite and digestion will catch up within the week. The best part about it is, when you reach your goal weight, you just keep eating your full TDEE, your "diet" was never really a diet, and you don't gain back all the weight!
Watching your macros is a good idea when you start eating more, to make sure you don't add all the calories as carbs! A good ratio that works for most is 40% carbs/ 30% protein/ 30% fat, but that is adjustable to suit you. This ratio leaves plenty of room for some delish carbs. I would say a minimum of 25% protein though. Eating plenty of protein helps you avoid losing muscle during the process of losing fat. You can customize your macros when you set your goals in MFP if you don't use the automatic calculator. Also aim for 30g of fiber a day. Watching your sodium will help with any bloat as well (2500 mg a day max is a good goal). If you eat meat, it may not be too difficult for you to hit your protein goal, but since I don't, I've added whey protein shakes to most my days. They are always a great easily absorbed source of protein to use after a workout anyway.
Okay, so now, the math. The first thing you need to do is figure out your body fat percentage. If you have had it professionally measured, that is the absolute most accurate method, but the following calculator will get you close enough. Get out your measuring tape!
http://www.fat2fitradio.com/tools/cbbf/
Okay, now that you have your BF%, head over here for the rest of your calculating, but see my notes below as you go through it:
http://scoobysworkshop.com/accurate-calorie-calculator/
Steps 1 through 4 are self explanatory.
Step 5 - choose your activity level based on the average number of hours per week that you exercise. However, if you are on your feet and moving about at work, consider that too, not just your "workouts".
Step 6 - Choose your goal. If you think you need to do a metabolic reset first, choose "gain muscle, lose fat" and it will calculate based on your full TDEE. If you want to start at a cut rate, choose the 5%, 10% or 15% option.
Step 7 - Meals per day. However often you like to eat. It really doesn't matter what time of day you eat your calories though, but i think most people like the 5 to 6 times a day for eating (3 meals and 2 or 3 snacks). This doesn't change your final outcome, it only changes the "per meal" averages that this little calculator suggest for various nutrients. But you'll probably want to just track "per day" in MFP anyway.
Step 8 - Research model - Select Katch-McArdle
Step 8a - Remember that BF% you just calculated? Enter it here.
Step 9 - Zero (If you want to read the instructions for calibrating, click on the little link at step 9... it takes a month to do and is pretty much unnecessary unless you are a serious bodybuilder or something).
Step 10 - Enter Macros - 40% Carb, 30% Protein, 30% Fat. Or whatever you decide you are comfortable with.
Scroll down to your results. It will list your BMR, your TDEE, and your TDEE - Cut (Daily Calories based on goal selected in Step 6) if you selected a cut.
Okay, you've got the numbers...now what? Eat your TDEE-Cut, every single day, regardless of exercise. It already has your average daily exercise figured in and your body will respond well to the consistency. BUT, you do still want to track your exercise, and here is why: You never ever ever want to "net" below your BMR on any given day. So on certain days you may need to eat back a PORTION of your exercise calories, to bring your net back up to your BMR.
eg. Your TDEE-Cut is 1900 calories and your BMR is 1400 calories. You have a great workout and burn 600 calories. 1900-600=1300, 1300<1400, so you need to eat 100 more calories, or a total of 2000 calories for that day, to net your BMR of 1400. You never want to EAT less than your cut value, and you never want to NET less than your BMR.
So most days on MFP, you really only pay attention to the "food calories" not the automatically calculated "calories remaining". However, enter your exercise and watch your net to make sure it doesn't drop below your BMR. Your "Food" section should alway end up around your cut level, and your "net" section should never be below your BMR. Did I repeat that enough times?
Okay, now, here is how you modify your goals in MFP to match this new math.
Go to "My Home", click the "Goals" tab. Select "change goals" button. Click "custom" and continue. Change your net calories to your new TDEE or Cut value. Change your fat/protein/carb percentages to your new macro values 30/30/40, change your fiber to 30g, your sodium to 2500 mg. If you aren't already tracking all those things, you may have to add them to your nutrients tracked first.
And that's pretty much it! Sorry its so long... OH, one more thing. If when you submit your completed diary at the end of the day MFP tells you you are going to gain weight, IGNORE IT.
Remember to go back and redo your calculations everytime your lose an additional 5 lbs or so, or if you have a significant change to your average weekly activity level!0 -
WOW what an informational post. The analogies really helped me understand,
these "diet" fads have really warped our minds thinking low calorie intake, and spend a zillion hours in the gym. SMH! goood luck everyone on upping your cals. Im in week 1 of upping my cals and will increase 100-200 cals each week.
Slow & Steady always wins the race!0 -
I could use a little support at this point..I know it's early! But since starting EMTWL - 3 weeks ago - I've not seen any progress, but I gained about 1.5lb and my scale weight seems to fluctuate by 2-4lb randomly through the week.
Is this normal and to be expected at this stage? Thanks!0
