Former Marine Detained over Facebook posts
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Mandy, I know that you know that I like you. You remind me of my own three daughters. I've said the following to all of them at one time or another, and to my youngest many many times.
"I love your passion. I love your Idealism. I would fight anyone that tried to stifle you, but...you are lacking one thing. Experience. When you accummulate a little more mileage, you might find that everything is not so black and white. There are a lot of gray areas."
I appreciate your sentiment, even if we don't agree.. I luv you long time. :laugh:
I really hate the term conspiracy theorist. I never liked them, I never have considered myself one and often thought they were wacky. I hate to say it but fiction films/tv all put into perspective how simple and easily a government can commit horrific acts without consequence and have made me think. Do I think 9/11 was an inside job? I don't know, what I do know is that there are far too many events taking place and wealthy, powerful people missing from the WTC on that day and I think it's stupid to think there is not more to that story. Too many people trust the government, too many people believe what the TV tells them rather than thinking for themselves.
You get a bunch of people here believe that someone is dangerous because that person says something that is against common belief. They are so brainwashed by the media, it strikes a chord with me. It's more than gray areas. It's not rules being bent, it's a problem that can and should be solved. This is nothing new, this country was founded on a Revolution and I'm thankful that there were people who cared enough to stand up against tyranny.
People have been led to believe that a person saying something that is not PC makes them a danger. That's what the media lives for, that's what the government needs people to think. The Governement is nothing unless people depend on it for survival. How is it that James Holmes managed to purchase thousands of dollars worth of gear in a short amount of time as a poor , unemployed college student, the same time that the UN is working on a gun ban, how convenient. The FBI has a history of staging attacks for politic influence, also nothing new. So lets arrest a former Marine, who has done nothing but be a good, hardworking person his whole life for saying that the government is wrong and the people need to do something about it.
You may call those gray areas, some people call them coincidence and will just believe that they are just acts of crazy people but I think there is something seriously wrong with all of it. I think most people write it off as crazy because they are afraid to admit that their government is capable of committing such crimes. To think that the government is safe, responsible and not capable of committing horrific acts of violence on it's own people is ignorant.
Now, onto labeling me as bat-**** crazy....:smokin:
Okay, you are going to have to source the whole FBI staging terror attacks thing. Are you talking about their terror exercises or are you saying that they perpetrate terror attacks in order to get what they want?
Also, the UN gun bill, which has no jurisdiction over the US and would have to be ratified by Congress, is to slow the illicit trade of small arms in regions that do not have the infrastructure to do it themselves. It has nothing to do with legal guns. Also, it was rejected by the US in July.
Here lies the problem with conspiracy theories. When some one presents the possiblity that our own FBI planned terror attacks against our own citizens, everyone thinks "Oh that is just nut, how can you think that?"
And while I can honestly say that I have never seen proof that I believed that our own government had actually attacked our own citizens, I can definately see where citizens like Mandy are suspicous based on the history of the world and things like Operation Northwoods. It is open to the public to go see the documentation that the Joint Chiefs of Staff presented JFK a plan to stage terror attacks against our own citizens in order to justify an invasion of Cuba. It was one signature away from approval and luckily JFK said hell no.
But once again, through out history, all you have to look at is how wars start. Decades and centuries later it become apparent that it was always about religion, political power, and resources...but how did they convince the public, how did they ratchet up the propoganda. By convincing the citizens that they were under attack. Golf of Tonkin. The Rorshtag fire in Nazi Germany and the bogus claims the polish rebels were attacking german citizens. Japans assertion that China was attacking them. Linking Saddam to 9/11. The list goes on and on. So once again, the older I get, the more I am willing to listen to a conspiracy theorist than my own government. Doesn't mean I will believe them, but maybe if someone had questioned a little more 58,000 american soliders and 1 million Vietnamese would still be alive....or however many from the current middle eastern debacle.
I am fully aware of Operation Northwoods and the true reasons for war. I was just asking for clarification of the FBI's track record of performing terrorist attacks for political means.
Let me be clear, the US has a very ugly history of using covert and "dark" means to achieve their goals or influence situations to go the way that they want them. I just ask for evidence when making these claims.
Cointelpro is pretty transparent now. The Red raids in which U.S. agents posed as hate group radicals. Hoover began collecting intel on US citizens as early as 1945. They surveyed anyone who claimed to be far left or have communist beliefs. They literally had agents joining radical political parties to destroy them from the inside out.
How about when the FBI targeted MLK Jr as 'enemy of the state' and sent him threatening letters, did anything they could to interfere with his public appearances. He eventually ended up dead.
Or here, where the FBI supplies 'suspected terrorists' with supplies for an attack just to arrest the person. http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/opinion/sunday/terrorist-plots-helped-along-by-the-fbi.html?pagewanted=all
In cases of the Newburgh Four and Ft Dix five, both times FBI sought out people with criminal records or history of mental illness to stage terrorist attacks. They would then charge them after the FBI had given them the necessary means to carry the attacks out, which didn't happen in either of these cases.
It just makes me wonder how many times a "real "attack has happened. I honestly do not think that the Batman shooter acted on his own. Between the edited images of the person who committed the crime and the court photos of a completely different person and the fact that I don't believe the person had the means to do that on his own, I don't believe it. Then again, that is my opinion and not fact..0 -
Personally, I think Adrian actually IS the cloned head of Robert McNamara and Ulrike Meinhof's alioen DNA baby. As such he controls the weather. Which is why it just stormed here. See he KNEW I would be posting this, exposing him for who and what he is, and so he threatened me by making it storm. Well, I ain't a'skeered o' yer thunderbolts! The truth MUST get out, man!0
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People in the armed forces do not have the same free speech rights as a private citizen. They know that.0
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Mandy, I know that you know that I like you. You remind me of my own three daughters. I've said the following to all of them at one time or another, and to my youngest many many times.
"I love your passion. I love your Idealism. I would fight anyone that tried to stifle you, but...you are lacking one thing. Experience. When you accummulate a little more mileage, you might find that everything is not so black and white. There are a lot of gray areas."
I appreciate your sentiment, even if we don't agree.. I luv you long time. :laugh:
I really hate the term conspiracy theorist. I never liked them, I never have considered myself one and often thought they were wacky. I hate to say it but fiction films/tv all put into perspective how simple and easily a government can commit horrific acts without consequence and have made me think. Do I think 9/11 was an inside job? I don't know, what I do know is that there are far too many events taking place and wealthy, powerful people missing from the WTC on that day and I think it's stupid to think there is not more to that story. Too many people trust the government, too many people believe what the TV tells them rather than thinking for themselves.
You get a bunch of people here believe that someone is dangerous because that person says something that is against common belief. They are so brainwashed by the media, it strikes a chord with me. It's more than gray areas. It's not rules being bent, it's a problem that can and should be solved. This is nothing new, this country was founded on a Revolution and I'm thankful that there were people who cared enough to stand up against tyranny.
People have been led to believe that a person saying something that is not PC makes them a danger. That's what the media lives for, that's what the government needs people to think. The Governement is nothing unless people depend on it for survival. How is it that James Holmes managed to purchase thousands of dollars worth of gear in a short amount of time as a poor , unemployed college student, the same time that the UN is working on a gun ban, how convenient. The FBI has a history of staging attacks for politic influence, also nothing new. So lets arrest a former Marine, who has done nothing but be a good, hardworking person his whole life for saying that the government is wrong and the people need to do something about it.
You may call those gray areas, some people call them coincidence and will just believe that they are just acts of crazy people but I think there is something seriously wrong with all of it. I think most people write it off as crazy because they are afraid to admit that their government is capable of committing such crimes. To think that the government is safe, responsible and not capable of committing horrific acts of violence on it's own people is ignorant.
Now, onto labeling me as bat-**** crazy....:smokin:
Okay, you are going to have to source the whole FBI staging terror attacks thing. Are you talking about their terror exercises or are you saying that they perpetrate terror attacks in order to get what they want?
Also, the UN gun bill, which has no jurisdiction over the US and would have to be ratified by Congress, is to slow the illicit trade of small arms in regions that do not have the infrastructure to do it themselves. It has nothing to do with legal guns. Also, it was rejected by the US in July.
Here lies the problem with conspiracy theories. When some one presents the possiblity that our own FBI planned terror attacks against our own citizens, everyone thinks "Oh that is just nut, how can you think that?"
And while I can honestly say that I have never seen proof that I believed that our own government had actually attacked our own citizens, I can definately see where citizens like Mandy are suspicous based on the history of the world and things like Operation Northwoods. It is open to the public to go see the documentation that the Joint Chiefs of Staff presented JFK a plan to stage terror attacks against our own citizens in order to justify an invasion of Cuba. It was one signature away from approval and luckily JFK said hell no.
But once again, through out history, all you have to look at is how wars start. Decades and centuries later it become apparent that it was always about religion, political power, and resources...but how did they convince the public, how did they ratchet up the propoganda. By convincing the citizens that they were under attack. Golf of Tonkin. The Rorshtag fire in Nazi Germany and the bogus claims the polish rebels were attacking german citizens. Japans assertion that China was attacking them. Linking Saddam to 9/11. The list goes on and on. So once again, the older I get, the more I am willing to listen to a conspiracy theorist than my own government. Doesn't mean I will believe them, but maybe if someone had questioned a little more 58,000 american soliders and 1 million Vietnamese would still be alive....or however many from the current middle eastern debacle.
I am fully aware of Operation Northwoods and the true reasons for war. I was just asking for clarification of the FBI's track record of performing terrorist attacks for political means.
Let me be clear, the US has a very ugly history of using covert and "dark" means to achieve their goals or influence situations to go the way that they want them. I just ask for evidence when making these claims.
Cointelpro is pretty transparent now. The Red raids in which U.S. agents posed as hate group radicals. Hoover began collecting intel on US citizens as early as 1945. They surveyed anyone who claimed to be far left or have communist beliefs. They literally had agents joining radical political parties to destroy them from the inside out.
How about when the FBI targeted MLK Jr as 'enemy of the state' and sent him threatening letters, did anything they could to interfere with his public appearances. He eventually ended up dead.
Or here, where the FBI supplies 'suspected terrorists' with supplies for an attack just to arrest the person. http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/opinion/sunday/terrorist-plots-helped-along-by-the-fbi.html?pagewanted=all
In cases of the Newburgh Four and Ft Dix five, both times FBI sought out people with criminal records or history of mental illness to stage terrorist attacks. They would then charge them after the FBI had given them the necessary means to carry the attacks out, which didn't happen in either of these cases.
It just makes me wonder how many times a "real "attack has happened. I honestly do not think that the Batman shooter acted on his own. Between the edited images of the person who committed the crime and the court photos of a completely different person and the fact that I don't believe the person had the means to do that on his own, I don't believe it. Then again, that is my opinion and not fact..
I always found it amazing it was never really publicized that the MLK family actually won a lawsuit in civil court against our government for their involvenment in the assassination. Now, of course this is not criminal court where the standard of proof is much higher...but still.0 -
Also, EvanKeel killed Kenny.0
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Also, EvanKeel killed Kenny.
*kitten*!
jk I adore him 
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People in the armed forces do not have the same free speech rights as a private citizen. They know that.
He's former, not active.0 -
And here lies another problem with conspiracies. Far be it from me to scoff at humor during these debates, I often am guilty of it myself. But all you have to do is look at the replies here and on other debates concerning conspiracies to see how easily they get turned into a punch line. Like I stated earlier, I can list conspiracies that are no longer theories, but fact due to investigations or the gov admitting to it. So in the face of overwhelming evidence that our nation's government has acted corruptly and with murderous intent not only through out our history, but rather recently, how can we justify this marine as being insane? I'm not saying he's not, and as also stated ealier, many of his posts that were considered threatening removed, so based on what we have seen, who is more insane, him, or the modern head in sand american?0
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so based on what we have seen, who is more insane, him, or the modern head in sand american?
I question that daily.
I am dreading the day I can say, "I told you so".0 -
He's been released and lawsuit filed.
"On August 23, Circuit Court Judge Allan Sharrett ordered Raub immediately released, noting that the government’s case was “so devoid of any factual allegations that it could not be reasonably expected to give rise to a case or controversy.”
https://www.rutherford.org/publications_resources/on_the_front_lines/rutherford_institute_defends_marine_arrested_incarcerated_in_psych_ward_det0 -
When he kills, fbmandy, I hope you're still here. But by then you'll blame it on his time inside or allege that it was not him at all but possibly Adrian in a chuicken suit. Congrats!0
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When he kills, fbmandy, I hope you're still here. But by then you'll blame it on his time inside or allege that it was not him at all but possibly Adrian in a chuicken suit. Congrats!
It seems you keep singling me out in a comical way in this thread, is there something you would like to say that we can actually debate or are you going to keep acting like a *kitten*?0 -
That was just a random you reference - it could be anyone in the chicken suit, really - and was actually intended to comically detract from the high references in the other thread and was much more of a dig at fbmandy.It seems you keep singling me out in a comical way in this thread, is there something you would like to say that we can actually debate or are you going to keep acting like a *kitten*?
I believe that the 30 days of observation would have been beneficial to this person and in the long run wold have gone a long way toward getting him the help that I believe he needs.
All that said, I'm not acting. ;-)0 -
That was just a random you reference - it could be anyone in the chicken suit, really - and was actually intended to comically detract from the high references in the other thread and was much more of a dig at fbmandy.It seems you keep singling me out in a comical way in this thread, is there something you would like to say that we can actually debate or are you going to keep acting like a *kitten*?
I believe that the 30 days of observation would have been beneficial to this person and in the long run wold have gone a long way toward getting him the help that I believe he needs.
All that said, I'm not acting. ;-)
It's so nice to know that your opinion of the guy trumps that of medical professionals and a judge who have decided he is not a danger...0 -
That was just a random you reference - it could be anyone in the chicken suit, really - and was actually intended to comically detract from the high references in the other thread and was much more of a dig at fbmandy.It seems you keep singling me out in a comical way in this thread, is there something you would like to say that we can actually debate or are you going to keep acting like a *kitten*?
I believe that the 30 days of observation would have been beneficial to this person and in the long run wold have gone a long way toward getting him the help that I believe he needs.
All that said, I'm not acting. ;-)
It's so nice to know that your opinion of the guy trumps that of medical professionals and a judge who have decided he is not a danger...
A judge isn't a doctor. He can't tell if someone is crazy, or sick or a loon. His job is to listen to the testimonials of others and uphold the law. Medical professionals will say one thing one day and turn around the next. Like when we used to treat ahlziemers with cocaine and what not. What if he does go batsh!t crazy and starts shooting people. What then? Do we say the professionals were all wrong and the military could now say "we told you so" and then blame it on hypnosis like The Manchurian Candidate?0 -
Actually, my opinion is in line with the the psychologist who interviewed him and recommended the 30 day evaluation.It's so nice to know that your opinion of the guy trumps that of medical professionals and a judge who have decided he is not a danger...0 -
That was just a random you reference - it could be anyone in the chicken suit, really - and was actually intended to comically detract from the high references in the other thread and was much more of a dig at fbmandy.It seems you keep singling me out in a comical way in this thread, is there something you would like to say that we can actually debate or are you going to keep acting like a *kitten*?
I believe that the 30 days of observation would have been beneficial to this person and in the long run wold have gone a long way toward getting him the help that I believe he needs.
All that said, I'm not acting. ;-)
It's so nice to know that your opinion of the guy trumps that of medical professionals and a judge who have decided he is not a danger...
A judge isn't a doctor. He can't tell if someone is crazy, or sick or a loon. His job is to listen to the testimonials of others and uphold the law. Medical professionals will say one thing one day and turn around the next. Like when we used to treat ahlziemers with cocaine and what not. What if he does go batsh!t crazy and starts shooting people. What then? Do we say the professionals were all wrong and the military could now say "we told you so" and then blame it on hypnosis like The Manchurian Candidate?
But you are ALL basing your opinion of him on nothing but fear mongering. You have turned free speech into mental illness.0 -
But you are ALL basing your opinion of him on nothing but fear mongering. You have turned free speech into mental illness.
I sure am. If he had no military training, I would think nothing of it. But since he does, and we've seen a lot of people who say crazy things, do crazy things... yeah. I'll be calling someone.0 -
That was just a random you reference - it could be anyone in the chicken suit, really - and was actually intended to comically detract from the high references in the other thread and was much more of a dig at fbmandy.It seems you keep singling me out in a comical way in this thread, is there something you would like to say that we can actually debate or are you going to keep acting like a *kitten*?
I believe that the 30 days of observation would have been beneficial to this person and in the long run wold have gone a long way toward getting him the help that I believe he needs.
All that said, I'm not acting. ;-)
It's so nice to know that your opinion of the guy trumps that of medical professionals and a judge who have decided he is not a danger...
A judge isn't a doctor. He can't tell if someone is crazy, or sick or a loon. His job is to listen to the testimonials of others and uphold the law. Medical professionals will say one thing one day and turn around the next. Like when we used to treat ahlziemers with cocaine and what not. What if he does go batsh!t crazy and starts shooting people. What then? Do we say the professionals were all wrong and the military could now say "we told you so" and then blame it on hypnosis like The Manchurian Candidate?
But you are ALL basing your opinion of him on nothing but fear mongering. You have turned free speech into mental illness.
I am basing my opinion on his notion that the Bush's have a secret castle where they rape and then sacrifice babies. That is not a sane thing, which is fine except that it is also accompanied by statements about revolution and the like. Too many flags.0 -
That was just a random you reference - it could be anyone in the chicken suit, really - and was actually intended to comically detract from the high references in the other thread and was much more of a dig at fbmandy.It seems you keep singling me out in a comical way in this thread, is there something you would like to say that we can actually debate or are you going to keep acting like a *kitten*?
I believe that the 30 days of observation would have been beneficial to this person and in the long run wold have gone a long way toward getting him the help that I believe he needs.
All that said, I'm not acting. ;-)
It's so nice to know that your opinion of the guy trumps that of medical professionals and a judge who have decided he is not a danger...
A judge isn't a doctor. He can't tell if someone is crazy, or sick or a loon. His job is to listen to the testimonials of others and uphold the law. Medical professionals will say one thing one day and turn around the next. Like when we used to treat ahlziemers with cocaine and what not. What if he does go batsh!t crazy and starts shooting people. What then? Do we say the professionals were all wrong and the military could now say "we told you so" and then blame it on hypnosis like The Manchurian Candidate?
But you are ALL basing your opinion of him on nothing but fear mongering. You have turned free speech into mental illness.
I am basing my opinion on his notion that the Bush's have a secret castle where they rape and then sacrifice babies. That is not a sane thing, which is fine except that it is also accompanied by statements about revolution and the like. Too many flags.
So you know that's exactly what he is thinking? Not that he is using that to make a point, he's not using some of the things he said as metaphors? Several people have testified to his sanity, since his release he has even volunteered to undergo a different psychiatric evaluation to PROVE he is sane and this was all unjust.
Because that's what he has said, that one of the 'trigger posts' he was jailed for are lyrics from a Candaian rap song. So now posting song lyrics on facebook throws a red flag?
“If you read ‘1984’…in that society there was something called the ‘Ministry of Truth.’ Bill Clinton very recently went on record and said that he believed there should be a Ministry of Truth in this country to monitor the internet,” said Raub.
“It’s a government that I loved,” he added, saying he still “absolutely” wants truth to prevail within the federal government.
Raub reiterated that people should take “peaceful” and “non-violent” methods to educate themselves and disseminate information about what is going on in the United Sates.
Yep, sounds like a crazy person who wants to go shoot a bunch of people.0
