Doesn't Counting Calories Count?
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IamUndrCnstruction wrote: »I don't count calories, I track solely for carb count. Some days I eat 1500 calories, some days I eat 3000. Depends how hungry I am. For the record: I am very heavy, almost 50, female, not very active and peri-menopausal. Last I checked I lost 14kgs (30lbs) in 13 weeks.
May ask how low you keep your carb macro? I am still trying to find what works for me.
My carb count is all over the place. My aim is under 20g. I might do that for 4-5 days and then have 30g. At least once a week I have 40g. About once a month I've had a 100g but I'm not doing that anymore because I felt physically ill for a couple of days after having a pizza and garlic bread dinner. Under 100g is still considered low carb. marksdailyapple.com/the-primal-carbohydrate-continuum/#axzz3KaeLoOoM
I eat when I'm hungry. That might consist of snacking all day or it might be 2 meals a day. Some days I eat early in the day, some days it's midday before I'm hungry. I'm more interested in tuning in to my body. It knows when it's hungry. My only definite routine is that I like to wake up with a cup of coffee and a big dollop of cream with one sugar. Because I like it with one sugar and I work it into my macros.
My philosophy:
This is life. It has to be sustainable for the rest of it. If I want to have a piece of battered fish once a week, I'm going to have a piece of fish. Because I like it and want it to be part of my life. Some things (like chips) I can give up and it doesn't bother me.
My time frame for being in being shape is 7 years. I've lost weight fast and that's great. I don't know if that's sustainable. If it is, great, if not, so be it. I'm not in any hurry. I'll get there eventually.
My weight also fluctuates. It can go up and down 3 kgs (7 lbs) a day. So I don't weigh myself very often. Whenever I think about it. My clothes are much looser and that's mostly good enough for me.
I'll adjust this plan as I go along. It might need some tweaking. As I get lighter, I know I'll want to do more activity so I'll do that. I might not be as hungry when I'm lighter. Then again, I might not. There are no absolutes in life apart from death and change.
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@Sajyana I positively love your outlook! Mine is much the same. I haven't encountered any foods I couldn't live without yet, but I've only been doing this about 40 days.
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@Sajyana Thank you. Such a wonderful way of looking at life, and one people should learn from.
This whole thread has given me so much to think about. The video too. Thanks!!!1 -
No one can ever tell me again that a calorie is a calorie. When I did CICO a couple years ago, it took me 3 1/2-4 months to lose 35 lbs and I was actually exercising more and eating 100-200 less calories a day and this time on keto I've kept my net carbs under 25 from the start (now under 22) and the first couple weeks ate around 1900 cals, recently between 13-1800 depending on the day and what I feel like eating. I've lost 37 lbs now in 2 months, so pretty much twice as much as I was losing with CICO. It's just freakin flying off. It's like my body knows where it's supposed to be and is racing to get there. I LOVE it and I LOVE keto. 3
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This is all so new to me, I'm learning a lot from you all and this is extremely interesting and inspiring. Right now I'm just lowering the total carbs - 120 max (which is likely a lot for those on LCHF, but I've cut out all bread, rice, pasta, potatoes and highly processed foods). I'm trying to regain a sense of portion control (so the calories for me are a guide line - I don't sweat if I go over or under, just so I have a feeling of fullness and am losing weight.) I lost 5 pounds doing this in about 2 weeks along with exercise, but likely the pounds won't come off so quickly now...My goal is to be healthy. I plan on seeking out a nutritionist with low carb credentials and I'll have several weeks of MFP records to show to see what I need to change in the future.
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Goat this is the best thread ever! It should be put at the very top of the Launch Pad! I've been trying to wrap my head around the calorie conundrum ever since joining MyFitnessPal. Up until this point I hadn't been paying attention to calories and still lost a significant amount of weight but I couldn't really articulate why. I just watched the video from start to finish and it was simply fantastic! Heading to the library tomorrow to check out The Calorie Myth to learn more.
Favorite Points Covered:- If you focus on the quality of what you eat, the quantity will take care of itself
- It is truly impossible to accurately track calories in and even harder to track calories out
- Changing the quality of what you eat will cause you to burn more calories than any exercise ever will
- Sugar is more addictive than cocaine
- Calorie counting only works for 4.6% of the population
- Exercise is also about quality not quantity
- Eating fat doesn't make you fat, it makes you full
- You burn more calories in the process of burning protein vs carbohydrates
- Become Fat Adapted vs Sugar Adapted
- Sometimes the pursuit of health can become unhealthy. If you just stick to eating non-starchy vegetables, nutrient dense protein, whole fat, and low fructose fruits, in that order, you will be fine.
The one thing I'm not totally sold on (and I know you're not either) is the idea of eating 10 - 12 servings of vegetables a day. I can't see myself eating that much food, but he does say if you've found a lifestyle that works for you, even if it is calorie counting, then by all means keep it up!2 -
Lowcarbheart, hippygirl, et al. you have no idea how happy I am that this thread helped you. LowCarbHeart those points are really some of the key ones from that video. My rants are not nearly as eloquent as he is, but I pasted them anyway because I know some people won't watch an hour long video.
My opinion on vegetables is "controversial" to say the least. LOL. Frankly, if vegetables help someone with being low-carb (and I think for a lot of people they provide at least a mental shield for coping with the high fat content of this way of eating), then eat as many low-carb vegetables as you desire. Obviously some are better than others, especially in regards to carb count, but even some of the worst ones (not counting those that are pure starches like potatoes) are hard to really get fat with. Have you ever heard of someone getting obese from eating carrots?
Regardless, just because I don't agree with every point he makes doesn't mean I don't think the core of his message is right and beneficial for people to hear. Quality of food first and quantity takes care of itself. I just refer to it as watching the carbs first, and the calories take care of themselves.
I'm just glad that this thread helps some people. In the end, if someone reads this and wants to count calories, that's really not the end of the world. Or, if someone reads this and tries it, but finds they need to count or they overeat, that's fine too. I believe there may be underlying hormonal, medical, behavioral, or other underlying issues that prevent some people from relying on their body even when restricting carbs. I believe that many of these issues resolve with the retraining eating this way brings, so it may not be permanent, but they may exist for some people.3 -
Brilliant FIT_Goat. Thanks for a clear and relevant explanation of how to utilize this WOE. I do feel like I am a test rat in my own science experiment, but that's OK!
The cool geeky term is "biohacker" in an "n=1" experiment!
I too track cals still, mostly just to keep myself motivated. I have a fear that if I don't track on MFP everyday, I will eventually slip back into carbland and gain it all back again. So this keeps me accountable. Lately, I have been less strict, and going over on my day's calorie allotment doesn't bother me... At least it won't until the jeans start to fit tight!
kcko!
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I can't say that I won't continue to count...at least for awhile, but this thread has made me think. Today, I weighed myself. The scale had not budged from last week. Now, in the past I wouldhave freaked out. I would have immediately dropped my calorie intake. Today, I just stepped off, thought about the fact that I am eating good food, I feel good, I have energy to work out....and the pants I put on are too big. So, to borrow a phrase I have heard here, keep calm and keto on.1
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Since there's a literal mountain of scientific evidence supporting CICO, I was curious if you've seen anything in the scientific literature supporting this. I'm doing a search (as I'm lucky enough to have access to a bunch of journals) but not finding much research out there. Not being confrontational, just curious.0
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I did find one article from the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition that was published in 1973 (the study was done in West Germany) that 100% supports this. Fascinating.0
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Hey camtosh, not everyone can be a cool geek!
I have decided to try this to negotiate the panic I feel when the number of calories heads for the stratosphere
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Plan is starting today I will log everything to be aware of what I am actually eating. Get the big picture of a day of eating.
Then, it's history. Before I save the log for the day I will delete everything that doesn't have carbs. Then I will save what is left, to have a record of my carb counts only and focus on that only over a period of time. Of course if my weight balloons up over the next few weeks I will be a fat lab rat
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jmarton1977 wrote: »Since there's a literal mountain of scientific evidence supporting CICO, I was curious if you've seen anything in the scientific literature supporting this. I'm doing a search (as I'm lucky enough to have access to a bunch of journals) but not finding much research out there. Not being confrontational, just curious.
I'd recommend you watch this as a starting point https://youtube.com/watch?v=fL5-9ZxamXc The Professor mentions plenty of studies.
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jmarton1977 wrote: »Since there's a literal mountain of scientific evidence supporting CICO, I was curious if you've seen anything in the scientific literature supporting this.
There are studies where an ad lib restricted carb diet does better than calorie restriction in an RCT.
Bill at caloriesproper.com has graphed the lack of correlation between weight loss and calorie intake across multiple studies. Volk's recent paper on saturated fat showed a correlation between weight loss and carb intake at constant calorie intake.0 -
The best losses I have had have been by NOT counting calories but keeping my carbs low so I know this to be truth BUT I find it hard to disassociate myself from the calories so although I do track them, they are as part of a larger group of macros & not the number I am interested in.
I will & sometimes do, go over calories but as long as I am getting enough fibre, protein & keep my carbs low, I will & do lose. 0 -
IamUndrCnstruction wrote: »I can't say that I won't continue to count...at least for awhile, but this thread has made me think. Today, I weighed myself. The scale had not budged from last week. Now, in the past I wouldhave freaked out. I would have immediately dropped my calorie intake. Today, I just stepped off, thought about the fact that I am eating good food, I feel good, I have energy to work out....and the pants I put on are too big. So, to borrow a phrase I have heard here, keep calm and keto on.
Wow, @IamUndrCnstruction That is a HUGE NSV right there!!! I hope you celebrate the crap out of that...
I'm loving all the information I'm taking in from all the different sources here. It makes so much more sense than the bull we've always been fed that never made sense! Some of the advice doesn't fit specifically to me, but it will fit for others. I firmly believe that by watching my carbs and filling in with fats, my body will level out on the calories! I'm so happy to hear my body's internal voice again. It's been too long.1 -
Great information.... I do count - but it is more to track and learn. I hope to get to a place where I don't need to. I am still learning what to eat - so tracking allows me to see what the macros of different foods are.
I back and forth on dairy and nuts. This is where I need to continue to read as well as listen to my body figure out where they belong.1 -
I've seen the other side of this. I've been back and forth LC/keto for over a decade, and I have gained on it. I don't mean 5 lbs of water or 10 lbs along the way. It's somewhere in the range of 60-100. Unfortunately, I really don't know how much of it is fat and how much is water, but I only have lymphedema in my legs, and my arms are definitely fat. You can still overeat while limiting carbs. In some ways it's easier, because overeating fatty foods will get you there twice as fast unless you eat them slowly. The only reason I gained is because I had other stuff going on, did not make my weight a priority, and quit paying attention to how much I ate, only kept within my low carb guidelines because I don't have a choice there. Doing otherwise makes me sick.
I think there is a trend, especially lately, for people to expect far too much out of LC. It's a WOE that helps control your hunger and improves a lot of varied health problems. It's not a diet or a magic fat killing fairy dust. Some people will have luck that staying under X number of carbs will translate to also eating fewer calories than they need during that day, but that's hardly a guarantee. It's certainly not a universal truth. The all-butter diet idea is similar to that twinkie strawman the IIFYM people throw around the main forums, but reality is, if you limit your carbs, but have an extra cup of coffee with cream/oil/butter/etc each day, or make yourself dessert with berries and whipped cream every night, that alone is easily enough to push you over into gaining. Or if you do both. Or if some days you decide to have a drink after dinner. Essentially, eating like a "normal" person, only restricting carbs in the process. The lower your TDEE, the easier it is to add an extra thing or two that seems like nothing, especially if it's carb free, that will instead have you gain instead.
It's bad at one extreme there are people who misguidedly think they have to eat all of their fat grams every day to stay on track, but it's just as bad for people to think that as long as they don't exceed their carbs, some process in their body will suddenly regulate their intake forever.1 -
JPW, we'll have to agree that not counting calories doesn't work for you. There are many possible underlying issues that can work to prevent a natural weight maintenance even with low-carb. You may have some of them.
I would disagree that anyone is claiming that low-carb is 'magic' or something. Even the experiment where the man intentionally over-ate a significant amount to prove that CICO doesn't work, showed he gained weight. He gained significantly less than expected on low carb (and almost exactly as expected on high-carb), but he did gain. You can gain weight eating any diet. But, I still disagree that you (or at least most people) need to count calories to lose or maintain weight. Watch the video, if you need to see why from someone smarter than I am.0
