Just BLEW UP the low carb life
ConstantStruggle
Posts: 89 Member
OMG!!! I just completely ruined my low carb commitment with Pizza and Beer!!!!
I know I will be paying for it for the next couple days but.......DAMN!!!!
IT WAS SOOOOOOO GOOOOOOD!!!!!!!
OopS!!
I know I will be paying for it for the next couple days but.......DAMN!!!!
IT WAS SOOOOOOO GOOOOOOD!!!!!!!
OopS!!
1
Replies
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It happens. At least it was good and you enjoyed it!
Now, what's important is what you choose to eat for your next meal.
::flowerforyou::5 -
KetoGirl83 wrote: »It happens. At least it was good and you enjoyed it!
Now, what's important is what you choose to eat for your next meal.
::flowerforyou::
+1000!
It's only one meal. Plan some solid keto meals for the coming days. Get back on the wagon and back to losing fat!
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I do this every Friday, just minus the beer part. vOv Back to smelling like acetone by Saturday afternoon.1
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ConstantStruggle wrote: »OMG!!! I just completely ruined my low carb commitment with Pizza and Beer!!!!
I know I will be paying for it for the next couple days but.......DAMN!!!!
IT WAS SOOOOOOO GOOOOOOD!!!!!!!
OopS!!
Pizza & Beer ... ahhh....
Let me start again. Pizza & Beer..... is not an automatic cheat....
There are few things that get my heart pounding like those 3 *kitten* words.
Not that I obsess over Pizza & Beer (I do....), but I have been giving this some intellectual attention over the last few weeks.
Here's my thinking for that once-in-a-blue-moon evening. Hasn't been tested in actual practice - possibly for my First Ketoversary this December, if I am really *kitten* good and hit goal weight and labs.
- Pizza - Order double cheese and just rake it off the crust and jam it down your gullet.
- Beer - Not worth it to drink ultra-light.
So.... order a relatively dry, low-alcohol beer (like Founder's All-Day IPA). Here's a partial list of beer values for low carbers: http://lowcarbediem.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/FREE-Download-Atkins-List-Low-Carbohydrate-Beer-Compare-250-Beers.pdf
1. Simulate a Michelada - dump some hot sauce in your 2nd beer, so as to slow yourself down (enjoy the 1st one!);
2. Alternate each glass of beer with a glass of water;
3. If you need a jolt, get a shot of tequila or whiskey on the side and drink it before the beer and water arrive.
PLAN I - All the day's carbs - 54 net carbs
=================================Cal--NetC--Prot--Fat
Founder's Brewing Co. - All Day Ipa, 36 oz.===432--36----0----0
Mozzarella Shredded Cheese, 1 cup========320---4---32---20
Patron - Tequila, 2 oz===================140---0----0----0
Classico - Traditional Pizza Sauce, 0.5 cup===80----12----2----2
============================TOTAL=972---54---34---22
=================================Cal--NetC--Prot--Fat
PLAN II - Might fit macros - 26 net carbs
=================================Cal--NetC--Prot--Fat
Founder's Brewing Co. - All Day Ipa, 16 oz.===192--16----0----0
Mozzarella Shredded Cheese, 1 cup========320---4---32---20
Patron - Tequila, 2 oz===================140---0----0----0
Classico - Traditional Pizza Sauce, 0.25 cup===40----6----1----1
============================TOTAL=692---26--33---21
=================================Cal--NetC--Prot--Fat
One favor, @ConstantStruggle? Don't tell us if you don't wind up paying over next few days.....
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Pizza & Beer ... ahhh....
Let me start again. Pizza & Beer..... is not an automatic cheat....
There are few things that get my heart pounding like those 3 *kitten* words. Not that I obsess over Pizza & Beer (I do....), but I have been giving this some intellectual attention over the last few weeks.
Here's my thinking for that once-in-a-blue-moon evening. Hasn't been tested in actual practice - possibly for my First Ketoversary this December, if I am really *kitten* good and hit goal weight and labs.- Pizza - Order double cheese and just rake it off the crust and jam it down your gullet.
- Beer - Not worth it to drink ultra-light. So.... order a relatively dry, low-alcohol beer (like Founder's All-Day IPA). Here's a partial list of beer values for low carbers: http://lowcarbediem.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/FREE-Download-Atkins-List-Low-Carbohydrate-Beer-Compare-250-Beers.pdf
Drinking too much is not necessarily an issue (unless you are on insulin - when it can cause hypos - or you want to drink beer or wine (rather than liquor) and your goal is specifically to remain in ketosis.
I use alcohol (typically a glass of moscato or riesling) when my meal pushes the carb limit. I can typically eat about 30 carbs more in a meal (total of 50 net) when I drink 5 oz of wine - since alcohol turns off the background liver release of glucose.
Now - I don't have a set daily carb limit. My carb limits are for the sole purpose of keeping my blood glucose within normal ranges at all times. Without alcohol that is about 20 grams in a 2 hour period; with alcohol I can do about 50 (including whatever carbs are in the alcohol). So for me (theoretically - since I've only tried it with wine), I could come very close to handling even the higher carb content you outlined.
If your goal is expressly to remain in ketogenesis (rather than to reap the diabetic benefits that eating low carb generates), your math will differ.
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I had a big, high carb evening myself, but it was home made cheesecake and it was divine. Drinking lots of water tonight and hitting the gym tomorrow morning to help burn off the extra glycogen. I'm treating it like a refeed before I start my strength program, lol.
*edited for silly spell check.0 -
ConstantStruggle wrote: »OMG!!! I just completely ruined my low carb commitment with Pizza and Beer!!!!
I know I will be paying for it for the next couple days but.......DAMN!!!!
IT WAS SOOOOOOO GOOOOOOD!!!!!!!
OopS!!
Nah, not ruined. It was just a speed bump, albeit a tasty one! You can pick up where you left off keto-wise and get back up to speed in no time.
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ConstantStruggle wrote: »OMG!!! I just completely ruined my low carb commitment with Pizza and Beer!!!!
I know I will be paying for it for the next couple days but.......DAMN!!!!
IT WAS SOOOOOOO GOOOOOOD!!!!!!!
OopS!!
Pizza & Beer ... ahhh....
Let me start again. Pizza & Beer..... is not an automatic cheat....
There are few things that get my heart pounding like those 3 *kitten* words. Not that I obsess over Pizza & Beer (I do....), but I have been giving this some intellectual attention over the last few weeks.
Here's my thinking for that once-in-a-blue-moon evening. Hasn't been tested in actual practice - possibly for my First Ketoversary this December, if I am really *kitten* good and hit goal weight and labs.- Pizza - Order double cheese and just rake it off the crust and jam it down your gullet.
- Beer - Not worth it to drink ultra-light. So.... order a relatively dry, low-alcohol beer (like Founder's All-Day IPA). Here's a partial list of beer values for low carbers: http://lowcarbediem.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/FREE-Download-Atkins-List-Low-Carbohydrate-Beer-Compare-250-Beers.pdf
1. Simulate a Michelada - dump some hot sauce in your 2nd beer, so as to slow yourself down (enjoy the 1st one!);
2. Alternate each glass of beer with a glass of water;
3. If you need a jolt, get a shot of tequila or whiskey on the side and drink it before the beer and water arrive.
PLAN I - All the day's carbs - 54 net carbs
=================================Cal--NetC--Prot--Fat
Founder's Brewing Co. - All Day Ipa, 36 oz.===432--36----0----0
Mozzarella Shredded Cheese, 1 cup========320---4---32---20
Patron - Tequila, 2 oz===================140---0----0----0
Classico - Traditional Pizza Sauce, 0.5 cup===80----12----2----2
============================TOTAL=972---54---34---22
=================================Cal--NetC--Prot--Fat
PLAN II - Might fit macros - 26 net carbs
=================================Cal--NetC--Prot--Fat
Founder's Brewing Co. - All Day Ipa, 16 oz.===192--16----0----0
Mozzarella Shredded Cheese, 1 cup========320---4---32---20
Patron - Tequila, 2 oz===================140---0----0----0
Classico - Traditional Pizza Sauce, 0.25 cup===40----6----1----1
============================TOTAL=692---26--33---21
=================================Cal--NetC--Prot--Fat
One favor, @ConstantStruggle? Don't tell us if you don't wind up paying over next few days.....
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Other craft/quality beers I enjoyed on my summer of beer:
Cigar City Brewing - Jai Alai IPA
Appalachian Mountain Brewing - Long Leaf IPA
21st Ammendment Brewing - Brew Free or Die IPA
Bell's Brewery Inc - Two Hearted Ale (one of my less favorite)
Fairhope Brewing Company - some sour ale I can't remember the name of, it was a small batch, limited distribution, tap only.
Green Man Brewery - Wayfarer IPA
Rocket Republic Brewing Company - Grapefruit Mach 1 IPA
Salty Nut Brewery - Hop Naughty IPA
Yellowhammer Brewing - Hop Revival Imperial IPA
There were others, especially as we have a local place with 30 beer on tap, mostly local (and others in the state and region) with sampling and flights.1 -
Drinking too much is not necessarily an issue (unless you are on insulin - when it can cause hypos - or you want to drink beer or wine (rather than liquor) and your goal is specifically to remain in ketosis.
I use alcohol (typically a glass of moscato or riesling) when my meal pushes the carb limit. I can typically eat about 30 carbs more in a meal (total of 50 net) when I drink 5 oz of wine - since alcohol turns off the background liver release of glucose.
Now - I don't have a set daily carb limit. My carb limits are for the sole purpose of keeping my blood glucose within normal ranges at all times. Without alcohol that is about 20 grams in a 2 hour period; with alcohol I can do about 50 (including whatever carbs are in the alcohol). So for me (theoretically - since I've only tried it with wine), I could come very close to handling even the higher carb content you outlined.
If your goal is expressly to remain in ketogenesis (rather than to reap the diabetic benefits that eating low carb generates), your math will differ.
Hmmm. I think I must be missing something. I'm with you on the straight alcohol part. But when you start adding carbs, it seems counter-intuitive.....
According to your approach, shouldn't I be able to drink a high-carb sweet stout, along with a shot of whiskey and maybe even some candy, and keep my BG within normal ranges - not only while my liver's distracted by the alcohol, but also afterwards?
Focusing solely on the diabetes angle, every gram of carb has to be metabolized eventually (well, not counting fiber, etc.), and I would think that regardless of the alcohol, my pancreas would produce glucagon in response to the carbs, which due to my insulin resistance / delayed insulin release (since I'm T2D), would cause my BG to rise once my liver's done drinking. ??
Maybe your happy results are due to your being less insulin resistant/carb intolerant than I am (and already at your goal weight - congrats again!).
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I had a carb blow-out tonight too -- we had company, so I made low carb everything except for the flourless chocolate mousse cake. I was going to resist, but then...I've been good for a long time, and my chocolate mousse cake is really freaking good.
Tomorrow is back to the plan, though.2 -
@nicsflyingcircus, is the All-Day IPA glass empty just because while better than Mick Ultra, it still sucks compared to really good swill?
What I'd really like is one (case) of these..... 11%
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Drinking too much is not necessarily an issue (unless you are on insulin - when it can cause hypos - or you want to drink beer or wine (rather than liquor) and your goal is specifically to remain in ketosis.
I use alcohol (typically a glass of moscato or riesling) when my meal pushes the carb limit. I can typically eat about 30 carbs more in a meal (total of 50 net) when I drink 5 oz of wine - since alcohol turns off the background liver release of glucose.
Now - I don't have a set daily carb limit. My carb limits are for the sole purpose of keeping my blood glucose within normal ranges at all times. Without alcohol that is about 20 grams in a 2 hour period; with alcohol I can do about 50 (including whatever carbs are in the alcohol). So for me (theoretically - since I've only tried it with wine), I could come very close to handling even the higher carb content you outlined.
If your goal is expressly to remain in ketogenesis (rather than to reap the diabetic benefits that eating low carb generates), your math will differ.
Hmmm. I think I must be missing something. I'm with you on the straight alcohol part. But when you start adding carbs, it seems counter-intuitive.....
According to your approach, shouldn't I be able to drink a high-carb sweet stout, along with a shot of whiskey and maybe even some candy, and keep my BG within normal ranges - not only while my liver's distracted by the alcohol, but also afterwards?
Focusing solely on the diabetes angle, every gram of carb has to be metabolized eventually (well, not counting fiber, etc.), and I would think that regardless of the alcohol, my pancreas would produce glucagon in response to the carbs, which due to my insulin resistance / delayed insulin release (since I'm T2D), would cause my BG to rise once my liver's done drinking. ??
Maybe your happy results are due to your being less insulin resistant/carb intolerant than I am (and already at your goal weight - congrats again!).
There are two sources for glucose in your blood: carbohydrates (and to a lesser degree protein), and your liver.
Your liver constantly dumps glucose into your bloodstream (to keep you from going hypo), unless it gets a signal to shut off the background glucose because there is incoming food. Most (all?) T2 diabetics are missing the 1st phase insulin response to food - a small spike that signals the liver to stop releasing glucose - so it just keeps pumping it out, even though it isn't needed.
So when you don't have a 1st phase insulin response, and are insulin resistant, your body really struggles not only to handle the glucose from food - but also the glucose your liver is still pumping out since it didn't get the shut-off message.
So since my 1st phase insulin response is broken, I occasionally use alcohol as an artificial replacement for that 1st phase - to tell the liver to shut down (taking advantage of the liver's one-track mind). So the carbs I eat (or drink) are still moved out of the bloodstream at whatever rate I process them (slower than someone with a "normal" metabolism) - but because I've shut off the background dump from my liver, my body ONLY has to process what I eat (not the extra coming from my liver). If my insulin can handle liver dump + 20 carbs, and I shut off the liver dump, the response can then handle additional carbs equivalent to the liver dump until the liver returns its attention to keeping me from going hypo and starts dumping again.
Think of it as rain (the carbs you eat) falling into a dry river (no liver-added glucose) v. rain falling into a river that is already close to overflowing its bank (the background glucose your liver pumps out). The first phase response (or alcohol, or metformin) temporarily dams up the river and makes it dry - so you can handle a larger rain (the carbs you eat).
As to whether this relates to basic liver function v. weight - my insulin resistance has gone from mildly diabetic to pre-diabetic, but not because of weight loss. That change was the result of 6 weeks on the blood sugar diet (BSD). The response was near instantaneous (~ day 2 or 3 on the diet), whereas there was no change in carb tolerance in correlation to the 48 lb weight loss that predated the BSD. The immediate drop in average BG levels happened again Monday when I restarted the BSD after a 2-3 month break at maintenance calories. I can - after the first 6-weeks on the BSD - consume a few more carbs (~23-25 grams) without going above 140. That change in the amount of carbs I can consume occurred very near the start of the BSD and persisted through the 2-3-month weight maintenance period (even though the lower average BG did not persist - i.e. no spikes above 140, but fasting BG and average pre-meal BG were higher during the maintenance period). But that additional tolerance is nowhere near the 150% more I can consume (temporarily) just by drinking a 5 oz glass of wine - which began as early as Thanskgiving when I accidentally discovered it (at ~180 lbs).
As an example - I ate an ear of corn tonight + 5 oz of wine (total of 40 carbs). My BG at 1 hour was 117, 94 at 2 hours, and 78 at 3 hours. I've tracked it as long as 5 hours (late November/early December), with the same results. During that same period an 18 carb meal of certain carbs spiked me to between 150 and 180.
So - as to your hypothetical - candy varies quite a bit, so I'll use pizza, the other food in your post. I could have a sweet stout (7.5 carb grams/12 oz) and - almost - 2 slices of thin crust pizza (44 carbs). Without the alcohol, I couldn't quite even have one piece of pizza. The liver only has to be distracted long enough for the insulin to move the glucose from the digested carbs out of of my bloodstream (that takes under 2 hours, as long as I don't spike above 140). Once the food-related glucose is gone (the river is dry again), and the dam opens up to refill the river with the glucose put out by the liver when it restarts, it isn't any fuller than it was before I temporarily dammed it up by having a drink.
Try an experiment yourself - since diabetes is not uniform from person to person. If you don't want to add carbs by testing a stout, test a shot of carbless liquor and see if your BG goes down.
The first few times I didn't eat any additional carbs (other than the wine). It was in the early days of carb counting. I had carefully counted the carbs in the meal and expected the added carbs in the wine to put me at the top of the BG range I was comfortable with. I was dumbfounded when it barely broke 100, since the food alone should have put me around 130. So I tried it again another day, with a sweeter wine - same results. Next I tried wine without food - and my BG fell to the mid-80s (even though it was a very sweet wine). After that, I started careful experimentation with adding carbs - which is how I know that my liver dumps background glucose equivalent to about 30 grams of carbs. All of this testing took place when I weighed ~180 lbs (17 lbs down from my starting weight, and 50 lbs ago from where I am now).3 -
So, in layman's terms, are you saying that alcohol distracts your liver to the point that not all the carbs from food get absorbed?1
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Try an experiment yourself - since diabetes is not uniform from person to person. If you don't want to add carbs by testing a stout, test a shot of carbless liquor and see if your BG goes down.
In fact, I've done that experiment (and repeated to verify the result....) - if memory serves, at your suggestion.
But I haven't done the one with carbs yet....
I must have been under a misimpression in thinking that all glucose goes through the liver on its way to your blood stream and, therefore would be caught by the dam in your example, only to add to the water that's released when the floodgates are opened (and not pushed into the liver or muscles for storage, since a T2D's insulin doesn't work according to script).
Here's one for you - is metformin superfluous, then, during the time your liver is dealing with alcohol? (I think this was @midwesterner85's thinking, but I can't find his post right off......)
BTW, thanks! Nice to have you back.
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Folks, I'm going to start an "Alcohol & Carbs" thread, as I'm sure there will be many folks interested who won't stop into this one due the title not matching the content...... (sorry for hijacking!).0
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So, in layman's terms, are you saying that alcohol distracts your liver to the point that not all the carbs from food get absorbed?
Not quite. The alcohol doesn't affect converting carbs into glucose (which happens in the mouth and small intestine) - it just temporarily prevents the liver from making the glucose overload worse.
Think of your insulin as a bailing bucket. When you have T2 diabetes, insulin resistance makes your bailing bucket too small to keep up with the glucose in the bloodstream.
But a too-small-bailing bucket is not the only thing that is wrong.
Long before your bailing bucket shrunk, the switch that controls the glucose production factory in your liver broke. That factory is designed to turn on and off. It makes glucose when you need it (between meals and overnight), and doesn't make it when you don't need it (when you're eating). For people with diabetes, the switch is stuck permanently on - so it continues to make glucose, even when you are eating and don't need it.
That means my teeny-tiny bailing bucket has an even harder time keeping up with the glucose my gut is sending out from the carbs I just ate - because my liver didn't get the shut-off notice and is also still pumping out glucose.
All I'm accomplishing is making my body mimic the normal response to food - by shutting off the liver production factory - so my teeny-tiny bailing bucket only has to bail the glucose that comes from food (just like normal people). That means I can eat eat a few more carbs. Not a lot more - my bailing bucket is still too small to handle a normal carb load - but a little more for an occasional treat, since turning off my liver means I get to eat the glucose (in carbs) that my liver would otherwise have continued to send out (because its built-in shut-off switch is broken).2 -
So, in layman's terms, are you saying that alcohol distracts your liver to the point that not all the carbs from food get absorbed?
Not quite. The alcohol doesn't affect converting carbs into glucose (which happens in the mouth and small intestine) - it just temporarily prevents the liver from making the glucose overload worse.
Think of your insulin as a bailing bucket. When you have T2 diabetes, insulin resistance makes your bailing bucket too small to keep up with the glucose in the bloodstream.
But a too-small-bailing bucket is not the only thing that is wrong.
Long before your bailing bucket shrunk, the switch that controls the glucose production factory in your liver broke. That factory is designed to turn on and off. It makes glucose when you need it (between meals and overnight), and doesn't make it when you don't need it (when you're eating). For people with diabetes, the switch is stuck permanently on - so it continues to make glucose, even when you are eating and don't need it.
That means my teeny-tiny bailing bucket has an even harder time keeping up with the glucose my gut is sending out from the carbs I just ate - because my liver didn't get the shut-off notice and is also still pumping out glucose.
All I'm accomplishing is making my body mimic the normal response to food - by shutting off the liver production factory - so my teeny-tiny bailing bucket only has to bail the glucose that comes from food (just like normal people). That means I can eat eat a few more carbs. Not a lot more - my bailing bucket is still too small to handle a normal carb load - but a little more for an occasional treat, since turning off my liver means I get to eat the glucose (in carbs) that my liver would otherwise have continued to send out (because its built-in shut-off switch is broken).
Oh right! I get it, ok. Thank you for explaining. Who said the human body was simple eh?0 -
@nicsflyingcircus, is the All-Day IPA glass empty just because while better than Mick Ultra, it still sucks compared to really good swill?
What I'd really like is one (case) of these..... 11%
I like a good stout, but... In it's place. And it's place is not 100 degree beach and pool and summertime.
And the pint glass came with the pint for 5$ at a place at the beach. Wasn't high on my list, but it was funny that I had the glass when the beer was mentioned. I actually found it rather unassuming, I like my beer higher in IBU's than that.0 -
nicsflyingcircus wrote: »And the pint glass came with the pint for 5$ at a place at the beach. Wasn't high on my list, but it was funny that I had the glass when the beer was mentioned. I actually found it rather unassuming, I like my beer higher in IBU's than that.
It's not like the expectations from an "all day" beer are that high, but yeah, doesn't compare w Founders' Centennial.0 -
Too lazy to read the rest of the thread, but just want to say -- it happens.
My husband has been down and out for two weeks, including a four-day adventure with various doctors, three of which spent in the hospital, courtesy some sort of as-yet-unknown (like, "we're sending this to the CDC" unknown), antibiotic-resistant infection that caused abscesses in his jaw and took out three teeth and nearly part of his mandible in the process.
It started with what should have been routine extraction of some infected teeth on Monday (after a week of him being out in pain, waiting for the antibiotics to work), but they found out (after getting him under twilight sedation) that they couldn't do it, because his jaw wouldn't open enough. Since he was sedated, the earliest any dental surgeon would see him was the next day. So, the next day, we go to the one we found, who basically said that if my husband can't be a perfect little patient and let him stick his mirror in, we can GTFO. So, we fought to get into another one a couple of hours later, who promptly told him to go to the ER, because not even the dental surgeon had the equipment to do what turned out to be necessary and they needed the more advanced equipment in the hospital. So, for the next 9 hours, we sat and waited in the ER intake process, to get him into surgery, 7 of which were waiting to get him an actual room.
So, between the lack of money (he's sole income right now, and hourly), elevated stress, and time at the hospital, my diet has been...less than stellar, since I spent a fair bit of time eating out of the hospital cafeteria, which is a low-fat, grain-filled minefield. My choices were pretty much the Chiptole-knockoff Mexican, biting the bullet with the rice, or salad with a handful of chicken (and no non-light dressing in sight). The Mexican was heartier, but left me feeling not so great, and the salad, while more compliant, left much to be desired without any appreciable amount of fat (my saving grace was the cashews). I unfortunately found out the hard way that the Asian protein selections were all breaded.
Outside of the hospital, there have been more consumption of potatoes and subpar coffee than I've had in a while, further derailing me.
On the upside, I did not throw in the towel and go with a sub from Subway at the hospital, which I considered, due to the effect of the Mexican and the sad salad bar salad being my only other option (it wasn't until I was eating my last meal that I found out that they do, indeed, do sub salads, which I didn't find on their menu).1 -
I was listening to Livin La Vida Low Carb today and one of the doctors speaking said that from one meal of 100g Carbs it can take up to three weeks to recover. It was a dose of reality for me. If anyone is interested, I'll look up the episode number2
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@Dragonwolf I am so sorry that your husband and you are going through this. You'll need all your energy to deal with it... Good thoughts for good healing!0
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@Dragonwolf: Considering all the two of you have been through, you did remarkedly well. Hang in there and good thoughts for your hubby!1
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I was listening to Livin La Vida Low Carb today and one of the doctors speaking said that from one meal of 100g Carbs it can take up to three weeks to recover. It was a dose of reality for me. If anyone is interested, I'll look up the episode number
Hi. Would you please post the episode number?
Thanks!
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@Dragonwolf: Considering all the two of you have been through, you did remarkedly well. Hang in there and good thoughts for your hubby!
Oh my goodness! I would go temporarily mad over that situation. So much stress. I hope he's doing better. 0 -
Thanks. He's doing better on that front, now, finally, after more than a week of super doses of antibiotics. Unfortunately, his *kitten* of a manager fired him two days after returning (and yes, unfortunately, it is legal), putting us into "applying for food stamps to get up to broke college kid" level of survival mode until we can get jobs again.
When it rains, it pours, eh?1
This discussion has been closed.