April 2018 Challenge
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I was listening to 2 Keto Dudes podcasts a while back, but haven't in a bit. I think they share a lot of valuable information and explain the science behind a lot of topics they cover HOWEVER...they aren't Drs. They are upfront about that, and go back every podcast to correct any misinformation they've previously shared. I can't recall if there were things they said that I now know are erroneous because I was so new to keto when I was a listener.
I'm visually driven, so listening to people talk for hours with nothing to see or visualize doesn't work for me. I occasionally watch a video but not from one specific source I can even remember.2 -
@NikkJRM:[/quote]The thing with keto is it's incredibly easy to overeat fat. Once people start making desserts & even a lot of the snacks or bpc & using hwc there is a lot of fat. Fat is calorie dense. [/quote]
“What Nikki said!!!” I used to eat fat bombs (FB) and drink bullet proof coffee(BPC) when I first started keto. I was a macro hawk, and if the recipes I made didn’t meet my high fat needs, I’d slam down a FB or BPC. However, once I became fully keto/fat adapted (about 3 weeks) my weight loss dropped off drastically. I found it to be a delicate dance to balance my calorie restriction with my high fat macros.
I had to back way off from FB, BPC and other non-meal ways to get fat into my diet. I didn’t like the idea ingesting pure fat that I didn’t really enjoy eating. Frozen coconut oil mixed with peanut butter and butter in my coffee were not appetizing to me. So, I searched for and became more sophisticated in my menus.
Deserts are one way to go. There are numerous yummy keto deserts out there. I’ve tried several of the ones posted on this thread. I prefer simple one serving deserts because I will eat all 12 servings if a recipe makes that much. But my go to is homemade sauces and dressings. There are a lot of them out there. What I like about them is control. You control ingredients and the amount you use. In addition, they make stuff delicious. I don’t feel I’m sacrificing calories solely for the sake of adding fat.
By the way, I
keto and I eating fat!
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Just saying 'Hi' to everyone new, it's never too late to join this challenge, even the 29th April will be fine! Then you will slip gently into to May Challenge and yes there will be a May Challenge!2
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That is one of the fascinating things to me, @stormywxs288
At first, I didn't feel good without adding more fats. I have since discovered that an underlying health condition was inhibiting my ability to convert the eating fat to ketones -- and my ability to use the ketones...
Looking at the macro breakdown, I think one of the things the keeps getting lost in translation is this:
Our nutritional needs to not change WITH A CALORIE DEFICIT.
Whether we are eating to lose 0.5 pounds per day or 2.0 pounds per day, our protein needs are the same (additional exercise excepting, etc,). Our carb limit is the same.
And this is because we are providing the caloric difference in the calories we are burning - BY BURNING THROUGH STORED BODY FAT. This stored body fat doesn't have any nutrients in it. It is straight up stored energy. The ONLY macro this should replace is fat.
That means YOUR ENTIRE CALORIC DEFICIT, WHETHER 200 CALORIES OR 1000 CALORIES OF A DEFICIT SHOULD COME STRAIGHT FROM YOUR EATEN FAT.
Take a moment to let that sink in...
You're burning body fat for the caloric deficit. Therefore, that can ONLY replace consumed fat.
The fat, in a non-medical ketogenic diet (as in, you're not managing seizures, migraines, other neurological things, etc.) is used for hormone health (this is EVERYONE, not just keto folks)...and then for satiety... It is a combo of burned body fat and eaten fats that make up the main "fuel."
The carbs are a limit...
The protein is a MINIMUM range needed for muscle protection, for skin, etc. maintenance, and such.
The only thing left to tweak is fat...2 -
Re People to read/listen to, my person of choice is Amy Berger at tuit nutrition, I love her approach and utter common sense and she makes me laugh out loud at times!
Re Fat and Calories, yup calories matter. If Keto was all that was needed to loose weight then those on strict keto for years for medical reasons would disappear, just waste away! There is a balance to everything and I think the issue is not thinking 'I have so many calories per day therefore I can eat what I want as I'm just following a calories deficit diet', we've mostly all done that and it hasn't worked too well for most of us which is why we are here now.
It's not quite the simple 'a calorie in equals a calorie out' equation as it's what these calories are made of and our bodies responses to them that counts. We need to keep up the protein keep down the carbs and loose some of the fat once we are fat adapted. After all as KnitOrMiss says, it's the body fat we want to loose, not provide our bodies with unlimited amounts of fat via our diet.
Both protein and fat contribute to the lack of hunger most people experience on Keto, which is why suddenly it is easier to loose weight and to go longer between meals which means some people end up doing some fasting which is fine if you aren't hungry but if you are then go ahead and eat! Just make sure it's in your macros and also remember that these will change as your weight drops.
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I just want to say that I love this group and I enjoyed just reading that last round of discussion! I SO wish I had the time to join in fully right now (and give my 2 cents-lol)! I love the support and encouragement that is freely shared, along with the wealth of information.
@KnitOrMiss , I agree with your most recent post and have learned first-hand during the times I have tried to 'cheat the system' that I get the best results when I stick firmly to macros by looking at my protein # as a GOAL, my carbs # as a LIMIT and fat to be tweaked depending on my current need or the calorie deficit I am aiming for!
And, @stormywxs288 , I also think Keto is "a magical, beautiful, scientific miracle." !!
I like the works of Dr Phinney and Dr Volk. I read/watch others for additional info, recipes, ideas, but I typically weigh the info I get against what Phinney and Volk say and stick with them. There are a lot of resources out there (which is great), but there are many speaking definitively without supporting what they say with science and many are not doctors (not that being a dr makes anyone automatically right!) I don't discount the other resources, but I do weigh and research what they say....
I did not post my weight on Sunday because I was boycotting my scale. I was up a few lbs and know exactly what it was from, so I'm working on getting it together. I will be logging tomorrow no matter what it yells at me.
I get frustrated that I feel I have to be so strict in my approach to get results - especially when I see losses others are experiencing with what to me looks like a much more laid back approach. I feel this way even when I KNOW not to compare - as we all have different goals, different bodies and are at very different parts in our journeys. UPSIDE: what I love about Keto is that the 'strict' is just so darn easier than any other thing I've tried....and it works!!
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xDaniDragonflyx wrote: »calories aren't supposed to matter as much because you're eating more healthy on a keto diet
This may be true for someone who eats meat & veggies but, at the end of the day calories are exactly what matters no matter what diet you keep. The thing with keto is it's incredibly easy to overeat fat. Once people start making desserts & even a lot of the snacks or bpc & using hwc there is a lot of fat. Fat is calorie dense.
I know I personally loved making desserts & keto alternatives to a lot of my favorite foods, but they always have a lot of dairy & butter. I had to skip over many recipes because they would have put me over on calories for the day.
Maybe that's why I haven't come across over eating yet, lol! I haven't really played with too many dessert recipes. I have seen some really yummy looking ones that I've saved for pinterest for 'later.' Later, when I've lost much more weight. Because one of those yummy fat bombs would be my entire fat allocation for one day. So, I've had to really look around for recipes that aren't too terrible. But again, I haven't really used too many recipes.
I'm barely a month and a half in to my keto journey, so I'm following my KISS method and just keeping it as simple as possible til I adapt.
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@KnitOrMiss @stormywxs288 Love this discussion about fat and weight loss. My question is, then, since the deficit needs to come from fat calories (i.e. burning body fat in place of nutritional fat), should my macros be more like 5% carbs, 30-35% protein, 60-65% fat, since reduction of fat intake will reduce the percentage of calories from fat in my diet?
Thanks!0 -
I this group! Because of you I’ve added experts like Phinney, Volek and Berger to my library of keto/low carb gurus. I’ve experienced the simple delicious things like mug cakes and frozen frostys that I never would have discovered on my own.
But more important than all of that is I’ve come to appreciate, respect and look forward to hearing your points of view (POVs) on our common subject – KETO. We are all experiments of one so, of course what works for me may not work for you and vice-versa. However, in my POV we seem able to deliver and share our POVs in a kinder, gentler manner than most internet forums I’ve experienced.
In my opinion, I put more value in your POVs than the so-called experts, because you are real people sharing your stories of what works for you. I value results more than words. On this thread I’ve been inspired by real people showing real results. I hope we continue this thread into May and the rest of this year.
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@stormywxs288 I agree with you, Stormy, it's much easier to be on this journey with people you can talk to rather than depending on videos and blogs and slogging through the down times all by yourself. I started being interested in keto back in October of last year when I came across Dr. Eric Berg's videos. It's been a long haul with not much movement on the scale compared to many of you on this thread (13 pounds so far) but when this challenge began in January and I realized that I'm not the only one that gets discouraged because of slow loss, it boosted my motivation considerably!
This last discussion has been insightful regarding macros. I've been fat adapted for a long time and perhaps I've been eating too much fat and that's been sabotaging my progress. I'll be paying closer attention to that from now on. That, and increasing my calorie intake slightly. Most days I stay under 1200. It's hard to eat when I'm not very hungry. How many successful "diets" have that as a problem??? I'm loving keto!5 -
@KnitOrMiss @stormywxs288 Love this discussion about fat and weight loss. My question is, then, since the deficit needs to come from fat calories (i.e. burning body fat in place of nutritional fat), should my macros be more like 5% carbs, 30-35% protein, 60-65% fat, since reduction of fat intake will reduce the percentage of calories from fat in my diet?
Thanks!
@d_dc_lady
I have to say that I don't remember how far you are in to your keto journey or whether you're struggling currently...
My general thought is - if it ain't broke, don't fix it... You can always adjust later. But if you feel well, you're regaining health markers, and you're losing weight (if that is a goal), keep calm and keto on... Does that make sense???
BUT, if it is "broken," then yes, your breakdown being more that way makes sense to me as long as you aren't using a MEDICAL KETOGENIC DIET for neurological reasons and instead are using a Nutritional Ketogenic Diet for weight loss/health gains.
But remember, while the breakdown in percentages are what we use here on MFP, it is really more about the grams as far as keto itself.
5% of carbs for one person can be 10 grams -- for another person it might be 60 grams! (obviously different height/weight situations there)....
But, saying 20 NET grams or carbs with a cap of 50 TOTAL grams of carbs is better - and you can just make that percentage as close to your number as possible, whichever makes you feel better, not seeing RED or using RED as a motivator.
And so on...
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@KnitOrMiss @stormywxs288 Love this discussion about fat and weight loss. My question is, then, since the deficit needs to come from fat calories (i.e. burning body fat in place of nutritional fat), should my macros be more like 5% carbs, 30-35% protein, 60-65% fat, since reduction of fat intake will reduce the percentage of calories from fat in my diet?
Thanks!
I started following my macros in grams rather than percentages. Because a person could be at 3000 calories, and the percentages could look perfect. I was spending a lot of time tracking. When I stick to my current macros by numbers rather than percentages, the calorie count takes care of itself.
So, my macros are 100p/68f/20c and if I stick there, I am about 1092 calories for the day automatically and I don't have to think about it. (I still look at it because I am requiring a higher calorie deficit right now to lose weight - and I get that through exercise or lowering my fat for the day) But, I am not following a high fat version of keto because it wasn't working for me.
I try to always meet my protein number because I don't want to lose muscle mass, I try to not go over on carbs. I read that women do best with at least 50 g of fat - so I look at that, but as long as I don't go over my 68 I don't care. If I'm feeling hungry too soon between meals, or having cravings I look at my fat number (along with my electrolytes).
I also try not to snack because I read how it spikes your blood sugar and affects cortisol levels every time you eat, so I'm trying to keep at least 4 hours between my meals. That was hard to get past because I was always told that we needed to be eating constantly to keep our metabolism up. I have a lot of things I 'learned' when I was younger that I am trying to re-learn! And definitely, the things that worked for me to lose weight when I was younger (and before having 4 kids) most definitely do NOT work for me now! I have really gotten to know the current version of myself during this process - because I am a far cry from my 20 or even 30 year old self!3 -
stormywxs288 wrote: »I value results more than words. On this thread I’ve been inspired by real people showing real results. I hope we continue this thread into May and the rest of this year.
This is true for me as well.2 -
Well, I just got my new RENPHO Smart Scale, and a Mononucleosis diagnosis all in one morning.2
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eggfooyamyam wrote: »Well, I just got my new RENPHO Smart Scale, and a Mononucleosis diagnosis all in one morning.
@eggfooyamyam
Mono?? Oh, goodness. That's awful... Did you suspect at all??? All the hugs...0 -
@KnitOrMiss I didn’t suspect Mono at all, I thought it was an abscess due to recent dental work. I still think I got it at the dentist, or my child sneezing into my mouth every day.0
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Sunday 04/01: 174.4
Sunday 04/08: 172.4
Sunday 04/15: 173.9
Sunday 04/22
Sunday 04/290 -
SW 09/24
04/01 155
04/08 155
04/15 153.4
Goodness I've actually lost some weight...........!! Croatia on Tuesday though.......... that should blow it!
Also just had various checkup tests at the doctors (offered to all the aged over 60s) and my BMI is just above the 'normal range'!!! Also my risk factor for cardiovascular episode the lowest she has ever seen at 8.01%, doesn't stop me walking under a bus though!
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I made some adjustments after feedback from you guys and listening to lots of 2 Keto Dudes podcasts. I stopped eating breakfast (sooo weird for me!) because I am just not hungry in the mornings any more. Now I have two meals a day and feel satiated through the day. That's dropped my calories and I've been getting more exercise in.
Sunday 04/01: 164.0
Sunday 04/08: 163.6
Sunday 04/15: 162.4
Sunday 04/22
Sunday 04/295 -
Enough with the eating intuitively already (2 weeks). It is getting harder to lose as I approach my goal weight, so I’m going to need all hands on deck to squeak out these last ten pounds. The last two weeks proved to me I may be able to maintain without logging food. However, weight loss is going to get my laser focus to include my OCD daily weigh-in, macro managing, and calorie restriction until I reach my 50-pound loss goal.
One thing I have let go of is checking my ketones. I can’t remember the last time I peed on a stick or breathed in a tube? However, I can tell you the few occasions when I was NOT in ketosis over the last 14 weeks even without sticks or tubes. I love the way I feel IN ketosis! My brain, joints, sleep, hunger, attitude and life all seem better when I’m in ketosis.
You know what else I like about keto: Air fried chicken wings, pulled pork, bacon wrapped asparagus and ribeye steaks. I also like only eating twice a day. I have freed up so much time, not even thinking about food, because I’m not HANGERY.
This week I lost 1.4 pounds and 0.8% BF, weighing in at 164.4. My goal weight is 154.4 pounds. That would get me to a total of 50lbs and about 15% BF lost. Also, at 155 and my height, the MFP BMI calculator says I will be in the healthy range. And so far, I’ve only lost 1.4 pounds of muscle out of the total 40 pounds I’ve dropped. I’m going to try to get to 3 bowling balls (45lbs) by the end of April.
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