Forcing Your Child to be Vegan/Vegetarian.
Turtlehurdle
Posts: 412
My question is, would you let your child choose? Or force them into eating how you eat? Is it too much to make seperate meals? Or is it worth it to let your child feel in control?
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I think it depends on your reasons for being vegan or vegetarian. If you do it for ethical reasons, well, isn't your job as a parent to raise an ethical child? If you are doing it just because (for example, you don't like the taste of meat, or you have a health issue), then it would make sense to let your child eat non-vegetarian food. It wouldn't, however, make sense to cook separate meals for them.0
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If you're doing it at all, I think you need to take some growth and development and nutrition courses. After that, sure, your kid, your rules. See how that works out when the kid is a teenager, though. :laugh:0
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Both of my children were raised vegetarian and have never had meat. My son i s now 18 and vegan and my daughter is 6. My family is vegan for ethical as well as health reasons and both of my children have said they never want to eat meat. If they wanted to eat meat (outside of my home as I do not want it here), they are, of course, free to do so. I would never "force" them to eat anything - how awful!
I am very glad that my son is vegan and has no interest in meat and hope my daughter follows the same path.0 -
I don't think it's any different than raising your child according to your own religious beliefs - as a parent, you're responsible for teaching your child what you believe is right, which of course, is up to personal interpretation.
Once the child gets old enough to make his own choices, eats lunch at school, etc. you can encourage them to follow the vegetarian/vegan life, but I don't think you can "force" them. I guess that, like with anything, you can only send them on their way and hope that they've absorbed some of the lessons you've taught them.
I don't plan on having children, but if I did, I would be adamant that there be no meat or animal secretions brought into my house. They would be free to make their own food choices outside of the home, but under my roof I would not be comfortable with my children consuming animals or animal products. I would ultimately let them choose because, let's face it, if they want a beef burger they're going to have one, but they would definitely know how I feel about it - and ultimately, how sad I would be.
Again though, I really don't want kids, so this si really just my own musing.0 -
Interesting that this should come up, since I was independently discussing this with my 20 year-old lifelong vegetarian son this morning. He told me he had an encounter with a friend recently after he told the friend he was vegan for the first 3 years of his life. The friend said, "You mean your parents MADE YOU eat vegan. How awful!" My son responded, "You mean your parents MADE you eat dead animals. How awful!" The friend backed down.
Bottom line is this: Just because eating meat is the dominant dietary choice in the US, doesn't mean families aren't imposing it on their children. Many children need to be coaxed and cajoled into eating meat. Many are horrified once they hear that death of animals is involved in meat production. I know--I was one of those children who hated the appearance and texture of meat, yet it was imposed upon me.0 -
Hey, kids, would you like some mac and cheese or the dead arm of an animal recently chopped off his body?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bps-xbo8wnA 0 -
As far as ethics go, parents can explain their positions and let the kids choose, vegan or otherwise. As far as health goes, I think all parents can do is the best they can and hope they're right...even though they won't be from time to time.
Personally, I don't happen to believe there's anything wrong with eating dead animals as a generalization, though I'm sure there would complications and exceptions to that. Being part of the society I'm in, I still think it's taboo to eat other people, for example. Other people obviously think there's a problem with eating "animals" and that's fine. At some point it just boils down to people holding different values as "Truths."
I do think there are ethical problems with the way we raise the animals that we do generally consider to be acceptable food options. I'm against torture, though not killing. I think animals can be killed humanely. There's definitely contention on that point, I realize.0 -
The ethics of eating meat go beyond the family. It is more than a "personal choice." It is a choice that affects the whole planet.Eating meat is causing global warming:
Eat less meat to prevent climate disaster, study warnsFertilisers used in growing feed crops for cattle produce the most potent of the greenhouse gases causing climate change
Suzanne Goldenberg, US environment correspondent
guardian.co.uk,
Friday 13 April 2012 07.56 EDT
Eating less meat will help environment, a new study says.
Meat eaters in developed countries will have to eat a lot less meat, cutting consumption by 50%, to avoid the worst consequences of future climate change, new research warns.
The fertilisers used in farming are responsible for a significant share of the warming that causes climate change.
A study published in Environmental Research Letters warns that drastic changes in food production and at the dinner table are needed by 2050 in order to prevent catastrophic global warming.
It's arguably the most difficult challenge in dealing with climate change: how to reduce emissions from food production while still producing enough to feed a global population projected to reach 9 billion by the middle of this century.
The findings, by Eric Davidson, director of the Woods Hole Research Centre in Massachusetts, say the developed world will have to cut fertiliser use by 50% and persuade consumers in the developed world to stop eating so much meat.
Davidson concedes it's a hard sell. Meat is a regular part of the diet in the developed world. In developing economies, such as China and India, meat consumption has risen along with prosperity.
"I think there are huge challenges in convincing people in the west to reduce portion sizes or the frequency of eating meat. That is part of our culture right now," he said.
Researchers have been paying closer attention in the past few years to the impact of agriculture on climate change, and the parallel problem of growing enough food for an expanding population. Some scientists are at work growing artificial meat which would avoid the fertilisers and manure responsible for climate change.
Nitrous oxide, released by fertilisers and animal manure, is the most potent of the greenhouse gases that cause climate change. The UN's climate body has called for deep cuts to those emissions.
Growing feed crops, for cattle and pigs, produces more of those emissions than crops that go directly into the human food chain. Eating less meat would reduce demand for fertiliser as well as reduce the amount of manure produced.
Davidson also suggests changes in current farming practice – such as growing winter ground cover crops – would help absorb nitrogen and prevent its release into the atmosphere.
In reaching his conclusion, Davidson draws on figures from the Food and Agricultural Organisation suggesting the world population will reach 8.9 billion by 2050, and that daily per capita calorie intake will also rise to 3130 calories.
Meat consumption is also projected to increase sharply to 89kg per person a year in rich countries and 37kg per person a year in the developing world.
Such a trajectory would put the world on course to more severe consequences of climate change.
Davidson is not suggesting people give up meat entirely. "The solution isn't that everyone needs to become a vegetarian or a vegan. Simply reducing portion sizes and frequency would go a long way," he said. So would switching from beef and pork, which have a high carbon foot print, to chicken or fish.0 -
As far as ethics go, parents can explain their positions and let the kids choose, vegan or otherwise. As far as health goes, I think all parents can do is the best they can and hope they're right...even though they won't be from time to time.
Are you saying ALL children should be given the choice of a vegan or meat-inclusive diet? Or, are you saying only children in families eating a minority diet (veganism in the US, for instance) should be offered a choice? Should Hindu children of vegetarian parents be offered a choice in India where vegetarianism is a majority diet? Does the dominant diet mean it should be accepted as the default?0 -
As a parent you are raising your children and influencing their lives forever. I have a feeling that I'll be forcing my little one to take a bath way more often then I am going to be shoving food down his throat. In a way, yes I will be instilling vegetarianism into his daily life, that is, until he is old enough to make the decisions himself. He will know what goes into his dinner and that alone is powerful. Whether meat eating family or not, every kid should have the opportunity to see what is truly on their plate.
My husband is not a vegetarian but has zero problem keeping a vegetarian household. He is also perfectly fine raising our son as a vegetarian until he makes the decision himself. I wish my son luck if he thinks he can convince me to bring any meat in the house though. When he's 10 and goes camping with friends or stays with other families, I am not going to judge him if he chooses to eat weinies and smores. The point is that while raising him, my husband and I are going to educate and influence every part of his day. You can still raise a vegetarian without forcing them.
Perfectly stated.Once the child gets old enough to make his own choices, eats lunch at school, etc. you can encourage them to follow the vegetarian/vegan life, but I don't think you can "force" them. I guess that, like with anything, you can only send them on their way and hope that they've absorbed some of the lessons you've taught them.0 -
As a parent you are raising your children and influencing their lives forever. I have a feeling that I'll be forcing my little one to take a bath way more often then I am going to be shoving food down his throat. In a way, yes I will be instilling vegetarianism into his daily life, that is, until he is old enough to make the decisions himself. He will know what goes into his dinner and that alone is powerful. Whether meat eating family or not, every kid should have the opportunity to see what is truly on their plate.
My husband is not a vegetarian but has zero problem keeping a vegetarian household. He is also perfectly fine raising our son as a vegetarian until he makes the decision himself. I wish my son luck if he thinks he can convince me to bring any meat in the house though. When he's 10 and goes camping with friends or stays with other families, I am not going to judge him if he chooses to eat weinies and smores. The point is that while raising him, my husband and I are going to educate and influence every part of his day. You can still raise a vegetarian without forcing them.
Perfectly stated.Once the child gets old enough to make his own choices, eats lunch at school, etc. you can encourage them to follow the vegetarian/vegan life, but I don't think you can "force" them. I guess that, like with anything, you can only send them on their way and hope that they've absorbed some of the lessons you've taught them.
True. When my son went on his first sleepover at age 5, we told the parents that he was a lifelong vegetarian. Once we left, the mother offered my son a hotdog saying 'It's okay. Your parents aren't here." He refused it. And he only told me this last year when he was 19 years old. There is no 'forcing' someone beyond a certain point.0 -
If you're doing it at all, I think you need to take some growth and development and nutrition courses. After that, sure, your kid, your rules. See how that works out when the kid is a teenager, though. :laugh:
My oldest is 20, going into his 2nd year of law school. He is a lifelong vegetarian who is 6 ft tall and weight proportionate. He also has a black belt in karate, which I mention to let you know he is neither pale nor wane. :laugh:
Edit: Oh yeah, and all this was done without a single nutrition or growth & development course.0 -
True. When my son went on his first sleepover at age 5, we told the parents that he was a lifelong vegetarian. Once we left, the mother offered my son a hotdog saying 'It's okay. Your parents aren't here." He refused it. And he only told me this last year when he was 19 years old. There is no 'forcing' someone beyond a certain point.
It is definitely more the parent/adult supervisors that I worry about most. Saying things like that is so incredibly disrespectful to the parent of the child. It definitely undermines the parent and basically points out the their parent is somehow doing something wrong. L will be able to make his own choices, but I don't want him making those choices because another parent placed him in that sort of uncomfortable position.0 -
If we were vegetarians, there would be no meat allowed in our house. It wouldn't matter if it was for ethical reasons or personal choice. Our kids eat what I serve. They follow the rules of our home.Or force them into eating how you eat?
Now, if we were vegetarians for religious reasons, we would expect our children to refrain from meat anywhere. We'd teach the our religious practices and explain why. As minors, if they ate meat behind our backs, they'd be in trouble. As adults, they'd be free to choose their own beliefs.0 -
True. When my son went on his first sleepover at age 5, we told the parents that he was a lifelong vegetarian. Once we left, the mother offered my son a hotdog saying 'It's okay. Your parents aren't here." He refused it. And he only told me this last year when he was 19 years old. There is no 'forcing' someone beyond a certain point.
It is definitely more the parent/adult supervisors that I worry about most. Saying things like that is so incredibly disrespectful to the parent of the child. It definitely undermines the parent and basically points out the their parent is somehow doing something wrong. L will be able to make his own choices, but I don't want him making those choices because another parent placed him in that sort of uncomfortable position.
Truthfully, I was horrified. I also think that vegetarians of years duration lack the digestive enzymes to eat meat on a lark. I truly believe there was a good chance my son would have been very ill had he accepted the hotdog. On a personal note, I felt very disrespected and my son's forced conspiratorial interaction with an adult had a sleazy feel to it. I believe that is the reason my son kept this a secret for so long. I felt badly for him, and felt I put him in the wrong hands all those many years ago.
I have had children visiting my house with various food sensitivities which I suspected were parental choice, and not actual allergies. Still, I respected the limits.0 -
I think I'd raise my kids to eat the way I did. I mean, I don't plan on having kids, but if I did, I wouldn't go around making exceptions to my lifestyle to please my children. Of course as they grew older I would let them make their own decisions, but as a parent, the responsibility of supplying nutrition is mine. However, if I were a vegetarian and he/she decided not to be, they'd have to cook their own food because I'm not going to be one of those parents who acts like a restaurant. I cook what I cook and if the kid doesn't want it, he can cook for himself.0
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I think I'd raise my kids to eat the way I did. I mean, I don't plan on having kids, but if I did, I wouldn't go around making exceptions to my lifestyle to please my children. Of course as they grew older I would let them make their own decisions, but as a parent, the responsibility of supplying nutrition is mine. However, if I were a vegetarian and he/she decided not to be, they'd have to cook their own food because I'm not going to be one of those parents who acts like a restaurant. I cook what I cook and if the kid doesn't want it, he can cook for himself.
I respect your reasoning, but I doubt I could ever agree to see meat cooked in my pans at home. Vegetarianism is mainly an ethical choice for me, but there's also an aesthetic aspect. The sights and smells of meat are repugnant to my husband and me.
I also might point out that while ethical vegetarianism isn't a 'religion,' it can be an overarching life view about humans and their relationship to animals. A life philosophy--particularly one that guides your choices several times every day and is therefore a living one--can be as strongly felt as a religious life view. So, I agree with the poster above who said that the motivation for the vegetarianism is an important consideration in reflecting on the questions posed by the OP.0 -
If my children are reaching an age where they want to start exploring things like being a vegetarian or vegan, I'm fine within reason and budget. If they are willing to fix their own food and educate themselves on different dish preperation, far be it from me to inhibit free thought or independent thinking. I would probably enjoy the conversations around the table due to their choices. Plus, that's and extra Ribeye for me.0
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If you're doing it at all, I think you need to take some growth and development and nutrition courses. After that, sure, your kid, your rules. See how that works out when the kid is a teenager, though. :laugh:
My oldest is 20, going into his 2nd year of law school. He is a lifelong vegetarian who is 6 ft tall and weight proportionate. He also has a black belt in karate, which I mention to let you know he is neither pale nor wane. :laugh:
Edit: Oh yeah, and all this was done without a single nutrition or growth & development course.
You might not have needed one, but if I'd decided my son should be vegetarian like I was, I would have needed those classes for sure. I wasn't the healthiest vegetarian eater in the world. And I've seen other vegetarians eat almost as bad as I did. I wouldn't wish that on a kid.0 -
Aw, everyone is being so respectful here. Let me stir the pot a bit.
How are your opinions affected by the following facts?
1. Many vegetarians do not eat a healthy diet, relying on high-fat and high-carbohydrate items for calories.
2. It is very difficult to get balanced nutrition on a vegan diet, and many vegans take multivitamins in order to get nutrients that most people get without problem from meat.
3. Plants don't want to die any more than animals do, and have a surprising variety of defense mechanisms to avoid being eaten/alert other plants to danger.
4. Research shows that certain people are physically unable to keep to a vegetarian diet, and physicians often advocate vegetarian patients who feel unwell to add fish once a week to their diet.0 -
If you're doing it at all, I think you need to take some growth and development and nutrition courses. After that, sure, your kid, your rules. See how that works out when the kid is a teenager, though. :laugh:
My oldest is 20, going into his 2nd year of law school. He is a lifelong vegetarian who is 6 ft tall and weight proportionate. He also has a black belt in karate, which I mention to let you know he is neither pale nor wane. :laugh:
Edit: Oh yeah, and all this was done without a single nutrition or growth & development course.
You might not have needed one, but if I'd decided my son should be vegetarian like I was, I would have needed those classes for sure. I wasn't the healthiest vegetarian eater in the world. And I've seen other vegetarians eat almost as bad as I did. I wouldn't wish that on a kid.
A lot of kids--vegetarian or not--are picky eaters who live on a few foods like pizza, mac & cheese, chicken nuggets and fruit juice. I'm not advocating this, by the way. But, kids are amazingly flexible creatures, who look like they survive by consuming air alone at times. I think kids that eat enough calories generally balance out over time. One of my children is a picky eater--one day I entered her largely monotonous diet into my food dairy to see how it balanced out. Darn if the macros and micros weren't impressive! I wasn't expecting that at all.0 -
The OP's original questions seem to assume that meat-eating is a birthright that even vegetarian/vegan families should respect. I wonder how many people here feel that way.0
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Aw, everyone is being so respectful here. Let me stir the pot a bit.
How are your opinions affected by the following facts?
1. Many vegetarians do not eat a healthy diet, relying on high-fat and high-carbohydrate items for calories.
2. It is very difficult to get balanced nutrition on a vegan diet, and many vegans take multivitamins in order to get nutrients that most people get without problem from meat.
3. Plants don't want to die any more than animals do, and have a surprising variety of defense mechanisms to avoid being eaten/alert other plants to danger.
4. Research shows that certain people are physically unable to keep to a vegetarian diet, and physicians often advocate vegetarian patients who feel unwell to add fish once a week to their diet.
Okay, you've stirred the pot.
1. Vegetarians as a whole are healthier and live longer than meat eaters, DESPITE the fact that some vegetarians make poor diet choices.
http://newsinhealth.nih.gov/issue/Jul2012/Feature1
2.I have been a vegetarian since 1979, and I have never had a problem with balanced diet. What exactly are you saying? Are you saying all or most vegetarians are incapable of maintaining a balanced diet. If so, that is just wrong. We have an epidemic of obesity and diabetes in this country and it is NOT due to vegetarians.
3. Plants have neither brains nor nervous systems. They cannot feel pain, nor can they "want" anything. What you are saying is utter nonsense,
4. More nonsense. Kindly give me a link to this "research."0 -
As far as ethics go, parents can explain their positions and let the kids choose, vegan or otherwise. As far as health goes, I think all parents can do is the best they can and hope they're right...even though they won't be from time to time.
Are you saying ALL children should be given the choice of a vegan or meat-inclusive diet? Or, are you saying only children in families eating a minority diet (veganism in the US, for instance) should be offered a choice? Should Hindu children of vegetarian parents be offered a choice in India where vegetarianism is a majority diet? Does the dominant diet mean it should be accepted as the default?
I'm saying that parents should do what they think is right and best for the child with the understanding that their kids are going to do whatever it is they want to do past a certain age. Additionally, the parents decision about what's right should be informed and reasoned; that's where the debate comes in when we talk about specific diets. Whether or not a parent should expose their child to all their options is sort of irrelevant to me because I don't think it *necessarily* affects the health of the child one way or the other, though it certainly could.
Given the proper composition, there's nothing inherently unhealthy about a vegetarian diet. The same can be said for a one that includes meat.0 -
The ethics of eating meat go beyond the family. It is more than a "personal choice." It is a choice that affects the whole planet.Eating meat is causing global warming:
It appears that what you're arguing against with your sources--and I admit I didn't read them all because I assumed they were there to reinforce some sort of hyperbolic rhetoric--is the system by which we eat meat now as a society. There may be some validity to that, but I think your statement "the ethics of eating meat go beyond the family." might rightly be rephrased to "the ethics of the way our meat eating habits affect our planet go beyond the family." The distinction there is that if I happened to raise my own chickens (I assume I would feed them with food I grow and only raise enough for my own family) or hunted pheasants and deer, etc, my carbon footprint is somewhat less than it is if I purchase a steak from a cattle ranching conglomerate. Now, not everyone has that option and even when people do have that option they don't exercise it. That's different than saying that eating meat is unethical. I guess I'm just more comfortable saying that our meat industry and habits may be unethical.0 -
As far as ethics go, parents can explain their positions and let the kids choose, vegan or otherwise. As far as health goes, I think all parents can do is the best they can and hope they're right...even though they won't be from time to time.
Are you saying ALL children should be given the choice of a vegan or meat-inclusive diet? Or, are you saying only children in families eating a minority diet (veganism in the US, for instance) should be offered a choice? Should Hindu children of vegetarian parents be offered a choice in India where vegetarianism is a majority diet? Does the dominant diet mean it should be accepted as the default?
I'm saying that parents should do what they think is right and best for the child with the understanding that their kids are going to do whatever it is they want to do past a certain age. Additionally, the parents decision about what's right should be informed and reasoned; that's where the debate comes in when we talk about specific diets. Whether or not a parent should expose their child to all their options is sort of irrelevant to me because I don't think it *necessarily* affects the health of the child one way or the other, though it certainly could.
Given the proper composition, there's nothing inherently unhealthy about a vegetarian diet. The same can be said for a one that includes meat.
I think as parents, we all offer the best of our experience. I became a vegetarian in my teens, and was always queasy about cooking meat before that. Consequently, my culinary talents and knowledge of nutrition reflects that experience. Similarly, I would expect a meat-eating parent facing a 4 year-old who doesn't want to eat meat would be at a disadvantage.
Then there are the ethical issues. As parents, we try to instill our values into our children. We do this both consciously and unconsciously. Ultimately, the kids choose which ones they will adopt into adulthood, but it doesn't mean we don't try to influence them on points which we feel strongly about.0 -
As far as ethics go, parents can explain their positions and let the kids choose, vegan or otherwise. As far as health goes, I think all parents can do is the best they can and hope they're right...even though they won't be from time to time.
Are you saying ALL children should be given the choice of a vegan or meat-inclusive diet? Or, are you saying only children in families eating a minority diet (veganism in the US, for instance) should be offered a choice? Should Hindu children of vegetarian parents be offered a choice in India where vegetarianism is a majority diet? Does the dominant diet mean it should be accepted as the default?
I'm saying that parents should do what they think is right and best for the child with the understanding that their kids are going to do whatever it is they want to do past a certain age. Additionally, the parents decision about what's right should be informed and reasoned; that's where the debate comes in when we talk about specific diets. Whether or not a parent should expose their child to all their options is sort of irrelevant to me because I don't think it *necessarily* affects the health of the child one way or the other, though it certainly could.
Given the proper composition, there's nothing inherently unhealthy about a vegetarian diet. The same can be said for a one that includes meat.
I disagree. While it is possible to have a healthy diet that includes meat, virtually all the studies show that eating meat is correlated with chronic diseases such as heart disease and cancer. A british study shows that while it is possible to have a healthy diet eating meat, the amount of meat in that diet must not be more than 70 grams per week, that is one quarter pounder every week and a half maximum. Few Americans who eat meat eat that little.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/8335986/Eat-less-red-meat-Government-scientists-warn.html0 -
As far as ethics go, parents can explain their positions and let the kids choose, vegan or otherwise. As far as health goes, I think all parents can do is the best they can and hope they're right...even though they won't be from time to time.
Are you saying ALL children should be given the choice of a vegan or meat-inclusive diet? Or, are you saying only children in families eating a minority diet (veganism in the US, for instance) should be offered a choice? Should Hindu children of vegetarian parents be offered a choice in India where vegetarianism is a majority diet? Does the dominant diet mean it should be accepted as the default?
I'm saying that parents should do what they think is right and best for the child with the understanding that their kids are going to do whatever it is they want to do past a certain age. Additionally, the parents decision about what's right should be informed and reasoned; that's where the debate comes in when we talk about specific diets. Whether or not a parent should expose their child to all their options is sort of irrelevant to me because I don't think it *necessarily* affects the health of the child one way or the other, though it certainly could.
Given the proper composition, there's nothing inherently unhealthy about a vegetarian diet. The same can be said for a one that includes meat.
I disagree. While it is possible to have a healthy diet that includes meat, virtually all the studies show that eating meat is correlated with chronic diseases such as heart disease and cancer. A british study shows that while it is possible to have a healthy diet eating meat, the amount of meat in that diet must not be more than 70 grams per week, that is one quarter pounder every week and a half maximum. Few Americans who eat meat eat that little.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/8335986/Eat-less-red-meat-Government-scientists-warn.html
Yes, but does this research take into account that we are not eating the lean meats of our ancestors, rather the bulk processed meats and mass produced fatty beef of today's society. Lean turkey, beef, and fish are surely not as likely to give you chronic dieseases as McDonald's beef patties, or a I wrong?0 -
1. Many vegetarians do not eat a healthy diet, relying on high-fat and high-carbohydrate items for calories.
2. It is very difficult to get balanced nutrition on a vegan diet, and many vegans take multivitamins in order to get nutrients that most people get without problem from meat.
3. Plants don't want to die any more than animals do, and have a surprising variety of defense mechanisms to avoid being eaten/alert other plants to danger.
4. Research shows that certain people are physically unable to keep to a vegetarian diet, and physicians often advocate vegetarian patients who feel unwell to add fish once a week to their diet.
1. Why does high-fat and high-carb automatically equal unhealthy? Avocados and peanut butters are high in fat, rice and pasta are all high carb, but each of these can have a place in a healthy diet.
2. Balanced nutrition isn't an issue strictly limited to vegan diets - there are plenty of omnivores out there who struggle to meet their dietary needs. With just a little planning, vegan nutrition is easy - we just get it from different sources. The only issue would be B12, which can be eaten through plant-based sources (after all, that's how cows and other animals get it), but in a lot of cases, it's simply easier to take a supplement.
3. Generally, at least from my own experience, vegetarians and vegans take issue with perpetuating the pain, suffering and slaughter of other sentient beings. Cows, pigs, chickens and other animals all have brains, nervous systems and are capable of suffering - at least for me, it's that issue that causes me to lead an animal-free lifestyle. If research comes that plants really are capable of feeling pain, suffering and loss like animals are, maybe I will reconsider my choices, but for now, I, and other vegans, are doing their best to reduce the amount of suffering in the world - we do, however, recognize that this does not mean we can necessarily eliminate suffering.
4. This isn't really a valid argument - you could state this for anything that requires above-average effort, say, running a marathon or getting into an Ivy-League university. Sure there are people who aren't "cut out for it" - but really that just means they don't want to put in the extra effort. The same can be said for people who turn to fast food and processed meals instead of cooking for themselves - it's not really a valid argument against a meatless lifestyle.0 -
As far as ethics go, parents can explain their positions and let the kids choose, vegan or otherwise. As far as health goes, I think all parents can do is the best they can and hope they're right...even though they won't be from time to time.
Are you saying ALL children should be given the choice of a vegan or meat-inclusive diet? Or, are you saying only children in families eating a minority diet (veganism in the US, for instance) should be offered a choice? Should Hindu children of vegetarian parents be offered a choice in India where vegetarianism is a majority diet? Does the dominant diet mean it should be accepted as the default?
I'm saying that parents should do what they think is right and best for the child with the understanding that their kids are going to do whatever it is they want to do past a certain age. Additionally, the parents decision about what's right should be informed and reasoned; that's where the debate comes in when we talk about specific diets. Whether or not a parent should expose their child to all their options is sort of irrelevant to me because I don't think it *necessarily* affects the health of the child one way or the other, though it certainly could.
Given the proper composition, there's nothing inherently unhealthy about a vegetarian diet. The same can be said for a one that includes meat.
I disagree. While it is possible to have a healthy diet that includes meat, virtually all the studies show that eating meat is correlated with chronic diseases such as heart disease and cancer. A british study shows that while it is possible to have a healthy diet eating meat, the amount of meat in that diet must not be more than 70 grams per week, that is one quarter pounder every week and a half maximum. Few Americans who eat meat eat that little.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/8335986/Eat-less-red-meat-Government-scientists-warn.html
Yes, but does this research take into account that we are not eating the lean meats of our ancestors, rather the bulk processed meats and mass produced fatty beef of today's society. Lean turkey, beef, and fish are surely not as likely to give you chronic dieseases as McDonald's beef patties, or a I wrong?
I know of no research that addresses that point. I have seen research that says the so-called Paleo diet is not particularly healthy, if that is where you are going. But I am not sure what ancestors you are referring to.0
This discussion has been closed.