TDEE & BMR: What they are and what to do with them
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Hi everyone, thank you in advance for any advice!
I've been eating 1600 cal per day and found that weight loss is stalling - seem to be losing and gaining the same 4 or 5 pounds.
I'm 5ft5, and I currently weigh 130 pounds. Each week I do 1 circuit training (approx 350 cals burned), 3 Les Mills Body Combat classes (approx 600 cals burned per class, so 1800 each week), and 2 Body Pump classes (approx 430 cals burned per class, so 860 per week). That's on average 3,000 cals burned each week, not taking into account 1 or 2 workouts in the gym. The gym classes are not everyday, and on 2 days I do Combat and Pump back to back, which means a burn of over 1000 cals on those 2 days.
Would you say this counts as 3-5 hrs moderate exercise or 5-6 hrs strenuous exercise? I used http://scoobysworkshop.com/calorie-calculator/ and if I set at 5-6hrs, it has worked out that TDEE -20% would be 1900 cals per day. I think this seems a lot and I'm worried to up from 1600 to 1900 each day and gain weight.
My diary is open if anyone could take a look and let me know what you think.
Thanks again.0 -
Hi everyone, thank you in advance for any advice!
I've been eating 1600 cal per day and found that weight loss is stalling - seem to be losing and gaining the same 4 or 5 pounds.
I'm 5ft5, and I currently weigh 130 pounds. Each week I do 1 circuit training (approx 350 cals burned), 3 Les Mills Body Combat classes (approx 600 cals burned per class, so 1800 each week), and 2 Body Pump classes (approx 430 cals burned per class, so 860 per week). That's on average 3,000 cals burned each week, not taking into account 1 or 2 workouts in the gym. The gym classes are not everyday, and on 2 days I do Combat and Pump back to back, which means a burn of over 1000 cals on those 2 days.
Would you say this counts as 3-5 hrs moderate exercise or 5-6 hrs strenuous exercise? I used http://scoobysworkshop.com/calorie-calculator/ and if I set at 5-6hrs, it has worked out that TDEE -20% would be 1900 cals per day. I think this seems a lot and I'm worried to up from 1600 to 1900 each day and gain weight.
My diary is open if anyone could take a look and let me know what you think.
Thanks again.
That's 6 pretty intense hrs, with no strength training in there for just the classes. Add the other, oh yeah.
And don't worry, it may seem like a lot, but what are you really comparing it to?
So you have been ONLY eating 1600 combined with that workout?
And your BMR around 1375 your body would like to burn if you were sleeping all day?
So been eating about 225 more than sleeping, and burning 350 - 600 almost daily on JUST the exercise, not including other moving around?0 -
The strength training is in the Body Pump classes, and in the gym.
It seems like a lot as for a couple of years I was eating 1200 a day, and upped to 1600 in around Sept/Oct 2012 because of the amount I burn at the gym. So it was a big deal for me to eat the 1600 initially although I understood the concept of eating more, it took me time to undo all my old thought process (i.e., eat as little as possible and workout as much as possible).
When you put it the way you have about 'eating about 225 more than sleeping, and burning 350 - 600 almost daily on JUST the exercise', seems like I need to reset my thought process again??0 -
It seems like a lot as for a couple of years I was eating 1200 a day, and upped to 1600 in around Sept/Oct 2012 because of the amount I burn at the gym. So it was a big deal for me to eat the 1600 initially although I understood the concept of eating more, it took me time to undo all my old thought process (i.e., eat as little as possible and workout as much as possible).
When you put it the way you have about 'eating about 225 more than sleeping, and burning 350 - 600 almost daily on JUST the exercise', seems like I need to reset my thought process again??
You are there, bam!
It's like me in KS going 4 hrs down to the Ozarks, and thinking, wow, these 300-400 ft elevation changes are huge, look at these mountains when down in this valley.
Now take me 12 hrs to the base of Longs Peak in CO, and ask me how big that 400 ft elevation change really is.0 -
It seems like a lot as for a couple of years I was eating 1200 a day, and upped to 1600 in around Sept/Oct 2012 because of the amount I burn at the gym. So it was a big deal for me to eat the 1600 initially although I understood the concept of eating more, it took me time to undo all my old thought process (i.e., eat as little as possible and workout as much as possible).
When you put it the way you have about 'eating about 225 more than sleeping, and burning 350 - 600 almost daily on JUST the exercise', seems like I need to reset my thought process again??
You are there, bam!
It's like me in KS going 4 hrs down to the Ozarks, and thinking, wow, these 300-400 ft elevation changes are huge, look at these mountains when down in this valley.
Now take me 12 hrs to the base of Longs Peak in CO, and ask me how big that 400 ft elevation change really is.
Thank you so much! I love this site - so many helpful people with real, practical advice :-) will I expect to see a weight increase initially as I change to 1900 cals? I'm guessing I will.0 -
I think the great thing about this thread is that it allows you a method to log your exercise (which I like doing).
I am set to lightly active and I have changed my settings to net my BMR and I know what my TDEE and deficit range is, and I focus on the total cals for the day and make sure I at least eat my BMR each day ...0 -
BUMP0
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It seems like a lot as for a couple of years I was eating 1200 a day, and upped to 1600 in around Sept/Oct 2012 because of the amount I burn at the gym. So it was a big deal for me to eat the 1600 initially although I understood the concept of eating more, it took me time to undo all my old thought process (i.e., eat as little as possible and workout as much as possible).
When you put it the way you have about 'eating about 225 more than sleeping, and burning 350 - 600 almost daily on JUST the exercise', seems like I need to reset my thought process again??
You are there, bam!
It's like me in KS going 4 hrs down to the Ozarks, and thinking, wow, these 300-400 ft elevation changes are huge, look at these mountains when down in this valley.
Now take me 12 hrs to the base of Longs Peak in CO, and ask me how big that 400 ft elevation change really is.
Thank you so much! I love this site - so many helpful people with real, practical advice :-) will I expect to see a weight increase initially as I change to 1900 cals? I'm guessing I will.
Here goes......
TDEE journey starts today!
1900 cals on heavy work out days (1000 cal burn)
1700 cals on lower workout days (500-600 burn)
1600 on non workout day.
Going to be very difficult to stick to it if I see the scale going up, but I can see from here how successful it has been for others, thanks so much for your advice and very easy to understand explanations.0 -
Thank you so much! I love this site - so many helpful people with real, practical advice :-) will I expect to see a weight increase initially as I change to 1900 cals? I'm guessing I will.
Here goes......
TDEE journey starts today!
1900 cals on heavy work out days (1000 cal burn)
1700 cals on lower workout days (500-600 burn)
1600 on non workout day.
Going to be very difficult to stick to it if I see the scale going up, but I can see from here how successful it has been for others, thanks so much for your advice and very easy to understand explanations.
Actually, your weekly exercise calorie burn is being averaged out to a daily basis.
Your eating calories needs to be also.
That 1900 TDEE is avg. Non-workout days are extra calories to make up for high-burn days with no extra available.
So just make sure if doing different levels like that, you don't actually accomplish what we are talking about, and still holding yourself back.
1900 x 7 = 13300 eaten weekly.
Your method won't reach it.
I would build up slowly though. Up to BMR for 1 week, up half way to deficit amount for a week or two, up to deficit amount for a week or two, actually then half-way to TDEE for another couple weeks. Still a deficit, just not as much. Confirm your body knows it can raise metabolism.
Then back to deficit amount.0 -
Thank you so much! I love this site - so many helpful people with real, practical advice :-) will I expect to see a weight increase initially as I change to 1900 cals? I'm guessing I will.
Here goes......
TDEE journey starts today!
1900 cals on heavy work out days (1000 cal burn)
1700 cals on lower workout days (500-600 burn)
1600 on non workout day.
Going to be very difficult to stick to it if I see the scale going up, but I can see from here how successful it has been for others, thanks so much for your advice and very easy to understand explanations.
Actually, your weekly exercise calorie burn is being averaged out to a daily basis.
Your eating calories needs to be also.
That 1900 TDEE is avg. Non-workout days are extra calories to make up for high-burn days with no extra available.
So just make sure if doing different levels like that, you don't actually accomplish what we are talking about, and still holding yourself back.
1900 x 7 = 13300 eaten weekly.
Your method won't reach it.
I would build up slowly though. Up to BMR for 1 week, up half way to deficit amount for a week or two, up to deficit amount for a week or two, actually then half-way to TDEE for another couple weeks. Still a deficit, just not as much. Confirm your body knows it can raise metabolism.
Then back to deficit amount.
Thank you again for your advice, I really appreciate it.0 -
Thank you for this! I have been stuck at the same weight +/- 2 lbs for MONTHS and I am so frustrated! I am going to give this a shot and up my calories, and then when I am done with my current program, I am going to focus more on weight training. I am going to spend some time this weekend reading through these threads.0
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Hello,
This is a new concept to me.
Activity Level Daily Calories
Sedentary (little or no exercise, desk job) 1624
Lightly Active (light exercise/sports 1-3 days/wk) 1860
Moderately Active (moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/wk) 2097
Very Active (hard exercise/sports 6-7 days/wk) 2334
Extremely Active (hard daily exercise/sports & physical job or 2X day training, i.e marathon, contest etc.) 2571
Why can't I just take the TDEE and substract 500? 500*7=3500cal/week deficit which equals 1 lb/week. Which puts my daily food intake at 1597
I am doing the insanity workouts so I already accounted for my exercise by choosing moderately active. My BMR=1353 so if I eat between 1353 and 1597 shouldn't I lose weight? Do I have to account again for the calories I lose from working out?
For example: One insanity workout will burn 400 cals. On that day should I eat 1353+400= 1753?? Why do I account for the exercise twice?
Also, why does the my fitness pal tell me that my daily calories burned from normal activity only amount to 1660? Shouldn't their numbers be the same as my TDEE?0 -
Yes, you can just subtract 500 from TDEE instead of take 20%. No, you do not add your workout calories--they are figured into the TDEE, and the reason the numbers are different is that it's an average. You don't burn 400 every day, right? So it just spreads the calories out over the week so that you eat the same amount every day instead of a different amount on rest and workout days.Hello,
This is a new concept to me.
Activity Level Daily Calories
Sedentary (little or no exercise, desk job) 1624
Lightly Active (light exercise/sports 1-3 days/wk) 1860
Moderately Active (moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/wk) 2097
Very Active (hard exercise/sports 6-7 days/wk) 2334
Extremely Active (hard daily exercise/sports & physical job or 2X day training, i.e marathon, contest etc.) 2571
Why can't I just take the TDEE and substract 500? 500*7=3500cal/week deficit which equals 1 lb/week. Which puts my daily food intake at 1597
I am doing the insanity workouts so I already accounted for my exercise by choosing moderately active. My BMR=1353 so if I eat between 1353 and 1597 shouldn't I lose weight? Do I have to account again for the calories I lose from working out?
For example: One insanity workout will burn 400 cals. On that day should I eat 1353+400= 1753?? Why do I account for the exercise twice?
Also, why does the my fitness pal tell me that my daily calories burned from normal activity only amount to 1660? Shouldn't their numbers be the same as my TDEE?
MFP is telling you that you would burn 1660 without the workout, then when you add in the workout calories you eat them back, so you eat a different amount every day, but it should work out to be about the same (that's just a little more than you would burn at sedentary--you burn calories doing more than exercise). MFP is set up so that you can lose weight with or without exercise, so the calories are based on what you need to eat to lose even if you don't exercise, then if you do, you add the calories and eat them.0 -
Moderately Active (moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/wk) 2097
Why can't I just take the TDEE and substract 500? 500*7=3500cal/week deficit which equals 1 lb/week. Which puts my daily food intake at 1597
I am doing the insanity workouts so I already accounted for my exercise by choosing moderately active. My BMR=1353 so if I eat between 1353 and 1597 shouldn't I lose weight? Do I have to account again for the calories I lose from working out?
One thing here. Lower is not better when your are exercising an Insane amount, or doing Insanity for that matter.
You should eat between 1597 and 2097 and you will lose weight.
You got the wrong side of safety there. Anything below 2097 is losing weight.
The closer to 2097 you eat and workout intense, the more body improvement.
The closer to 1353 you eat and workout intense, the more you risk plateau and burning off muscle.
So stay on the safe side.0 -
So when looking at my MFP I should make sure my actual FOOD amount equals my TDEE cut and not the net that includes my calories burned because those 5 hours of exercise has already been included in my TDEE cut calculation (moderate 3-5 hours). I dont know why I keep getting fogged up with this. LOL.0
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So when looking at my MFP I should make sure my actual FOOD amount equals my TDEE cut and not the net that includes my calories burned because those 5 hours of exercise has already been included in my TDEE cut calculation (moderate 3-5 hours). I dont know why I keep getting fogged up with this. LOL.
Exactly, you don't eat back exercise burned when you already included it in your TDEE estimate.
That's why you see logging of 1 calorie, doesn't mess with daily goal with MFP's normal default usage.0 -
Lightbulb finally lit! LOL. Thanks
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I am going to try to this eat more to weigh less approach because what I have been doing (eating about 1500 cal per day) is not working. I eat wholesome foods, barely any junk and cannot lose weight. I work out about 4-5 days per week for a hour or more and I am not seeing the results I thought I would have (I have been the same weight since last winter). I was diagnosed with Hashimotos Hypothyroiditis last year and recently have gone gluten free due to positive antibodies in my blood.
I am scared to try this but I want to. Can anyone share some encouragement, successes, advice, etc? Is there medical data to support this approach? Thanks for your time! -Betsy0 -
I am going to try to this eat more to weigh less approach because what I have been doing (eating about 1500 cal per day) is not working. I eat wholesome foods, barely any junk and cannot lose weight. I work out about 4-5 days per week for a hour or more and I am not seeing the results I thought I would have (I have been the same weight since last winter). I was diagnosed with Hashimotos Hypothyroiditis last year and recently have gone gluten free due to positive antibodies in my blood.
I am scared to try this but I want to. Can anyone share some encouragement, successes, advice, etc? Is there medical data to support this approach? Thanks for your time! -Betsy
Reasonable deficit even without exercise can spare muscle mass loss.
http://fampra.oxfordjournals.org/content/16/2/196.full
Too large a deficit causes metabolic slowdown, not only through loss of muscle and expected, but even more than that would cause.
Showing the predicted changes in metabolic rates decline sharply in individuals undergoing adaptive thermogenesis which does lead to plateauing. ie suppressed BMR, slower metabolism, ect.
Christian Weyer, Roy L Walford, Inge T Harper, Mike Milner, Taber MacCallum, P Antonio Tataranni and Eric Ravussin, "Energy metabolism after 2 y of energy restriction: the Biosphere 2 experiment", American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, Vol. 72, No. 4, 946-953, October 2000. Free Full Text
Friedlander AL, et al. "Three weeks of caloric restriction alters protein metabolism in normal-weight, young men" Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab., 2005 Sep;289(3):E446-55. Epub 2005 May 3. PMID: 15870104
Welle SL, Seaton TB, Campbell RG. "Some metabolic effects of overeating in man", Am J Clin Nutr. 1986 Dec;44(6):718-24. PMID: 3538842
Martin CK, Heilbronn LK, de Jonge L, Delany JP, Volaufova J, Anton SD, Redman LM, Smith SR, Ravussin E. "Effect of calorie restriction on resting metabolic rate and spontaneous physical activity", Obesity (Silver Spring). 2007 Dec;15(12):2964-73. PMID: 18198305
Rosenbaum M, Hirsch J, Gallagher DA, Leibel RL., Long-term persistence of adaptive thermogenesis in subjects who have maintained a reduced body weight. Am J Clin Nutr., 2008 Oct;88(4):906-12. PMID: 188427750 -
BUMP! So helpful. Thanks for posting.0
