Keto - major TMI help
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I feel like you guys need to all take us out to dinner now that you know so much about our poos.5
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It will take a few days to come up with the right meal plan.... heh heh.
In the meantime..... you might want to have some generic Imodium handy (though Dr. Bernstein swears by Lomotil).
Factoid - Before I switched from generic metformin to name-brand Glucophage XR (at Dr. Bernstein's recommendation), I used to gulp up to 12 of them - 3x the supposed daily max printed on the bottle.*
While I never waltzed out of the house in white pants with no underwear, the Imodium was a life saver. I don't want to get too graphic here (your choice
), but the frequent episodes of spontaneous internal combustion before I started taking generic Imodium were near spectacular..........
* [ Since a few people here berated me when I previously sang the virtues of Imodium ("you're not a doctor," etc.) let me say that I don't specifically advocate exceeding the manufacturer's recommended daily max... HOWEVER, no physicians (GI, endo, etc) have ever offered any reason not to consume such amounts, once they were confident that constipation is not and has never been an issue for me. ]3 -
jasperdog52554 wrote: »First of all, what a difference in responses of like minded individuals vs. The general forums. YAY LC group
Yarr. That would be why I mentioned it as I did. The main forum first response is almost always "zomg why are you running keto?! You're gonna give yourself cancer of the AIDS, and lay a plague upon your second born's lineage!!"3 -
Gallowmere1984 wrote: »jasperdog52554 wrote: »First of all, what a difference in responses of like minded individuals vs. The general forums. YAY LC group
Yarr. That would be why I mentioned it as I did. The main forum first response is almost always "zomg why are you running keto?! You're gonna give yourself cancer of the AIDS, and lay a plague upon your second born's lineage!!"
Lol! Cancer of the AIDS!!!! We are all so getting that!!!3 -
Lots of good ideas here. I need to cut back on the soda anyway. I think that will try that first. @Sunny_bunny I do enjoy veggies, so I wouldn't necessarily mind eating them eventually. I1
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@jasperdog52554 the sweetener that causes my friend (who I mentioned much earlier in this thread) is aspartane. They can not drink Mountain Dew at all without issues. Given your post, thus why I ranked artificial sweeteners first on my list.2
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SamandaIndia wrote: »@jasperdog52554 the sweetener that causes my friend (who I mentioned much earlier in this thread) is aspartane. They can not drink Mountain Dew at all without issues. Given your post, thus why I ranked artificial sweeteners first on my list.
I've seen a lot of reports of this regarding most sugar alcohols, and artificial sweeteners. I must just have an iron gut, because even when I was eating six Quest bars per day, and drinking literally nothing but zero cal soft drinks, I never had a problem. I can't help but feel for the people that the stuff affects negatively. Really, the only thing that ever seemed to wreck my digestive tract, was the high fat, high carb diet that had me over 200 pounds before I was ten, and kept me that way into my 20s.0 -
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What has worked for me was: 1) cut way back on caffeine (coffee and/or soda) and 2) pay close attention to sugar alcohols or any other artificial sweeteners. What did not bother you before can suddenly rear its head when you change your woe.
Good luck!4 -
I thought I would add some of my own experience with keto and bathroom issues. I myself had to build up the amount I could eat of fat at one time. I know you said you didn't add extra fat, but how much are you eating at once in the meals? I find if I eat more than 30g at one time I will have issues with cramping and poo. Fatty meals (over 25g) + caffeine also causes me issues. For me, saturated fats from animal sources causes the most trouble. So, like it's easier on my bowels for me to eat an avocado drizzled with olive oil than steak and eggs. (My issues seem to be related to my lack of gall bladder, but I thought I'd share anyways.)4
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Here is the incomplete list of things that I know of that can cause or exacerbate bowel issues:
1. Sugar alcohols and other artificial sweeteners.
2. Coffee
3. Too much magnesium supplementation
4. Too much fiber (particularly insoluble fiber)
5. Interaction of ketosis and some medications (namely, Metformin/Glucophage)
6. Too much protein paired with not enough fat (this largely only applies to people trying to do low carb, low fat, high protein; doing at least moderate fat is usually sufficient to avoid such issues, but you may need to toy around with ratios a little to find your particular balance)
7. Gut microbe die-off (drastic changes in diet cause changes in our microbiome, which can include the mass die-off of certain species of microbes, which can, in turn, cause a number of symptoms)
8. Too much fat, too soon (this is especially the case for people without a gallbladder or who have undergone weight loss surgery). This can be fat in general, and/or coconut oil, specifically, and especially when paired with coffee (ie - if you suddenly started drinking Bulletproof Coffee at full fat strength, that's probably your culprit).4 -
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drjuliewilson.com/if-im-healthier-why-are-my-symptoms-worse/
Keep in mind that 'retracement' of symptoms can be a reality. I think this is one reason so many stop LCHF before any real healing is completed and wind up calling LCHF dangerous and no good. I had times when I was much worse on LCHF and crazy things happening but I just kept working the plan. After about 90 days the weird stuff stopped and it was all good after that.
Dragonwolf's #7 and #8 nearly made me want to give up LCHF in week two.
Keep in mind I was 63 at the time and was at my low point of 40 years health issues standing on banana peelings with both feet. Someone 35 with no major health issues may have little issue going LCFH.0 -
Dragonwolf wrote: »Here is the incomplete list of things that I know of that can cause or exacerbate bowel issues:
1. Sugar alcohols and other artificial sweeteners.
2. Coffee
3. Too much magnesium supplementation
4. Too much fiber (particularly insoluble fiber)
5. Interaction of ketosis and some medications (namely, Metformin/Glucophage)
6. Too much protein paired with not enough fat (this largely only applies to people trying to do low carb, low fat, high protein; doing at least moderate fat is usually sufficient to avoid such issues, but you may need to toy around with ratios a little to find your particular balance)
7. Gut microbe die-off (drastic changes in diet cause changes in our microbiome, which can include the mass die-off of certain species of microbes, which can, in turn, cause a number of symptoms)
8. Too much fat, too soon (this is especially the case for people without a gallbladder or who have undergone weight loss surgery). This can be fat in general, and/or coconut oil, specifically, and especially when paired with coffee (ie - if you suddenly started drinking Bulletproof Coffee at full fat strength, that's probably your culprit).
I would add:
9. Low stomach acid. Having low stomach acid doesn't keep the food in the digestive system long, as it gets erroneous symptoms that the "wash cycle" so to speak, is done, because the acids are all gone, etc., regardless of how much or how little nutrition has been digested. Since adding ACV and/or digestive enzymes, the majority of my loose stool issues are almost completely resolved.
10. Add probiotics AND diatomaceous earth. This is the other set of things I've added that have very much settled my stomach/digestive/bowel dramas. I think it is far more the second than the first, but hugely noticeable difference.4 -
11. Eating too much, too quickly (Achtung, fasters!)
12. Other LCHF stalwarts - Apple cider vinegar, esp. raw, organic ACV; Raw nuts & seeds; Avocados; Omega-3 supplements.3 -
I echo @supergal3 advice - watch those sugar alcohols, specifically malitol. It makes me have to GO and gives me some bad cramping sometimes. Some people digest it fine, and I am ok up to a point, but I can definitly feel it when I have too much. One time I ate 7 sugar free toffee candies thinking, yay sugar free! No.. just no. Never again!
If none of those are an issue we'd have to check out your diary to find the culprit. Have you tried adding more dairy?0 -
I might add sorbitol to the malitol warning. Oh, and xylitol, too. All that stuff should come with incendiary warnings!
Erythritol, on the other hand, doesn't appear to generate conspicuous internal combustion.3 -
Oy. Now I'm overwhelmed with wtf it could be. I'm going to try seeing if cutting back on my caffeine to just the two cups in the morning will help, to start. Then up my potassium intake (it's really low). I already eat a lot of veg, so it's not that...it could be the diving head-first into a lot of fat intake, perhaps even the fact I'm on Metformin (which I will not quit just yet, I've already cut out insulin). I don't think I can tolerate loosey goosey bathroom time for much longer.0
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@bjwoodzy - I would suggest that you be careful with potassium. You are likely getting more than you know. USDA does not require potassium to be included on the nutritional labels, so the majority of companies simply leave it off, despite there being normal amounts in the food. USDA nutritional site and fatsecret.com often have better data there. Just as too little potassium can be dangerous, so can too much.
Magnesium is a far more common deficiency (90%+ of the first world population is deficient due to soil depletion and such).
Also, with the metformin, it always triggered that reaction in me, and explosively most of the time. I had to avoid dairy 4 hours either side of my medication dosage - have no sugars around the dosages at all - and no coconut oil around it (particularly with vinegar/pickles/high sodium foods - as far as I've been able to tell, this last one is exclusive to just ME). But, I've also found a good bit of relief in that area by using probiotics and diatomaceous earth (thanks, @dietbepsi for the recommendation!).
With no gallbladder, I far more tend to this reaction than most folks. Also, once I added in apple cider vinegar and/or digestive enzymes with every meal, the dumping reaction almost immediately ceased.1 -
Oy. Now I'm overwhelmed with wtf it could be. I'm going to try seeing if cutting back on my caffeine to just the two cups in the morning will help, to start. Then up my potassium intake (it's really low). I already eat a lot of veg, so it's not that...it could be the diving head-first into a lot of fat intake, perhaps even the fact I'm on Metformin (which I will not quit just yet, I've already cut out insulin). I don't think I can tolerate loosey goosey bathroom time for much longer.
I was right there with you. Saturday I was feeling defeated and declared that I can eat what I want. Saturday night and all day Sunday. Ugh.
Good news is, I was back on the wagon Monday, which was easier this time. I have cut back on the caffeine/diet dew but not eliminated, and I have eaten more dairy this week thus far. Things are slowly improving a bit. I'll continue to monitor and see how it goes. Sorry this doesn't help much for you @bjwoodzy I think you already said you eat quite a bit of cheese1
